(idm) Take those words and mix 'em round.

From Jason J. Tar
Sent Wed, Aug 25th 1999, 00:02

Ah, noticing my point becoming confused and a bit watered down, so....

>not to diss, but 2 people out of 3 answered your question.  the other
>one told you to read the magazine -- darn, bummer.  what are you still
>complaining about?

Umm...wasn't my question.  Someone else asked, glad they got an answer.  
Me...I'm just trying to prevent IDM from becoming a sales list instead of
an informative list.  (Or is it too late for such actions?  Probably.  In
that case, I'm just trying to step on toes.)

>> No, just wondering what the point of this list is if people are gonna be
>> greedy with their info.
>hmmm I don't get the greedy part. 

"Greedy" as in "keeping the info to themselves or to those special enough
to BUY the zine".  As opposed to freely offering an answer when a question
is asked (if you know the answer).

>I think small zines like Grooves add a good degree of exposure. I know
>plenty of people who are not on IDM who don't keep up with the Jones' but
>instead rely on things like small mags for checking new stuff out.

Good for them.  But does that mean we can't discuss manners on the list
that are covered in the zine(s)?  Should we just say, "oh that information
can be found on this or this zine, so I can't discuss it".  Or, "Just buy
the disc, I can't review it".

>And I don't mean to keep stressing this, but I
>think a lot of people take for granted the amount of info that passes
>though this list.

I don't think that I implied the magazine was pointless in my original
post. My original intention was simply that people answer questions if they
can, not simply say "buy the zine".
And again, this implies regardless of what zine it is...IE--this isn't a
diss/attack on Grooves.

>I was the one who said buy the mag.  Shame on me.   
Ah, now that is the reply I was looking for.  :)  

>In fact, anytime someone reviews something or recommends something isn't
that an advertisement?  
>Someone says, hey I want ambient dub.  Then someone says go buy Comp X.  
>Those money grubbing bastards could have sent the person mp3s instead of
>telling them to buy the CD.  Stingy with the information yet again...

Hmmm...I could go either way on this one.  If they sent the mp3s with the
intent that the person would buy the CD if they enjoyed it, then no problem
as that is the ultimate in review.  (sounds speaks more than volumes of
words.)
But no, a well written review is not an ad.  "Go buy ..." is an ad.  There
is a different.
In Other Words--your example doesn't follow from your statement.

>as for the utopian outlook of art for arts sake.  No money is needed;
>peace love etc..  I have to say this:

Not what I said.  Simply said that the person deserving of the money (or
bulk there of) is the artist/musician.  Not the lawyers, label execs, etc.
Not even the writers.

>when you go to the grocery store to buy milk they won't give it to you
>because you wrote an opus...  

No, they will because I have a job that relies on my talents, not on riding
the backs of others.


>I'd imagine that this list contains a large
>population of the IDM music buyin public.
>What's wrong with sportin $2.50 to read about
>releases that are potential purchases.
>Even more than that. When these IDM producers
>are heralded so greatly for their music, isn't it
>worth $2.50 to read interviews with them and maybe
>get some insight as to who they are and where they're
>coming from

Then what is the point of this list?  To advertise such paper?  
...and on an unrelated point...it is often that learning who these people
are destroys the respect for the sounds they make.  But take that as you
will.  It is off topic, so.

>3) greedy?  do you think that we make one cent from this thing?

Reference my definition of "greedy" above.  I didn't say you were making
money.  I didn't even imply that you were the one keeping the information
to yourself.  (As the original post was made by another).  

>>well.  Screw the labels, screw the magazines, screw all those riding on the
>>backs of the artists.  Support the people making the sounds and help those
>>looking to find good sounds, and then things will be all right.
>I gather From the way you talk that you must run around naked in the woods, 
>and beat on leather skin drums for your music.

No.  I buy the music I enjoy, directly from the artist/label when I can.
And when I like it, I tell others who have similar tastes that they might
enjoy it, and describe it to them.  Then if they care to, they also give
that artist some money.  
Just because I don't care for the money-making-music-machine, doesn't imply
that I "run around naked in the woods".  


Now, for kicking some info:
Angelica 97 compilation not only features <MANY> tracks with Otomo
Yoshihide and Stock Hausen & Walkman, it features a track with both of
them!  Plus it has an Otomo Yoshihide track with him doing some CD-J work
with an Autechre disc.  Fun!  :)
(I suppose I could have printed that on a piece of paper and said "buy my
paper and learn about a Stock Hausen & Walkman/Otomo Yoshihide
collaboration".  But...I didn't.  And aren't you glad?)

---
Peace Hugs and Unity                        Jason J. Tar        
                W.        W.        J.        D?
                      (What would Jason Do?)        
            http://www.msu.edu/user/tarjason
                      xxx@xxxxxxxx