From Kevin Ponto Sent Fri, Jul 1st 2005, 02:48
From Kevin Ponto Sent Fri, Jul 1st 2005, 02:48
Two snaps and a 'round the world. k:p On Jun 30, 2005, at 11:49 AM, bryan garcia wrote: > "right, the fuck , on" > <artist> > > --- graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > > >> THIS is EXACTLY the kind of links that people should >> be allowed to post here, >> regardless of list. >> >> is is NOT necessarily self-promotion but rather a >> POTENTIAL BASIS for the >> kind(s) of philosophical discussions on music and >> microsound culture that are >> supposedly supposed to happen here. >> >> how is anyone supposed to discuss anything unless >> there is some kind of FIRST >> CAUSE, whether that's a post, a picture or a piece? >> >> trying to make it to a gig halfway around the world >> is one thing... >> >> but i'm all for artists posting links to their >> work... >> >> otherwise, you end up with endless debates as to the >> conversational power of a >> stoplight... >> >> i USED to actually find out information here. and >> links would generate >> discussion. whether it was an article, a MAX/MSP >> patch, a new label or piece >> of software, sounds from space, MP3s, AIFFs, WAVs, >> MPEGS, WMVs... i mean, >> honestly, what the hell does twiki have to do with >> anything music? i don't >> even know what a twiki is, but i'm pretty sure >> they'd be happier in the wild >> and not in a cage. >> >> this whole no links bullshit (for fear of being >> BANNED to the furthest reaches >> of the internet) seems to prioritize the written >> word, online reading lists, or >> ink and paper, as the first cause from which >> discussion is to stem... so >> fucking university, it's makes me sick. let's get >> into actual art itself as >> the basis for discussion... NOT what's been written >> about it... i have to deal >> with that kind of intellectually removed bullshit on >> a daily basis elsewhere... >> >> with these kinds of global online groups there's the >> potential to engage music, >> musicians and artist on a GRASSROOTS level... you >> get the benefit by BYPASSING >> the record label filters, the publishing company >> filters, the 'taste' filters, >> and go straight to the source and dialogue directly >> with the artists >> themselves... why aren't we talking advantage of >> that? why do you think all the >> musician have left here? >> >> why can't people talk about their own work? WTF? >> it's hard enough for our kind >> of music to get any kind of recognition as it is... >> >> i for one would love to have people like twerk, >> sutekh, deadbeat back here... i >> can even deal with taylor dupree's spacebar static >> just to make everyone happy. >> >> i highly doubt john cage is going to post anything >> here anytime soon... or >> xenakis or even fucking curtis roads for that >> matter... let's deal with the >> artists that are: >> >> A) alive >> >> B) online >> >> C) post here >> >> to be honest, the kind of draconian enforcement of >> some kind ambiguous >> manifesto drafted to serve the intents of a handful >> of people (which only post >> on microsound to remind people NOT to post on >> microsound) has driven away >> contribution, NOT encouraged it. meanwhile it seems >> fine to have a signature >> file with a dozen hyperlinks... i have no problem >> with that and i personally >> check out everybody's work and find it a great >> source of encouragement and >> inspiration. >> >> anyway, this has been bugging me for a while and i'd >> hate to see a new poster >> chastised for contributing links to their work... >> >> i've kept every single microsound post on my >> computer for the past four years >> or whatever i've been here... there is definitely a >> difference and i hardly >> think the solution is have less posts rather than >> more... >> >> art and artists come first. theory comes later. >> discussion comes later. that's >> the way it's always been. >> >> let's see more links. and then let's talk about >> them? cool? cool. >> >> graham. >> >> >> >> Joseph Scott wrote: >> >> >>> I have posted some digital photos that I modified >>> >> using basic techniques in >> >>> free photo editing software. The photos often >>> >> resemble visual equivalents of >> >>> microsound works, hence me posting the link here: >>> >>> >>> >> >> > http://pub48.bravenet.com/photocenter/album.php?usernum=4063395084 > >>> >>> If other people on this list are also involved >>> >> with innovative visual art >> >>> and have works online, please post links on the >>> >> list or offlist to me. >> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > _________________________________________________________________ > >>> Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free >>> >> MSN Toolbar now! >> >>> http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ >>> >>> >>> >> >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: >>> >> xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: >>> >> xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >> >> >> >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: >> xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: >> xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 23:38:18 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36453-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:38:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:38:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 30443 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 23:38:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 30417 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 23:38:14 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Jul 2005 01:37:39 +0200 From: COSTELLOE Richard <xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: RE: [microsound] re summertime project? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.6944.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] re summertime project? Thread-index: AcV9wrUAyYKFeN7ZT7O/FGQqBGe/kAACXkhA Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jun 2005 23:37:40.0426 (UTC) FILETIME=[B4747AA0:01C57DCC] okay, i've put the basics on the twiki page (not very poetic i'm afraid.) can all those interested add/delete/update/comment as desired. perhaps we can agree to have the project defined by next week, then post the official description and get creative! http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR enjoy --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 23:25:46 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36452-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:25:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:25:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 23529 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 23:25:43 +0000 Received: (qmail 23518 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 23:25:43 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 23:25:39 +0000 From: bobby whn <xxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> X-Originating-IP: [64.4.61.207] X-Sender: xxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bcc: Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Originating-Email: [xxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jun 2005 23:25:40.0106 (UTC) FILETIME=[071C5EA0:01C57DCB] i have a fairly mellow maxpatch , if you have max and a contact mic its quite fun to just leave it going for a while, it feeds back and modulates the feedback when it reaches a certain level, like a mini installation in yr bedroom or whatever. i stuck it on _you send it_ as text in a word document, as far as im aware its cool just to copy the link on here and you can download it if you want . enjoy! http://s21.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=364IJX2YGKHDR0LPMK9EVFIIGL _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 22:42:36 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36451-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:42:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:42:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 9597 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 22:42:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 9586 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 22:42:34 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Jul 2005 00:42:27 +0200 From: michael beijer <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] i agree with graham - our links are an important and necessary part of this list To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:message-id:content-type:to:from:subject:date:x-mailer; b=lfVIrGZ7uqF0U/KNsygHJmKmom7q1kcbZv5pvc8QC/Y7WdgeJ59EkxmWFaINkdEeHbNeHIgZEXavnItrBOm5UIvT5vN5XLt7QrQ6THJm9m1DnOvXSoiBP1+JXeozOApz2OnoxBIISTt2Nky4poYBTzNi+vRurwLKQ4x+54IFU2A= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i also go check out your links and then get ideas from them -m --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 22:25:53 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36450-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:25:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:25:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 1210 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 22:25:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 1197 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 22:25:49 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Jul 2005 00:25:41 +0200 From: michael beijer <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] re summertime project? To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:message-id:content-type:to:from:subject:date:x-mailer; b=RtwZwcffN17UXOxwapgaNLmgU6cz2X7mJXwnWxyzk2eS1Cd4hh/95uEO2l2JTOmj8UHtCnjtZeIgWJrGR4+Y6sMnDBSThpK98TBKzJNEWsSxYeIYgnYuheXtQTM46FTPpxhG0ooevFBYQq8X46gAjq6aaQ6DRxqtjqgNrJK6xIk= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i'm in! i've never posted before but have been carefully reading most of what goes on here and am already getting to work on THE SOUNDS OF THE SUMMER -michaelbeijer --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 21:37:15 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36449-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:37:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:37:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 79496 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:37:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 79472 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:37:11 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:35:59 -0700 From: roberth <xxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <014701c57dbb$dc3ed9b0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 Content-type: text/plain; reply-type=original; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <00d401c57da8$3b7fdbe0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx except you have started a discussion about it. i think its a good idea. i like to associate people's music with their posts. robert horton ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Nisi" <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 1:03 PM Subject: Re: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC nicely put, graham. how about posting our latest recordings for a start - an audible werkstattbrief. about 20 minutes ago I've recorded this: http://michaelnisi.com/tmp/scape.mp3 post your stuff (and get banned) :) regards, michael --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 21:11:58 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36448-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:11:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:11:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 67531 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:11:52 +0000 Received: (qmail 67518 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 21:11:51 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:11:21 -0400 From: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=tqAw2EDdPcttW0bImf27ByXCQoKJf32+JPqcRZnFsOrlIlRYw7HUnZxUMoxaCaQzFwtONnteW7UaV8cGtOt1xRCOCJgjtnZrsAQEbU6Nqs6zOTZlAPANu6CNg9nkPJHttBE1lPD9CJZYDRR/KvBCV+yuWeiA7T7esLl83NqR/5I= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi On 6/30/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Bjorn set up the wiki page for the project: > http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR i don't think attachments will work on this page right now. if it gets to be time to upload files, lemme know and i will do the sysadmin stuff that needs to be done to allow for file uploads on this page [or another one, if the project needs it]. the results of the project can be put on the .microsound web server, but that usually happens after the project is closed. -- \js [ http://or8.net/~johns/ ] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 20:21:27 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36447-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:21:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:21:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 42873 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:21:19 +0000 Received: (qmail 42863 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:21:19 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 13:21:09 -0700 From: Jorge Bachmann <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - host.tritoncore.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - hyperreal.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - anihilo.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I back you up 100%, Lately I was thinking about that... I'm glad you expressed paz J21 On Jun 30, 2005, at 11:01 AM, graham miller wrote: > THIS is EXACTLY the kind of links that people should be allowed to > post here, > regardless of list. > > is is NOT necessarily self-promotion but rather a POTENTIAL BASIS for > the > kind(s) of philosophical discussions on music and microsound culture > that are > supposedly supposed to happen here. > > how is anyone supposed to discuss anything unless there is some kind > of FIRST > CAUSE, whether that's a post, a picture or a piece? > > trying to make it to a gig halfway around the world is one thing... > > but i'm all for artists posting links to their work... > > otherwise, you end up with endless debates as to the conversational > power of a > stoplight... > > i USED to actually find out information here. and links would generate > discussion. whether it was an article, a MAX/MSP patch, a new label > or piece > of software, sounds from space, MP3s, AIFFs, WAVs, MPEGS, WMVs... i > mean, > honestly, what the hell does twiki have to do with anything music? i > don't > even know what a twiki is, but i'm pretty sure they'd be happier in > the wild > and not in a cage. > > this whole no links bullshit (for fear of being BANNED to the furthest > reaches > of the internet) seems to prioritize the written word, online reading > lists, or > ink and paper, as the first cause from which discussion is to stem... > so > fucking university, it's makes me sick. let's get into actual art > itself as > the basis for discussion... NOT what's been written about it... i have > to deal > with that kind of intellectually removed bullshit on a daily basis > elsewhere... > > with these kinds of global online groups there's the potential to > engage music, > musicians and artist on a GRASSROOTS level... you get the benefit by > BYPASSING > the record label filters, the publishing company filters, the 'taste' > filters, > and go straight to the source and dialogue directly with the artists > themselves... why aren't we talking advantage of that? why do you > think all the > musician have left here? > > why can't people talk about their own work? WTF? it's hard enough for > our kind > of music to get any kind of recognition as it is... > > i for one would love to have people like twerk, sutekh, deadbeat back > here... i > can even deal with taylor dupree's spacebar static just to make > everyone happy. > > i highly doubt john cage is going to post anything here anytime > soon... or > xenakis or even fucking curtis roads for that matter... let's deal > with the > artists that are: > > A) alive > > B) online > > C) post here > > to be honest, the kind of draconian enforcement of some kind ambiguous > manifesto drafted to serve the intents of a handful of people (which > only post > on microsound to remind people NOT to post on microsound) has driven > away > contribution, NOT encouraged it. meanwhile it seems fine to have a > signature > file with a dozen hyperlinks... i have no problem with that and i > personally > check out everybody's work and find it a great source of encouragement > and > inspiration. > > anyway, this has been bugging me for a while and i'd hate to see a new > poster > chastised for contributing links to their work... > > i've kept every single microsound post on my computer for the past > four years > or whatever i've been here... there is definitely a difference and i > hardly > think the solution is have less posts rather than more... > > art and artists come first. theory comes later. discussion comes > later. that's > the way it's always been. > > let's see more links. and then let's talk about them? cool? cool. > > graham. > > > > Joseph Scott wrote: > >> I have posted some digital photos that I modified using basic >> techniques in >> free photo editing software. The photos often resemble visual >> equivalents of >> microsound works, hence me posting the link here: >> >> http://pub48.bravenet.com/photocenter/album.php?usernum=4063395084 >> >> If other people on this list are also involved with innovative visual >> art >> and have works online, please post links on the list or offlist to me. >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free MSN Toolbar now! >> http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > justino aka jorge bachmann sculpture-photography-sound P.O.Box 15953 San Francisco, CA 94115-0953 M-415-706-9629 http://anihilo.com W-415-750-3517 http://ruidobello.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 20:04:03 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36446-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:04:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:04:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 36452 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:04:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 36442 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:03:59 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 22:03:57 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC In-reply-to: <00d401c57da8$3b7fdbe0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=ho9mQvIfF5Qj7EiDrGuaP3qqZhNB+hRzYc88qngyR8rL4l3z80caCd+5kJdnaUB0Kzp5514Os0qBWec7pv8sYxLkjKq89elPHxRAOSIiomT3AMMHcE1bsCaGX6s3rhaRJBPWSNXdTOAQa+mS36Gug1bCCH9qlmWCurKXG/LvQgY= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <00d401c57da8$3b7fdbe0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx nicely put, graham. how about posting our latest recordings for a start - an audible werkstattbrief. about 20 minutes ago I've recorded this: http://michaelnisi.com/tmp/scape.mp3 post your stuff (and get banned) :) regards, michael --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 19:59:06 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36445-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:59:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:59:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 34321 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:59:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 34306 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:59:01 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:00:36 -0400 From: chris mcnamara <xxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.618) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@x.xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I'd be happy to participate in this project. Perhaps some of the other Thinboxers are interested as well. As far as the facilitation of said project, I think Nick's offer seems good and generous - I would be happy to help with whatever I can also. Cheers Chris McNamara On Jun 30, 2005, at 2:00 PM, David Powers wrote: > This sounds great to me... I'm not really set up for field recording, > but would love to do work on a microsound piece if others would make > their samples available - whether "summer" or not, and regardless of > hemisphere. > > ~David > > nick knouf wrote: > >> Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... >> >> I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe >> the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but >> if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able >> to... >> >> We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the >> overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale >> as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of >> insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For >> others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling >> leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for >> those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge >> of winter in the northern hemisphere) >> >> So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds >> of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by >> hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a >> composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload >> the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, >> provide a CD to those who wish one. >> >> Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but >> if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the >> project? >> >> cheers, >> >> nick >> >> >> On 6/24/05, //jonCates <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> >>> Scott C >>> >>> snds fantastic >>> >>> in support of sandy slippage + pouring snd into snd via summer >>> >>> // jonCates >>> # http://www.r4wb1t5.org >>> # http://www.criticalartware.net >>> # http://www.systemsapproach.net >>> >>> On Jun 18, 2005, at 7:42 PM, Scott Carver wrote: >>> >>>> In the interest of being outside and actually appreciating summer >>>> while it's around, what about something performed live, outside, >>>> perhaps using sounds from the location of performance? Pick a >>>> outdoor >>>> location and a time (hopefully a time when it's appropriately >>>> summer-ish), and perform a piece, in whatever sense of 'perform' is >>>> appropriate and interesting. Screw sitting around in my house with >>>> headphones on, if I'm going to do a summer project, I want to make >>>> sounds so inextricably entangled with summer they can't be >>>> separated, >>>> summer and sound pouring into each other until the mixture is >>>> impossible to separate. >>>> >>>> - Scott C. >>>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >>> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 19:16:51 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36444-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:16:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:16:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 16804 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:16:44 +0000 Received: (qmail 16794 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 19:16:44 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:15:16 -0700 From: roberth <xxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <00d401c57da8$3b7fdbe0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 Content-type: text/plain; reply-type=original; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i agree with graham. makes it more real less heady. r ----- Original Message ----- From: "graham miller" <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 11:01 AM Subject: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC > THIS is EXACTLY the kind of links that people should be allowed to post > here, > regardless of list. > > is is NOT necessarily self-promotion but rather a POTENTIAL BASIS for the > kind(s) of philosophical discussions on music and microsound culture that > are > supposedly supposed to happen here. > > how is anyone supposed to discuss anything unless there is some kind of > FIRST > CAUSE, whether that's a post, a picture or a piece? > > trying to make it to a gig halfway around the world is one thing... > > but i'm all for artists posting links to their work... > > otherwise, you end up with endless debates as to the conversational power > of a > stoplight... > > i USED to actually find out information here. and links would generate > discussion. whether it was an article, a MAX/MSP patch, a new label or > piece > of software, sounds from space, MP3s, AIFFs, WAVs, MPEGS, WMVs... i mean, > honestly, what the hell does twiki have to do with anything music? i > don't > even know what a twiki is, but i'm pretty sure they'd be happier in the > wild > and not in a cage. > > this whole no links bullshit (for fear of being BANNED to the furthest > reaches > of the internet) seems to prioritize the written word, online reading > lists, or > ink and paper, as the first cause from which discussion is to stem... so > fucking university, it's makes me sick. let's get into actual art itself > as > the basis for discussion... NOT what's been written about it... i have to > deal > with that kind of intellectually removed bullshit on a daily basis > elsewhere... > > with these kinds of global online groups there's the potential to engage > music, > musicians and artist on a GRASSROOTS level... you get the benefit by > BYPASSING > the record label filters, the publishing company filters, the 'taste' > filters, > and go straight to the source and dialogue directly with the artists > themselves... why aren't we talking advantage of that? why do you think > all the > musician have left here? > > why can't people talk about their own work? WTF? it's hard enough for our > kind > of music to get any kind of recognition as it is... > > i for one would love to have people like twerk, sutekh, deadbeat back > here... i > can even deal with taylor dupree's spacebar static just to make everyone > happy. > > i highly doubt john cage is going to post anything here anytime soon... or > xenakis or even fucking curtis roads for that matter... let's deal with > the > artists that are: > > A) alive > > B) online > > C) post here > > to be honest, the kind of draconian enforcement of some kind ambiguous > manifesto drafted to serve the intents of a handful of people (which only > post > on microsound to remind people NOT to post on microsound) has driven away > contribution, NOT encouraged it. meanwhile it seems fine to have a > signature > file with a dozen hyperlinks... i have no problem with that and i > personally > check out everybody's work and find it a great source of encouragement and > inspiration. > > anyway, this has been bugging me for a while and i'd hate to see a new > poster > chastised for contributing links to their work... > > i've kept every single microsound post on my computer for the past four > years > or whatever i've been here... there is definitely a difference and i > hardly > think the solution is have less posts rather than more... > > art and artists come first. theory comes later. discussion comes later. > that's > the way it's always been. > > let's see more links. and then let's talk about them? cool? cool. > > graham. > > > > Joseph Scott wrote: > >> I have posted some digital photos that I modified using basic techniques >> in >> free photo editing software. The photos often resemble visual equivalents >> of >> microsound works, hence me posting the link here: >> >> http://pub48.bravenet.com/photocenter/album.php?usernum=4063395084 >> >> If other people on this list are also involved with innovative visual art >> and have works online, please post links on the list or offlist to me. >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free MSN Toolbar now! >> http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 18:49:54 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36443-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:49:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:49:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 3451 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:49:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 3441 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:49:48 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 11:49:45 -0700 (PDT) From: bryan garcia <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] ON TOPIC, or why do men start fires >?< In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=x3civmZdMhjWDqGdOZYENy4pVKnux3cKot6w5gXE43XeKA01HikqRWd26dTvu2Pi5A5hHT54viFFv95QyDI/xKHVTYhV/Li2Nj/t7PKmzM/pJHKodxYSvR9+6BVRFgKtn1WSSrTzhhqmZDxE5kfixIQQ+nZ/YUEF/FngmLs+btU= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx "right, the fuck , on" <artist> --- graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > THIS is EXACTLY the kind of links that people should > be allowed to post here, > regardless of list. > > is is NOT necessarily self-promotion but rather a > POTENTIAL BASIS for the > kind(s) of philosophical discussions on music and > microsound culture that are > supposedly supposed to happen here. > > how is anyone supposed to discuss anything unless > there is some kind of FIRST > CAUSE, whether that's a post, a picture or a piece? > > trying to make it to a gig halfway around the world > is one thing... > > but i'm all for artists posting links to their > work... > > otherwise, you end up with endless debates as to the > conversational power of a > stoplight... > > i USED to actually find out information here. and > links would generate > discussion. whether it was an article, a MAX/MSP > patch, a new label or piece > of software, sounds from space, MP3s, AIFFs, WAVs, > MPEGS, WMVs... i mean, > honestly, what the hell does twiki have to do with > anything music? i don't > even know what a twiki is, but i'm pretty sure > they'd be happier in the wild > and not in a cage. > > this whole no links bullshit (for fear of being > BANNED to the furthest reaches > of the internet) seems to prioritize the written > word, online reading lists, or > ink and paper, as the first cause from which > discussion is to stem... so > fucking university, it's makes me sick. let's get > into actual art itself as > the basis for discussion... NOT what's been written > about it... i have to deal > with that kind of intellectually removed bullshit on > a daily basis elsewhere... > > with these kinds of global online groups there's the > potential to engage music, > musicians and artist on a GRASSROOTS level... you > get the benefit by BYPASSING > the record label filters, the publishing company > filters, the 'taste' filters, > and go straight to the source and dialogue directly > with the artists > themselves... why aren't we talking advantage of > that? why do you think all the > musician have left here? > > why can't people talk about their own work? WTF? > it's hard enough for our kind > of music to get any kind of recognition as it is... > > i for one would love to have people like twerk, > sutekh, deadbeat back here... i > can even deal with taylor dupree's spacebar static > just to make everyone happy. > > i highly doubt john cage is going to post anything > here anytime soon... or > xenakis or even fucking curtis roads for that > matter... let's deal with the > artists that are: > > A) alive > > B) online > > C) post here > > to be honest, the kind of draconian enforcement of > some kind ambiguous > manifesto drafted to serve the intents of a handful > of people (which only post > on microsound to remind people NOT to post on > microsound) has driven away > contribution, NOT encouraged it. meanwhile it seems > fine to have a signature > file with a dozen hyperlinks... i have no problem > with that and i personally > check out everybody's work and find it a great > source of encouragement and > inspiration. > > anyway, this has been bugging me for a while and i'd > hate to see a new poster > chastised for contributing links to their work... > > i've kept every single microsound post on my > computer for the past four years > or whatever i've been here... there is definitely a > difference and i hardly > think the solution is have less posts rather than > more... > > art and artists come first. theory comes later. > discussion comes later. that's > the way it's always been. > > let's see more links. and then let's talk about > them? cool? cool. > > graham. > > > > Joseph Scott wrote: > > > I have posted some digital photos that I modified > using basic techniques in > > free photo editing software. The photos often > resemble visual equivalents of > > microsound works, hence me posting the link here: > > > > > http://pub48.bravenet.com/photocenter/album.php?usernum=4063395084 > > > > If other people on this list are also involved > with innovative visual art > > and have works online, please post links on the > list or offlist to me. > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free > MSN Toolbar now! > > http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 18:02:42 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36442-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:02:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:02:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 79628 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:02:38 +0000 Received: (qmail 79618 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:02:38 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:01:19 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] OT? Modified Photos = ON TOPIC To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx THIS is EXACTLY the kind of links that people should be allowed to post here, regardless of list. is is NOT necessarily self-promotion but rather a POTENTIAL BASIS for the kind(s) of philosophical discussions on music and microsound culture that are supposedly supposed to happen here. how is anyone supposed to discuss anything unless there is some kind of FIRST CAUSE, whether that's a post, a picture or a piece? trying to make it to a gig halfway around the world is one thing... but i'm all for artists posting links to their work... otherwise, you end up with endless debates as to the conversational power of a stoplight... i USED to actually find out information here. and links would generate discussion. whether it was an article, a MAX/MSP patch, a new label or piece of software, sounds from space, MP3s, AIFFs, WAVs, MPEGS, WMVs... i mean, honestly, what the hell does twiki have to do with anything music? i don't even know what a twiki is, but i'm pretty sure they'd be happier in the wild and not in a cage. this whole no links bullshit (for fear of being BANNED to the furthest reaches of the internet) seems to prioritize the written word, online reading lists, or ink and paper, as the first cause from which discussion is to stem... so fucking university, it's makes me sick. let's get into actual art itself as the basis for discussion... NOT what's been written about it... i have to deal with that kind of intellectually removed bullshit on a daily basis elsewhere... with these kinds of global online groups there's the potential to engage music, musicians and artist on a GRASSROOTS level... you get the benefit by BYPASSING the record label filters, the publishing company filters, the 'taste' filters, and go straight to the source and dialogue directly with the artists themselves... why aren't we talking advantage of that? why do you think all the musician have left here? why can't people talk about their own work? WTF? it's hard enough for our kind of music to get any kind of recognition as it is... i for one would love to have people like twerk, sutekh, deadbeat back here... i can even deal with taylor dupree's spacebar static just to make everyone happy. i highly doubt john cage is going to post anything here anytime soon... or xenakis or even fucking curtis roads for that matter... let's deal with the artists that are: A) alive B) online C) post here to be honest, the kind of draconian enforcement of some kind ambiguous manifesto drafted to serve the intents of a handful of people (which only post on microsound to remind people NOT to post on microsound) has driven away contribution, NOT encouraged it. meanwhile it seems fine to have a signature file with a dozen hyperlinks... i have no problem with that and i personally check out everybody's work and find it a great source of encouragement and inspiration. anyway, this has been bugging me for a while and i'd hate to see a new poster chastised for contributing links to their work... i've kept every single microsound post on my computer for the past four years or whatever i've been here... there is definitely a difference and i hardly think the solution is have less posts rather than more... art and artists come first. theory comes later. discussion comes later. that's the way it's always been. let's see more links. and then let's talk about them? cool? cool. graham. Joseph Scott wrote: > I have posted some digital photos that I modified using basic techniques in > free photo editing software. The photos often resemble visual equivalents of > microsound works, hence me posting the link here: > > http://pub48.bravenet.com/photocenter/album.php?usernum=4063395084 > > If other people on this list are also involved with innovative visual art > and have works online, please post links on the list or offlist to me. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free MSN Toolbar now! > http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 18:00:57 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36441-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:00:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:00:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 76976 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:00:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 76966 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:00:53 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 13:00:54 -0500 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_gv+askzzA6T5CfkRzfJ/9w)" X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@x.xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_gv+askzzA6T5CfkRzfJ/9w) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This sounds great to me... I'm not really set up for field recording, but would love to do work on a microsound piece if others would make their samples available - whether "summer" or not, and regardless of hemisphere. ~David nick knouf wrote: >Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... > >I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe >the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but >if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able >to... > >We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the >overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale >as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of >insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For >others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling >leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for >those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge >of winter in the northern hemisphere) > >So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds >of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by >hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a >composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload >the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, >provide a CD to those who wish one. > >Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but >if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the >project? > >cheers, > >nick > > >On 6/24/05, //jonCates <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > >>Scott C >> >>snds fantastic >> >>in support of sandy slippage + pouring snd into snd via summer >> >>// jonCates >># http://www.r4wb1t5.org >># http://www.criticalartware.net >># http://www.systemsapproach.net >> >>On Jun 18, 2005, at 7:42 PM, Scott Carver wrote: >> >> >>>In the interest of being outside and actually appreciating summer >>>while it's around, what about something performed live, outside, >>>perhaps using sounds from the location of performance? Pick a outdoor >>>location and a time (hopefully a time when it's appropriately >>>summer-ish), and perform a piece, in whatever sense of 'perform' is >>>appropriate and interesting. Screw sitting around in my house with >>>headphones on, if I'm going to do a summer project, I want to make >>>sounds so inextricably entangled with summer they can't be separated, >>>summer and sound pouring into each other until the mixture is >>>impossible to separate. >>> >>>- Scott C. >>> >>> >>--------------------------------------------------------------------- >>To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> >> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --Boundary_(ID_gv+askzzA6T5CfkRzfJ/9w)-- From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 14:00:19 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36440-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:00:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:00:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 37038 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:00:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 37026 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:00:12 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:00:10 -0400 From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] OT: Modified Photos In-reply-to: <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=IzdsYotqxn9lkNaR9u1IYDc1niRW6hzbIuzyyRNUy4G0ImU4nj/EW65I3rrtYHD1LlLDwpK6X9HBr6VGz37VCzQLGcuz6oT+LqfYD9Tekg1kKTGTyj4r7FKxTfQs1nasYwTn2NMeLl8L3beClNzB/07ozKIP++N9KD+jnMIIjjg= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For those of you interested in this sort of "databending", there's a list called, appropriately enough, databenders. A member recently posted a rather large amount of bent photoshop PSD and jpeg files; I've included the message below. cheers, nick From: stAllio! <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-To: xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx Date: Jun 27, 2005 4:27 PM Subject: [databenders] massive new bent image gallery i've been working on this for a few weeks now, and i'm ready to launch it to the public: the new stAllio! image-bending gallery: http://www.animalswithinanimals.com/bent/ this is the new home for my databent image work, and i kick it off with a massive new RRX gallery. this new gallery includes a bunch of new bent JPEG files (about 23 actual bent jpeg files and at least two screencaps of each), so if you enjoyed last month's bollybend experiment, you will enjoy this up to 23x more. beyond that, there are more than 100 images created by bending PSD files. so when i say it's massive, you know i mean it. also, the classic RR8 gallery has been expanded as well as galleryized so you can easily browse through it by looking through thumbnails. -- I've never thought of it like that before. But I'm going to go with, "no, it is not strange to eat your own parasite." http://www.animalswithinanimals.com http://badtastesucks.com On 6/30/05, Joseph Scott <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > I have posted some digital photos that I modified using basic techniques in > free photo editing software. The photos often resemble visual equivalents of > microsound works, hence me posting the link here: > > http://pub48.bravenet.com/photocenter/album.php?usernum=4063395084 > > If other people on this list are also involved with innovative visual art > and have works online, please post links on the list or offlist to me. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free MSN Toolbar now! > http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 12:22:53 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36439-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:22:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:22:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 2820 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:22:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 2808 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:22:49 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:22:48 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=VCmYaxpEYGg/4e5avD7ZL8JxnMI4mFsC0lTqAJHXS4OZLbVpftHPsMsr7wwgkinm4ANHEXJteCa/7SyHvTv10E+aaYB7pq/MDBs1NLyzaS93UBhfc00Ma9C84eDBzz8Q9OFQf6LqU3Eb6ZeJJSiJRjDLDoWdCimPjcqEkOP/sjc= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx saving bandwidth sounds like a plan and don't forget to breathe, man. sorry, michael --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 12:16:00 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36438-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:16:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:16:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 403 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:15:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 392 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:15:56 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 14:18:44 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <011301c57d6d$dc465030$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2527 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2527 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I don't think real time chat is more scary than an ordinary phone call or a real chat/talk. Real time chat sometimes has the advantages of getting fast solutions to practical problems. Maybe it is not ideal for a lot else. The different situations at hand has different needs and different ways to communicate. /Björn Eriksson > etc... It is also possible that people do not want to interact in real > time and their reticence is not a case of being too lazy to participate. > The material I have contributed to this thread is in an attempt to get > people to consider the experiences of others who have gone down these > paths, rather than behave as if they know it all, or that the experiences > of others are irrelevant. > > or indeed taking up list bandwidth with obtuse in-jokes which make sense > to the poster but to no one else. > > julian > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 12:03:55 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36437-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:03:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:03:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 97032 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:03:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 97022 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:03:51 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 22:03:47 +1000 From: Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 30/06/2005, at 5:58 PM, Michael Nisi wrote: > haha, yeah more real and shit - sounds familiar. like painting your > toe nails black and feeling your strengthened personality through it. > like producing weak sounding music and label it underground. i'm not sure i get this reply... and how it contributes to the discussion on the list. It sounds like someone with issues... the material i posted was a report from someone else (earlier in the thread) who is running real time chat for a list not dissimilar to this. His observation was that most people do not like real time chat, or at least are reluctant to take the interactions from these spaces into that context. Real time chat appeals to stronger personalities and not to all. Your surprise at the small number of participants in your irc channel is therefore not a surprise for others who have tried a similar thing... there are also quite pragmatic issues like time zones etc... It is also possible that people do not want to interact in real time and their reticence is not a case of being too lazy to participate. The material I have contributed to this thread is in an attempt to get people to consider the experiences of others who have gone down these paths, rather than behave as if they know it all, or that the experiences of others are irrelevant. or indeed taking up list bandwidth with obtuse in-jokes which make sense to the poster but to no one else. julian --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 09:33:15 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36436-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 05:33:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 05:33:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 34990 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:33:13 +0000 Received: (qmail 34980 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:33:13 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:33:04 +0000 From: Joseph Scott <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] OT: Modified Photos In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-Originating-IP: [217.19.131.135] X-Sender: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bcc: Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Originating-Email: [xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jun 2005 09:33:04.0841 (UTC) FILETIME=[B773DB90:01C57D56] I have posted some digital photos that I modified using basic techniques in free photo editing software. The photos often resemble visual equivalents of microsound works, hence me posting the link here: http://pub48.bravenet.com/photocenter/album.php?usernum=4063395084 If other people on this list are also involved with innovative visual art and have works online, please post links on the list or offlist to me. _________________________________________________________________ Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free MSN Toolbar now! http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 09:04:00 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36435-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 05:04:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 05:03:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 9628 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:04:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 9616 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:04:01 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 11:03:23 +0200 From: COSTELLOE Richard <xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: RE: [microsound] RE: summertime project? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.6944.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] RE: summertime project? Thread-index: AcV9UWRFwsbeTNHfQfWqDHtyYsfkAwAAKX5g Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jun 2005 09:03:24.0286 (UTC) FILETIME=[9228B9E0:01C57D52] I'll post the project basics so far on the twiki later today. We can use this to formulate a clear project plan & deadline. Also, I'd more than happy to do the webpage for this - how has this been done in the past? I'm not sure how/where the .microsound web is hosted. When is the official end of summer? (Not that I'm anxious for it!) -----Original Message----- From: Björn Eriksson [mailto:xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx] Sent: 30 June 2005 09:50 To: microsound Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? Coffe or not, the TWiki page is there ready for anyone to just fill in. The next stage would actually be to just get this thing rolling. When we come to deadline (in end of summer?) there maybe is someone willing to design a nice webpage too? /Björn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Nisi" <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 10:13 AM Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? we where? oh god, give me coffee... sorry, michael On 6/30/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > hi, > > we where discussing this last night: > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > Bjorn set up the wiki page for the project: > http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR > > step in. > > regards, > michael > > http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR > > On 6/30/05, xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> wrote: > > Hi Nick and all, > > > > I have been working on a piece called 'memory of summer' - what > > interests me is creating a track based around summer only from memory > > (as someone suggested before). I will also work on a piece more locally > > based in Australia's winter... > > > > I really like the ideas that this project has brought up and it would be > > great to have it coordinated. Perhaps you and I could nut out some > > project guidelines and get people to post their tracks on the hotline > > server/twiki? Email me with suggestions.. > > > > Who actually did start this thread?? :) > > > > Simon. > > > > Symbiosis > > Sunday nights, 12am - 2am > > 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au > > Melbourne, Australia > > > > xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > > > > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > > Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? > > > From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > > > Date: Thu, June 30, 2005 2:28 pm > > > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > > > > > > Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... > > > > > > I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe > > > the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but > > > if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able > > > to... > > > > > > We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the > > > overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale > > > as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of > > > insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For > > > others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling > > > leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for > > > those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge > > > of winter in the northern hemisphere) > > > > > > So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds > > > of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by > > > hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a > > > composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload > > > the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, > > > provide a CD to those who wish one. > > > > > > Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but > > > if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the > > > project? > > > > > > cheers, > > > > > > nick > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 08:54:45 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36434-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:54:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:54:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 4842 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:54:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 4824 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:54:40 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:49:52 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <007a01c57d50$af5005c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2527 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2527 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Coffe or not, the TWiki page is there ready for anyone to just fill in. The next stage would actually be to just get this thing rolling. When we come to deadline (in end of summer?) there maybe is someone willing to design a nice webpage too? /Björn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Nisi" <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 10:13 AM Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? we where? oh god, give me coffee... sorry, michael On 6/30/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > hi, > > we where discussing this last night: > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > Bjorn set up the wiki page for the project: > http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR > > step in. > > regards, > michael > > http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR > > On 6/30/05, xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> wrote: > > Hi Nick and all, > > > > I have been working on a piece called 'memory of summer' - what > > interests me is creating a track based around summer only from memory > > (as someone suggested before). I will also work on a piece more locally > > based in Australia's winter... > > > > I really like the ideas that this project has brought up and it would be > > great to have it coordinated. Perhaps you and I could nut out some > > project guidelines and get people to post their tracks on the hotline > > server/twiki? Email me with suggestions.. > > > > Who actually did start this thread?? :) > > > > Simon. > > > > Symbiosis > > Sunday nights, 12am - 2am > > 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au > > Melbourne, Australia > > > > xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > > > > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > > Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? > > > From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > > > Date: Thu, June 30, 2005 2:28 pm > > > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > > > > > > Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... > > > > > > I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe > > > the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but > > > if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able > > > to... > > > > > > We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the > > > overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale > > > as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of > > > insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For > > > others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling > > > leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for > > > those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge > > > of winter in the northern hemisphere) > > > > > > So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds > > > of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by > > > hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a > > > composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload > > > the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, > > > provide a CD to those who wish one. > > > > > > Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but > > > if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the > > > project? > > > > > > cheers, > > > > > > nick > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 08:13:30 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36433-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:13:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:13:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 90346 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:13:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 90336 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:13:31 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:13:25 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=lPW6C/nr3Cb9RuGyR3KPO8ydqoNW/MjNxCGtMIh+Q1qsg6VjpLHOhi34Jd01vlgWbQm3Vup/KuLog1CjKhs3jpup1DrpYMD2vtx0ujj25Zd8y/Q6L4abIYfybzA3Bpi4bP6PdZINwqEUg7uQ3Xwi62gs0d/rSf1lvjtkOP1qNPM= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx we where? oh god, give me coffee... sorry, michael On 6/30/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > hi, > > we where discussing this last night: > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > Bjorn set up the wiki page for the project: > http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR > > step in. > > regards, > michael > > http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR > > On 6/30/05, xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> wrote: > > Hi Nick and all, > > > > I have been working on a piece called 'memory of summer' - what > > interests me is creating a track based around summer only from memory > > (as someone suggested before). I will also work on a piece more locally > > based in Australia's winter... > > > > I really like the ideas that this project has brought up and it would be > > great to have it coordinated. Perhaps you and I could nut out some > > project guidelines and get people to post their tracks on the hotline > > server/twiki? Email me with suggestions.. > > > > Who actually did start this thread?? :) > > > > Simon. > > > > Symbiosis > > Sunday nights, 12am - 2am > > 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au > > Melbourne, Australia > > > > xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > > > > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > > Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? > > > From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > > > Date: Thu, June 30, 2005 2:28 pm > > > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > > > > > > Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... > > > > > > I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe > > > the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but > > > if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able > > > to... > > > > > > We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the > > > overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale > > > as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of > > > insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For > > > others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling > > > leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for > > > those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge > > > of winter in the northern hemisphere) > > > > > > So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds > > > of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by > > > hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a > > > composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload > > > the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, > > > provide a CD to those who wish one. > > > > > > Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but > > > if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the > > > project? > > > > > > cheers, > > > > > > nick > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 08:07:26 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36432-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:07:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:07:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 88043 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:07:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 88026 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:07:26 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:07:20 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=sSuun2VvTGN3vFkRGvvjm9sNzjrbjPZlCa5bPk1ohdEj+t5eoaE71kS0VGUbMwrOS9iKQgsS2G6rF+7hJUqZGLipXAgzPpNPejreKoPql3kp/Y+Tm5NSmXS0FT4vrwVLLtAXzKlx0ec+GexvPQocUD5FIJYFm2+TsWIouqyzbjU= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi, we where discussing this last night: irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound Bjorn set up the wiki page for the project: http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR step in. regards, michael http://microsound.nexthop.net/bin/view.cgi/Main/SummeR On 6/30/05, xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> wrote: > Hi Nick and all, > > I have been working on a piece called 'memory of summer' - what > interests me is creating a track based around summer only from memory > (as someone suggested before). I will also work on a piece more locally > based in Australia's winter... > > I really like the ideas that this project has brought up and it would be > great to have it coordinated. Perhaps you and I could nut out some > project guidelines and get people to post their tracks on the hotline > server/twiki? Email me with suggestions.. > > Who actually did start this thread?? :) > > Simon. > > Symbiosis > Sunday nights, 12am - 2am > 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au > Melbourne, Australia > > xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? > > From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > > Date: Thu, June 30, 2005 2:28 pm > > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > > > > Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... > > > > I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe > > the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but > > if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able > > to... > > > > We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the > > overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale > > as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of > > insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For > > others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling > > leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for > > those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge > > of winter in the northern hemisphere) > > > > So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds > > of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by > > hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a > > composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload > > the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, > > provide a CD to those who wish one. > > > > Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but > > if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the > > project? > > > > cheers, > > > > nick > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 08:05:30 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36431-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:05:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:05:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 86700 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:05:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 86688 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:05:30 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:04:53 +0200 From: COSTELLOE Richard <xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: RE: [microsound] RE: summertime project? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.6944.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] RE: summertime project? Thread-index: AcV9MA/PoVqivhFWSkGlQOEEWJgP0AAF4Onw Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jun 2005 08:04:54.0345 (UTC) FILETIME=[66123B90:01C57D4A] Hi, thread-starter here... I've been, er, researching summer in Spain for the past week so just catching up with the discussions now... didn't mean to leave it hanging. I like Nick's idea of collecting sounds independently for a period, sharing them, then using them for our compositions. (That's how I understand it anyway) - in a more collaborative vein we could also upload our summer tracks first, then remix each's others up, though this could be messy ; ) There was mention of using synthetic sounds rather than/in combination with ambient samples. It seems perfectly legitimate to gather sounds from any source that we feel represents or reflects the essence of "summer." So, as Simon suggests, a few of us could mesh out some details then officially present the project to the group. I haven't read what is up with the hotline discussion (the client never worked for me) - but I'm know we can find server space as needed. Hope I didn't overlook any good ideas!! - R.Diddy -----Original Message----- From: xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx [mailto:xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx] Sent: 30 June 2005 05:56 To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: RE: [microsound] RE: summertime project? Hi Nick and all, I have been working on a piece called 'memory of summer' - what interests me is creating a track based around summer only from memory (as someone suggested before). I will also work on a piece more locally based in Australia's winter... I really like the ideas that this project has brought up and it would be great to have it coordinated. Perhaps you and I could nut out some project guidelines and get people to post their tracks on the hotline server/twiki? Email me with suggestions.. Who actually did start this thread?? :) Simon. Symbiosis Sunday nights, 12am - 2am 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au Melbourne, Australia xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? > From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > Date: Thu, June 30, 2005 2:28 pm > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > > Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... > > I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe > the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but > if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able > to... > > We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the > overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale > as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of > insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For > others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling > leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for > those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge > of winter in the northern hemisphere) > > So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds > of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by > hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a > composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload > the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, > provide a CD to those who wish one. > > Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but > if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the > project? > > cheers, > > nick --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 07:59:01 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36430-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 03:59:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 03:58:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 84290 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 07:59:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 84280 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 07:59:00 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 09:58:55 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=WKnDDt+n+eaLDZ4LSuT4Dd47lTLo8Z8D/P4mvsXCZkrzUNjRsszzIe/ebiTT0lf5gLUUdj33BH0f7ue7YGRYf6x8Sru+GNgHya9Ka9McKkGT1ibJi+i5209y7aYvNLUbR6ZADmADlu5mj+VnzyfJmj7+icf+QOQ1QZ5KTS2hRI0= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, > >> more about strong personalities. haha, yeah more real and shit - sounds familiar. like painting your toe nails black and feeling your strengthened personality through it. like producing weak sounding music and label it underground. oh well, michael On 6/30/05, Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > On 30/06/2005, at 7:58 AM, Michael Nisi wrote: > > > six people! c'mon. is that it? /join #microsound :) > > > > > From: "Tom Ellard" <xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> > > Date: 13 June 2005 7:00:54 PM > >> We found that a different bunch of people use KDX than used to be on > >> the mailing list. Odd. > > >> It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, > >> more about strong personalities. > >> > > > julian > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 05:23:04 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36429-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 01:23:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 01:23:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 30890 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 05:23:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 30879 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 05:23:02 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 07:20:06 +0200 From: Roberto Rodrigo =?iso-8859-1?b?TWFzaeE=?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] LA CASA MICROSCOPICA X-Originating-IP: 81.202.60.103 To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.4 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hello people, "La casa Microscopica" or "the microscopic house " consists in a open common project exploring the relationship between the creators and their living places. The idea would be to take as a start point for the compositions the sounds from the place where one lives, inside our houses.(pipes, people, mosquitos, traffic fromoutide, whatever),so the works of the project are subject to this rule of using only sounds coming from recordings made in your house. In this way we have first the effort (always interesting, I think) of having some sort of rule or autolimitation in our work and in the other hand the fact of the inmediate enviroment having a direct and explicit influence in the music or better said the inmediate environrment almost being our music. Confirmed artists till now are Pablo Reche, Sogar, Marco Godme, 1=0, Plumb & Plumber, Marc Mc Nulty , Interested? Roberto Rodrigo www.montgorecords.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 04:56:11 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36428-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 00:56:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 00:55:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 22492 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:56:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 22482 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:56:06 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:56:01 -0700 From: xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx Subject: RE: [microsound] RE: summertime project? To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hi Nick and all, I have been working on a piece called 'memory of summer' - what interests me is creating a track based around summer only from memory (as someone suggested before). I will also work on a piece more locally based in Australia's winter... I really like the ideas that this project has brought up and it would be great to have it coordinated. Perhaps you and I could nut out some project guidelines and get people to post their tracks on the hotline server/twiki? Email me with suggestions.. Who actually did start this thread?? :) Simon. Symbiosis Sunday nights, 12am - 2am 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au Melbourne, Australia xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? > From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > Date: Thu, June 30, 2005 2:28 pm > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > > Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... > > I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe > the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but > if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able > to... > > We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the > overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale > as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of > insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For > others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling > leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for > those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge > of winter in the northern hemisphere) > > So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds > of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by > hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a > composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload > the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, > provide a CD to those who wish one. > > Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but > if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the > project? > > cheers, > > nick --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 04:28:29 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36427-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 30 Jun 2005 00:28:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 00:28:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 10109 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:28:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 10091 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 04:28:21 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 00:28:16 -0400 From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=tYuINcHhps+AxihvbpGzJu6JnNuWogc5lKz+Ns4ppB4ZW57kAFxiS0zuWVrZttJG/XA9AjEDtPbdg4zEMlIubNeGQ7cHKQ3oUaybOGSB1/Hna4QSTMjuGOUq5iaypWy4FckaJa6E9KBpxnNcXFG8+P4YOA2OuqroUPMNansjmxc= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@x.xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hmm, no movement on this for nearly a week... I'm not sure if there is a person "in charge" of this project; maybe the thread starter? I don't want to step on anyone's toes here, but if nobody else is interested in taking charge, I'd be interested/able to... We seem to have a fairly wide range of options, but one of the overarching themes (as I read it) is using the sounds of your locale as the basis of a composition. For many, that might be the sounds of insects, of people jumping into a swimming pool, of thunder. For others, the sound of cold rain, of boots in the snow, of rustling leaves. (pardon me if those sounds are completely out of whack for those of you in the southern hemisphere; i'm basing it on my knowledge of winter in the northern hemisphere) So it seems to me that what we should do is first collect the sounds of "summer" (and if you're interested/willing, provide those sounds by hosting them/linking to them from the wiki) and then work those into a composition of your own desire. At the end of the summer we upload the files for everyone to enjoy, and perhaps, given the interest, provide a CD to those who wish one. Now, maybe I've completely misrepresented people's desires here, but if not, does this sound like a good point of departure for the project? cheers, nick On 6/24/05, //jonCates <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Scott C > > snds fantastic > > in support of sandy slippage + pouring snd into snd via summer > > // jonCates > # http://www.r4wb1t5.org > # http://www.criticalartware.net > # http://www.systemsapproach.net > > On Jun 18, 2005, at 7:42 PM, Scott Carver wrote: > > In the interest of being outside and actually appreciating summer > > while it's around, what about something performed live, outside, > > perhaps using sounds from the location of performance? Pick a outdoor > > location and a time (hopefully a time when it's appropriately > > summer-ish), and perform a piece, in whatever sense of 'perform' is > > appropriate and interesting. Screw sitting around in my house with > > headphones on, if I'm going to do a summer project, I want to make > > sounds so inextricably entangled with summer they can't be separated, > > summer and sound pouring into each other until the mixture is > > impossible to separate. > > > > - Scott C. > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 03:27:21 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36426-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:27:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:27:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 85907 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 03:27:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 85897 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 03:27:17 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:24:15 -0400 From: godo <xxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] soulseek To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <017101c57d23$329f1160$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2742.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2741.2600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_8HhxK+3bTOOWZHdPqtPk2A)" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-PopBeforeSMTPSenders: xxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - denver.servershost.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - hyperreal.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - pictomotion.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <016301c57d16$e01ebaf0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_8HhxK+3bTOOWZHdPqtPk2A) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Alina es lo primero que pude escuchar gracias a un amigo. Ahora tengo más trabajos de Arvö Part: Arvo Pärt - Arbos (2000) Arvo Pärt - Beatus Arvo Pärt - Collage Arvo Pärt - Fratres (1994) Arvo Pärt - Orient Occident (2002) Arvo Pärt - Tabula Rasa y encontré tambien los trabajos de Frederic Mompou increibles un abrazo ----- Original Message ----- From: Jorge Bachmann To: microsound Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 10:53 PM Subject: Re: [microsound] soulseek ni idea en cuanto a soulseek, pero en cuanto al trabajo de Arvo PÄRT si y no solamente Alina... no idea about soulseek, but regarding the work of Arvo PÄRT yes, and not only Alina... paz J21 On Jun 29, 2005, at 6:55 PM, godo wrote: > Hola, necesito conectarme de nuevo a soulseek pero a través de un > servidor proxy. Busqué ayuda en los foros de slsk pero todavía sin > solución. > > Nota: revisen Rune Grammofon (www.runegrammofon.com) > > Alguien en esta lista conoce el trabajo de Arvö Part: Alina? > > > justino aka jorge bachmann sculpture-photography-sound P.O.Box 15953 San Francisco, CA 94115-0953 M-415-706-9629 http://anihilo.com W-415-750-3517 http://ruidobello.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --Boundary_(ID_8HhxK+3bTOOWZHdPqtPk2A)-- From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 02:53:41 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36425-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 22:53:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 22:53:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 67422 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 02:53:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 67411 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 02:53:36 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 19:53:28 -0700 From: Jorge Bachmann <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] soulseek In-reply-to: <016301c57d16$e01ebaf0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <016301c57d16$e01ebaf0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx ni idea en cuanto a soulseek, pero en cuanto al trabajo de Arvo PÄRT si y no solamente Alina... no idea about soulseek, but regarding the work of Arvo PÄRT yes, and not only Alina... paz J21 On Jun 29, 2005, at 6:55 PM, godo wrote: > Hola, necesito conectarme de nuevo a soulseek pero a través de un > servidor proxy. Busqué ayuda en los foros de slsk pero todavía sin > solución. > > Nota: revisen Rune Grammofon (www.runegrammofon.com) > > Alguien en esta lista conoce el trabajo de Arvö Part: Alina? > > > justino aka jorge bachmann sculpture-photography-sound P.O.Box 15953 San Francisco, CA 94115-0953 M-415-706-9629 http://anihilo.com W-415-750-3517 http://ruidobello.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 01:59:08 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36424-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:59:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:59:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 35775 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 01:59:05 +0000 Received: (qmail 35764 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 01:59:04 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:55:59 -0400 From: godo <xxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] soulseek To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <016301c57d16$e01ebaf0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2742.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2741.2600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_5zEvSZaiBFqMNk+dHaGraw)" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-PopBeforeSMTPSenders: xxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - denver.servershost.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - hyperreal.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - pictomotion.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_5zEvSZaiBFqMNk+dHaGraw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hola, necesito conectarme de nuevo a soulseek pero a través de un servidor proxy. Busqué ayuda en los foros de slsk pero todavía sin solución. Nota: revisen Rune Grammofon (www.runegrammofon.com) Alguien en esta lista conoce el trabajo de Arvö Part: Alina? --Boundary_(ID_5zEvSZaiBFqMNk+dHaGraw)-- From ???@??? Thu Jun 30 01:51:59 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36423-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:51:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:51:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 31906 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 01:51:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 31895 invoked from network); Thu, 30 Jun 2005 01:51:55 +0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 11:51:47 +1000 From: Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 30/06/2005, at 7:58 AM, Michael Nisi wrote: > six people! c'mon. is that it? /join #microsound :) > From: "Tom Ellard" <xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> > Date: 13 June 2005 7:00:54 PM >> We found that a different bunch of people use KDX than used to be on >> the mailing list. Odd. >> It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, >> more about strong personalities. >> julian --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 29 22:02:06 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36422-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 18:02:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 18:02:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 36545 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 22:01:59 +0000 Received: (qmail 36535 invoked from network); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 22:01:59 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 17:01:55 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? X-Originating-IP: 66.72.201.239 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Originating-Server: ws1-1a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I will when I have some free time from worka nd I don't have any personal computer problems ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Nisi" <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:58:10 +0200 > > six people! c'mon. is that it? /join #microsound :) > > On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Join: > > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > > > Mac OS X Client: > > http://www.colloquy.info/ > > > > Firefox Extension: > > https://addons.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?id=16 > > > > cu, > > michael > > > > On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > Uh, C'mon! > > > > > > On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > I've just blindly did /join microsound on freenode and found > > it's already there. > > > > House occupation is always an option :) > > > > > > > > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > Michael > > > > > > > > ps. replacing one propretary system by another doen't seem to > > be that smart > > > > > > > > > > > > On 6/14/05, Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > I felt that Tom might better explain his decision to use KDX. Here is > > > > > his response. > > > > > > > > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > > > > > > > > > From: "Tom Ellard" <xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> > > > > > > Date: 13 June 2005 7:00:54 PM > > > > > > To: Julian Knowles > > > > > > Subject: Re: thread re KDX sevcom > > > > > > > > > > > > Interesting. > > > > > > > > > > > > My response: I am sure the microsound list can understand > > the need for > > > > > > experimentation - in this case in terms of > > communications. We're about > > > > > > 6 months down the track and I think I can answer some questions. > > > > > > > > > > > > We chose KDX because it works the same on all platforms. We looked at > > > > > > a lot of other tools and thought this seemed pretty compact and > > > > > > efficient. It fits on a USB key and it works on any machine you care > > > > > > to use - take it to India with you! It's also very security minded. > > > > > > Bad points - one developer - he's a touch nutty and we > > don't know when > > > > > > the new version comes. But he listened to every one of our requests, > > > > > > said some are already happening. We are more about talk > > than files and > > > > > > that's not common. > > > > > > > > > > > > Community building - is hard work. KDX is not for the lazy sysop. You > > > > > > have to have the drive of the small town. One problem is that people > > > > > > are confused by 'news'. It's the same as 'mail' but it > > just seems hard > > > > > > to grasp that you can just mail that way - and they feel pressured to > > > > > > chat when they don't have to do that. But having said that - once > > > > > > you're in KDX it uses up no bandwidth. Just log in and ignore it. We > > > > > > even found a new concept we call 'blurking'. You just sit in the chat > > > > > > and leave it running all day. Come home at night and see > > what was said > > > > > > all day. The quality of the community is people, not the program. > > > > > > > > > > > > We found that a different bunch of people use KDX than used to be on > > > > > > the mailing list. Odd. > > > > > > > > > > > > I would sum it up by saying that you cannot move a > > mailing list onto a > > > > > > KDX. It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, > > > > > > more about strong personalities. > > > > > > > > > > > > If anybody would like to kick the tyres they are welcome at > > > > > > 'sevcom.com' port '1984' pass and name 'guest'. > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 29 21:58:20 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36421-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 17:58:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 17:58:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 33863 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:58:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 33849 invoked from network); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 21:58:14 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:58:10 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=OjB9AuMquOfO7CJwnCbhwliT0YJvaoC0CY2k9uvhmNVbmLwclxmvUJRl6opDbZCCdt+8c+HC7I6bF8Hyj5205IbVLy6DFS/U+Cryu+CaQAhxmBmraQG/y0W4FU7Db91LRImZfQWI9AM7eKR1WdmiH0i9fInnCIZdyth1/Auwl5g= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx six people! c'mon. is that it? /join #microsound :) On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Join: > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > Mac OS X Client: > http://www.colloquy.info/ > > Firefox Extension: > https://addons.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?id=16 > > cu, > michael > > On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Uh, C'mon! > > > > On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > I've just blindly did /join microsound on freenode and found it's already there. > > > House occupation is always an option :) > > > > > > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > > > > > Take care, > > > Michael > > > > > > ps. replacing one propretary system by another doen't seem to be that smart > > > > > > > > > On 6/14/05, Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > I felt that Tom might better explain his decision to use KDX. Here is > > > > his response. > > > > > > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > > > > > > > From: "Tom Ellard" <xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> > > > > > Date: 13 June 2005 7:00:54 PM > > > > > To: Julian Knowles > > > > > Subject: Re: thread re KDX sevcom > > > > > > > > > > Interesting. > > > > > > > > > > My response: I am sure the microsound list can understand the need for > > > > > experimentation - in this case in terms of communications. We're about > > > > > 6 months down the track and I think I can answer some questions. > > > > > > > > > > We chose KDX because it works the same on all platforms. We looked at > > > > > a lot of other tools and thought this seemed pretty compact and > > > > > efficient. It fits on a USB key and it works on any machine you care > > > > > to use - take it to India with you! It's also very security minded. > > > > > Bad points - one developer - he's a touch nutty and we don't know when > > > > > the new version comes. But he listened to every one of our requests, > > > > > said some are already happening. We are more about talk than files and > > > > > that's not common. > > > > > > > > > > Community building - is hard work. KDX is not for the lazy sysop. You > > > > > have to have the drive of the small town. One problem is that people > > > > > are confused by 'news'. It's the same as 'mail' but it just seems hard > > > > > to grasp that you can just mail that way - and they feel pressured to > > > > > chat when they don't have to do that. But having said that - once > > > > > you're in KDX it uses up no bandwidth. Just log in and ignore it. We > > > > > even found a new concept we call 'blurking'. You just sit in the chat > > > > > and leave it running all day. Come home at night and see what was said > > > > > all day. The quality of the community is people, not the program. > > > > > > > > > > We found that a different bunch of people use KDX than used to be on > > > > > the mailing list. Odd. > > > > > > > > > > I would sum it up by saying that you cannot move a mailing list onto a > > > > > KDX. It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, > > > > > more about strong personalities. > > > > > > > > > > If anybody would like to kick the tyres they are welcome at > > > > > 'sevcom.com' port '1984' pass and name 'guest'. > > > > > > > > > > Cheers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 29 16:25:32 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36420-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 12:25:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 12:25:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 50057 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 16:25:27 +0000 Received: (qmail 50042 invoked from network); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 16:25:27 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 18:25:25 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=CWcqnvTFwF0ZFqtlk1yXeKGbpbZ0tun58sgw0DauzyU9BfqKEZ641262hd4y5U1egFGCdN74Ro2IQouxq9Sl23G9T0lY04S2ykMSIB5CYNk6YcQe+KmUnlD5teoNEsMBIn357vogYPI1gFJbiCbu3kydt6ySk43PsHW2HSmHxHA= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Join: irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound Mac OS X Client: http://www.colloquy.info/ Firefox Extension: https://addons.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?id=16 cu, michael On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Uh, C'mon! > > On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > I've just blindly did /join microsound on freenode and found it's already there. > > House occupation is always an option :) > > > > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > > > Take care, > > Michael > > > > ps. replacing one propretary system by another doen't seem to be that smart > > > > > > On 6/14/05, Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > I felt that Tom might better explain his decision to use KDX. Here is > > > his response. > > > > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > > > > > From: "Tom Ellard" <xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> > > > > Date: 13 June 2005 7:00:54 PM > > > > To: Julian Knowles > > > > Subject: Re: thread re KDX sevcom > > > > > > > > Interesting. > > > > > > > > My response: I am sure the microsound list can understand the need for > > > > experimentation - in this case in terms of communications. We're about > > > > 6 months down the track and I think I can answer some questions. > > > > > > > > We chose KDX because it works the same on all platforms. We looked at > > > > a lot of other tools and thought this seemed pretty compact and > > > > efficient. It fits on a USB key and it works on any machine you care > > > > to use - take it to India with you! It's also very security minded. > > > > Bad points - one developer - he's a touch nutty and we don't know when > > > > the new version comes. But he listened to every one of our requests, > > > > said some are already happening. We are more about talk than files and > > > > that's not common. > > > > > > > > Community building - is hard work. KDX is not for the lazy sysop. You > > > > have to have the drive of the small town. One problem is that people > > > > are confused by 'news'. It's the same as 'mail' but it just seems hard > > > > to grasp that you can just mail that way - and they feel pressured to > > > > chat when they don't have to do that. But having said that - once > > > > you're in KDX it uses up no bandwidth. Just log in and ignore it. We > > > > even found a new concept we call 'blurking'. You just sit in the chat > > > > and leave it running all day. Come home at night and see what was said > > > > all day. The quality of the community is people, not the program. > > > > > > > > We found that a different bunch of people use KDX than used to be on > > > > the mailing list. Odd. > > > > > > > > I would sum it up by saying that you cannot move a mailing list onto a > > > > KDX. It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, > > > > more about strong personalities. > > > > > > > > If anybody would like to kick the tyres they are welcome at > > > > 'sevcom.com' port '1984' pass and name 'guest'. > > > > > > > > Cheers. > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 29 16:19:17 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36419-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 12:19:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 12:19:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 44727 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 16:19:13 +0000 Received: (qmail 44716 invoked from network); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 16:19:12 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 17:19:07 +0100 From: Alex Young <xxxx@xxxxx.xx.xx> Subject: [microsound] IRC discussions To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new-20030616-p10 (Debian) at aardvarkmedia.co.uk X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx We're on IRC if anyone wants to come. Server: irc.freenode.org Channel: #microsound If you haven't used IRC before, there's quite a few clients around for different operating systems. Windows (shareware): http://www.xchat.org/windows/ Mac OS (free): http://www.colloquy.info/ Linux/other: You're probably an IRC junkie anyway ;) We could set dates and times for discussions if anyone's interested. It's really quite straightforward! There's channels on freenode for supercollider and pd as well. -- homepage: http://alexyoung.org music: http://noise.me.uk --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 29 15:56:03 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36418-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 11:56:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 11:56:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 28957 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 15:55:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 28945 invoked from network); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 15:55:50 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 17:55:47 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=af26m8LdTYv2fOvaVFDhvTUPBYusGoOx3wPBOCGYYe78qyx1gb+3rfyyzRjcb/PMlNDn9Rna/YY+NsVv1GK6mcwa0pAaqb/S4E0yVhwRowcuu0e0qAYKZ5M5YMTlAB3MXrrkg9z7uYVa+Ig98Z65ozRWaXmxuq8QNBXZb0+rep4= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Uh, C'mon! On 6/29/05, Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > I've just blindly did /join microsound on freenode and found it's already there. > House occupation is always an option :) > > irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound > > Take care, > Michael > > ps. replacing one propretary system by another doen't seem to be that smart > > > On 6/14/05, Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > I felt that Tom might better explain his decision to use KDX. Here is > > his response. > > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > > > From: "Tom Ellard" <xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> > > > Date: 13 June 2005 7:00:54 PM > > > To: Julian Knowles > > > Subject: Re: thread re KDX sevcom > > > > > > Interesting. > > > > > > My response: I am sure the microsound list can understand the need for > > > experimentation - in this case in terms of communications. We're about > > > 6 months down the track and I think I can answer some questions. > > > > > > We chose KDX because it works the same on all platforms. We looked at > > > a lot of other tools and thought this seemed pretty compact and > > > efficient. It fits on a USB key and it works on any machine you care > > > to use - take it to India with you! It's also very security minded. > > > Bad points - one developer - he's a touch nutty and we don't know when > > > the new version comes. But he listened to every one of our requests, > > > said some are already happening. We are more about talk than files and > > > that's not common. > > > > > > Community building - is hard work. KDX is not for the lazy sysop. You > > > have to have the drive of the small town. One problem is that people > > > are confused by 'news'. It's the same as 'mail' but it just seems hard > > > to grasp that you can just mail that way - and they feel pressured to > > > chat when they don't have to do that. But having said that - once > > > you're in KDX it uses up no bandwidth. Just log in and ignore it. We > > > even found a new concept we call 'blurking'. You just sit in the chat > > > and leave it running all day. Come home at night and see what was said > > > all day. The quality of the community is people, not the program. > > > > > > We found that a different bunch of people use KDX than used to be on > > > the mailing list. Odd. > > > > > > I would sum it up by saying that you cannot move a mailing list onto a > > > KDX. It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, > > > more about strong personalities. > > > > > > If anybody would like to kick the tyres they are welcome at > > > 'sevcom.com' port '1984' pass and name 'guest'. > > > > > > Cheers. > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 29 14:51:15 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36417-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 29 Jun 2005 10:51:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 10:51:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 91254 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:51:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 91243 invoked from network); Wed, 29 Jun 2005 14:51:09 +0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 16:51:06 +0200 From: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] hotline server? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Michael Nisi <xxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=so/NtXRtnCAVAT5GtW6Zu/L6ZzWluFr936kmq+2wZV+9iDhBbfEPgnTyiJOdHbvXNLaMDjvgXpTM4629mbG/MW8ihp1gHPQfWStZ45jcSHN694VWsezd39z8M5Vbaq9KeAS76MM35oda+zV6UmQMeUunZk8PGHK78zphl/SpyCg= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I've just blindly did /join microsound on freenode and found it's already there. House occupation is always an option :) irc://irc.freenode.org/microsound Take care, Michael ps. replacing one propretary system by another doen't seem to be that smart On 6/14/05, Julian Knowles <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > I felt that Tom might better explain his decision to use KDX. Here is > his response. > > Begin forwarded message: > > > From: "Tom Ellard" <xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> > > Date: 13 June 2005 7:00:54 PM > > To: Julian Knowles > > Subject: Re: thread re KDX sevcom > > > > Interesting. > > > > My response: I am sure the microsound list can understand the need for > > experimentation - in this case in terms of communications. We're about > > 6 months down the track and I think I can answer some questions. > > > > We chose KDX because it works the same on all platforms. We looked at > > a lot of other tools and thought this seemed pretty compact and > > efficient. It fits on a USB key and it works on any machine you care > > to use - take it to India with you! It's also very security minded. > > Bad points - one developer - he's a touch nutty and we don't know when > > the new version comes. But he listened to every one of our requests, > > said some are already happening. We are more about talk than files and > > that's not common. > > > > Community building - is hard work. KDX is not for the lazy sysop. You > > have to have the drive of the small town. One problem is that people > > are confused by 'news'. It's the same as 'mail' but it just seems hard > > to grasp that you can just mail that way - and they feel pressured to > > chat when they don't have to do that. But having said that - once > > you're in KDX it uses up no bandwidth. Just log in and ignore it. We > > even found a new concept we call 'blurking'. You just sit in the chat > > and leave it running all day. Come home at night and see what was said > > all day. The quality of the community is people, not the program. > > > > We found that a different bunch of people use KDX than used to be on > > the mailing list. Odd. > > > > I would sum it up by saying that you cannot move a mailing list onto a > > KDX. It becomes something else. It becomes smaller, more dedicated, > > more about strong personalities. > > > > If anybody would like to kick the tyres they are welcome at > > 'sevcom.com' port '1984' pass and name 'guest'. > > > > Cheers. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 21:58:56 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36416-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 17:58:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 17:58:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 61949 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 21:58:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 61913 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 21:58:54 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 14:58:50 -0700 (PDT) From: sick mode <xxxxxxxx_xxx_xxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] FREE DVD release from SickMODE.net - turb0slut - everything we do is illegal (music video album) To: xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx, xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx, xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx, xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=qPFfpL61u8E8XUEaim04nTa3RDF6GpmsaGeCMM3Gc1wOj/Uq63RqnzC8S0C2eFO1OQ0r2fWQjTlHlNTHNUubA2C1daKgPNwUmAqc2XYXtn69GrwjmdCYVYo2J1HLzABJ58lqtpewpCLOKs+GGt1kmgBAdCByRgjMviIIiLjtmzA= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx debut video collage release from turb0slut... 40 minutes of lofi psychedelic subversion backed by 21 tracks of the finest sickmode hardcore. free, as always, at www.sickmode.net quick link to releases: www.sickmode.net/mp3s DVD release is [mode017] turb0slut - everything we do is illegal __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 16:21:05 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36415-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:21:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 12:21:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 3555 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 16:21:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 3545 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 16:21:00 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 18:18:14 +0200 From: Roberto Rodrigo =?iso-8859-1?b?TWFzaeE=?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] aesthethic suspension X-Originating-IP: 81.202.60.103 To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.4 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx In my experience in playing or listening to music, I have observed that sometimes I get in a state of "mind suspension". This happens especially I think in improvisated music. There is a moment when you have that particular state that everything is in its place. I could not describe the characteristics of the music in this moment in a "scientifical" or rational way, but my experience is that some people agree when that happens and that is kind of a energetic flow to what you can be opened or not. To start that flow I think intuition is a better thing than strategy. Roberto Rodrigo --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 15:28:43 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36414-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 11:28:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 11:28:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 78983 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 15:28:38 +0000 Received: (qmail 78972 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 15:28:38 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 11:28:36 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <a05200f02bee6ee7c52ff@[192.168.0.101]> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <a05200f02bee6ee7c52ff@[192.168.0.101]> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > Which leads to my point: that IMHO music is more like a code than > language. It can clearly convey messages that are understood by > 'transmitter and receiver' through some level of agreed cultural > meaning (the less widespread the understanding, the more specialist > the codes - and the music), but unlike text or stoplight codes, the > code of music doesn't convey language, and unlike language (or > 'language about music') it cannot genuinely critique itself, convey a > manifesto, or request another cup of coffee. > I agree, but also feel that meaning can be assigned to anything, by anyone. >> Score one for the neanderthal in the opening scene of 2001space >> Oddesey when he realized a bone can be used to crush some sods head >> with. > > And then he started drumming with it, which IMO encapsulates the > prototype of 'instrumental' military music ; ) > > S. LOL! We use whatever we can to achieve a set goal. That was the gist of that blurb... aLEKs --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 13:29:05 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36413-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:29:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:29:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 30608 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:29:02 +0000 Received: (qmail 30597 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 13:29:01 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 23:27:49 +1000 From: Steve Adam <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> X-Sender: xxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <a05200f02bee6ee7c52ff@[192.168.0.101]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> Exegene wrote: >>Employing a stoplight as a morse code transmitter requires that it >>does not function as a stoplight because stoplight as it is cannot >>be seperated from stoplight as traffic control. A spoon and bowl >>can just as well be used to tap out morse code, although in that >>case they would still be able to function as a eating implements, >>but that bears in no way on whether or not "soup slurping" is a >>language. aleks vasic wrote: >Who cares if it does not function as a stop light. It can still be >used as a tool to communicate in the same exact way you and i are >right now. Not entirely the same way. It requires both knowledge of the language *and* knowledge of the stoplight code thru which to interpret that language. In this regard text is indeed a code as well, but it just happens to be one that is recognized by more people. Which leads to my point: that IMHO music is more like a code than language. It can clearly convey messages that are understood by 'transmitter and receiver' through some level of agreed cultural meaning (the less widespread the understanding, the more specialist the codes - and the music), but unlike text or stoplight codes, the code of music doesn't convey language, and unlike language (or 'language about music') it cannot genuinely critique itself, convey a manifesto, or request another cup of coffee. >Score one for the neanderthal in the opening scene of 2001space >Oddesey when he realized a bone can be used to crush some sods head >with. And then he started drumming with it, which IMO encapsulates the prototype of 'instrumental' military music ; ) S. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 06:01:18 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36412-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:01:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:01:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 86133 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 06:01:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 86112 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 06:01:15 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:01:10 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Well now that you have basically repeated what i sai On Jun 27, 2005, at 10:34 PM, Exegene wrote: > On Mon, 27 Jun 2005, aleks vasic wrote: > >> >> On Jun 27, 2005, at 5:17 PM, Exegene wrote: > *snip* >>> stoplights convey specific agreed on information, because stoplights >>> can't be used to convey musings on conveying musings with stoplights >>> the use of stoplights can't be taken as language. >> >> You cant use a stop light the same way you can use and old school >> Morse code/ telegraph? Whats the difference between assigning >> meaning to letters/and words and doing the same to a stop light? You >> know i can use a stop light to reproduce all which has been said in >> this thread today by assigning meaning to flashes, colours and what >> not. > *snip* > > Taking the excuse to engage in some slightly slimy post hoc wordplay, > and acknowledging only a particular case of stoplight to facilitate > brevity, the stoplight as it is is a device that will emit one of > three impulses, one signifying "stop", another "go", the last "prepare > to stop." Go is invariably followed by prepare to stop, followed by > stop, followed by go. The only room for variability in impulses > emitted is found in the time between the onset of each. The impulses > are meaningful only to a person operating a vehicle within sight of > and in line to pass under the stoplight. Brilliant... > > Employing a stoplight as a morse code transmitter requires that it > does not function as a stoplight because stoplight as it is cannot be > seperated from stoplight as traffic control. A spoon and bowl can just > as well be used to tap out morse code, although in that case they > would still be able to function as a eating implements, but that bears > in no way on whether or not "soup slurping" is a language. > > Who cares if it does not function as a stop light. It can still be used as a tool to communicate in the same exact way you and i are right now. Score one for the neanderthal in the opening scene of 2001space Oddesey when he realized a bone can be used to crush some sods head with. aLEKs > -- > Dear Patron Saint, > your lips are lopsided > www.devo.com/exegene > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 04:41:13 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36411-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 28 Jun 2005 00:41:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 00:41:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 57585 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 04:41:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 57575 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 04:41:11 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 06:39:38 +0200 From: Kassen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <006501c57b9b$68492aa0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <003b01c57b61$780a1ce0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Exegene; <snip clarification of terms> > "Something like literary theory..." might be most simply expressed as > talking about talking. Assuming this, is there really any culture that > does not have "something like literary theory...?" Well, being capable of selfreferentialness will do as a rough indiction for me now. I would think that this would, according to this definition, make a lot of music apear to be language. We can quote, for example, and exagerate while quoting which would to me strike me as comparable to talking about talking. The equivalent of a exhaustive book on linguistics would be quite hard but I think you could certainly compose a piece that would say something about similarities between minimalist piano pieces and loop-based techno, including citations from important sources in those fields. Such a piece may well be more convincing then a written article on the same topic.... > It is hoped that the proposal or one(many?) to shoulder its burden will > facilitate the creation and use of language in nonverbal communication > forms, ideally allowing, for example, for nonverbal music to be both > political and as expressive and meaningful as the communist manifesto, or > UN declaration of human rights, or what have you. Yes, well, here we have a little problem in that I think music can be selfreferential or refering to other musical expressions in meaningfull ways but it´s not so well suited for writing manifests (exept perhaps for manifests on music itself), declaring rights or reporting on court cases. If we realy wonder wether or not music counts as a language (or what it´d need to become one) we have to wonder wether it needs to be able to talk about arbitrary subjects; many real-life languages won´t have the vocabulary to talk about such matters as nuclear missile design which we clearly can´t hold against them because not all cultures build nuclear missiles. Music, currently, seems to have a vocabulary that´s badly suited for any technical or factually precise discussion but well suited for expressing feelings, moods and so on. One element that strikes me as important is that in music the composer will probably have the feeling he has expressed something and the listener will ideally have the feeling he got some amount of meaning from it. These things may well be very different but the same -if we are honest- holds true for English. However, in the case of music both may well get a sense of a satisfactory comunication out of a complete missmatch between those two, probably more so then with English. To illustrate; a while ago I composed a instrumental piece for a compilation on the subject of the battle for Stalingrad during WOII. Without mentioning the topic I played this to a friend and afterwards asked her what meaning she got from it. She replied that she beleived it to be about the transportation of the jews during the same war (this war wasn´t mentioned previously that afternoon). We now have to wonder wether my piece successfully comunicated something. I would say I was about as successfull as the average person shouting over heavy machinery or music is; some indication of the subject got across but not all of what was said about it. As far as purely political expressions go (and if we are flatering to me as a composer and disregard luck) you could say it was a success since the rejection of nazi practices got across. Personally I suspect that this inherent uncertainity and vagueness may well be a large part of what makes music so enjoyable. Law and contracts may be very exact and non-ambiguous (as far as comunication goes) but they are not realy enjoyable which I´m inclined to look at as a advantage for music in it´s comunicative ablity; if you want to be heard then there´s a lot to be said for making your expressions apealing to your audience. .....Which I suppose comes down more to a set of side-notes on the subject then a real discussion of all of your points. Yours, Kas. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 03:16:31 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36410-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:16:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:16:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 26709 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 03:16:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 26684 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 03:16:27 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:16:20 -0700 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] ***yet another reminder*** To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam: [F=0.0100000000; heur=0.500(0); stat=0.010; spamtraq-heur=0.500(2005062716)] X-MAIL-FROM: <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-SOURCE-IP: [64.143.55.196] X-Loop-Detect: 1 X-DistLoop-Detect: 1 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx ============================================================ below is a re-post of the info w/r/t the microsound-announcement list for those who have just joined the microsound list: ============================================================ John Saylor has generously donated both his server space and time setting up a new list for members who want to promote content...it is called the microsound-announce list and can be found here: http://microsound.nexthop.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce ########################################### - this is where the microsound community should post announcements promoting their music, label, radio show, upcoming concert, or whatever... ########################################### - here is how the process of switching over is going to work: - all people who normally post announcements to the microsound list will have two weeks (Friday April 8) to update their address books and switch to the announce list for posting future microsound related announcements - after April 8 (last Friday) members still posting announcements to the regular microsound list will be contacted by email and politely asked to redirect their posts to the microsound-announce list - if after a couple of polite requests the poster continues to post announcements to the regular list their microsound account will be terminated... - the process should be pretty simple but if there are problems unsub'ing or sub'ing please contact: Andy Thomas <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> - for the microsound list or John Saylor <xxxxx@xxx.xxx> - for the microsound-announce list and let them know about the problem you are having... thanks! KIM --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 03:15:21 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36409-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:15:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:15:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 25137 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 03:15:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 25111 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 03:15:14 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 05:15:06 +0200 (CEST) From: Exegene <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <003b01c57b61$780a1ce0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_z9sHJgOovE4CnUGtvXDy5A)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at devo.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <003b01c57b61$780a1ce0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_z9sHJgOovE4CnUGtvXDy5A) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Mon, 27 Jun 2005, Kassen wrote: > Exegene; > >> i submit that a language-candidate is indeed a language only if it can be >> used to write a book on literary theory(1). >> 1 - Where book means anything similar to a recorded, transmissible and >> archivable message, literary theory is divorced of western cultural >> imperialism, etc. > > Well, that´s a clear definition, but I fail to see how it´s a good or > usefull one or what the use is of excluding languages (well, canidates, to > you) that have no written form (there are a lot of those) or that belong to > culures that for some reason aren´t so inclined towards literary theory (I > could see some solid reasons for that). Okay. "Book" and "literary theory" may have been poor choices. How about instead "something like a book" and "something like literary theory, depending on what 'something like a book' evaulates to." Mayan calendars, the Finnbogi Saga, and so on satisfy "something like a book." Any language-candidate with words for "speak" and similar probably pass the "something like literary theory..." condition. > It will also immediately raise the question exactly what is literary theory > in this context while we try to sort the savages from the users of language. > "Jack´s song rhimes nicely" and "Error parsing "Exegene" in line 001; > invalid expression" could both be seen as examples of expressions that have > some aspects of literary theory", are they? Suppose we chanced uppon some > group of people that made sounds towards one another; how would we go about > comunicating with them, even if we had a interperter, if we wouldn´t yet be > sure wether they had a language at all? If I´d belong to such a group I´d > immediately claim that yes, you could write a book on language theory in my > language but no, we are not going to do it, being presently engaged in some > other activity. This would leave the poor anthropologist with the task of > trying to write or record a book equivalent in my language. *snip* "Something like literary theory..." might be most simply expressed as talking about talking. Assuming this, is there really any culture that does not have "something like literary theory...?" This phrase of course does not allow the transmission of novel information and can only reference what the receiver already knows on the matter of talking, and needs to be analysed to reveal is secret kernal. Similarly "something like a book" so far i can come up with no rigorous definition for, being able only to list things sufficiently "like a book" in the hopethat its own secret kernel may be meaningfully referenced. Clearly, if the proposal is to be good, useful, or advantageous, the two gaping placeholders will require serious investment of effort. Just who does or does not understand whom does not come into the picture of determining who is in posession of language by the proposed criteria. If the strange people with the strange language-candidate are capable of, say, spreading rumors, recognising those rumors as rumors, and expressing that they are indeed so, they would certainly be in posession of language. To indulge in buzzwords, it's the fractaline complexity of language that is one of its most defining feature, that gives it its expressivity, that can only occur with the potential for significant self-reference. Whether the possibility of self reference require some amount of something like self reference to be already in the memory of the user of the language-candidate in question is a difficult question. But, it seems that the ability to analyse analysis really is so important, because it is a languages equivalent of self-awareness. It's not enough that a person is able to transmit meaning, the language and its words/sagas/tax law reform proposals/LPs/... have to be part of the conversation, possibly holding their own private conversation, too. It is hoped that the proposal or one(many?) to shoulder its burden will facilitate the creation and use of language in nonverbal communication forms, ideally allowing, for example, for nonverbal music to be both political and as expressive and meaningful as the communist manifesto, or UN declaration of human rights, or what have you. -- Dear Patron Saint, your lips are lopsided www.devo.com/exegene --Boundary_(ID_z9sHJgOovE4CnUGtvXDy5A) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --Boundary_(ID_z9sHJgOovE4CnUGtvXDy5A)-- From ???@??? Tue Jun 28 02:35:05 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36408-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:35:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:35:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 8098 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:35:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 8086 invoked from network); Tue, 28 Jun 2005 02:35:01 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 04:34:54 +0200 (CEST) From: Exegene <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at devo.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Mon, 27 Jun 2005, aleks vasic wrote: > > On Jun 27, 2005, at 5:17 PM, Exegene wrote: *snip* >> stoplights convey specific agreed on information, because stoplights can't >> be used to convey musings on conveying musings with stoplights the use of >> stoplights can't be taken as language. > > You cant use a stop light the same way you can use and old school Morse code/ > telegraph? Whats the difference between assigning meaning to letters/and > words and doing the same to a stop light? You know i can use a stop light to > reproduce all which has been said in this thread today by assigning meaning > to flashes, colours and what not. *snip* Taking the excuse to engage in some slightly slimy post hoc wordplay, and acknowledging only a particular case of stoplight to facilitate brevity, the stoplight as it is is a device that will emit one of three impulses, one signifying "stop", another "go", the last "prepare to stop." Go is invariably followed by prepare to stop, followed by stop, followed by go. The only room for variability in impulses emitted is found in the time between the onset of each. The impulses are meaningful only to a person operating a vehicle within sight of and in line to pass under the stoplight. Employing a stoplight as a morse code transmitter requires that it does not function as a stoplight because stoplight as it is cannot be seperated from stoplight as traffic control. A spoon and bowl can just as well be used to tap out morse code, although in that case they would still be able to function as a eating implements, but that bears in no way on whether or not "soup slurping" is a language. -- Dear Patron Saint, your lips are lopsided www.devo.com/exegene --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 23:03:02 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36407-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:03:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:02:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 18236 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:02:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 18222 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:02:56 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:02:53 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Never mind Graham answered my question, thanks in advance all who are furiously typing at this moment!;) aLEKs On Jun 27, 2005, at 7:01 PM, aleks vasic wrote: > No your memory does not play tricks. In my sickness i have been > watching some rare TV and caught Forbidden Planet just a few days ago > on some channel( i watch about an hour of TV a week so i am not to > keen on what channels are out there besides cartoon network/Comedy > Channel) > > The scene you described made me sit up in my seat and say, "Wow." > That was cool! > It was very microsoundish. I very much enjoyed all the sound elements > in the film, keeping in mind that the film was made some 40 plus odd > years ago. anyone know who did the sound in that film? The same gent > who did the score? > > > aLEKs > > > On Jun 27, 2005, at 6:47 PM, bobby whn wrote: > >> >> its all about the barron's sound for 'forbidden planet' , i like the >> scene where the doctor plays some >> music made by the alien race which used to inhabit the planet , after >> he's described how immensely >> advanced and intense they were , and its this wonderful bleepy >> semi-microsound-ish (memory plays >> tricks) electronic music. I heard it was made by constructing doomed >> circuits which gradually died >> and produced unique sounds , which were then used for little >> leitmotifs for some of the characters >> also. Anybody know more about this? >> >> -Mr whn (sounds a bit like 'mysteron', heheh) >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's >> FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 23:01:30 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36406-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:01:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:01:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 16979 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:01:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 16967 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:01:26 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:01:23 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... In-reply-to: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx No your memory does not play tricks. In my sickness i have been watching some rare TV and caught Forbidden Planet just a few days ago on some channel( i watch about an hour of TV a week so i am not to keen on what channels are out there besides cartoon network/Comedy Channel) The scene you described made me sit up in my seat and say, "Wow." That was cool! It was very microsoundish. I very much enjoyed all the sound elements in the film, keeping in mind that the film was made some 40 plus odd years ago. anyone know who did the sound in that film? The same gent who did the score? aLEKs On Jun 27, 2005, at 6:47 PM, bobby whn wrote: > > its all about the barron's sound for 'forbidden planet' , i like the > scene where the doctor plays some > music made by the alien race which used to inhabit the planet , after > he's described how immensely > advanced and intense they were , and its this wonderful bleepy > semi-microsound-ish (memory plays > tricks) electronic music. I heard it was made by constructing doomed > circuits which gradually died > and produced unique sounds , which were then used for little > leitmotifs for some of the characters > also. Anybody know more about this? > > -Mr whn (sounds a bit like 'mysteron', heheh) > > _________________________________________________________________ > Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's > FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 22:49:40 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36405-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:49:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:49:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 12473 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:49:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 12463 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:49:35 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:48:15 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx from the liner notes of the album: “We design and construct electronic circuits which function electronically in a manner remarkably similar to the way that lower life-forms function psychologically,” the composers explain. “There is a comprehensive mathematical science explaining it, called ‘Cybernetics,” which is concerned with Control and Communication in the Animal and Machine. It was first propounded by Prof. Norbert Wiener of M.I.T. who found that there are certain natural laws of behaviour applicable alike to animals (including humans) and electronic machines. In scoring FORBIDDEN PLANET ? as in all our work ? we created individual cybernetic circuits for particular themes and leit motifs, rather than using standard sound generators. Actually, each circuit has a characteristic activity pattern as well as a ‘voice.’ Most remarkable is that the sounds which emanate from these electronic nervous systems seem to convey strong emotional meaning to listeners.” there's a great reaktor patch called 'krel' which does this sound justice... do a search on the native instruments page.. g. bobby whn wrote: > its all about the barron's sound for 'forbidden planet' , i like the scene > where the doctor plays some > music made by the alien race which used to inhabit the planet , after he's > described how immensely > advanced and intense they were , and its this wonderful bleepy > semi-microsound-ish (memory plays > tricks) electronic music. I heard it was made by constructing doomed > circuits which gradually died > and produced unique sounds , which were then used for little leitmotifs for > some of the characters > also. Anybody know more about this? > > -Mr whn (sounds a bit like 'mysteron', heheh) > > _________________________________________________________________ > Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! > http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 22:47:20 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36403-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:47:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:47:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 10067 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:47:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 10057 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:47:15 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:47:12 +0000 From: bobby whn <xxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... In-reply-to: <l03130302bee62ba19b56@[213.84.105.55]> X-Originating-IP: [64.4.61.207] X-Sender: xxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bcc: Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Originating-Email: [xxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jun 2005 22:47:12.0579 (UTC) FILETIME=[287A7130:01C57B6A] its all about the barron's sound for 'forbidden planet' , i like the scene where the doctor plays some music made by the alien race which used to inhabit the planet , after he's described how immensely advanced and intense they were , and its this wonderful bleepy semi-microsound-ish (memory plays tricks) electronic music. I heard it was made by constructing doomed circuits which gradually died and produced unique sounds , which were then used for little leitmotifs for some of the characters also. Anybody know more about this? -Mr whn (sounds a bit like 'mysteron', heheh) _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 22:47:44 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36404-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:47:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:47:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 11127 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:47:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 11117 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:47:42 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:46:21 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] R: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx knowing williams' creative process and his thoughtfulness, you're probably right. speaking of which, i'm going to see the toronto symphony orchestra do 'star wars' tomorrow and wednesday (hosted by anthony daniels!)... i've been dreaming about this gig for the past 27 years:) very unmicrosound, though. > > > I don't know if John Williams has chosen those 5 notes because of this but > D4 E4 C4 C3 G3 are all in the C1 overtones series > which is not a western harmony's prerogative (though western harmony's > theorists too many times used the overtone series to justify funny rules). > I think this gives a much more wider perspective to his motif. > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 22:34:30 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36402-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:34:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:34:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 1919 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:34:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 1880 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:34:19 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 00:33:54 +0200 From: Davide Morelli <xxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] R: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-index: AcV7ZMtwmk6H4S7WRzCD15dJyWIpLgAAUung Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > i always loved that idea in the film, although i find it > highly suspect that the aliens prefer western harmony... > I don't know if John Williams has chosen those 5 notes because of this but D4 E4 C4 C3 G3 are all in the C1 overtones series which is not a western harmony's prerogative (though western harmony's theorists too many times used the overtone series to justify funny rules). I think this gives a much more wider perspective to his motif. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 22:20:39 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36401-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:20:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:20:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 94979 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:20:33 +0000 Received: (qmail 94963 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:20:33 +0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 00:20:27 +0200 From: Arie van Schutterhoef <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <l03130302bee62ba19b56@[213.84.105.55]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by XS4ALL Virus Scanner X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >i find it highly suspect that the aliens prefer western harmony... -You might be disappointed: but aliens are like everybody else in the universe. If you pay enough they play your tune in whatever key you like... AvS . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... ` |Schreck Ensemble . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + ` |# -laboratory for live electro-acoustic music- # | | http://www.schreck.nl/ | | http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/ | ` *===========================================================++ ` |Compositions http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/compo.html | ` |Samples http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/samp.html | ` |Patches http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/pat.html | ` |Videos http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/video.html | ` |Scores http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/scores.html | *===========================================================++ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 22:08:55 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36400-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:08:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:08:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 87546 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:08:52 +0000 Received: (qmail 87536 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:08:51 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:07:31 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] non-verbal encounters of the 3rd kind... To: Microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx last scene in the movie... light and sound used to communicate to the little aliens... (cue john williams 5 note melodic motif) who would have thought that the intergalactic language would turn out to be synthesis... the aliens seem to have no problem understanding major scales:) i always loved that idea in the film, although i find it highly suspect that the aliens prefer western harmony... now that i'm thinking about, isn't tabla music written out as words, as opposed to notes? and aren't the tabla drum patterns themselves used to communicate specific narratives? "this means something..." weird al. g. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 21:56:01 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36399-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:56:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:56:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 81576 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:55:59 +0000 Received: (qmail 81566 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:55:58 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:55:55 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Jun 27, 2005, at 5:17 PM, Exegene wrote: > On Mon, 27 Jun 2005, Kassen wrote: > > i submit that a language-candidate is indeed a language only if it can > be used to write a book on literary theory(1). It follows that while > stoplights convey specific agreed on information, because stoplights > can't be used to convey musings on conveying musings with stoplights > the use of stoplights can't be taken as language. You cant use a stop light the same way you can use and old school Morse code/ telegraph? Whats the difference between assigning meaning to letters/and words and doing the same to a stop light? You know i can use a stop light to reproduce all which has been said in this thread today by assigning meaning to flashes, colours and what not. Its just a vessel with which we use in order to communicate. Sure carrying around a stop light with you in your day to day life is not very convenient, and speech and language fill that need in much more efficient manner, but thats not the point here. > > Further consideration of the thread starter seems to support certain > other listees in their belief that nonverbal music may be made > political by means of packaging, titling, and other things external to > the music proper, and that nontraditional and noncommercial music are > inherently political. A small push : the finished track is the > transmissible, marketable congealment of the artist, but is not the > vital truth, the artist's existence, awareness, and life-activities. > Any attempt to keep politics sequestered inside the (nonverbal) music > means allowing the artist's greatest expressive tool - hirself - to be > depoliticized. > > > 1 - Where book means anything similar to a recorded, transmissible and > archivable message, literary theory is divorced of western cultural > imperialism, etc. > Unless i misunderstand you i believe the exact opposite to be true. aLEKs --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 21:46:22 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36398-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:46:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:45:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 76797 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:46:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 76786 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:46:17 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:44:57 +0200 From: Kassen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <003b01c57b61$780a1ce0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Exegene; > i submit that a language-candidate is indeed a language only if it can be > used to write a book on literary theory(1). > 1 - Where book means anything similar to a recorded, transmissible and > archivable message, literary theory is divorced of western cultural > imperialism, etc. Well, that´s a clear definition, but I fail to see how it´s a good or usefull one or what the use is of excluding languages (well, canidates, to you) that have no written form (there are a lot of those) or that belong to culures that for some reason aren´t so inclined towards literary theory (I could see some solid reasons for that). It will also immediately raise the question exactly what is literary theory in this context while we try to sort the savages from the users of language. "Jack´s song rhimes nicely" and "Error parsing "Exegene" in line 001; invalid expression" could both be seen as examples of expressions that have some aspects of literary theory", are they? Suppose we chanced uppon some group of people that made sounds towards one another; how would we go about comunicating with them, even if we had a interperter, if we wouldn´t yet be sure wether they had a language at all? If I´d belong to such a group I´d immediately claim that yes, you could write a book on language theory in my language but no, we are not going to do it, being presently engaged in some other activity. This would leave the poor anthropologist with the task of trying to write or record a book equivalent in my language. Sillyness aside, I´m not yet convinced of your proposed definition; I´d realy like to hear some advantages of it. For sure the ability of selfreferntailness is a important stage in culural development but is it so important that we can claim languages that don´t have it (yet) aren´t languages? Yours, Kas. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 21:26:39 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36397-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:26:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:26:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 68891 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:26:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 68881 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:26:36 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:26:31 +0200 From: Arie van Schutterhoef <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <l03130301bee61eb49198@[213.84.105.55]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by XS4ALL Virus Scanner X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >Any attempt to keep politics sequestered inside the (nonverbal) music >means >allowing the >artist's greatest expressive tool - hirself - to be >>depoliticized. -If that is the decision of the artist, I don't see any problems with that. It's only the problem of the sycophants, svengali's and other vultures, who want to decide for others. AvS . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... ` |Schreck Ensemble . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + ` |# -laboratory for live electro-acoustic music- # | | http://www.schreck.nl/ | | http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/ | ` *===========================================================++ ` |Compositions http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/compo.html | ` |Samples http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/samp.html | ` |Patches http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/pat.html | ` |Videos http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/video.html | ` |Scores http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/scores.html | *===========================================================++ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 21:17:46 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36396-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:17:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:17:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 64660 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:17:40 +0000 Received: (qmail 64650 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:17:40 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:17:32 +0200 (CEST) From: Exegene <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at devo.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Mon, 27 Jun 2005, Kassen wrote: > aleks vasic; *snip* >> IMO, or a better description would be complex communication. Using >> your rationale the lights on a stop light, red, yellow, and green are a >> language of sorts. > > Yes. It is debatable indeed wether that is a language. When push comes to > shove I think I believe those things to be a very limited language with just > a few words and hardly any gramar. To me, within the larger context of > comunicating ideas (possibly political ones) through the use of non-verbal > sound the concept of comunication and the transfer of information are much > more interesting then wether something is a actual language, should we be > able to find a definition of "language" that everybody finds satisfactory.. *snip* i submit that a language-candidate is indeed a language only if it can be used to write a book on literary theory(1). It follows that while stoplights convey specific agreed on information, because stoplights can't be used to convey musings on conveying musings with stoplights the use of stoplights can't be taken as language. Further consideration of the thread starter seems to support certain other listees in their belief that nonverbal music may be made political by means of packaging, titling, and other things external to the music proper, and that nontraditional and noncommercial music are inherently political. A small push : the finished track is the transmissible, marketable congealment of the artist, but is not the vital truth, the artist's existence, awareness, and life-activities. Any attempt to keep politics sequestered inside the (nonverbal) music means allowing the artist's greatest expressive tool - hirself - to be depoliticized. 1 - Where book means anything similar to a recorded, transmissible and archivable message, literary theory is divorced of western cultural imperialism, etc. -- Dear Patron Saint, your lips are lopsided www.devo.com/exegene --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 21:04:07 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36395-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:04:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:04:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 58598 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:04:04 +0000 Received: (qmail 58588 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:04:03 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 23:02:45 +0200 From: Kassen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <003601c57b5b$92c74360$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx aleks vasic > I can be pretty dense sometimes, also afflicted with tunnel vision here > and there. Rereading your initial post as well as your explanation in > this post, i do not know how i missed the gist of it. Sorry i am sick > and i have a fever, maybe i should refrain from discourse that requires > my brain to function past the thrid grade level! Get well soon. Wars, language, music and 16 year olds with dubious amounts of hair styling carying record bags will still be there for you after your fever is gone again. Yours, Kas. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 20:52:24 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36394-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:52:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:52:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 51904 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:52:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 51891 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:52:17 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:52:14 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Jun 27, 2005, at 4:21 PM, Kassen wrote: > aleks vasic; > >> The use of music on the battle field had a finite set of purposes >> throughout military history. Communication, psychological >> intimidation, morale booster. > > Yes, I agree. What I was trying to say was that such factors also come > in > play in conventional music, in adition to the IMHO comparable element > of > impressing prospective mates and the afiliation with a certain social > tribe. > That last factor may also play a role in military use of sound and > music. > What I intended as the core of my message but which may have been > pushed to > the back by other points is that when those factors play a role in > civilian > music then the influence they have is taken to be caused by aestetic > concerns while very comparable influences in military use are often > asumed > to be purely practical or admitted to signal the kind of thing we´d > rather > not admit to signalling in day to day life on a personal scale. > > I think this muddies that way in which we evaluate the material, > particularly because it would mean multiple levels of comunication > within > music. I can be pretty dense sometimes, also afflicted with tunnel vision here and there. Rereading your initial post as well as your explanation in this post, i do not know how i missed the gist of it. Sorry i am sick and i have a fever, maybe i should refrain from discourse that requires my brain to function past the thrid grade level! >> To the best of my knowledge we are addressing the use of Music and >> instruments on the battlefield as a form of communication , at least >> thats what i responded too from a previous microsounders post. > > Yes, I might have digressed from that a little, back to the > comunicative > sides of sounds and music. > Sorry if that confused. > > I jumped on your discussion of military comunication more to try to > use it > to illustrate sides of non-military music then to engage in a detailed > discussion on battlefield comunication, interesting as that may be > currently > with the word "friendly fire" becoming common. > >> Im sure some personal choice may go into it. But in the spirit of the >> Military tradition, functionality is king. You can play all the >> beatiful songs you want after your enemies are crushed under foot. To >> crush them you need an efficient way to communicate on the field of >> battle. Hence the topic matter. Remember my original opinion was >> that >> using music on the battlefield is not a form of literal communication >> IMO, or a better description would be complex communication. Using >> your rationale the lights on a stop light, red, yellow, and green are >> a >> language of sorts. > > Yes. It is debatable indeed wether that is a language. When push comes > to > shove I think I believe those things to be a very limited language > with just > a few words and hardly any gramar. To me, within the larger context of > comunicating ideas (possibly political ones) through the use of > non-verbal > sound the concept of comunication and the transfer of information are > much > more interesting then wether something is a actual language, should we > be > able to find a definition of "language" that everybody finds > satisfactory.. > > Hope that helps. > Yes it does, but many of your thoughts and opinions open up other cans of worms such as point of reference of an individual, of a culture, context, point of reference of said context. All points you addressed directly or indirectly. As is said i was afflicted with tunnel vision inregards to all non military matter within the topic, again my delerium must be to blame for this! aLEKs --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 20:23:23 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36393-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:23:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:23:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 33983 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:23:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 33972 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:23:17 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:21:59 +0200 From: Kassen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <003101c57b55$e0c87f80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx aleks vasic; > The use of music on the battle field had a finite set of purposes > throughout military history. Communication, psychological > intimidation, morale booster. Yes, I agree. What I was trying to say was that such factors also come in play in conventional music, in adition to the IMHO comparable element of impressing prospective mates and the afiliation with a certain social tribe. That last factor may also play a role in military use of sound and music. What I intended as the core of my message but which may have been pushed to the back by other points is that when those factors play a role in civilian music then the influence they have is taken to be caused by aestetic concerns while very comparable influences in military use are often asumed to be purely practical or admitted to signal the kind of thing we´d rather not admit to signalling in day to day life on a personal scale. I think this muddies that way in which we evaluate the material, particularly because it would mean multiple levels of comunication within music. > > To the best of my knowledge we are addressing the use of Music and > instruments on the battlefield as a form of communication , at least > thats what i responded too from a previous microsounders post. Yes, I might have digressed from that a little, back to the comunicative sides of sounds and music. Sorry if that confused. I jumped on your discussion of military comunication more to try to use it to illustrate sides of non-military music then to engage in a detailed discussion on battlefield comunication, interesting as that may be currently with the word "friendly fire" becoming common. > Im sure some personal choice may go into it. But in the spirit of the > Military tradition, functionality is king. You can play all the > beatiful songs you want after your enemies are crushed under foot. To > crush them you need an efficient way to communicate on the field of > battle. Hence the topic matter. Remember my original opinion was that > using music on the battlefield is not a form of literal communication > IMO, or a better description would be complex communication. Using > your rationale the lights on a stop light, red, yellow, and green are a > language of sorts. Yes. It is debatable indeed wether that is a language. When push comes to shove I think I believe those things to be a very limited language with just a few words and hardly any gramar. To me, within the larger context of comunicating ideas (possibly political ones) through the use of non-verbal sound the concept of comunication and the transfer of information are much more interesting then wether something is a actual language, should we be able to find a definition of "language" that everybody finds satisfactory.. Hope that helps. Yours, Kas. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 20:06:27 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36392-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:06:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:06:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 24124 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:06:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 24096 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:06:22 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:06:20 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <l03130300bee60a97d78c@[213.84.105.55]> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <l03130300bee60a97d78c@[213.84.105.55]> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Touche'! LOL! aLEKs On Jun 27, 2005, at 4:00 PM, Arie van Schutterhoef wrote: >> fail to see how its relevant to communicating on a battlefield using >>> instruments and bugle calls(Loops!) > -It makes the communication with the enemy much better, because now > they > now where you are and can shoot you more easily.... > > AvS > > . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . > ..................................................................... > > ` |Schreck Ensemble . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + > > ` |# -laboratory for live electro-acoustic music- # | > | http://www.schreck.nl/ | > | http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/ | > ` *===========================================================++ > ` |Compositions http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/compo.html | > ` |Samples http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/samp.html | > ` |Patches http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/pat.html | > ` |Videos http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/video.html | > > ` |Scores http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/scores.html | > > *===========================================================++ > . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . > ..................................................................... > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 20:00:18 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36391-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:00:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 16:00:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 18942 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:00:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 18931 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:00:12 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 22:00:08 +0200 From: Arie van Schutterhoef <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <l03130300bee60a97d78c@[213.84.105.55]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by XS4ALL Virus Scanner X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >fail to see how its relevant to communicating on a battlefield using >>instruments and bugle calls(Loops!) -It makes the communication with the enemy much better, because now they now where you are and can shoot you more easily.... AvS . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... ` |Schreck Ensemble . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + ` |# -laboratory for live electro-acoustic music- # | | http://www.schreck.nl/ | | http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/ | ` *===========================================================++ ` |Compositions http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/compo.html | ` |Samples http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/samp.html | ` |Patches http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/pat.html | ` |Videos http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/video.html | ` |Scores http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/scores.html | *===========================================================++ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 19:47:33 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36390-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:47:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:47:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 10928 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:47:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 10901 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:47:23 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:47:22 -0500 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Language is much broader than signals, although signals are included within language, particularly in the imperative statements: "Wash the dishes. Get that report out by 3 P.M." Signals are commands that are meant to be unambiguous and have a direct effect on the party receiving the communication. A signal could also be entirely mechanical (or biological) with no human involved in the communication process. A chemical in the brain can act as a signal after all. I take spoken language, on the other hand, to include much ambiguity and to include the possibility for multiple interpretations and creative interplay which may or may not have any clear purpose or function. Likewise, musically normally operates in an ambiguous way, as a play of abstract sonorities controlled by arbitrary sets of rules and with any meaning or message tending to be ambiguous. Clearly, however, sound can be used as a command or signal in an UN-ambiguous way, depending on the context. Is not the return of the 4-to-the-floor kick drum after an extended absence not a command to resume dancing in house and techno music? Deleuze and Guattari do some interesting exploration of "order words" and the relationship between language and command (and a signal is a kind of command) - a speech situation which, interestingly, they take as central to language whereas a philosopher like Habermas takes such situations to be marginal and not the "essence" of inter-subjective communication. ~David graham miller wrote: >just to play devil's advocate here, but isn't spoken language just >'signals' too? more complex and multifaceted, yes. more open to multiple >interpretations and ambiguity? yes. but signals none less encoded into >sound deep within the larynx... ditto for written language... every form of >communication, which includes art, falls within the scope of semiotics... > >i'm not sure there is such a thing as a 'literal language' aside from >mathematics, the only form of communication that holds true throughout the >universe (more or less...) >g. > >aleks vasic wrote: > > > >>Well the use of music on the battle field is not "Literal >>communication" Its a form of cumminication that would be better labeld >>as "Signals" Because thats what they were. Just because music can be >>used in ways other then it was intended to, does not make it a literal >>language. I think you can come up with a better example then military >>use of music, which at the time was the best way to communicate over >>small distances. >> >>I never defined music or launguage. Please reread my original post. >> >>aLEKs >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 19:36:13 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36389-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:36:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:36:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 4568 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:36:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 4545 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:36:08 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:36:06 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx The use of music on the battle field had a finite set of purposes throughout military history. Communication, psychological intimidation, morale booster. To the best of my knowledge we are addressing the use of Music and instruments on the battlefield as a form of communication , at least thats what i responded too from a previous microsounders post. On Jun 27, 2005, at 3:05 PM, Kassen wrote: > I think the line is a little more blurry then that. I once read that > music > originated from young males trying to impress the girls (from time to > time I > get the idea nothing changed when looking at DJ or car audio > culture...) and > there you could argue it´s very much a comunicative signal. Love > songs, the > more political side of punk and so on could all be argued to > comunicate. > Just like a big drum is a good medium to get messages across large > fields > putting you political or romantic aspirations to melody may make them > cary > futher, albeit in a different way. > I see where your going but i fail to see how its relevant to communicating on a battlefield using instruments and bugle calls(Loops!) > In many cases I´m not sure I realy see so much difference particularly > not > because music has many other functions besides just being beautufull. I > think there is for example some element of marking teritory with > portable > instalations meant for high volume such as ghetto blasters. When > picking a > drum from amongst multiple suitable canidates i´m sure the warlords of > old > would want the one that sounded the lowest for reasons very similar to > D&B > producers. In the case of the producer we´d probably call that a > musical > choice, why not in the warlord? Im sure some personal choice may go into it. But in the spirit of the Military tradition, functionality is king. You can play all the beatiful songs you want after your enemies are crushed under foot. To crush them you need an efficient way to communicate on the field of battle. Hence the topic matter. Remember my original opinion was that using music on the battlefield is not a form of literal communication IMO, or a better description would be complex communication. Using your rationale the lights on a stop light, red, yellow, and green are a language of sorts. While logically i would have to agree with you, it would hardly be the choice i would make had i a need to adopt a fform of communication for whatever reason. Its limited, that was the gist of my intitial statement that you responded too. Kinda apples and oranges IMO. > Perhaps it´s pushing it to call it a language but I think those uses of > sound are often very similar in how they map to meaning, even if much > of > this process may be unconcious. Yes, i touched upon this in my previous paragraph. Again i agree. > > Microsound would at first seem to be too abstract to be linked to > comunication in such a blatant way but I think it´s no accident that > Microsound often uses sounds asociated with breaking or broken > products and > that the Microsound comunity is very crtical of comercial companies. > The > impressiveness of the drum sound does not nesicarily have anything to > do > with the functioning of the batalions as such but it´s still there > because > the general needs to urgently express how much more impressive his > army is > and I think this is akin to a Microsound composer that still uses the > sounds > of broken things even when the subject of the piece is -say- > summertime. Thats a stretch IMO, care to elaborate for me incase i am not following you? > > Multiple levels of symbolism and comunication may be intertwined, > perhaps > even conflicting (one MTV leader sounded quite microsoundy to me) but > even > if it´s not possible to "translate" everything coherently all of the > time, > there´s still a lot of cumunication through symbolim going on and > exactly > what part of that is "music" to you may depend more on how you relate > to the > sound and who makes it then to anyhting else. > > My cents, > Kas. > Within Context, sure. aLEKs --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 19:21:13 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36388-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:21:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:21:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 92573 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:21:11 +0000 Received: (qmail 92546 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:21:10 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:19:47 +0200 From: Kassen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <002001c57b4d$313544c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mr.D > The problem I see is that spoken language is by default a mere copy > of the real thing. We only describe things with spoken languages, we > don't actualize them. "Sold". Kas. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 19:14:24 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36387-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:14:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:14:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 88903 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:14:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 88893 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:14:16 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 12:14:09 -0700 From: "Mr.D" <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at xdrive.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Jun 27, 2005, at 11:01 AM, graham miller wrote: > just to play devil's advocate here, but isn't spoken language just > 'signals' too? more complex and multifaceted, yes. more open to > multiple > interpretations and ambiguity? yes. but signals none less encoded into > sound deep within the larynx... ditto for written language... every > form of > communication, which includes art, falls within the scope of > semiotics... The problem I see is that spoken language is by default a mere copy of the real thing. We only describe things with spoken languages, we don't actualize them. In music, things are actualized as new sound, with an ability to be completely and utterly devoid of context except that which defines it in the instant it is created. With languages that use words that have already been created to describe something, we automatically have a cognitive association with the word, so it seems to me that it is impossible to simply divorce words from language. I really like a lot of the work by poets like Retallack (she has some wonderful poetry, besides the great published conversations with Cage) and Mac Low that take pieces and parts of language and diverge their meaning... Cage did a lot of this too, and I also like similar stuff done by cummings, Joyce and Stein. > i'm not sure there is such a thing as a 'literal language' aside from > mathematics, the only form of communication that holds true > throughout the > universe (more or less...) But math falls right into the same trap that word-based languages do. The symbols are only that, signifiers and abstractions of something that's real. Concepts are only concepts because we enumerate them, and exist exclusively from the language that describes them, regardless of whether they are qualitative or quantitative. m --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 19:06:27 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36386-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:06:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 15:06:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 84746 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:06:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 84734 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 19:06:21 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 21:05:04 +0200 From: Kassen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <001b01c57b4b$2228f3c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx aleks vasic > Well, the use of INSTRUMENTS, to communicate on the battlefield is not > music in its traditional sense. More along the lines of humans being > problem solvers and using whatever is at hand to solve said problem, in > this case keeping formations in sync, signaling attack and retreats, > and other military gobbledy gook. Its definatley not a language when > compared to literal communication(i assume this to be written word). > Its very limited for todays world, but it did serve its purpose. Non > exhistent in todays military world aside from nostalgia and tradition. I think the line is a little more blurry then that. I once read that music originated from young males trying to impress the girls (from time to time I get the idea nothing changed when looking at DJ or car audio culture...) and there you could argue it´s very much a comunicative signal. Love songs, the more political side of punk and so on could all be argued to comunicate. Just like a big drum is a good medium to get messages across large fields putting you political or romantic aspirations to melody may make them cary futher, albeit in a different way. In many cases I´m not sure I realy see so much difference particularly not because music has many other functions besides just being beautufull. I think there is for example some element of marking teritory with portable instalations meant for high volume such as ghetto blasters. When picking a drum from amongst multiple suitable canidates i´m sure the warlords of old would want the one that sounded the lowest for reasons very similar to D&B producers. In the case of the producer we´d probably call that a musical choice, why not in the warlord? Perhaps it´s pushing it to call it a language but I think those uses of sound are often very similar in how they map to meaning, even if much of this process may be unconcious. Microsound would at first seem to be too abstract to be linked to comunication in such a blatant way but I think it´s no accident that Microsound often uses sounds asociated with breaking or broken products and that the Microsound comunity is very crtical of comercial companies. The impressiveness of the drum sound does not nesicarily have anything to do with the functioning of the batalions as such but it´s still there because the general needs to urgently express how much more impressive his army is and I think this is akin to a Microsound composer that still uses the sounds of broken things even when the subject of the piece is -say- summertime. Multiple levels of symbolism and comunication may be intertwined, perhaps even conflicting (one MTV leader sounded quite microsoundy to me) but even if it´s not possible to "translate" everything coherently all of the time, there´s still a lot of cumunication through symbolim going on and exactly what part of that is "music" to you may depend more on how you relate to the sound and who makes it then to anyhting else. My cents, Kas. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 18:34:34 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36385-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:34:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:34:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 70818 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:34:27 +0000 Received: (qmail 70788 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:34:27 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:34:25 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Well, the use of INSTRUMENTS, to communicate on the battlefield is not music in its traditional sense. More along the lines of humans being problem solvers and using whatever is at hand to solve said problem, in this case keeping formations in sync, signaling attack and retreats, and other military gobbledy gook. Its definatley not a language when compared to literal communication(i assume this to be written word). Its very limited for todays world, but it did serve its purpose. Non exhistent in todays military world aside from nostalgia and tradition. I just felt that this was a bad example. Inregards to literal language, maybe i am using the term incorrectly? Every culture and demographic on the planet has developed one, wether its taught in the written form or verbally. Sure you can compare it to many things and have a valid argument, but i am more interested in what is used in the real world(efficient communication) in this example. Another fun factoid. Through the use of math, all written word(literal communication) is universal. Was it guess work that helped us break down the meaning of hieroglyphics?(Math makes it very efficient guess work!:)) How about the enigma machine via WWII? It can be argued that this device could be used to communicate with any intelligent life in the universe. aLEKs On Jun 27, 2005, at 2:01 PM, graham miller wrote: > just to play devil's advocate here, but isn't spoken language just > 'signals' too? more complex and multifaceted, yes. more open to > multiple > interpretations and ambiguity? yes. but signals none less encoded into > sound deep within the larynx... ditto for written language... every > form of > communication, which includes art, falls within the scope of > semiotics... > > i'm not sure there is such a thing as a 'literal language' aside from > mathematics, the only form of communication that holds true throughout > the > universe (more or less...) > g. > > aleks vasic wrote: > >> Well the use of music on the battle field is not "Literal >> communication" Its a form of cumminication that would be better >> labeld >> as "Signals" Because thats what they were. Just because music can be >> used in ways other then it was intended to, does not make it a literal >> language. I think you can come up with a better example then >> military >> use of music, which at the time was the best way to communicate over >> small distances. >> >> I never defined music or launguage. Please reread my original post. >> >> aLEKs >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 18:02:25 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36384-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:02:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:02:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 55458 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:02:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 55441 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 18:02:21 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:01:02 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx just to play devil's advocate here, but isn't spoken language just 'signals' too? more complex and multifaceted, yes. more open to multiple interpretations and ambiguity? yes. but signals none less encoded into sound deep within the larynx... ditto for written language... every form of communication, which includes art, falls within the scope of semiotics... i'm not sure there is such a thing as a 'literal language' aside from mathematics, the only form of communication that holds true throughout the universe (more or less...) g. aleks vasic wrote: > Well the use of music on the battle field is not "Literal > communication" Its a form of cumminication that would be better labeld > as "Signals" Because thats what they were. Just because music can be > used in ways other then it was intended to, does not make it a literal > language. I think you can come up with a better example then military > use of music, which at the time was the best way to communicate over > small distances. > > I never defined music or launguage. Please reread my original post. > > aLEKs > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 17:50:32 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36383-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 13:50:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 13:50:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 48768 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:50:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 48754 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 17:50:03 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 13:50:00 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Well the use of music on the battle field is not "Literal communication" Its a form of cumminication that would be better labeld as "Signals" Because thats what they were. Just because music can be used in ways other then it was intended to, does not make it a literal language. I think you can come up with a better example then military use of music, which at the time was the best way to communicate over small distances. I never defined music or launguage. Please reread my original post. aLEKs On Jun 23, 2005, at 9:40 PM, Exegene wrote: > On Wed, 22 Jun 2005, aleks vasic wrote: > *snip* >> Literal communication is not music, music was never intended to be >> so by itself. >> >> Music can be reworked into a language very easily. Then literal >> communication could take place, but then it would cease to be music, >> and become literal language. > *snip* > > Music has been used to convey specific, agreed on meaning(the word > literal has no place describing meaning conveyed without word or text) > by means of martial marches, battlefield orders given through drums > and brass, communication by australian aborigines through didgeridoo > across miles of desert. All blurring the lines in their own, more or > less verbal ways are also yodeling, the whistle language of the > canary(?) islands, and throat singing of tuva. > > It seems premature and unnecessarily restrictive to outright define > music and language as entirely seperate. > > -- > Dear Patron Saint, > your lips are lopsided > www.devo.com/exegene > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Jun 27 14:28:45 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36382-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 27 Jun 2005 10:28:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 10:28:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 63909 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:28:41 +0000 Received: (qmail 63899 invoked from network); Mon, 27 Jun 2005 14:28:41 +0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 10:25:14 -0400 From: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Subject: [microsound] [announce] COZYSCSHOP - GOTO10 supercollider workshop july2005 - LONDON To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.8i X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx beep sorry for x,y and z beep --- a SC workshop for the openlab friends and family in London. brought to you by jan kees of goto10! SuperCollider is a programming environment for real-time audio generation. It is one of the finest and most versatile softwares for musical applications of all kinds, such as algorithmic composition, interactive performance and sound installations. In this workshop, primary focus is learning to effectively apply SuperCollider for our own sound synthesis & performance needs. --- SCHEDULE SATURDAY | 1pm -> 6pm = hands on ! | 6pm till late = food + beer + jam SUNDAY | 1pm -> 6pm = hands on ! | 6pm till late = bbq + beer --- please note that although the workshop is free/donation, please send a mail to book your place so that we can prepare the workshop for the right number of people. --- :DATE: JULY 2nd-3rd 2005 :HOST: openlab http://www.pawfal.org/openlab/ :LANGUAGE: english :FEE: Free free! but donation would be nice:) :LOCATION: 51-53 city road, london (old street tube station,exit 3 | 4) :FOOD&DRINKS: we will prepare some soft drink but do bring your own sandwidth :HOUSING: not included :HARDWARE: bring your own laptop :BOOKING: chun -at- goto10 -dot- org --- http://goto10.org/-/cozyscshop.html --- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Jun 26 14:16:12 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36381-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 26 Jun 2005 10:16:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 26 Jun 2005 10:16:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 94135 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 26 Jun 2005 14:16:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 94125 invoked from network); Sun, 26 Jun 2005 14:16:08 +0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jun 2005 07:16:06 -0700 (PDT) From: bryan garcia <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] tastes like microsound In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, brine <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=b4H4hifP4HuACLxKCmTgbi0T2iJdJbYqwVzpTMWF96o0LOiDCJb1kaUJd3nMEcNjoIVyaCtL/7A042g0pkxrgJj1jsgjBuWCSJu5lRTGv0i9pgxYIBl2OS6oOW4dHEAuU/dj09VlavoLOiyD1GIgkU2kl5tPBywNlzaF+GQFhxM= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx well said. it's all very true. but also very false. b/g --- brine <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > i definitely agree with this sentiment. > there's an awful lot to be said for wide-eyed > exploration. > and at the same time.. a friend once quoted > someone-or-other-who-is-regarded-as-'important' as > having once said > something to the effect of "the only reason for > abject experimentation in > art is the purpose of avoiding the straightforward > expression of an honest > emotion." > i wrote it off immediately, but it stayed with me > and continues to gnaw at > me. > i think there's something to it. i don't think it's > dead-on or anything.. > but i do think that experimentation for > experimentation's sake can become as > much of a crutch as imitative catharsis for > imitative catharsis' sake. > > i suppose all i'm really saying is that there's no > proper way to simplify or > formulize the process. > and i guess it's just best to allow yourself to be > surprised and try not to > get defensive about it. > > i'm sure this has all been said before, too. > frequently. > > my.02 > -b. > > On 6/10/05, Barry Grant <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > My speculation, based on my own experience, is > that if one doesn't regard > > music (only) as a source of consolation or > nostaligia, it can become a vast > > area to be explored and one can find lots of very > different things to like > > for very different reasons. Just like with > literature or painting or any > > other art form. > > > > Barry > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Jun 26 02:11:56 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36380-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 22:11:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 22:11:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 19475 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 26 Jun 2005 02:11:55 +0000 Received: (qmail 19464 invoked from network); Sun, 26 Jun 2005 02:11:55 +0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:11:49 +0900 From: michael noble <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] [tech] Multitrack for OS X? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xx.x.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: michael noble <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=np8z6RZqrpVYNxXAL9RS+CRIAnDPJfyYWUlOeot5Rbdria/rQQrAfvxTPKSJvUgZoMpuU860y6oCv2cUSI+az43Rr7hsNPhiMoYRiITGHBWq3k4OVbhpp5vez+wM1fg34gA2l1HsZmtC0phBux4DslDJnILqzYLzvwcwhWH9W58= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xx.x.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi, if you're feeling adventurous, there is a beta version of the free Ardour multitrack software (ardour.org) floating around the web (try www.hitsquad.com/smm/programs/ArdourX/ ). I've only used Ardour under linux, but if the OSX version is up to scratch then it could be very useful. regards omjn --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Jun 25 18:51:41 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36379-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 14:51:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 14:51:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 93924 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:51:39 +0000 Received: (qmail 93914 invoked from network); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:51:38 +0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 13:51:33 -0500 From: Rob Danielson <xxxx@xxx.xxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] [tech] Multitrack for OS X? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx.xxx.xxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06110401bee357504e4c@[172.16.1.34]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx At 8:38 AM -0700 6/25/05, Phil Thomson wrote: >Hi all, > >Aside from Audacity, which i find can only handle about 4 tracks at a >time, what recommendations can people make for a multitrack app for OS >X? Hopefully free or cheap. Reply offlist if you think your response >would pollute the rarified atmosphere of the list. > >PT > > >-- >Phil Thomson, BFA, MFA There used to be a free version of Tracktion by Mackie thats a pretty full featured ap-- supports recording many tracks, automation, plugs etc. The free deal was extended but I'm not sure what the current offering is. Start at the Mackie website. There's a PC version too. Rob D --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Jun 25 18:44:57 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36378-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 14:44:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 14:44:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 91751 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:44:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 91740 invoked from network); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:44:54 +0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 20:39:50 +0200 From: nicola catalano <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] CD inserts In-reply-to: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> X-Sender: xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <v03110700bee34dfd8a50@[151.24.222.14]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at libero.it serv1 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >Im wondering if anyone on the list has a template for laying out CD jewel >case inserts for appleworks? >Ive trawled the web and can only find leads, never an actual template. >When I make my own, they are always inaccurate in some way. >TIA >Rob i'm not sure i've understood what you need, but i think "cover xp" is what you're looking for. can't remember the url now, but going googlin' helps for sure. there's a pro version (can't remember the cost) and free version too, which is okay for... well... minimal necessities. bye. nic + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + "objective reality is an artificial construction, which has to do with a hypothetical universalization of a multitude of subjective realities." philip k. dick --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Jun 25 18:15:23 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36377-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 14:15:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 14:15:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 82491 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:15:19 +0000 Received: (qmail 82481 invoked from network); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 18:15:19 +0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 14:13:22 -0400 From: John Nowak <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] [tech] Multitrack for OS X? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Jun 25, 2005, at 11:38 AM, Phil Thomson wrote: > Hi all, > > Aside from Audacity, which i find can only handle about 4 tracks at a > time, what recommendations can people make for a multitrack app for OS > X? Hopefully free or cheap. It's not free or cheap, but Bias Deck is the only real thing I've seen. Actually Deck LE is only $99, so if it does what you need (and I suspect it does), go with that. Faux-hardware fades make me vomit, but otherwise it is alright. - John --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Jun 25 16:53:56 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36376-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 12:53:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 12:53:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 62948 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 16:53:53 +0000 Received: (qmail 62938 invoked from network); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 16:53:52 +0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 09:53:50 -0700 From: brine <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] tastes like microsound In-reply-to: <xxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xx@xxxxxx.xxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: brine <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_5T25OQdyIF9jY5TbBd2eNQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=svQdfkp6cbPsFaAcO0K3dKRQ6/7tAWIZR1ZHTIewYbg2ko+CKipy1c/RggpBbyzw6UlqwExh7adkShGjSL3Re+8PcXQw5PIR8HN8wjY+d6WWaltD8FB0e7+jklv8s/LOxb+QBCYtc/oQVyqtL4faleUN/p58hky9811DtepWRNI= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xx@xxxxxx.xxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_5T25OQdyIF9jY5TbBd2eNQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i definitely agree with this sentiment. there's an awful lot to be said for wide-eyed exploration. and at the same time.. a friend once quoted someone-or-other-who-is-regarded-as-'important' as having once said something to the effect of "the only reason for abject experimentation in art is the purpose of avoiding the straightforward expression of an honest emotion." i wrote it off immediately, but it stayed with me and continues to gnaw at me. i think there's something to it. i don't think it's dead-on or anything.. but i do think that experimentation for experimentation's sake can become as much of a crutch as imitative catharsis for imitative catharsis' sake. i suppose all i'm really saying is that there's no proper way to simplify or formulize the process. and i guess it's just best to allow yourself to be surprised and try not to get defensive about it. i'm sure this has all been said before, too. frequently. my.02 -b. On 6/10/05, Barry Grant <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > My speculation, based on my own experience, is that if one doesn't regard > music (only) as a source of consolation or nostaligia, it can become a vast > area to be explored and one can find lots of very different things to like > for very different reasons. Just like with literature or painting or any > other art form. > > Barry > > --Boundary_(ID_5T25OQdyIF9jY5TbBd2eNQ)-- From ???@??? Sat Jun 25 16:22:37 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36375-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 12:22:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 12:22:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 55755 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 16:22:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 55745 invoked from network); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 16:22:33 +0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 12:22:21 -0400 (EDT) From: xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx Subject: [microsound] CD inserts To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 28 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_xFpeRR973WtT8a3dr1tbgg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_xFpeRR973WtT8a3dr1tbgg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Im wondering if anyone on the list has a template for laying out CD jewel case inserts for appleworks? Ive trawled the web and can only find leads, never an actual template. When I make my own, they are always inaccurate in some way. TIA Rob --Boundary_(ID_xFpeRR973WtT8a3dr1tbgg)-- From ???@??? Sat Jun 25 15:39:04 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36374-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 25 Jun 2005 11:39:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 11:39:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 43934 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:39:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 43924 invoked from network); Sat, 25 Jun 2005 15:39:00 +0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 08:38:58 -0700 From: Phil Thomson <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] [tech] Multitrack for OS X? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Phil Thomson <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=pic1qFnQGd90Z37Ah2ZIMYh0L7t6rJjMdDTjvsAK2g0R5LGC3IiZ5aG3isFlpa8x36q55UbP0zOBjVw3vIU8+s9LRGfX8Zm4203hwF8USk2eybHPRHUw9WNxF6UT2KYPCftW0TH1sVLX8hx1KB8B2EG9PS6x4dHd3yXwS/CiaCc= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hi all, Aside from Audacity, which i find can only handle about 4 tracks at a time, what recommendations can people make for a multitrack app for OS X? Hopefully free or cheap. Reply offlist if you think your response would pollute the rarified atmosphere of the list. PT -- Phil Thomson, BFA, MFA 010100000110100001101001011011000010000001010100011010000110111101101101011100110110111101101110 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx http://www.sfu.ca/~pthomson/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 22:20:04 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36373-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 24 Jun 2005 18:20:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 18:20:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 67331 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 22:20:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 67304 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 22:19:59 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:22:22 -0500 From: //jonCates <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@x.xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@x.xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Scott C snds fantastic in support of sandy slippage + pouring snd into snd via summer // jonCates # http://www.r4wb1t5.org # http://www.criticalartware.net # http://www.systemsapproach.net On Jun 18, 2005, at 7:42 PM, Scott Carver wrote: > In the interest of being outside and actually appreciating summer > while it's around, what about something performed live, outside, > perhaps using sounds from the location of performance? Pick a outdoor > location and a time (hopefully a time when it's appropriately > summer-ish), and perform a piece, in whatever sense of 'perform' is > appropriate and interesting. Screw sitting around in my house with > headphones on, if I'm going to do a summer project, I want to make > sounds so inextricably entangled with summer they can't be separated, > summer and sound pouring into each other until the mixture is > impossible to separate. > > - Scott C. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 20:40:06 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36372-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 24 Jun 2005 16:40:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 16:39:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 30668 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 20:40:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 30658 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 20:40:03 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 14:40:00 -0600 From: Jeff Shell <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Jeff Shell <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=GsGOEm6JV1bDzzgmu6PcJVVHSJ3yjRn0sZeLlCXgJ6M6R5VY+kfC6Z+YTo8VZrh3gcwN1Tdy2Go9stDim5hWmXzJadAKxRkxOlG4dXno9gAjzwJ15i/XSECFUkg1u8DAHUBy6AnOHo7RcfXj9FaWVEeLu/cU/J3jJGdX8CW5t6Y= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/17/05, nathan dickerson <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > synthetic peices that sound like summer / make one think of summer. > > synthetic summer soundscapes > > what does summer sound like anyway? Like bright lights and cold wet sand. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 18:06:12 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36371-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 24 Jun 2005 14:06:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 14:06:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 54326 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 18:06:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 54314 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 18:06:08 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 20:07:16 +0200 From: th_ost <xxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Subject: AW: [microsound] what electronic music communicates [was: being 'political'] In-reply-to: <v03110702bee177052ee8@[151.24.155.178]> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <000001c578e7$8e9f4bf0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Authenticated: #3048294 X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >curiosly zappa used to say: "talking about music is like dancing about >architecture". I wish there was more architecture that makes me dance...:) .... °~° Beyond Good, Evil, AND Nietzsche... http://www.tomoroh.com/ >Music for Connoisseurs< ~°~ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 17:36:45 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36369-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 24 Jun 2005 13:36:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 13:36:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 38369 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:36:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 38359 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:36:42 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 10:36:40 -0700 From: nathan dickerson <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] RE: summertime project? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: nathan dickerson <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=pqsesJ7K8zBUwCMqXuzL2V8WyJJEQDyjm1nh6UOkdYOxdm19s19nFZKB2AggWog/8Oz5nsL3bZremOZ/dMoKEaG5vfTqWk0y+xFS3jznC8D1dljtpR6nDyjgul+rYuaxoMxDF9jFTAbziIFS66ub6xZxJuu80W7s4to2jeXgsrY= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDCA889.20878%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i was wondering if anyone is doing anything with and/or about this? there seems to be alot of ideas in this thread, and i'm sure they all fall under some abstract category.. someone just needs to give a name to this category, pull a finalized list of interested people, and set a deadline.. this may require going through the thread and pulling out all the ideas and/or arguments to identify a common theme. i'm sure someone will offer hosting and a repository, if thats done -- and if they don't i can. but maybe this was just a discussion about the viability of a project with a summertime theme and i am confused. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 17:30:52 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36368-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 24 Jun 2005 13:30:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 13:30:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 34600 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:30:44 +0000 Received: (qmail 34589 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:30:44 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 12:39:19 -0400 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?B?sLcut2A7Jy4ut7AgJ7c=?= ." <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Tiger + microsound software In-reply-to: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <BEE1AF77.3006%xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1309 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx ·.·`·.· . xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx Geschrieben hat .·.·`·.·'·.. . . . . . hallo, have you installed TclTk 8.4 ? do you have pure-data of some variety installed prior; if so, it may be the wrong version of TclTk and discompatibility issues may result. do read the release notes with cecilia! [i assume you did - but just in case you forgot or not noticed] good luck! . 1001 > I recently got a new (mac) machine and I am enjoying the splendours of OS > 10.4.1. > Im trying to get Cecilia to work, and I just cannot. > If there is anybody on this list who is successfully using Cecilia with > Tiger, could you explain to me how this can be done? > Feel free to email me off list, although it may well be of interest if anyone > else is using Cecilia and in a similar jam. > Regards > Rob > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 17:40:09 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36370-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 24 Jun 2005 13:40:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 13:40:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 40910 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:40:07 +0000 Received: (qmail 40898 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 17:40:06 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 10:39:35 +0200 From: nicola catalano <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] what electronic music communicates [was: being 'political'] In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> X-Sender: xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <v03110702bee177052ee8@[151.24.155.178]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at libero.it serv2 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >I've always maintained there's not enough Zappa in electronic music. > > curiosly zappa used to say: "talking about music is like dancing about architecture". cheers. nic + + + + + + + + + + + + + + { { d i s c o g r a p h y } } z_e_l_l_e | nth | line (http://www.12k.com) aug 2001 z_e_l_l_e | rjctd::nw | cubicfabric (http://www.cubicmusic.com/fabric/index.html) nov 2003 "zen enlightenment lifts life energy" on tu M'p3 (http://www.tu-m.com) jan 2002 "shayozoku" on tu M'p3 (http://www.tu-m.com) sept 2002 "tief herz" on lib. (http://www.cubicmusic.com/fabric/index.html) june 2003 "rjctd 11" on netmage 04 @ the wire 239 (http://www.netmage.it) or (http://www.thewire.co.uk) jan 2004 UPCOMING "kitanai" on star6_789' v.2 (http://www.star6789.tk/) TBA SOUND EXHIBITION "rjctd 9" (from rjctd::nw) @ Ecoute | Centre Pompidou | Paris, France | 22 Sept, 2004 - 17 Jan, 2005 | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | REVIEWS http://www.12k.com/line/linepress.htm | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | "battiti" daily radio programme (12:00am) on rai-radio3 :: third channel of italian national broadcasting company http://www.radio.rai.it/radio3/battiti/index.cfm | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | columnist on: "blow up" (monthly) http://www.blowupmagazine.com "rumore" (monthly) http://www.rumoremag.com + + + + + + + + + + + + + + NICOLA CATALANO c/o MAURIZIO MARTUSCIELLO Via Sant'Arcangelo di Romagna, 45 00127 Roma Italia ph. ++39 06 52370975 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 03:07:10 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36367-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 23:07:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 23:07:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 35581 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 03:07:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 35571 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 03:07:08 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 20:06:53 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-Sender: xxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxxxxxx.xxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06100507bee126c6c186@[192.168.0.6]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hey folks, missed most of this thread on account of doing a nice roadtrip from SF (nice dinner with Mr. C. ;-)) across the Sierras, some days in the UFO regions of NV, to the North Rim of the Grand Canyon for a bit, and to central Arizona... inspiring sights and sounds... anyway... two-sense: just meditating on this thread -- I think there are (political) concepts of revolutionary and reactionary that map into creative spaces (making "political sounds") as following: revolutionary -- taking creative energies and configuring them in ways that (the listener) has not been exposed to or is unexpected to them -- propelling the listener into an unfamiliar space -- the locus of the unknown is a seed site for revelation/revolution, change, and transformation :: dynamic, alive reactionary -- re-presenting the known in known and recognized formulas -- does not move the listener into an unknown space, rather into a space of comfort and safety -- supporting a status-quo situation :: static, dead so when the regime presently in power in the US talks about the "culture of life," it is nothing they know about, and at best is wishful thinking from a polarized ideological situation. the Liberals fall into status quo in equal measure. forget the safety of labels of any sort. seek what you cannot describe to others or circumscribe to yourself... cheers jh -- -~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ tech-no-mad::hypnostatic:: exploring the desert once again domain: http://neoscenes.net travelog: http://neoscenes.net/travelog/weblog.php -~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 02:27:17 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36366-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:27:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:27:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 23205 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 02:27:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 23195 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 02:27:15 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:26:54 -0400 From: John Nowak <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Jun 23, 2005, at 7:34 PM, Jon wrote: >> Well, the answer would then be no. Nor could you create a >> sentence, or an act, or a symbol or anything else that could be >> identified as political, or anything. If you remove all the >> "programming" (and by this I assume you mean the ability to >> reference and compare one experience with another), then nothing >> means anything and I fail to see the point of even asking about it. >> > > goddam -- kevin -- thank you. i agree completely. i'm sick of > constant "art in a vacuum" to-ing and fro-ing. context/programming > - it's simple and fundamental to the concept of meaning. any > linguist will tell you. The reason you hear so much "art in a vacuum" to-ing and fro-ing, I suspect, is that people do not want to believe their personal art is context dependent, and hence, can never be "timeless". This causes feelings of unease regarding one's own sense of mortality, hence the large amount of warbling sine wave academic faux-timeless crap created in denial (or in spite of) of the truth. Just an idea of course. - John --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 02:19:18 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36365-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:19:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:19:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 19072 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 02:19:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 19061 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 02:19:11 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 04:19:05 +0200 (CEST) From: Exegene <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at devo.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Thu, 23 Jun 2005, Bill Ashline wrote: *snip* > I am insisting that outside of an interpretive framework, sound has no > meaning whatsoever, other than the meaning you wish to place on it, > which you are certainly allowed to do. As for being "ultimately *snip* But sound is only listened to as music by people, all people have culture, and so sound is always listened to inside an interpretive framework. Until the no one who heard the tree falling can report back on the meaning of what they heard, everyone who hears a tree falling will have no choice but to associate with it meaning. Because the framework is always available, sound can always be considered music, and music can always have impressed and perceived meanings. -- Dear Patron Saint, your lips are lopsided www.devo.com/exegene --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 02:06:20 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36364-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:06:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 22:06:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 14175 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 02:06:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 14165 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 02:06:18 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 04:06:12 +0200 (CEST) From: Exegene <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at devo.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Wed, 22 Jun 2005, Damian Stewart wrote: > How do you get across political messages in music which has no lyrics and > which has no voice samples? *snip* This may be akin to asking "how do I give a moving speech without using any words or gestures?" or "how do I build a chair without using my hands or any tools?" It has by now been pointed out enough that context matters. It sounds like you are approaching the issue with a nod to the universal, and so refuse any ephemera such as the mentioned recording of barcelonans banging away in reaction to the most noxious current example of western imperialism because, in terms specific to this recording, nobody fifty years ago or almost nobody today in the usa or probably nobody in five hundred years and so on will be able to pick up on the very precise intended meaning, that is, alyrical music requring an understanding of real world context to convey meaning is not univerally understandable, is less meaningful than it could or is wished to be. But, while it is the rare piece of information with popular currency that lasts the ages, there have always been and will always be unfortunately disposable ideas and reflections of ideas; the specific availablility of identity of an ephemerum(?) may not be universal, but the presence of unforeseeable ephemera is. A sample of, say, GWB provides the hooks biting into the flesh of the listener strung to the artist's intended meaning in a way similar to provision by the words you read at this very moment, indeed relevant samples and related can be thought of as the words available to modern music. To return to analogy, a conscious minor restriction in words allowed can make for an interesting experiment(Try spending some time in normal conversation without saying the words "I", "me", "my", or "mine." Bonus points for creativity.), a wordless conversation can make for a fulfilling session of expression while causing the casual onlooker to roll their eyes, but engaging in more or less normal declaration or discourse without any word available in any dictionary is sheer foolishness. -- Dear Patron Saint, your lips are lopsided www.devo.com/exegene --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Jun 24 01:41:09 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36363-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 21:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 21:41:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 6516 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 01:41:07 +0000 Received: (qmail 6502 invoked from network); Fri, 24 Jun 2005 01:41:07 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 03:40:58 +0200 (CEST) From: Exegene <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at devo.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Wed, 22 Jun 2005, aleks vasic wrote: *snip* > Literal communication is not music, music was never intended to be so by > itself. > > Music can be reworked into a language very easily. Then literal > communication could take place, but then it would cease to be music, and > become literal language. *snip* Music has been used to convey specific, agreed on meaning(the word literal has no place describing meaning conveyed without word or text) by means of martial marches, battlefield orders given through drums and brass, communication by australian aborigines through didgeridoo across miles of desert. All blurring the lines in their own, more or less verbal ways are also yodeling, the whistle language of the canary(?) islands, and throat singing of tuva. It seems premature and unnecessarily restrictive to outright define music and language as entirely seperate. -- Dear Patron Saint, your lips are lopsided www.devo.com/exegene --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 23:47:42 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36362-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 19:47:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 19:47:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 65519 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 23:47:40 +0000 Received: (qmail 65500 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 23:47:40 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 01:47:35 +0200 From: Arie van Schutterhoef <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <l03130301bee0fa1ae806@[213.84.105.55]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by XS4ALL Virus Scanner X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >fundamental to the concept of meaning. -But this depends on the perspective within which it is presented. AvS . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... ` |Schreck Ensemble . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + ` |# -laboratory for live electro-acoustic music- # | | http://www.schreck.nl/ | | http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/ | ` *===========================================================++ ` |Compositions http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/compo.html | ` |Samples http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/samp.html | ` |Patches http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/pat.html | ` |Videos http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/video.html | ` |Scores http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/scores.html | *===========================================================++ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 23:29:20 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36361-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 19:29:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 19:28:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 58317 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 23:29:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 58306 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 23:29:17 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 09:34:47 +1000 From: Jon <xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > Well, the answer would then be no. Nor could you create a sentence, or > an act, or a symbol or anything else that could be identified as > political, or anything. If you remove all the "programming" (and by > this I assume you mean the ability to reference and compare one > experience with another), then nothing means anything and I fail to > see the point of even asking about it. goddam -- kevin -- thank you. i agree completely. i'm sick of constant "art in a vacuum" to-ing and fro-ing. context/programming - it's simple and fundamental to the concept of meaning. any linguist will tell you. --- dizzydonor.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 21:08:35 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36360-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 17:08:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 17:08:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 91901 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 21:08:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 91890 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 21:08:31 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:08:28 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music X-Originating-IP: 66.72.201.250 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Originating-Server: ws1-1a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx How can one define an emotion? You can't. You can describe the action, or how it has affect/effected you. Poets try to describe the feeling, the sensation but can only attempt to describe the picture/ to create a picture to better understand. So, through music can we discribe the emotion of summer? The feeling one gets through memory? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin Ponto" <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 13:40:29 -0700 > > On Jun 23, 2005, at 12:56 AM, Bill Ashline wrote: > > The only way you get the > > hell out of the way when a bus sounds its horn is because you've been > > programmed to read that sound as a warning and an alert. That's > > culture, of course, but without that, it's just another sound. So > > back to the original question, can you create a sound that contains an > > inherent politics outside of a discursive form that identifies it as > > such? I have yet to see one solitary example that demonstrates such a > > possibility. > > > Well, the answer would then be no. Nor could you create a sentence, > or an act, or a symbol or anything else that could be identified as > political, or anything. If you remove all the "programming" (and by > this I assume you mean the ability to reference and compare one > experience with another), then nothing means anything and I fail to > see the point of even asking about it. > > > k > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 20:40:34 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36359-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:40:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:40:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 78712 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 20:40:30 +0000 Received: (qmail 78701 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 20:40:29 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 13:40:29 -0700 From: Kevin Ponto <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Provags-ID: perfora.net xxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx login:85f6f213efa75345adbd40246e580591 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Jun 23, 2005, at 12:56 AM, Bill Ashline wrote: > The only way you get the > hell out of the way when a bus sounds its horn is because you've been > programmed to read that sound as a warning and an alert. That's > culture, of course, but without that, it's just another sound. So > back to the original question, can you create a sound that contains an > inherent politics outside of a discursive form that identifies it as > such? I have yet to see one solitary example that demonstrates such a > possibility. Well, the answer would then be no. Nor could you create a sentence, or an act, or a symbol or anything else that could be identified as political, or anything. If you remove all the "programming" (and by this I assume you mean the ability to reference and compare one experience with another), then nothing means anything and I fail to see the point of even asking about it. k --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 16:35:55 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36358-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:35:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:35:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 41233 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:35:46 +0000 Received: (qmail 41223 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:35:45 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 18:35:41 +0200 From: Arie van Schutterhoef <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] what electronic music communicates [was: being 'political'] In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <l03130300bee094fba7eb@[213.84.105.55]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: by XS4ALL Virus Scanner X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >"headspaces" (something that music is undoubtedly great at communicating) >as a >type of feeling. -A.K.A.: hangover... AvS . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... ` |Schreck Ensemble . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . + ` |# -laboratory for live electro-acoustic music- # | | http://www.schreck.nl/ | | http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/ | ` *===========================================================++ ` |Compositions http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/compo.html | ` |Samples http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/samp.html | ` |Patches http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/pat.html | ` |Videos http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/video.html | ` |Scores http://www.xs4all.nl/~schreck/html/scores.html | *===========================================================++ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ...................................................................... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 16:13:07 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36357-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:13:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:13:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 28636 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:12:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 28623 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:12:54 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 09:12:52 -0700 From: Quintus Frimschlowder VIII <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] what electronic music communicates [was: being 'political'] In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Quintus Frimschlowder VIII <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=AIvS9qoIoh43J+07i+y9iFxzSpVVDWBYiCxivtDsncnAnRZqVwMrhJkVL/1pvcwYNLxaWMhm3hShGzZncQ0yTZSKCfi+3FY+8kcpwpoxX60yOGkE6h/5Djnr9bD5cUXqwkAL4QWWcSA8EBwuVv5MvIAsCI4uk1TmAQ9ONJOdXK0= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/23/05, Mr.D <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > I've always maintained there's not enough Zappa in electronic music. Seriously. On 6/23/05, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > I think electtronic music is about communicating headspaces, actually. If I understand what you're referring to here (and I think I do), we're in agreement. I would classify "headspaces" (something that music is undoubtedly great at communicating) as a type of feeling. - QF8 http://scatterbrain.raygunarmy.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 15:15:44 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36356-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 11:15:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 11:15:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 92809 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 15:15:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 92799 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 15:15:35 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:15:33 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=deWHY6zVHPsomKWui/5ZKu4bkUuRNgnbFWOVCe4lUsvI6n9gO+B3JGhlljME06Fr1vOwpo05ySshsWXZ4BefVhOVBRZ+syuV2AxIp5DgQ3m4aqEZO6uovK19mKDX6l7JqSDHOpIMcORgGuYBuhxD1USkk35e6ba7oYVL1WjGvwQ= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bill Ashline wrote: > > I am insisting that outside of an interpretive > framework, sound has no > > Damian Stewart replied: Can we even speak meaningfully of sound 'outside of > an interpretive > framework'? > > Doesn't this just mean sound that is heard by no-one > and/or recorded in > no way? (Or recorded and not listened to.) > > Can we say anything useful about or via this > concept? I think this very question might have been behind my initial motivations for getting into this thread. When I said that sound is always being interpreted or always tending to become meaningful and then recounted my story of Derrida, I was basically saying that we are involved in a autonomously renewing poetic process. I do not agree that we have the unshakeable knowledge to say that anything is inherently without meaning, anything. My take on Derrida (as it relates by analogy to this issue) might be a bit "talmudic" but I take the undecidability (between there being a tending toward meaning and there being no one true meaning) in the strictest sense. When we declare something to be inherently without meaning we have put it in a place already. We deny it the possibility of having a voice. Not allowing that something may have a voice is the first step in it's exploitation. So my own approach to sound is rather to wait and listen. --- Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 14:54:55 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36355-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:54:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:54:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 80755 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:54:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 80742 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:54:50 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:54:48 -0700 From: "Mr.D" <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] what electronic music communicates [was: being 'political'] In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at xdrive.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I've always maintained there's not enough Zappa in electronic music. On Jun 23, 2005, at 5:42 AM, Damian Stewart wrote: > A response I'm working towards in my own music is the giggle.. If I > write something and kind of let myself get carried away without > thinking too much, and then at some point in the future sudden > listen critically and find myself giggling, then I feel like I'm > doing something interesting. Bloody hard to bring about that state > of mind though. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 14:54:37 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36354-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:54:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:54:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 79603 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:54:13 +0000 Received: (qmail 79579 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:54:12 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:54:09 -0700 From: "Mr.D" <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at xdrive.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx It may have no vocal content itself, but it references vocal content. Already I have an idea of what this work probably communicates, only knowing it's based on a religious-bound theme. :) On Jun 22, 2005, at 11:31 PM, Jon wrote: > > > i don't know if you have heard it or have access to it, but john > baker (of the bbc radiophonic workshop) has a piece with a very > clear, well-defined and instantly decodable message -- with no use > of vocal material. i think you will find it enriching as an > example, particularly in its simplicity -- there is no need to > theorise over it one bit to get what it means. (and let's face > it. if you want it to be widely legible, it needs to be clear. > you can't rely on derrida to create your public.) > > the tune in question is merely "o come all ye faithful" (a popular > christmas carol) played by the bell of a cash register drawer. > simple and way more effective (and powerful) than any sine wave > composition i've ever heard. > > "christmas commercial" - john baker. > > > > > --- > dizzydonor.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 14:38:41 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36353-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:38:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:38:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 71936 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:38:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 71925 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:38:37 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:38:35 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=1J/vcsScOvAhdFGuGtwREw/kTzLUyZYNHntnCYY7ELBSt0X2bitPjpHUh4lV1w73s2fbvNsoj/BD/KZqrS9DiUT3RsQKvkNtwuo6KN95bJtYBAarYN7d4FdImzxYN1tA5FpCAVfqVCuhqWIziXLeCiF/mO6qxFAZGWu0BrzglyM= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx He believes deeply in broken == good. He likes finding busted sound gear in dumpsters he ought to be careful not get caught inside! but seriously, i guess i must say this interests me, enough so that my latest cdr release called "realism and the revolution in recorded sound" is all made with defective items. the heap of the pile was the sound card i got bilked for 200 bucks for on ebay...but more on that in the official announcement later...thanks for your posts damian... jeff gbk --- Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 14:05:19 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36352-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:05:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:05:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 59708 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:05:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 59694 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 14:05:10 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:05:07 -0700 (PDT) From: "P. Lasell" <x_xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=4xIw9NHBy9bfv2dF4m9KoAf2HalmghdLfANZqYCrJX774jjw+UI5rmGm7IgKi13Iaepe/W5Q44JuCNBr3HtIA20MoWD7gdkkCZqZF0RJPAlsQKuDoSEQFgrFsjiIMmwUdkWmXSA2sn7Sl4drs3drRYnO++jOyAi68DQOO8RTmCs= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx The problem with non-verbal music being percieved as political is that the listener experience can be so highly subjective (and maybe intuitive) that it doesn't particularly engender a similar wide scale response. I think *genres* of music, on the macro-level, can create an atmosphere where people can become highly politicized (like the more political sides of techno in the US and EU). ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 13:07:59 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36351-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 09:07:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 09:07:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 31209 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 13:07:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 31195 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 13:07:53 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 01:07:39 +1200 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <000001c577cd$5d16bf20$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <000001c577cd$5d16bf20$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Kassen wrote: > I second you on Linux though, some people still use Amigas and Ataris for > music too, much to my delight. My friend Warwick does a solo show involving a Commodone Vic-20 and a guitar and a collection of effects units and mixers and toys in various states of disrepair. He believes deeply in broken == good. He likes finding busted sound gear in dumpsters and 'seeing what happens' when he plugs input into it. Or rewires it and then plugs input into it. He tries not to use musical devices in the ways that they were intended.. almost to the point of reading the manual and then deliberately avoiding doing the things it tells you to do. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 13:03:10 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36350-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 09:03:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 09:03:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 27450 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 13:03:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 27439 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 13:03:06 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 01:02:51 +1200 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Cc: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bill Ashline wrote: > I am insisting that outside of an interpretive framework, sound has no Can we even speak meaningfully of sound 'outside of an interpretive framework'? Doesn't this just mean sound that is heard by no-one and/or recorded in no way? (Or recorded and not listened to.) Can we say anything useful about or via this concept? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 12:52:21 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36349-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:52:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:51:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 22678 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:52:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 22666 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:52:16 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 00:52:01 +1200 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Cc: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx tobias c. van Veen wrote: > If one were to broadcast at extremely high volume piercing sinewaves in a > centre of a citycore, the polis would evacuate if nothing could be done > about it. Although isn't this more a matter of performance than of composition? The same piece at lower volume wouldn't have nearly the same effect. You could achieve the same thing with a piece of techno music. Hell, you could do the same with a piece of pop. I know which would drive me out faster. In this instance I think it is nothing inherent in the music itself, it is in the performance of the music, specifically the volume of the performance. By being very bloody loud you are making a political statement just like that. It really doesn't matter what you are being loud /with/. I spent a little while in Indonesia, and it became apparent to my friend after a while (he shared this revelation with me and it seems to make sense) that having a big stereo was a status symbol over there for the very reason that you could make louder noise than your neighbour. Universally, car stereos, ghettoblasters, and shop radios were turned up FULL VOLUME, no matter how difficult it made it to talk, or how distorted they were. If you could play it loud, then show it off. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 12:43:01 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36348-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:43:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:42:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 18130 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:42:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 18119 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:42:57 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 00:42:15 +1200 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] what electronic music communicates [was: being 'political'] In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Quintus Frimschlowder VIII wrote: > your listeners uniformly. Music is generally better-suited to communicating > feelings, rather than specific words and non-musical concepts. It's context I think electtronic music is about communicating headspaces, actually. One of the things that make electronic music unique is concentrated mental space... this is especially the case techno/electronica, *especially* Wolfgang Voight style stuff where the music is basically non-structural, just a small gesture repeated for given interpretations of 'repeated'. What you've got is a small segment of time that represents a much much larger chunk of refinement down to a single experience.. When I compose, I will keep on working on a piece until I can listen to it the whole way through without wanting to make changes. IE, until I'm happy with the exact psychoacoustic effects it has on me... I still see charges of 'inhumanity' and 'soullessness' levelled at electronic music, which is ironic because the noises that make their way onto a recording usually represent refinement to create a noise that at least one person on the planet finds wonderful and amazing. Although... one of the strengths of Aphex Twin's work is that he doesn't do too much in the way of refining like this. Sometimes listening to his work I get the sense that it has been written utterly irreverently.. sitting in a studio he just lays something down, lays something else over the top with minimal thought, thinking to himself 'yeah! that sounds good! yeah! uhhrrm... all right, now i'll squeal like a pig over the top' or whatever, does that, goes 'yeah! cool!' and calls it a night and a track. A response I'm working towards in my own music is the giggle.. If I write something and kind of let myself get carried away without thinking too much, and then at some point in the future sudden listen critically and find myself giggling, then I feel like I'm doing something interesting. Bloody hard to bring about that state of mind though. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 12:29:04 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36347-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:29:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:29:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 11567 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:28:59 +0000 Received: (qmail 11554 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:28:58 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 00:28:44 +1200 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx David Powers wrote: > What is much more important is political involvement in your nation, > working for governments that don't push global economic strategies that > make these exploitive factories profitable and inevitable. To bring about governmental/societal/systemic change you have to challenge the headspace of the population, their mental environment. That is part of our job as artists, I think. I'm concerned about the people in the rest of New Zealand. They are increasingly sleepwalking consumption machines. I want to bonk them over the head. I think the way I am best at communicating anything is through music. I want to work toward creating consciousness through the music I make, but I don't want to do it through lyrics because I believe lyrics can dilute and destroy some very amazing musical experiences. (Tangent - there's a track on the Rhythm & Sound self-titled album, the only one with lyrics.. there's a point where the lyricist stops talking for two or three minutes, allowing the music to just wander for a while; then he comes back. The point where he comes back is a jolt, tipping you right out of the musical space that just the music has transferred you to. I think this is always what lyrics do.) I have a plan (muahaha), and that is to save up some money and buy some advertising time on ZM (the commercial pop shite network radio here), and use the advertising time to play sonic art, ideally of an overtly anti-consumerist nature. If I can do this without words, it will be even more effective. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 12:21:06 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36346-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:21:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:21:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 8971 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:20:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 8949 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:20:56 +0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2005 00:20:37 +1200 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music - an example? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Josh Ronsen wrote: > I don’t think the question is how can wordless music > have a political meaning, but how can music made that > is so entrenched in the current economic worldview > effectively question that worldview. One gains the ability to be conscious of an environment/worldview/set of cultural assumptions when one experiences something else. I make my music using technology, yes, but I stay out of the consumption cycles, and I try and make it being as aware as possible of the ways I am affected by my society. Society teaches me to not care, to be excited about trivial things, to hide my emotions. In the music I wrote I used to unconsciously reflect these ideas. Now I'm trying to comment on and critique it. The other day I wrote this: http://www.frey.co.nz/frey/audio/frey-loveah.mp3 Ideally you can hear what was going through my mind. If you can't, here's some context: it was written in response to a compilation of singer-songwriter style songs, heavily lyrical, very 'pretty.' One thing that really pisses me off about the whole singer-singwriter genre (lone guitarist + 'meaningful' vocals) is that it's pretty universally singing about romantic love using complex metaphor to make it seem much more sophisticated than it actually is. It's the genre considered the most 'meaningful' or the most 'human' to some and to me it's impenetrable words against harmonically backward music. (Not that Ani DiFranco can't move me to tears sometimes, but we're all hypocrites, it's part of being capitalists.) There are lyrics in this, yes; the political content isn't in the lyrics themselves, it's in how the lyrics sit against the music/context/genre itself. The first verse is basically 'I love you' but with weird, almost mentally unstable-sounding emphasis on the 'love', the phrase disintegrating into a kind of a throaty strangulation sound. The second verse is 'I love you, your breasts are very large and jubbly.' What is my point? I'm not sure that I have one. Would this music be as political without the lyrics? Would it be engaging, would it just be 'bad music'? Would its meaning be as clear? This isn't really much of an example because the lyrics are as fundamental to its parody of the singer-songwriter genre as can be. An instrumental version of this song would be in many very important ways a different piece of music. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 08:21:22 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36344-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 04:21:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 04:21:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 16069 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:21:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 16032 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:21:21 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 01:21:15 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=fQ4w/IwUpWU5UZxugXRKSjNHzulU5bQC+PeqiI9p/3nje+M7DYbWBNZ86M+d+orG2CfEOLtsm6TEGkrD+JWguMa9WtaSsDjAiHEYFU+9MoTAFv2wxNUysHQ5nvNsSMYFR00TDyY8nfmH1f7jK+m5wt+r4ukO3SiIzDkZCQc7h+4= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > back to the original question, can you create a > sound that contains an inherent politics outside of a discursive form that identifies it as such? I have yet to see one solitary example that demonstrates such a possibility. in vico's scienza nuova he attempted to describe the origin of language via the clap of thunder. the thunder-clap is physically percievable by all in the vicinity/community. it often inspires fear because it is so loud. at one time it was louder than any sound a human being could make. arguably, a good thunder may still be louder as any attack than any we can create electronically using a membrane. maybe the crash of speeding vehicles approaches this decibel level and certainly nuclear weapons take the prize for volume. but, to not stray too far from the question at hand, the thunder always still means generally one thing on planet earth! > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 08:28:22 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36345-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 04:28:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 04:28:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 18787 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:28:23 +0000 Received: (qmail 18775 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:28:22 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:19:09 +0200 From: Kassen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <000001c577cd$5d16bf20$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bill Ashline; > And > using an Apple is an alternative to the dominance of Windows though > not as politically preferable as using Linux. So using an apple > machine is somewhat counterhegemonic all the while supporting the > hegemonic "aspirations" of Apple. A good friend of mine said about companies like Apple and The Bodyshop (in a mock voice); "Yes, I only support the smaller multinationals". Much more interesting from this perspective to me is are the communities of artists who gather outdated computer equipment. Video-wall build of monitors that would otherwise have been thrown away, controlled by a central Linux pc, blasting out Ascii art, "chillout" areas with 8bit dos pinball games and the constant knowledge that the machines that are entertaining you were considdered trash a few days ago.... One didn´t work, I frowned and turned it upside down. The curator or artist came up to me, asking wether I needed a screwdriver. I´m all for the fall of the MS empire, but let´s not pretend Apple is in it out of charity. Were Apple to gain that position many people that currently enjoy them wouldn´t be able to afford computers anymore due to closed hardware arteficially keeping the price up. I don´t see Apple as any more politically preferable then -say- Silicon Graphics. I second you on Linux though, some people still use Amigas and Ataris for music too, much to my delight. Yours, Kas. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 08:02:07 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36343-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 04:02:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 04:02:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 11723 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:02:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 11713 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 08:02:08 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 01:02:03 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=XcEr/HdTT++ga1VIWedrxRM4WPyXetO18Vc9evrwiae8CWoL8zCZdP/wvNpdImWPtri2LO7b/KdfYFnF2nskqXCm8+m+35z7cYEIYnu7cO2i2Pzt2SOaB5l/1aQlT4B/NPgZQ8DWfeVjI6XquRoHn+d+ZILmJ40zXhCqXxKC+tE= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx "There is no outside." which is very often accompanied by the contention that there is nothing "inside"--namely that my own pysche is constructed by culture etc. but what do we really know? i prefer to say it is possible to reconstruct myself. i also prefer to say there might be messages out there we do not yet understand. how do we tune into frequencies that might be out of our range (ah, which dimension/vector of range, eh?) I > have no idea what you're trying to say there. this is to me a sign of moving in the right direction! some decades ago when we were all getting "post-modern" i hit upon the formula "why is it that when i have explained myself clearly to you that i still remain incomprehensible to myself?" back then i was describing my sense of alienation from critical discourse. but really i had stumbled into a kind of cave or cave-painting of myself. there is finally always something that resists expression that remains outside saying, that resembles in it's silence before our questioning what is either a great gift given by no one or a pointless curse wired through mattter itself. is lyotard's cave any different than plato's? the legende of er? in a strange way, language itself can be a lot like serialism. --Jeff Gburek > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 07:56:26 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36342-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 03:56:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 03:56:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 9691 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:56:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 9681 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:56:25 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:56:20 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=YF2pfmDnZ4mZ0KaaQ08I8QE3A9F/7nhCwTbQNs+8b/gbDw75Nfvgub0+ccz0HhBwDiLbpjzEP/NB3/r6loYKiQ0DL+WrWV/9IynS+KrVOL4gqFJVSwTT48/qBFp1CFDCG9yHfxZAlkF9tK43YA/wbPhTpPhCmScz1UngJc3VBis= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/23/05, jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > this paraphrase from lyotard has something that i do > find interesting but i don't read the historicization > of the "distinction" to be so distant and proscribed > by discourse on art or linguistics. the act of > interpretation upon seeing the cave painting is rather > instantaneous. The point from Lyotard is that you have phenomena but the categories for organizing the phenomena are part of human knowledge, part of culture, if you will. We often assume these categories in advance without realizing that phenomena are what they are first of all and then a use-value for human understanding later. In Nietzsche's terms, we made up the category and then we forgot that we made it up. Then, we forgot that we forgot. Then it became culture. We assumed that the meaning of sound had always accompanied its occurence, but we simply hadn't remembered far back enough. We forgot our own invention--the rhetoric that gave meaning to the sonic sign. So an inscription is an inscription first of all and a message after a certain framework of understanding is invented. the same for sound. Which applies to your example of the bus. The only way you get the hell out of the way when a bus sounds its horn is because you've been programmed to read that sound as a warning and an alert. That's culture, of course, but without that, it's just another sound. So back to the original question, can you create a sound that contains an inherent politics outside of a discursive form that identifies it as such? I have yet to see one solitary example that demonstrates such a possibility. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 07:33:24 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36341-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 03:33:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 03:33:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 2756 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:33:25 +0000 Received: (qmail 2745 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:33:25 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:33:19 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Cc: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=f30ABikk337YrQY616pl/JbXTLoxU2IME7zpxjSUiYXovzvAckiZ27SogjdM+cxxYp3yOOugFGmF36lyFl3/c7CEtInRI1WaXtpaMhrwjJmMhiLNPMz/44MxDiQKVNrX9AbncPFQ2XYZTxzSiWTuhpoxBT+llfO8US1GyJfMFC4= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/23/05, jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > clear, but that's not exactly what you said and the > drift of your statements accumulated in the direction > of what i find to be the ultimately unjustifiable and > and unsupportable notion that sounds don't have any > meaning. I am insisting that outside of an interpretive framework, sound has no meaning whatsoever, other than the meaning you wish to place on it, which you are certainly allowed to do. As for being "ultimately unjustifiable and unsupportable," I'd say that about the idea that sound has an inherent meaning outside of culture. Your point was that it has a "potential for meaning." If it has a "potential," this means that there isn't one in advance and that you are agreeing with my position. Feel free to produce sound in such a way that's political but without the rhetoric or the artist statement being available, to see as such, no listener, unless you are exploiting the obvious codes like the cash register and "Come All Ye Faithful," is going to hear an inherent politics. >mine is a political stance that seeks to > empower sound and those who do not feel yet that sound > can say something outside of being recognized by a > powerful elite, which, being driven to that > conclusion, is the same "cultural" cul-de-sac all > post-modernism ends up in: stale academic > conceptualism. if you only have culture as the final > arbiter then an individual who says something > different has nothing else to do but to declare a > break with culture. But the break with culture is always already "cultural." It's already part of the fabric of cultural resistance, which has a very long history. There is no outside. You're not being clear in your sweep about postmodernism and academic conceptualism. I have no idea what you're trying to say there. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 07:23:33 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36340-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 03:23:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 03:23:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 98989 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:23:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 98979 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 07:23:34 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 00:23:28 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=SJBivDBUn7b3/cSuNL5b2kzklcDR49+wX3DDmTSmpebQ13QW07LWk8VS5f/lHNdroa76VehzpKc8d3fLDiyXn8jmD/+CsCTCQ3Rp6QFKXycoBg2+1COwB6HdHOxuZtswccw6Glc6IfiNFy2bngAyu9NER4IE1cj0FcbFD/t0aMw= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx The politics comes later. > > Paraphrasing Lyotard: a cave dweller inscribes a > figure on the wall > > inside a cave. Is it art? Is it language? It is > neither. The > > distinction will come later. > > this paraphrase from lyotard has something that i do find interesting but i don't read the historicization of the "distinction" to be so distant and proscribed by discourse on art or linguistics. the act of interpretation upon seeing the cave painting is rather instantaneous. the interpretations will depend on whether or not the immediate phenomenon means something for me personally. one never questions a bus's horn as it goes off, you just look fast and get the fuck out of the way. if i come from planet xenon265 where there are no such things as buses, i might get creamed. but the ability to interpret signs depends on the fact we are familiar with the reality of communication and that we percieve an intention. humanity has long percieved propriety in terms of a model of what "nature" does until it evolved to only look for the "laws" of nature. once you have begun to look in this direction, the cultural becomes percievable as a kind of collapsed hierarchy with the natural universe. better, let's call it a horizontal hierarchy, no more significant than any other layers in the terrestrial sedimental compaction. we can percieve all sounds as potentially communicative but we may sometimes be wrong about the nature of the transmission. throughgout our lives we become familiar with more and more languages or langauage-like systems. that we inteptret a sound as music is an immediate assessment of the sound's meaning or the intention of the one who makes the sound. the political act comes when we organize and inject priorities into the sound or music. these priorities are "preset" systems, if you will. these indeed do come later to be imposed on the phenomenon as we judge what is "more meaningful" to us and the problems start to occur when one assumes the "presets" are of the order of nature--which is how all the unexplainable arbitrariness of culture is presented to children: this is just the way it is. but this is not the truth. --- aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote: > Who's distinction? Yours, mine, we/ours? We have > no point of > reference. Only the creator of the image has it. > We can only percieve > to know what distinction/purpose it really had. But > in the end that > only further supports your rationale on the whole > subject. > > > aLEKs > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 06:53:56 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36339-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:53:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:53:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 83570 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 06:53:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 83553 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 06:53:56 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 23:53:51 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=xhELEJiSy064wrCjIkKmRHcmFRBWNJcD2iaqbocyNKm/hG7D6Hk5bzKuXlquVYm+GFpIH5FTbrXpwYPIlc4shHAoF/NRdcOLl5D1qn+Id5WdHnBywF319rjZ7u2kfAVlaJNigtev8QGXzXK/fjAqBymitCc7uadiDi1raaXT2DM= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx The polis in and of itself requires its surrounds as inherent to its boundary construction; culture is inseparable from the gesture of exclusion necessary for the polis. High volume sound as tactical dispersion method of polis-itics might drive some to some mad nomadism -- or another city. - tV tobias, i appreciate the sounding out of the greco-roots of these concepts. it reminds me what attali said: that we live in the ritual, representational and repetitive eras all at once--or at least traces of the previous era persist. maybe nomadism would be the result of the sonic terror but more likely would be a violence of another kind to reduce the sound to ash, of silencing anyone who crossed the line... --jeff gburek __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 06:41:41 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36338-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:41:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:41:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 78433 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 06:41:41 +0000 Received: (qmail 78423 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 06:41:41 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 23:41:35 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=zFQnbWjWcTaUxaEfeSEddyR0RwrVhNRMfG0BMl0p+hI1sMrPnMzLADmgvWTP3ZddGpbm2AXC3ukpgXUEwuG15y4CcWHAypZs1d6qrWWHG38BcHcM6FsnlFHthieIKiM1pjjqwUcKGlXwhRFpWHS5IhADTlLY09uFjQoU6DyMqWI= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >I think it is a big > > mistake to decide that sound has no meaning. I > think > > it is more true to say there is always the > potential > > to become meaningful. > > But the idea that sound has the "potential" to > become meaningful > assumes already that it isn't meaningful outside of > its potential, > which is exactly my point. clear, but that's not exactly what you said and the drift of your statements accumulated in the direction of what i find to be the ultimately unjustifiable and and unsupportable notion that sounds don't have any meaning. mine is a political stance that seeks to empower sound and those who do not feel yet that sound can say something outside of being recognized by a powerful elite, which, being driven to that conclusion, is the same "cultural" cul-de-sac all post-modernism ends up in: stale academic conceptualism. if you only have culture as the final arbiter then an individual who says something different has nothing else to do but to declare a break with culture. not only popular artists of the seventies did this but also avant-gardists of that era were more populist (bueys and pasolini for example, although i have my own critiques of their behaviour as well). what is disturbing most is that today's avant-gardist does not even try to make such a break. they are in with the institution. if you bill or anyone would like to read a a review i have written of the cartsen nicolai installation here at the neu nationale gallerie, i may be willing to post it, as the above are all concerns that enter into my thought over it's potential meaninglessness. --Jeff Gburek __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 06:25:51 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36337-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:25:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:25:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 71203 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 06:25:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 71189 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 06:25:49 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 16:31:15 +1000 From: Jon <xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i don't know if you have heard it or have access to it, but john baker (of the bbc radiophonic workshop) has a piece with a very clear, well-defined and instantly decodable message -- with no use of vocal material. i think you will find it enriching as an example, particularly in its simplicity -- there is no need to theorise over it one bit to get what it means. (and let's face it. if you want it to be widely legible, it needs to be clear. you can't rely on derrida to create your public.) the tune in question is merely "o come all ye faithful" (a popular christmas carol) played by the bell of a cash register drawer. simple and way more effective (and powerful) than any sine wave composition i've ever heard. "christmas commercial" - john baker. --- dizzydonor.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 02:33:45 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36336-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:33:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:33:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 96973 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:33:43 +0000 Received: (qmail 96963 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:33:42 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 11:33:37 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> To: "tobias c. van Veen" <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Cc: Microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=rBW5+ubskEDgKR53CLX/3UesZKcBEbDNQ8CWRbBMZdG1Kria3zVtJmM+cSZ/G0rPh2+mRt8LEC8t3iitMqO8PFApQOjTVFRxCWJKPiqjXCrJxI9ebS53SHFrr25gM6e4134ERHbNy3pUoC+SwJqlUogTYd2Rb53iEv5XUhlIMEc= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/23/05, tobias c. van Veen <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> wrote: > If one were to broadcast at extremely high volume piercing sinewaves in a > centre of a citycore, the polis would evacuate if nothing could be done > about it. How would we know that, tobias? Are we assuming in this speculation that there's a distinction between noise and music such that if noise was played very loudly within a community for a certain duration and was inescapable that it would have the political dimension of dispersing a community? But doesn't this already assume a culture that can distinguish the difference between noise and music such that the intervening noise would become intolerable? As you may recall, I did play sine waves very loudly one day in a home in the US and it didn't cause the rest of the residents to vacate. It caused them to check out which room had tripped a fire alarm, and so the sine wave is always already going to be metonymically connected to the fire alert (probably), and so I'd speculate a civic act to prevent an inferno from taking place is a more likely outcome. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 02:22:01 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36335-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:22:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:22:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 92470 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:22:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 92459 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:22:01 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 11:21:40 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=HKgFmP1f5vGM5RRlTZjX7f/8hXkIYwnUgG6CLCbpjr7mCu8WDOJWPMbDNiHznmmV7KsA2WosEn1eLt+TRHlmATDUXiv55plSclkNC/9nOI3DGDjUly5Z1OJoc8u1D5L/a+XgmLdBBjk5LPmHBKw6PgOriR784XvN6t1Ws1TdZj8= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/23/05, graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > aren't letters just shapes and lines, nothing more? abstract graphics on a > empty background? Yes, that's right. That is fundamentally what they are. They only gain meaning within a landscape of signification, which is what we call culture. > > one person's written language is another person's hieroglyphics... yes, in a banal way, this is true. Except by now, we know that different languages are languages not heiroglyphics because we've had enough education to know what these symbols might mean. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 02:14:19 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36334-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:14:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:14:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 89185 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:14:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 89175 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 02:14:18 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 11:14:13 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=rvHnLRKXz4No+NXrp6ZkxEBhInhZg1HAn/lZ+pVHQOqcMzFdDT21DxMXvBRqrlreO3sYyuebgakXv95r3Km7JDSVtXn3Odx7KXeN7nIXiKW0A/sb0Sc0zUuVZUuIuse32XQd7eOo4QZ7f3EFKVmL8ZJNt1nz1xLmzpP7Wx8lfVk= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/22/05, Josh Ronsen <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > I don't think the question is how can wordless music > have a political meaning, but how can music made that > is so entrenched in the current economic worldview > effectively question that worldview. Impressively written question here. Nicely stated. But I think the situation about using the Apple computer is a bit more complex. LCD screens are manufactured in Korea, primarily, the twelfth largest industrial economy in the world with a high standard of living. And using an Apple is an alternative to the dominance of Windows though not as politically preferable as using Linux. So using an apple machine is somewhat counterhegemonic all the while supporting the hegemonic "aspirations" of Apple. Also, I shouldn't have to mention that popular music isn't always the inert status quo-supporting form that's being applied here. A lot of popular music has been politically counterhegemonic too. A lot of the popular music of the sixties and seventies for example. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 00:36:48 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36333-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:36:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:36:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 53499 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 00:36:46 +0000 Received: (qmail 53489 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 00:36:46 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 09:36:42 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Cc: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=uqtGE/QDvrF/F2kFHuFGS2MefjhGFkSNKd/hGuZn0ypcgtMxKnGXP6bQS5Bs44MTWaT1u8ieX/XLK7urJpNRxLw37/q1verZvL7ZcTKifYFIVGScRM5IFbH6OyVFR6oyVaR6cpbERBR/5Fi7WBZUAtSiyAc9a01qDVB+B7wNnkw= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/22/05, john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > if you read that group of words devoid of the message inherent in > them, they're only words. > if you view that group of colors and shapes devoid of the message > inherent in them, they're only colors and shapes. Sounds are not of the same order as linguistic signs. are you are saying is that words (linguistic signs) are arbitrary. I don't disagree. > > what does this phrase mean: > 'devoid of the message inherent in them' > ? > > what is the inherent message in sounds? Well, read the context :-) the statement made was that there was some "music" that involved the clanging of silverware, which outside of the declaration that they were made in opposition to the Iraq war would not be inherently pregnant with such meaning, right? Until those sounds are collected under that message, as a listener, you don't attach such intentionality, right? > why does it matter if it's art or language? what is the difference > between art and language? why is that distinction important? > Lyotard's point is that signs cannot be taken as such outside of culture. It's culture that decides whether a sign is art or language just as it is culture that decides if sounds are to be interpreted politically. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Jun 23 00:29:42 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36332-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:29:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:29:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 49314 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 00:29:41 +0000 Received: (qmail 49303 invoked from network); Thu, 23 Jun 2005 00:29:40 +0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 09:29:36 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=qO5eZ5BmAqfhtimxjMGGpIBLnOVtghp5cH3PRi/xtcJj596vmNThr5UyDPe/pUH5Ju4OZnARNURVcTxs23EZUvnFsF3OY+jHzjS9ZQFR0DroPg1J+btgtqCfn0pw01d6c100UMRnFW8TcYBmBGAHnnrbY2gDa4DkeLKeoByW3FI= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/22/05, jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > All sounds occur in a context. More specifically, all > sounds occur in the primordial context of "hearing". > So sounds are, like linguistic signs, always tending > toward contextualization(s) and therefore tending > toward meaning(s). None of this occurs in isolation. I > recall from live Derrida "set" hearing him say (in > English, and I quote from memory) "This idea that the > sign is detachable from the signifier, this is > insignificance itself". But Derrida also talked about the "arbitrariness" of the sign, which means that no sign attends inherently to any particular meaning but comes about, rather, through a social practice. It is a mistake as well to assume that linguistic signs and sonic ones are of the same order. They are nto. >I think it is a big > mistake to decide that sound has no meaning. I think > it is more true to say there is always the potential > to become meaningful. But the idea that sound has the "potential" to become meaningful assumes already that it isn't meaningful outside of its potential, which is exactly my point. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 22:37:27 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36331-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:37:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:37:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 3306 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:37:25 +0000 Received: (qmail 3295 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:37:25 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:37:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Richard Kamerman <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_1xTQEZG4+djS5eyaJhubZQ)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=zo3fWO7rvDszMJcpH9/DxExw/N3Qn40ygw6ecoOhzPb0Lqs2j+eaTQFmhTX6UE1DkMDciung2PbTGUS1tRP92Z/f3Ls48ShqIoi2s+qiwIIbYbZj31KT7EZcIue0R0EQjQfX1HTDPUeLDl8uIZ7yJxrHRtRIjJUgFpb9pA2QDNM= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_1xTQEZG4+djS5eyaJhubZQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Though music has been recently used as a weapon. Brings this article to mind. Wish I still had an active link to prove it legit but at least I copied the text: 'Tortured' with Rap?? Mon Dec 22,10:04 AM ET BEIRUT (Reuters) - Lebanese Mohammed Jaber said he went to Iraq on a pilgrimage to Muslim holy sites, he ended up being "tortured" with loud rap music by U.S. troops suspicious he might be a foreign fighter against their occupation. Jaber said an Iraqi taxi driver handed him and three friends over to U.S. troops for $100 each in April apiece as fighters for ousted Iraqi President Saddam Hussein. "They asked us why we were there and if we came to fight them. But we said we came only to visit the holy sites in Kerbala," he told Reuters. "They didn't torture us physically but they did psychologically by raising the volume of rap music all day until it became unbearable and by withholding food," he said. But Jaber said he kept one secret from his captors, fearing the treatment could get worse. "I mean I like rap, just imagine them playing jazz." U.S.-led forces in Iraq freed Jaber and sent him and seven other Arab detainees home on Saturday. graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: on sonic weapons: http://www.forteantimes.com/articles/153_sonicweapons.shtml http://www.rense.com/general/soundwaves.htm sound? yes. but music? is it important to distinguish? g. "tobias c. van Veen" wrote: > > High volume sound as tactical dispersion method of polis-itics might drive > some to some mad nomadism -- or another city. > > - tV > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org "Yesterday is history. Tomorrow is a mystery. And today? Today is a gift. That's why we call it the present." - Babatunde Olatunji - __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --Boundary_(ID_1xTQEZG4+djS5eyaJhubZQ)-- From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 22:22:52 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36330-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:22:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:22:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 96698 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:22:44 +0000 Received: (qmail 96676 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:22:43 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:21:24 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i'd like to drop the gay bomb on the white house:) Nicolas Grenier wrote: > Reach out for your tinfoil hat people... > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frey_effect > > And make sure to check out the gay bomb article linked there. These are great subversion tools, aren't they? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 22:12:41 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36329-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:12:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:12:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 91061 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:12:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 91050 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 22:12:35 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:12:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Grenier <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Xf1nH5gyrobmEs1AJ8ADSA)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=q/1CUEpzQJZK8zVw3krpI9+PCmP1cY4ZKLGFHOdWF7+kG4yI9nrvCKDRkHR/ZURK1cfKKDyqp1VxZUAItaH89R+yCsT7yAHAjxhPaujTBCHSk5nDJ36ovj8UCjg/jw0dZjj4oNON4cg4UiRG1Vq1q9zOwuBszMrQ0nGym/ssL6w= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_Xf1nH5gyrobmEs1AJ8ADSA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Reach out for your tinfoil hat people... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frey_effect And make sure to check out the gay bomb article linked there. These are great subversion tools, aren't they? graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> a écrit :on sonic weapons: http://www.forteantimes.com/articles/153_sonicweapons.shtml http://www.rense.com/general/soundwaves.htm sound? yes. but music? is it important to distinguish? g. "tobias c. van Veen" wrote: > > High volume sound as tactical dispersion method of polis-itics might drive > some to some mad nomadism -- or another city. > > - tV > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------- Lèche-vitrine ou lèche-écran ? Yahoo! Magasinage. --Boundary_(ID_Xf1nH5gyrobmEs1AJ8ADSA)-- From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 20:37:20 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36328-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:37:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:36:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 51700 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:37:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 51685 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:37:15 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:35:56 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx on sonic weapons: http://www.forteantimes.com/articles/153_sonicweapons.shtml http://www.rense.com/general/soundwaves.htm sound? yes. but music? is it important to distinguish? g. "tobias c. van Veen" wrote: > > High volume sound as tactical dispersion method of polis-itics might drive > some to some mad nomadism -- or another city. > > - tV > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 20:34:57 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36327-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:34:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:34:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 49675 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:34:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 49665 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:34:53 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:33:35 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx interesting... i would say constructs of masculine and feminine are just as learned as anything, since different societies have their own views on what signifies 'masculine' or 'feminine'... that said, there are clear objective biological differences in the chemical makeup of the sexes, which undoubtedly influence emotion and thought processes... could hormones manifest themselves in music? sure. or is labeling loud and aggressive music 'masculine' or 'testosterone-fueled' simply put us back into the same trappings? then again, why the long hair and makeup in so-called macho musics of the eighties, such as speed metal? once again, a complex and multifaceted 1000 page ethnomusicological discussion with probably no clear-cut answer... g. p.s. boys makes blue music. girls make pink music. nuff said. "Mr.D" wrote: > > there was a big discussion on some list i was on way back that pitted > the idea of Masculine and Feminine music, that there was a > discernible *audible* difference. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 20:29:54 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36326-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:29:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:29:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 46013 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:29:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 46003 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:29:48 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:29:47 -0400 From: "tobias c. van Veen" <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: Microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Cc: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <BEDF427B.209B4%xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > Nice to see you gettin' political there, Graham, but you're not really > getting my point. There's nothing inherently political in sound and > it's arrangements. It's the culture that surrounds it. If one were to broadcast at extremely high volume piercing sinewaves in a centre of a citycore, the polis would evacuate if nothing could be done about it. The centrism of gathering which all politics revolves around -- the polis as citystate, also the philosophical gesture of enclosure, around oikos, the hearth, and its connection to the polis, the city, the state -- would be disrupted. The polis in and of itself requires its surrounds as inherent to its boundary construction; culture is inseparable from the gesture of exclusion necessary for the polis. High volume sound as tactical dispersion method of polis-itics might drive some to some mad nomadism -- or another city. - tV --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 20:21:40 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36325-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:21:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:21:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 42379 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:21:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 42365 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:21:26 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:21:21 -0700 From: "Mr.D" <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at xdrive.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i want to preface this: john saylor brought up cage, not me! ;) there was a period in Cage's life where he wrote his compositions in accordance with his own worldview. the structures and forms he used supported his personal feelings of societal control and healthy living... an example would be the removal of any 'conductor' from a large ensemble piece, or the way instruments in the Number Pieces were meant to play as if they were solo parts, but that still coexist in harmony with all the other parts as a unified (and interpenetrating) whole. that said, Cage's political views could only REALLY be deciphered if you knew the musicology behind it. if you knew that Cage was interested in utopian anarchy and the philosophy of thoreau and bucky fuller, you might be able to hear that in these pieces. i doubt Cage wanted that result, however. he only wrote music as it occurred to him as something he does, which would naturally coincide with his own intersecting philosophical ideas. that is how i think 'political music without words' happens, because i agree, music as sound is nothing more than music as sound. anything beyond that is due to an interpretation by a human mind, which contextualizes it, and the more context the more meaning it may gain... or lose. there is no inherent meaning in sound or music, it is only present in the mind of the listener. there was a big discussion on some list i was on way back that pitted the idea of Masculine and Feminine music, that there was a discernible *audible* difference. my own opinion is that music, as a language, is ill equipped to communicate specific things. the semiotics and syntax of its language is different than word-based ones, which have more cognitive importance simply because they are widely used and recognizable. unfortunately, words are borne from things which are not them, they are fake and viral; music is itself categorically. On Jun 22, 2005, at 7:31 AM, john saylor wrote: > hi > > your post made some questions come to my mind. > > On 6/22/05, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > >> If you hear that group of sounds devoid of the message >> inherent in it, they're only sounds. >> > > if you read that group of words devoid of the message inherent in > them, they're only words. > if you view that group of colors and shapes devoid of the message > inherent in them, they're only colors and shapes. > > what does this phrase mean: > 'devoid of the message inherent in them' > ? > > what is the inherent message in sounds? > have you been reading john cage? zen texts? > > > >> Paraphrasing Lyotard: a cave dweller inscribes a figure on the wall >> inside a cave. Is it art? Is it language? It is neither. The >> distinction will come later. >> > > hmm ... > > why does it matter if it's art or language? what is the difference > between art and language? why is that distinction important? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 20:02:07 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36324-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:02:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:02:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 33552 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:02:04 +0000 Received: (qmail 33530 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 20:02:03 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:02:00 -0700 From: Quintus Frimschlowder VIII <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Quintus Frimschlowder VIII <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_RHUgDn0IZ8E7ie6+WQ+fHw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=ooII8cbU9UkdL5kcxEwhVE6V7Q2FGpfWkFv7gNBcdTsccq7ycLjXSVvqeOqXBvc/lXM/WaiyUW5uaLjvvAqFM+RkcGC17mVJ/EbL8Xj6s5OueNP1oSRktgKJveb9UtbYld9MEDnwlRM/aonkquTVFUgAHiHQrKGoow2PNNFIRlI= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_RHUgDn0IZ8E7ie6+WQ+fHw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll jump on the "context is everything" bandwagon, myself. Conveying something as specific as your support or disapproval of a political party or idea through means that use no words (written or spoken) is really difficult, and I doubt that your message would get through to all your listeners uniformly. Music is generally better-suited to communicating feelings, rather than specific words and non-musical concepts. It's context that gives music its meaning. We are able to tell that this is true because of the fact that anyone or anything lacking the context of a certain musical piece will be at least somewhat left in the dark upon hearing it. The same goes for language. I don't speak German, so if someone talks to me in German, I only have kinesthetics to utilize in receiving his communication. Likewise, hearing an instrumental piece with no context for it, I have only the emotional cues to pick up on. I can hear that it's sad or happy, but not what it's sad or happy about (unless the music itself makes reference to another musical piece that I do have context for - I've seen John Zorn do this once or twice, it's pretty funny). That said, I have seen some instrumental pieces that I would consider to be *vaguely* political. Communicating a political message through music can certainly be done, but there pretty much needs to be some prior understanding of what's going on in order to really successfully receive the communication, I think. (Intentionally vague for lack of time to fully explain myself.) - QF8 http://scatterbrain.raygunarmy.com/ --Boundary_(ID_RHUgDn0IZ8E7ie6+WQ+fHw)-- From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 19:47:48 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36323-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:47:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:47:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 24907 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:47:30 +0000 Received: (qmail 24864 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:47:29 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:46:07 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx http://www.theonion.com/2056-06-22/opinion/3/ "Tk-tkk-tk-tkik-tik! USA! USA! USA! Tk-tik-tkkk!" Nicolas Grenier wrote: > How about a musical party whose arguments would be mainly sonic? > "So, what are you going to do about those taxes sir?" > "brrrr.......wooooooiiiinggg........dzzzzzzzi... powf!" > > > --------------------------------- > Lèche-vitrine ou lèche-écran ? Yahoo! Magasinage. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 18:28:43 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36320-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:28:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:28:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 89953 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:28:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 89943 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:28:37 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:28:14 -0500 From: Michael North <xxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: RE: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <00a301c57760$88f572c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Yeah, the aac-48 channel bit is quite cool....only ever got up to 16 channels use myself....if you're interested in surround sound I'd recommend the surround sound mail list at: mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound lots of discussion, beyond surround sound as well... www.ambisonic.net/sursound.html has good discussions/info on ambisonics, and links to vsti's of surround/ambisonic plugins(mostly free) and forum.doom9.org has lots of info regarding tools setups etc.... Bidule (www.plogue.com) is a good modular environment(winxp & macOSX) that supports multichannel recording..... //*-----Original Message----- //*From: Mr.D [mailto:xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx] //*Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 11:18 AM //*To: microsound //*Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? //* //*Ah thanks for the clarification on the formats! I feel greatly //*enlightened. //* //*And I had no idea about AAC's capabilities, that's very cool. //* //*On Jun 22, 2005, at 7:10 AM, Michael North wrote: //* //*> //*> The following is from the MS site ....but I've used it, and it //*> works.... //*> //*> Windows Media Audio 9 Professional, is a great match for high-fidelity //*> hardware and computer with 5.1 channel surround sound. It captures //*> full-resolution audio (24-bit/96-kHz sampling) in stereo or 5.1 //*> channel (and //*> even 7.1 channel) surround sound for streaming or download-and-play //*> delivery //*> at 128 to 768 Kbps //*> //*> Had it wrong on the apple ac3(shouldn't answer emails without enough //*> sleeptime)...meant AAC | MPEG-4...from their site, the following/ //*> also have //*> used it and it worked.... //*> //*> When compared side-by-side, AAC proves itself worthy of replacing //*> MP3 as the //*> new Internet audio standard. Take a look at these AAC advantages //*> over MP3: //*> //*> * Improved compression provides higher-quality results with //*> smaller file //*> sizes //*> * Support for multichannel audio, providing up to 48 full //*> frequency //*> channels //*> * Higher resolution audio, yielding sampling rates up to 96 kHz //*> * Improved decoding efficiency, requiring less processing power //*> for //*> decode //*> //*> Real Audio also uses AAC and is as well capable of multi-channel //*> sound, have //*> used it and it worked......................... //*> //*> //*> //*> //*> //*-----Original Message----- //*> //*From: Mr.D [mailto:xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx] //*> //*Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 12:31 PM //*> //*To: microsound //*> //*Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? //*> //* //*> //*AC3 is Dolby Digital, not Apple. So naturally, it does surround. //*> //* //*> //*Apple's lossless implementation is m4a, MPEG layer 4, the audio //*> //*portion of an MPEG 4 movie. To my knowledge, it's dual channel //*> only. //*> //*That goes for WMA and RealAudio too, AFAIK. //*> //* //*> //*You may want to look into flac, which has multi-channel support; I //*> //*believe there is some work being done on the surround sound //*> //*capabilities of flac. http://flac.sourceforge.net/ //*> //* //*> //*matt //*> //* //*> //*On Jun 21, 2005, at 10:53 AM, Michael North wrote: //*> //* //*> //*> Franhoeffer(?) have released a surround mp3 encoder....is beta //*> and //*> //*> only does //*> //*> 192k....but you can do surround in apples ac3, ms wma and real //*> ra as //*> //*> well..................... //*> //*> //*> //*> //*-----Original Message----- //*> //*> //*From: Kassen [mailto:xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx] //*> //*> //*Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 8:54 AM //*> //*> //*To: microsound //*> //*> //*Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? //*> //*> //* //*> //*> //*Adam Young //*> //*> //* //*> //*> //*> I'm new to the surround sound game.. I was wondering if //*> there //*> //*> are any //*> //*> //*> MP3-like audio codecs that support surround sound in a //*> //*> portable format //*> //*> //*like //*> //*> //*> MP3s that can be downloaded and played with a player, etc. //*> //*> //* //*> //*> //*Somebody correct me if I´m wrong, but I believe codecs like //*> mp3 //*> //*> tend to //*> //*> //*lose //*> //*> //*the phase relations of the material. I think the more simple //*> //*> strategies //*> //*> //*for //*> //*> //*surround depend on those which would mean encoding will spoil //*> //*> the fun. //*> //*> //* //*> //*> //*Depending on your aplication you could work with multiple //*> //*> paralel files? //*> //*> //* //*> //*> //*Kas. //*> //*> //* //*> //*> //* //*> //*> //* //*> //*> // //*> //*> //*> *--------------------------------------------------------------------- //*> //*> //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*> //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*> //*website: http://www.microsound.org //*> //*> //*> //*> //*> //*> //*> --------------------------------------------------------------------- //*> //*> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*> website: http://www.microsound.org //*> //*> //*> //*> //*> //* //*> //* //*> // //*> *--------------------------------------------------------------------- //*> //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*website: http://www.microsound.org //*> //*> //*> --------------------------------------------------------------------- //*> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> website: http://www.microsound.org //*> //*> //* //* //*--------------------------------------------------------------------- //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 19:20:03 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36322-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:20:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:20:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 11157 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:20:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 11040 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:19:58 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 21:19:44 +0200 From: Marta Klonowska <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] *** Gameboyzz Orchestra Project *** Forma Nova Festival 2005 *** To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <00ef01c5775f$5c47e060$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2742.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2741.2600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_dbA6utih289GYJZYNYj4YQ)" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_dbA6utih289GYJZYNYj4YQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "If the noises emitting from your speakers sound like burps, farts and blips with electronic overtones, don't be alarmed - your stereo probably doesn't have indigestion. More likely, you're listening to the video-game-enhanced tunes of the Gameboyzz Orchestra Project" - Rachel Metz, WIRED News : : http://gameboyzz.com : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : # Friday, 8 July 2005, 9.30 pm concert Forma Nova Festival http://www.formanovafestival.com/ Fredericia Denmark : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : # piatek, 8 lipca 2005, godz. 21.30 koncert Forma Nova Festival http://www.formanovafestival.com/ Fredericia Dania : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : Marta Klonowska The Manager call me: 0048 601406977 : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : : --Boundary_(ID_dbA6utih289GYJZYNYj4YQ)-- From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 19:04:36 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36321-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:04:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:04:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 4481 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:04:32 +0000 Received: (qmail 4471 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 19:04:32 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:04:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Nicolas Grenier <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_qc6VDrqcRlR8ZWm8ryiL2g)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=UewUiZ/iLZTfCqfDVdDzNzHP9L9n9e6JJj1LvzIWaMOrSQBuzeyc8bmVNQhi7I59WnZaCn3vISWFwndtbpXddQs+I3JEaHdb9Ni6sGzXfGt2W87ov7/DSfjuGMKey5HzIczfVn48hgHcvPKKu2f8/S59PlgDgkwR2EiC+ix0bWE= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_qc6VDrqcRlR8ZWm8ryiL2g) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit How about a musical party whose arguments would be mainly sonic? "So, what are you going to do about those taxes sir?" "brrrr.......wooooooiiiinggg........dzzzzzzzi... powf!" --------------------------------- Lèche-vitrine ou lèche-écran ? Yahoo! Magasinage. --Boundary_(ID_qc6VDrqcRlR8ZWm8ryiL2g)-- From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 18:22:36 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36319-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:22:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:22:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 87258 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:22:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 87247 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 18:22:30 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:22:21 -0400 (EDT) From: xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xx.xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 28 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_UUVKbnpWZZDDTuWbJoO4Tg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_UUVKbnpWZZDDTuWbJoO4Tg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In a message dated 22/6/05 17:20:49, xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx writes: > Music can evoke emotion though. I think it is a phenomenon worth > mentioning. > I think that certain harmonic and melodic structures are associated culturally with certain emotions in ways which are specific to individual cultures. Whilst I enjoy the sounds of Chinese Orchestral music, I cannot say that I can necessarily understand all he emotional cues in the music since I have had so little exposure (as an Englishman) to true chinese culture. Within my own culture, I do agree there are musical moments that produce a profound physical response in my body, but I would be hesitant to call it 'emotional'. I prefer to think of it as a sort of acoustic 'stroking', similar to touch, a concordance of physicalities. rob --Boundary_(ID_UUVKbnpWZZDDTuWbJoO4Tg)-- From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 17:46:28 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36318-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:46:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:46:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 66513 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 17:46:23 +0000 Received: (qmail 66503 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 17:46:23 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:45:03 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > You can consider it to be apolitical, or you can > consider it to be very political in the sense that it > actively champions the current political and economic > structures that control much of what goes on (here in > America). To listen to most radio in America, you’ve > already been politicized into accepting commercials, a > limited sense of intellectual inquiry, corporate > control over just about everything, etc. absolutely true. i was just being political by calling it apolitical:) > > > Something that greatly concerns me as an electronic > musician is that my thoughts may be progressive in > some sense, but my actions actively support the status > quo through purchasing equipment, supplies and > services. oh no... i see where you are going here... > When I turn on the radio in my car, no > matter what radio station I tune into, I am still > powering the radio from gas from Texaco or whatever. > When I am cutting up sounds in Amadeus II or Pro > Tools, I am not just challenging people’s conception > of sound (or whatever), but I am supporting Apple > computers and the economic chain of overseas labor > which is invisible to me, the steady destruction of > the environment. the alternative is not make art and live on a desert island where nobody is ever going to hear from you and you'll zero chance of changing the world. subverting consumer goods and using them against themselves has always been the spirit of electronic music... look at the turntable... transformed from a product for passive consumption into an instrument for creative production... computers are no different. you can use them for autodial telemarketing or you can boot boot up MAX/MSP... if you want to start a 'fair trade' computer company up that adhere to all the ethics and morality by which you stand, by all means, do it... i''ll buy one. but it just means you'll be doing that for the next thirty years and not making art. time is against us. act now. this is limited time opportunity. the revolutionaries are standing by. > in particular; the parts used in any computer are > probably made with cheap labor and probably not made > with environmental protection in mind. > > Music does not just have a surface political meaning, > but the very existence and consumption of music > implies the political and economic (is there really a > difference?) structures the music lives in. This is > what I got out of Attail’s book, which otherwise I > found to be not very rigorous and not too useful. > > I don’t think the question is how can wordless music > have a political meaning, but how can music made that > is so entrenched in the current economic worldview > effectively question that worldview. i don't see capitalism in itself as particularly a problem. what it's become is the problem. i could never engineer the tools i use to make art, to write, to make films, music, communicate, myself. i appreciate the ingenuity of others... i guess what i'm saying is that i'm more in favour of what alvin toffler calls the 'prosumer' in his 'the third wave' book (which i highly recommend). i don't distinguish between consumption and production. the best kind of person on earth gives back as much as he takes. and that giving back does not necessarily entail merely money. it can be art. it can be time. it can be this e-mail. g. > > > -Josh Ronsen > in Austin, Texas > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 17:27:25 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36317-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:27:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:27:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 57625 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 17:27:20 +0000 Received: (qmail 57615 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 17:27:20 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:26:00 -0400 From: graham miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music To: Microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73C-SYMPA (Macintosh; U; PPC) Content-type: text/plain; x-mac-creator=4D4F5353; x-mac-type=54455854; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr-CA Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx aren't letters just shapes and lines, nothing more? abstract graphics on a empty background? one person's written language is another person's hieroglyphics... aren't spoken words just sounds too? the sound of one word in english, say 'chow' (which infers food) means goodbye in italian and something entirely different in chinese... same sound. different meaning... the meaning we ascribe to them is just as learned as the meaning we ascribe to musical sounds. i don't see the difference. music is text. language is contextual. maybe i still don't get you... g. > But sound > itself is just sound--nothing more. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 16:20:37 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36316-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:20:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:20:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 99617 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:20:33 +0000 Received: (qmail 99604 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:20:33 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:20:29 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Music can evoke emotion though. I think it is a phenomenon worth mentioning. Ever had the hairs on your arm stand on end when listening to music void of lyrics/history of said piece? Literal communication is not music, music was never intended to be so by itself. Music can be reworked into a language very easily. Then literal communication could take place, but then it would cease to be music, and become literal language. Music can be made into a programming language, then, blah blah blah you get the idea... aLEKs --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 16:18:17 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36315-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:18:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:18:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 97041 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:18:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 97012 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:18:07 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 09:17:59 -0700 From: "Mr.D" <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? In-reply-to: <009a01c57734$2cd94b50$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.730) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at xdrive.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <009a01c57734$2cd94b50$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Ah thanks for the clarification on the formats! I feel greatly enlightened. And I had no idea about AAC's capabilities, that's very cool. On Jun 22, 2005, at 7:10 AM, Michael North wrote: > > The following is from the MS site ....but I've used it, and it > works.... > > Windows Media Audio 9 Professional, is a great match for high-fidelity > hardware and computer with 5.1 channel surround sound. It captures > full-resolution audio (24-bit/96-kHz sampling) in stereo or 5.1 > channel (and > even 7.1 channel) surround sound for streaming or download-and-play > delivery > at 128 to 768 Kbps > > Had it wrong on the apple ac3(shouldn't answer emails without enough > sleeptime)...meant AAC | MPEG-4...from their site, the following/ > also have > used it and it worked.... > > When compared side-by-side, AAC proves itself worthy of replacing > MP3 as the > new Internet audio standard. Take a look at these AAC advantages > over MP3: > > * Improved compression provides higher-quality results with > smaller file > sizes > * Support for multichannel audio, providing up to 48 full > frequency > channels > * Higher resolution audio, yielding sampling rates up to 96 kHz > * Improved decoding efficiency, requiring less processing power > for > decode > > Real Audio also uses AAC and is as well capable of multi-channel > sound, have > used it and it worked......................... > > > > > //*-----Original Message----- > //*From: Mr.D [mailto:xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx] > //*Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 12:31 PM > //*To: microsound > //*Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? > //* > //*AC3 is Dolby Digital, not Apple. So naturally, it does surround. > //* > //*Apple's lossless implementation is m4a, MPEG layer 4, the audio > //*portion of an MPEG 4 movie. To my knowledge, it's dual channel > only. > //*That goes for WMA and RealAudio too, AFAIK. > //* > //*You may want to look into flac, which has multi-channel support; I > //*believe there is some work being done on the surround sound > //*capabilities of flac. http://flac.sourceforge.net/ > //* > //*matt > //* > //*On Jun 21, 2005, at 10:53 AM, Michael North wrote: > //* > //*> Franhoeffer(?) have released a surround mp3 encoder....is beta > and > //*> only does > //*> 192k....but you can do surround in apples ac3, ms wma and real > ra as > //*> well..................... > //*> > //*> //*-----Original Message----- > //*> //*From: Kassen [mailto:xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx] > //*> //*Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 8:54 AM > //*> //*To: microsound > //*> //*Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? > //*> //* > //*> //*Adam Young > //*> //* > //*> //*> I'm new to the surround sound game.. I was wondering if > there > //*> are any > //*> //*> MP3-like audio codecs that support surround sound in a > //*> portable format > //*> //*like > //*> //*> MP3s that can be downloaded and played with a player, etc. > //*> //* > //*> //*Somebody correct me if I´m wrong, but I believe codecs like > mp3 > //*> tend to > //*> //*lose > //*> //*the phase relations of the material. I think the more simple > //*> strategies > //*> //*for > //*> //*surround depend on those which would mean encoding will spoil > //*> the fun. > //*> //* > //*> //*Depending on your aplication you could work with multiple > //*> paralel files? > //*> //* > //*> //*Kas. > //*> //* > //*> //* > //*> //* > //*> // > //*> > *--------------------------------------------------------------------- > //*> //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > //*> //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > //*> //*website: http://www.microsound.org > //*> > //*> > //*> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > //*> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > //*> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > //*> website: http://www.microsound.org > //*> > //*> > //* > //* > // > *--------------------------------------------------------------------- > //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > //*website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 16:03:46 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36314-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:03:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:03:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 89575 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:03:41 +0000 Received: (qmail 89565 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 16:03:41 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 11:03:40 -0500 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hi, Josh Ronsen wrote: "To listen to most radio in America, you’ve already been politicized into accepting commercials, a limited sense of intellectual inquiry, corporate control over just about everything, etc." I think this is a very important point. Josh: "Something that greatly concerns me as an electronic musician is that my thoughts may be progressive in some sense, but my actions actively support the status quo through purchasing equipment, supplies and services." Yes, but that is in the nature of the system itself. Furthermore, I don't think the whole idea of putting the blame for the conditions of PRODUCTION on the consumer/end user is entirely justified. There does seem to be a progressive idea in the last few years that you can "get off the grid" and refrain from consuming negative corporate products. While this is a decent idea, in a limited sense, I daresay it does nothing to actualy improve the lives of, for instance, factory workers in Mexico. It's also not realistic to achieve for those of us who require computers and electronic instruments to do our work - though personally I do try to buy used equipment in some cases. I don't think you have to feel "guilty" about it buying a computer (unless that feeling helps you to be politically active in some other area). While the Marxist focus on conditions of production and ownership of the means of production might have been too narrow and dogmatic, it is a mistake to go to the opposite pole and only worry about the conditions of consumption. Consumption is itself PRODUCED by an elaborate and effective system. What is much more important is political involvement in your nation, working for governments that don't push global economic strategies that make these exploitive factories profitable and inevitable. However, realize that at a very important level, it is going to be up to the workers at the individual factories, or in the exploited nations, to fight their own political struggles and liberate themselves. I think it is rather more important to focus on those places in our lives, at work, school, the local neighborhood, and the voting booth, where we can make a difference. Our local success can allow us to then link up to broader global struggles, which we can support but which must be carried out by the individuals involved who have a stake in what happens. In particular, if the United States could ever assume a progressive role in world politics (I know this is hard to imagine!), it would likely assist ALL of the global struggles and lessen the ability of corporations to exploit around the world. Josh: "Music does not just have a surface political meaning, but the very existence and consumption of music implies the political and economic (is there really a difference?) structures the music lives in. This is what I got out of Attail’s book, which otherwise I found to be not very rigorous and not too useful." I agreed, the book was exciting when I first read it, but after some contemplation and analysis, the ideas don't really hold up and there's a lot of "grand meta-narrative" implying that history, in this case musical history, is inevitably marching on towards some glorious revolutionary destiny (telos) - the liberation of noise. I don't think we need yet another overblown grand narrative. Furthermore, Attali is very biased towards Western music, and if I recall correctly, make little mention of or analysis of non-Western music. I think that a more global and less ethnocentric vision of music would see that noise has always been an important part of music, though the particular quality of noise, and the balance between noise and pattern within music, varies with individual cultures. I do think the production of music is political, and it's important to look at the conditions of PRODUCTION of music, especially in our own lives. The mainstream music industry exploits a great many people in the making and selling of a record, and one of the nice things about independent music is that normally the conditions of production are simpler and non-exploitive, tending towards individual efforts and small collaborations, often with a gift economy operating at some points rather than any strictly capitalist one. Want to create a piece that is political without using words or musical signifiers that function in linguistic ways (quotations)? It's not difficult, once you put aside the tendency to "preach" and think that music must be some tool to convert people to your own point of view (which is a problem I have with a lot of progressive actions generally). Here are some of the political possibilities I see readily available: 1. Create music in an open collaboration with other artists, making sure to maintain a non-exploitive and progressive relationship with all parties involved. Or write music for multimedia/dance/etc where as an artist you collaborate with others in the artistic process in an open way. 2. Create music which you give away for free. 3. Create music specifically for an event or environment that is politically progressive and build solidarity while making life more beautiful and joyful for everyone present. 4. Study those composers and performers who feel are progress and create music that connects to and extends their tradition. 5. Take an experimental attitude in your music, and always seek to evolve and to move forward in your own approach, and structure your personal musical philosophy in a way which is reflective of your political outlook. 6. Use as much free, open source, independent, and used hardware and/or software as is practical in your music making. 7. Write versions of Russian and Chinese folks songs in the "socialist realist" style. (sorry just kidding!!!) And I would say that none of these examples are "external" to the music, one could just as well say that the actual music is external to the process of production which gives rise to it! In the end, I strongly believe that the fact that you use your time to create music, much of which is probably given away freely, is itself political - since you could be using this time to build bombs, sell stocks and real estate, or even just passively consume corporate media. ~David --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 15:53:31 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36313-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 11:53:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 11:53:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 83242 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:53:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 83224 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:53:26 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 11:53:21 -0400 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Who's distinction? Yours, mine, we/ours? We have no point of reference. Only the creator of the image has it. We can only percieve to know what distinction/purpose it really had. But in the end that only further supports your rationale on the whole subject. aLEKs > The politics comes later. > Paraphrasing Lyotard: a cave dweller inscribes a figure on the wall > inside a cave. Is it art? Is it language? It is neither. The > distinction will come later. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 14:40:21 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36312-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 10:40:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 10:40:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 48642 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:40:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 48631 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:40:17 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 07:40:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Josh Ronsen <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Re: being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=bSf8X0ty64KPJjUwovK1dN2Ggu115ufKEpe90p14pLrgZ8K8O2sx2w0U15Kj+l8xH+CJsUN8ZW7i7tndQVJ4SYgdN+30lbALwd38BSFuoVouroDN4WcDvjHXbamhX66HbaztRrjBqcSk17dF8KQN6i93VqJtDEdfD/e7priPLlI= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx graham miller wrote: >and think about this: the popular music on the radio is >some of the most apolitical, apathetic music in the entire >universe. and it's chock-full of 'lyrics.' You can consider it to be apolitical, or you can consider it to be very political in the sense that it actively champions the current political and economic structures that control much of what goes on (here in America). To listen to most radio in America, you’ve already been politicized into accepting commercials, a limited sense of intellectual inquiry, corporate control over just about everything, etc. Something that greatly concerns me as an electronic musician is that my thoughts may be progressive in some sense, but my actions actively support the status quo through purchasing equipment, supplies and services. When I turn on the radio in my car, no matter what radio station I tune into, I am still powering the radio from gas from Texaco or whatever. When I am cutting up sounds in Amadeus II or Pro Tools, I am not just challenging people’s conception of sound (or whatever), but I am supporting Apple computers and the economic chain of overseas labor which is invisible to me, the steady destruction of the environment. This is not an attack against Apple in particular; the parts used in any computer are probably made with cheap labor and probably not made with environmental protection in mind. Music does not just have a surface political meaning, but the very existence and consumption of music implies the political and economic (is there really a difference?) structures the music lives in. This is what I got out of Attail’s book, which otherwise I found to be not very rigorous and not too useful. I don’t think the question is how can wordless music have a political meaning, but how can music made that is so entrenched in the current economic worldview effectively question that worldview. -Josh Ronsen in Austin, Texas ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 14:31:24 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36311-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 10:31:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 10:31:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 43017 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:31:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 43007 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 14:31:21 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 10:31:19 -0400 From: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=e5AThlb8V1puERcd+e3sYJGYegUExGzRy7MNTkhVYtluoYS7Jez2kEN9LH+jiizm6mUlmgP+ftzOvBvefBQkLvmgixCAXogLCFZLvnJkPhPPj/rTV05tbOO/q96eCow5yHQ+knMNphEtKNYfc28YpWPo7j7KbGtckFByTYG8cyI= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi your post made some questions come to my mind. On 6/22/05, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > If you hear that group of sounds devoid of the message > inherent in it, they're only sounds. if you read that group of words devoid of the message inherent in them, they're only words. if you view that group of colors and shapes devoid of the message inherent in them, they're only colors and shapes. what does this phrase mean: 'devoid of the message inherent in them' ? what is the inherent message in sounds? have you been reading john cage? zen texts? > Paraphrasing Lyotard: a cave dweller inscribes a figure on the wall > inside a cave. Is it art? Is it language? It is neither. The > distinction will come later. hmm ... why does it matter if it's art or language? what is the difference between art and language? why is that distinction important? -- \js [ http://or8.net/~johns/ ] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 13:11:11 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36310-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 09:11:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 09:11:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 18191 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:11:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 18168 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 13:11:06 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 09:10:41 -0500 From: Michael North <xxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: RE: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <009a01c57734$2cd94b50$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx The following is from the MS site ....but I've used it, and it works.... Windows Media Audio 9 Professional, is a great match for high-fidelity hardware and computer with 5.1 channel surround sound. It captures full-resolution audio (24-bit/96-kHz sampling) in stereo or 5.1 channel (and even 7.1 channel) surround sound for streaming or download-and-play delivery at 128 to 768 Kbps Had it wrong on the apple ac3(shouldn't answer emails without enough sleeptime)...meant AAC | MPEG-4...from their site, the following/also have used it and it worked.... When compared side-by-side, AAC proves itself worthy of replacing MP3 as the new Internet audio standard. Take a look at these AAC advantages over MP3: * Improved compression provides higher-quality results with smaller file sizes * Support for multichannel audio, providing up to 48 full frequency channels * Higher resolution audio, yielding sampling rates up to 96 kHz * Improved decoding efficiency, requiring less processing power for decode Real Audio also uses AAC and is as well capable of multi-channel sound, have used it and it worked......................... //*-----Original Message----- //*From: Mr.D [mailto:xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx] //*Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 12:31 PM //*To: microsound //*Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? //* //*AC3 is Dolby Digital, not Apple. So naturally, it does surround. //* //*Apple's lossless implementation is m4a, MPEG layer 4, the audio //*portion of an MPEG 4 movie. To my knowledge, it's dual channel only. //*That goes for WMA and RealAudio too, AFAIK. //* //*You may want to look into flac, which has multi-channel support; I //*believe there is some work being done on the surround sound //*capabilities of flac. http://flac.sourceforge.net/ //* //*matt //* //*On Jun 21, 2005, at 10:53 AM, Michael North wrote: //* //*> Franhoeffer(?) have released a surround mp3 encoder....is beta and //*> only does //*> 192k....but you can do surround in apples ac3, ms wma and real ra as //*> well..................... //*> //*> //*-----Original Message----- //*> //*From: Kassen [mailto:xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx] //*> //*Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 8:54 AM //*> //*To: microsound //*> //*Subject: Re: [microsound] Portable audio codecs w surround? //*> //* //*> //*Adam Young //*> //* //*> //*> I'm new to the surround sound game.. I was wondering if there //*> are any //*> //*> MP3-like audio codecs that support surround sound in a //*> portable format //*> //*like //*> //*> MP3s that can be downloaded and played with a player, etc. //*> //* //*> //*Somebody correct me if I´m wrong, but I believe codecs like mp3 //*> tend to //*> //*lose //*> //*the phase relations of the material. I think the more simple //*> strategies //*> //*for //*> //*surround depend on those which would mean encoding will spoil //*> the fun. //*> //* //*> //*Depending on your aplication you could work with multiple //*> paralel files? //*> //* //*> //*Kas. //*> //* //*> //* //*> //* //*> // //*> *--------------------------------------------------------------------- //*> //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> //*website: http://www.microsound.org //*> //*> //*> --------------------------------------------------------------------- //*> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> website: http://www.microsound.org //*> //*> //* //* //*--------------------------------------------------------------------- //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 12:45:33 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36309-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 08:45:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 08:45:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 9683 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:45:28 +0000 Received: (qmail 9672 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 12:45:28 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 07:45:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Mika Martini <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_g5yZMcVp+RJpWExD+HaiTQ)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=abbLQ/BTl4QnX3U8Ez7T72MHC/DuHfBNPRxX9dsFXH+54ie9WC8PK+fslT2ZRSyjYVtMTL91bPH8fEgm2hXWs9SHysFDV0EKAMDxOpR3RrIrMgB+q4026dxBuHkUE51sqLmsWdyPzVDt1m1ZiXRl/5O9bkdRL9sw+edcCqqRotY= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_g5yZMcVp+RJpWExD+HaiTQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bill Ashline wrote: "The best way to give a political color to basically apolitical sonics is to use political titles and packaging." Por ejemplo/example graphic: http://www.mikamartini.scd.cl/CivicEducation.htm mika. Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> escribió: On 6/21/05, Damian Stewart wrote: > How do you get across political messages in music which has no lyrics > and which has no voice samples? > You can't. People can read anything they want into music, because music doesn't have any apriori political signifiers. The best way to give a political color to basically apolitical sonics is to use political titles and packaging. Some of the most overtly political music outside of the work of Cardew is the free jazz of the sixties, and that was all part of a process of social transformation and the political dimensions of the music came out in the culture that surrounded it--with tributes to Malcolm X, for example, and some of the clothes and styling of the musicians, like the Art Ensemble's tribal paint, etc. Without the cultural politics, the music isn't inherently political at all unless the forms are radical, which by now is pretty unlikely. -- What to the American slave is your 4th of July? I answer: a day that reveals to him, more than all other days in the year, the gross injustice and cruelty to which he is the constant victim. To him, your celebration is a sham; your boasted liberty, an unholy license; your national greatness, swelling vanity; your sounds of rejoicing are empty and heartless; your denunciations of tyrants, brass fronted impudence; your shouts of liberty and equality, hollow mockery; your prayers and hymns, your sermons and thanksgivings, with all your religious parade and solemnity, are, to him, mere bombast, fraud, deception, impiety, and hypocrisy--a thin veil to cover up crimes which would disgrace a nation of savages. There is not a nation on the earth guilty of practices more shocking and bloody than are the people of the United States, at this very hour.--Frederick Douglass --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org + + + + + + + + + + + + + [M!M] [CHILE] [www.mikamartini.scd.cl] __________________________________________________ Correo Yahoo! Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis! Regístrate ya - http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com/ --Boundary_(ID_g5yZMcVp+RJpWExD+HaiTQ)-- From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 11:53:46 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36308-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 07:53:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 07:53:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 94504 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 11:53:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 94493 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 11:53:33 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 04:53:29 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff gburek <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=JGV1eCS+ikSDI6qIQhtIC9Uwqqte4oul7FyU/dXSGhHY+GIy58Hewxy3lmkbWgqWtq/qML0jKG+kaSaEIrwZB+4+bNiWdvxuUgnPFphniYAKVOBzcluIf8kNS89F+Fj/MAtVpynR/MNFqA0a/lWWJ3RBKsL6WI1MqPyQZAaXXbo= ; Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Begging to differ in an indifferent world. All sounds occur in a context. More specifically, all sounds occur in the primordial context of “hearing”. So sounds are, like linguistic signs, always tending toward contextualization(s) and therefore tending toward meaning(s). None of this occurs in isolation. I recall from live Derrida "set" hearing him say (in English, and I quote from memory) “This idea that the sign is detachable from the signifier, this is insignificance itself”. In the context of that lecture on the undecidability of the phonic element of language over and above the graphic element, the irony of what this sounded like to me has continued to reverberate across the years. I think it is a big mistake to decide that sound has no meaning. I think it is more true to say there is always the potential to become meaningful. (It is not important to decide first that sound is meaningless in order to then re-interpret it as signal, etc.) The only reason one should give up is if one’s physical or mental pain suffered in this existence becomes too much to bear (Deleuze?). There is great despair if one cannot get one’s message across. And there is a despair that there is no message to get across. But is this unique to sound? I think not. “A true relationship of trust is when you believe in the other party like it is a human being, even if it may be a machine. This kind of trust also improves the endurance of the machine. Believing in something strongly enough will eventually envelop the whole world into the situation.” –Tetuzi Akiyama, Route 13 to the Gates of Hell So we ought to be careful about not only what we believe but about what we say we believe. There is a form of experience, a shape to the truth, that resists being tames by opinion, public or otherwise. The work needs to attain this notation within itself. This is what William Blake said: “Everything possible to be believed is an image of truth.” We will never or only rarely (and accidentally?) encounter the outside of capitalism while sitting in front of our computers. But maybe capitalism is empty enough to be filled with an intention more profound than the superficiality of products, no matter what their relative merits in the established hierarchies of value. To be singular is to light a fire under context. Who will pass the matches, please? One's politics is not often readable in what one talks about so much as in what one refuses to talk about. -Jeff Gburek --- Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > On 6/22/05, xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx > <xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > > > Not sure about that Bill. I've just heard a simple > piece called Cacerolada > > at the Sonic Arts Network Conference in > Scarborough, UK that made a very > > powerful political statement on several levels > without lyrics or voice > > samples. > > Interesting, mopani, and thanks for that tip. But > it doesn't change > my point. If you hear that group of sounds devoid > of the message > inherent in it, they're only sounds. The politics > comes later. > Paraphrasing Lyotard: a cave dweller inscribes a > figure on the wall > inside a cave. Is it art? Is it language? It is > neither. The > distinction will come later. > > > > On 6/22/05, Aaron Ximm <xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > Of course, in cases like this it's the context > that makes the recording > > meaningful -- not the sounds themselves... my > first reaction is that the > > contextualizing information here serves the same > roll as the lyrics in a > > protest song. > > Exactly, Aaron. > > > -- > What to the American slave is your 4th of July? I > answer: a day that > reveals to him, more than all other days in the > year, the gross > injustice and cruelty to which he is the constant > victim. To him, your > celebration is a sham; your boasted liberty, an > unholy license; your > national greatness, swelling vanity; your sounds of > rejoicing are > empty and heartless; your denunciations of tyrants, > brass fronted > impudence; your shouts of liberty and equality, > hollow mockery; your > prayers and hymns, your sermons and thanksgivings, > with all your > religious parade and solemnity, are, to him, mere > bombast, fraud, > deception, impiety, and hypocrisy--a thin veil to > cover up crimes > which would disgrace a nation of savages. There is > not a nation on > the earth guilty of practices more shocking and > bloody than are the > people of the United States, at this very > hour.--Frederick Douglass > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 08:43:08 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36307-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 04:43:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 04:43:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 32318 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 08:43:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 32308 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 08:43:09 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 17:43:03 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=aQWDClMLpDxd+SQGxyyVAd5YnUy/og2pu4aycGB5HbGj0diho5Z2ighbQe6zUfd7HYV6ERAWkSdHT1QV/kJ2ZVdLTFG4zXLaf03TPutYh3b+VgS2Kjh77VW5V400aryadHkL1YSJiOLulxBAPKAQRmrk6KOfIMTy4LIofwWJm7Y= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <BEDECE1C.E647%xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 6/22/05, xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx <xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > Not sure about that Bill. I've just heard a simple piece called Cacerolada > at the Sonic Arts Network Conference in Scarborough, UK that made a very > powerful political statement on several levels without lyrics or voice > samples. Interesting, mopani, and thanks for that tip. But it doesn't change my point. If you hear that group of sounds devoid of the message inherent in it, they're only sounds. The politics comes later. Paraphrasing Lyotard: a cave dweller inscribes a figure on the wall inside a cave. Is it art? Is it language? It is neither. The distinction will come later. On 6/22/05, Aaron Ximm <xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > Of course, in cases like this it's the context that makes the recording > meaningful -- not the sounds themselves... my first reaction is that the > contextualizing information here serves the same roll as the lyrics in a > protest song. Exactly, Aaron. -- What to the American slave is your 4th of July? I answer: a day that reveals to him, more than all other days in the year, the gross injustice and cruelty to which he is the constant victim. To him, your celebration is a sham; your boasted liberty, an unholy license; your national greatness, swelling vanity; your sounds of rejoicing are empty and heartless; your denunciations of tyrants, brass fronted impudence; your shouts of liberty and equality, hollow mockery; your prayers and hymns, your sermons and thanksgivings, with all your religious parade and solemnity, are, to him, mere bombast, fraud, deception, impiety, and hypocrisy--a thin veil to cover up crimes which would disgrace a nation of savages. There is not a nation on the earth guilty of practices more shocking and bloody than are the people of the United States, at this very hour.--Frederick Douglass --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Jun 22 08:38:33 2005 Return-path: <microsound-return-36306-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Nov 5 2004)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 22 Jun 2005 04:38:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 04:38:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 30664 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 08:38:30 +0000 Received: (qmail 30654 invoked from network); Wed, 22 Jun 2005 08:38:30 +0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 17:38:24 +0900 From: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] being 'political' in non-verbal music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Bill Ashline <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=sUIiHS/vAPjKwLEDfOK0QJRrraQenK1i17ktb0b5vy3gq0wu0RhgKeGjK5tU4JlCurJMQRm04a+FhnRm/yl1oaDppZyRCFH/k1FzeZ+AnhxGOrXtauLOEydQQBbN8p8vIpium6eyLWBHx5peJYbatUIzv9gMlJFUgwZ3xqzNMRg= Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@