From carl kruger Sent Sun, Dec 31st 2006, 19:11
From carl kruger Sent Sun, Dec 31st 2006, 19:11
>having just (well a year ago) completed a master's >thesis on exactly this kind of thing (thesis in a ?>nutshell: why don't sci-fi films ever try to imagine >what the music of the future might sound like?) i >have to say that this incidentally tiny sequence is >really one the best attempts at imagining or >designed a style of music that does not yet >exist. i can't think of any film that has really >tried to do this and succeeded the way 'children of >men' does. while i've yet to watch 'children of men', i'd nominate the bar "music" from a scene in one of the most celebrated sci-fi turkeys ever released as very futuristic, or at least strikingly alien / need i name it? imdb.com/title/tt0185183/ the sound was not unlike a couple of radios giving off sharp, yet not loud, jolts of feedback as you scanned their dials ... layered a top a vaporous blanket of bassy static (this may have been the ONLY thing this movie had 'gotten right') __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 31 18:18:06 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41179-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 31 Dec 2006 13:18:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 13:18:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 93717 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 18:22:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 93704 invoked from network); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 18:22:16 +0000 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2006 13:17:56 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] children of men/futuristic music In-reply-to: <002b01c72ce3$533132c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <002b01c72ce3$533132c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx really? which track? i have that album... On 31-Dec-06, at 8:55 AM, Steven McLeod wrote: > When Cain plays the "zen" music with Owen after their strawbery > spliff it is in part an Aphex Twin track fron Druqs and either > remixed or mixed with something else > > steve > - --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 31 13:55:33 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41178-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 31 Dec 2006 08:55:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 08:55:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 3314 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 13:59:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 3304 invoked from network); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 13:59:45 +0000 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2006 13:55:25 +0000 From: Steven McLeod <xxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] children of men/futuristic music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: Steven McLeod <xxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <002b01c72ce3$533132c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx When Cain plays the "zen" music with Owen after their strawbery spliff it is in part an Aphex Twin track fron Druqs and either remixed or mixed with something else steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Graham Miller" <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>; "tobias c. van Veen" <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx>; "Robert Bowman" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2006 5:29 AM Subject: [microsound] children of men/futuristic music just saw the absolutely mind-blowingly good sci-fi 'children of men,' one of the most impressive pieces of dystopian sci-fi i've seen in ages. 'code 46' meets 'saving private ryan' meets '28 days later'. i can't say enough good things about this film. go see it. thank god for proper science fiction. it comes so infrequently. but when it comes it gets me so excited about the possibilities inherent to this genre. this guy should direct neuromancer and get aphex twin (or sutekh) to do the score:) anyway, without giving anything away, i was particularly impressed in one scene in which the michael caine character plays some 'soothing' diagetic music from the near-future (roughly twenty years from now) for the main protagonist, clive owen, over his stereo, after a particularly traumatizing string of events. having just (well a year ago) completed a master's thesis on exactly this kind of thing (thesis in a nutchell: why don't sci-fi films ever try to imagine what the music of the future might sound like?) i have to say that this incidentally tiny sequence is really one the best attempts at imagining or designed a style of music that does not yet exist. i can't think of any film that has really tried to do this and succeeded the way 'children of men' does. i've only seen it once and intend to check it out again, so this description only comes from my muddy memory but basically it is a kind of über-heavy musique concrete of screaming and machine gun fire not all that far removed from say, public enemy, in terms of that kind of intensity and sonic politic. it really blew my mind. has anyone seen this movie and remember that scene? any thoughts? g. p.s. also check out the sounds of michael caine's (jasper) alarm system in the movie. cool stuff too in terms of totally original sound design. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.16.0/610 - Release Date: 30/12/2006 14:59 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 31 05:59:36 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41177-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 31 Dec 2006 00:59:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 00:59:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 51617 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 06:03:43 +0000 Received: (qmail 51592 invoked from network); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 06:03:42 +0000 Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 21:59:21 -0800 From: Bill Jarboe <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] children of men/futuristic music In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> X-Originating-IP: 4.242.105.184 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.623) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=j+Cdy7dRF5PByNyTbIjiC3sQtFsTeVwz22qy6R75MRtH9EiXpwC88aNiaeej1jeD; h=Received:Mime-Version:In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Message-Id:Content-Transfer-Encoding:From:Subject:Date:To:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; X-ELNK-Trace: f6dd78c2ac81c6498eb596e2db90c20d239a348a220c26090df3c974d8b829a7420778b9ffd11ddc666fa475841a1c7a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hello Graham Miller, I found this http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~snc/jtlife.htm on John Tavener , and a list of credits for Richard Beggs http://www.hollywood.com/celebs/detail/id/3078290 On Dec 30, 2006, at 9:29 PM, Graham Miller wrote: > just saw the absolutely mind-blowingly good sci-fi 'children of men,' > one of the most impressive pieces of dystopian sci-fi i've seen in > ages. 'code 46' meets 'saving private ryan' meets '28 days later'. i > can't say enough good things about this film. go see it. thank god for > proper science fiction. it comes so infrequently. but when it comes it > gets me so excited about the possibilities inherent to this genre. > this guy should direct neuromancer and get aphex twin (or sutekh) to > do the score:) > > anyway, without giving anything away, i was particularly impressed in > one scene in which the michael caine character plays some 'soothing' > diagetic music from the near-future (roughly twenty years from now) > for the main protagonist, clive owen, over his stereo, after a > particularly traumatizing string of events. > > having just (well a year ago) completed a master's thesis on exactly > this kind of thing (thesis in a nutchell: why don't sci-fi films ever > try to imagine what the music of the future might sound like?) i have > to say that this incidentally tiny sequence is really one the best > attempts at imagining or designed a style of music that does not yet > exist. i can't think of any film that has really tried to do this and > succeeded the way 'children of men' does. > > i've only seen it once and intend to check it out again, so this > description only comes from my muddy memory but basically it is a kind > of über-heavy musique concrete of screaming and machine gun fire not > all that far removed from say, public enemy, in terms of that kind of > intensity and sonic politic. it really blew my mind. > > has anyone seen this movie and remember that scene? any thoughts? > > g. > > p.s. also check out the sounds of michael caine's (jasper) alarm > system in the movie. cool stuff too in terms of totally original sound > design. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 31 05:30:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41176-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 31 Dec 2006 00:30:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 00:30:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 41411 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 05:34:13 +0000 Received: (qmail 41401 invoked from network); Sun, 31 Dec 2006 05:34:12 +0000 Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2006 00:29:52 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] children of men/futuristic music To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, "tobias c. van Veen" <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Robert Bowman <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx just saw the absolutely mind-blowingly good sci-fi 'children of men,' one of the most impressive pieces of dystopian sci-fi i've seen in ages. 'code 46' meets 'saving private ryan' meets '28 days later'. i can't say enough good things about this film. go see it. thank god for proper science fiction. it comes so infrequently. but when it comes it gets me so excited about the possibilities inherent to this genre. this guy should direct neuromancer and get aphex twin (or sutekh) to do the score:) anyway, without giving anything away, i was particularly impressed in one scene in which the michael caine character plays some 'soothing' diagetic music from the near-future (roughly twenty years from now) for the main protagonist, clive owen, over his stereo, after a particularly traumatizing string of events. having just (well a year ago) completed a master's thesis on exactly this kind of thing (thesis in a nutchell: why don't sci-fi films ever try to imagine what the music of the future might sound like?) i have to say that this incidentally tiny sequence is really one the best attempts at imagining or designed a style of music that does not yet exist. i can't think of any film that has really tried to do this and succeeded the way 'children of men' does. i've only seen it once and intend to check it out again, so this description only comes from my muddy memory but basically it is a kind of über-heavy musique concrete of screaming and machine gun fire not all that far removed from say, public enemy, in terms of that kind of intensity and sonic politic. it really blew my mind. has anyone seen this movie and remember that scene? any thoughts? g. p.s. also check out the sounds of michael caine's (jasper) alarm system in the movie. cool stuff too in terms of totally original sound design. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 30 20:01:09 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41175-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 30 Dec 2006 15:01:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 30 Dec 2006 15:01:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 1361 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 30 Dec 2006 20:05:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 1347 invoked from network); Sat, 30 Dec 2006 20:05:16 +0000 Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 11:59:02 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] fun online music generator In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200701c1bc75276d1c@[192.168.0.3]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_7Gpj3gRz0EBxfeX/i/1+Ew)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_7Gpj3gRz0EBxfeX/i/1+Ew) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit More fun: http://www.miniorgan.com/ Vintage electronic musical toys - cool, possibly useful sounds. -- -- Website: http://www.warbaby.com (Currently undergoing an overhaul. Some pages and links may not work yet.) Blog: http://raggedwings.blogspot.com/ Nifty Stuff: http://www.cafepress.com/warbaby -- "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." - Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi --Boundary_(ID_7Gpj3gRz0EBxfeX/i/1+Ew)-- From ???@??? Sat Dec 30 06:26:41 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41174-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 30 Dec 2006 01:26:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 30 Dec 2006 01:26:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31139 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 30 Dec 2006 06:30:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 31128 invoked from network); Sat, 30 Dec 2006 06:30:45 +0000 Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 01:26:31 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] fun online music generator To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx http://www.ampledesign.co.uk/va/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 23:25:49 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41173-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 29 Dec 2006 18:25:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 18:25:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 73388 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 23:29:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 73376 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 23:29:46 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:25:31 -0800 From: Bill Jarboe <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] noise-enzima In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> X-Originating-IP: 4.242.102.150 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.623) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=Mh6l6E5UPh3TxYIx/FQK0VGp55fuvbXLWwtY4nPyNA0DrAfdwSICSOkfKsMW4WWs; h=Received:Mime-Version:In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Message-Id:Content-Transfer-Encoding:From:Subject:Date:To:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; X-ELNK-Trace: f6dd78c2ac81c6498eb596e2db90c20d239a348a220c260903f61b1fe188e843e46429ba0adb4e49a7ce0e8f8d31aa3f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hi, Architect... honestly. It conjures up an image of someone wearing a cardboard shirt who actually knows how to use a mechanical pencil( I always seem to get the graphite too far out and can't get it back in the barrel with destroying something). Academic? That's probably someone who bluffed their way through college and now sits around wearing odd coloured turtlenecks and giggles over kiwi fruit, occasionally the eyes glaze over and wistful thoughts about why their isn't any funding for the arts. Ok. I have it all figured out. The answer lies more in the realm of urban planning than being an architect ( Do you play' So long, Frank Lloyd Wright' on an 8 track cartridge loop in the backgound?" Get a cinder in your eye...." Yeah , dude then people start using you for an ashtray.). The ground floor of our new quiet building houses one or all three of the following: An anechoic chamber , a recording studio and archival storage facility(more about that later) and a homeforunwedmothers/maternity ward/daycare center.I say go for all three, with the anechoic chamber at the front entrance and the maternity ward spread out with many access portals , that way people with sleeping infants could dash about telling, or rather reminding people to be quiet. There might be a slight difficulty in convincing the clients (polite term) to jettison what ever business ideas they had in mind and change their focus to archival storage; yet once they get the idea of owning everything and everyone inside their heads it will make more sense. You see, people come to store their tapes for a reasonable fee. The building is ultra secure. There is an underground rail system , the tunnel also houses electrical lines. Outside the building is a long term plan of permanent disarray. Homeless people are allowed to camp in tents. Trees are encouraged to grow long and wild , thereby toppling and damaging the conventional shallow underground powerlines. The building could be designed as a sort of windtrap , actually encouraging destruction during a storm. The idea is also to block off roads , get rid of the audible signs of other people's progress: jackhammers , cranes, backhoes etc. There could be street fairs on the weekend as long as nobody played any music. They could bring tapes for storage instead. It's a great place to socialize. What I want to know: What are you going to think about once it's quiet? -b p.s. I thought it was noise-excema; sounded horrible. Dec 29, 2006, at 7:44 AM, Derek Mason wrote: > My day job is an architect and if you can create a better solution to > the white noise for an office environment, you will have a great deal > of people interested. > > http://www.speechprivacysystems.com/resources.html > > Derek > >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "giovanni conti" <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> >> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> Subject: [microsound] noise-enzima >> Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:53:32 +0000 >> >> >> hi, >> for my thesis project I'm developing a software performing realtime >> nonlinear composition >> based on environmental_sound_analysis, >> to reduce the "psycological" (...) impact of noise on people living >> in acoustically-polluted zones. >> Keywords: >> + profound ecology >> + functional use of musical art >> + acoustic landscape modelling >> + urban noise impact abatement >> + environmental sensor systems - immersive acoustic environments >> >> Can anyone point me in the direction of already existing similar >> projects-softwares-ideas? >> Any help is greatly appreciated, >> thanks! >> have bright days, >> gio >> >> _________________________________________________________________ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 20:11:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41172-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:11:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:11:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 87724 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 20:15:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 87714 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 20:15:42 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 12:11:27 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] noise-enzima In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200700c1bb26ad0aba@[192.168.0.3]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx When I first saw the subject line I read it as 'noise-enema'. Boggled my mind for a few moments... R. -- -- Website: http://www.warbaby.com (Currently undergoing an overhaul. Some pages and links may not work yet.) Blog: http://raggedwings.blogspot.com/ Nifty Stuff: http://www.cafepress.com/warbaby -- "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." - Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 19:47:23 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41171-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:47:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 73805 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 19:51:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 73793 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 19:51:15 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 13:47:05 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] noise-enzima In-reply-to: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Cc: Charles Henry <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Vf0J35GQlG2HOJ3a0UHFfQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=r+BRLTMp78L6zHm7GJim70MBKZ2UAVplLxRHD5m8e16PnWhcOxZH2j3HmKmN8r8j8aWGw85Rw2DcEvGGNeAKVwhNtcgLVbOAgkygZjAwXMNF9+zpYK2rrczi3kFCGpoB4JggfLPHUf0ehUJ/8siloRRXNArptP5YTwDyyJITSEo= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_Vf0J35GQlG2HOJ3a0UHFfQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Giovanni~ You may want to talk with Charles Henry (xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx) about it. He's doing some sort of adaptive filtering stuff with Pd over at the University of Kansas. Stuff's way over my head! ~Kyle On 12/29/06, giovanni conti <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > hi, > for my thesis project I'm developing a software performing realtime > nonlinear composition > based on environmental_sound_analysis, > to reduce the "psycological" (...) impact of noise on people living in > acoustically-polluted zones. > Keywords: > + profound ecology > + functional use of musical art > + acoustic landscape modelling > + urban noise impact abatement > + environmental sensor systems - immersive acoustic environments > > Can anyone point me in the direction of already existing similar > projects-softwares-ideas? > Any help is greatly appreciated, > thanks! > have bright days, > gio > > _________________________________________________________________ > Cimentati con nuove domande su Duel Live… > http://specials.it.msn.com/DuelLive.aspx > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_Vf0J35GQlG2HOJ3a0UHFfQ)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 19:42:41 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41170-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:42:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:42:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 70541 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 19:46:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 70525 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 19:46:21 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 11:42:11 -0800 From: nick knouf <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] noise-enzima In-reply-to: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx There's a good project from a friend of mine at the MIT Media Lab named Noah Vawter: Ambient Addition http://web.media.mit.edu/~nvawter/thesis/index.html I think this is close to what you're describing. He used a DSP chip to create a mobile platform for analysis and resynthesis of environmental sounds. nick On Dec 29, 2006, at 6:53 AM, giovanni conti wrote: > hi, > for my thesis project I'm developing a software performing realtime > nonlinear composition > based on environmental_sound_analysis, > to reduce the "psycological" (...) impact of noise on people living > in acoustically-polluted zones. > Keywords: > + profound ecology > + functional use of musical art > + acoustic landscape modelling > + urban noise impact abatement > + environmental sensor systems - immersive acoustic environments > > Can anyone point me in the direction of already existing similar > projects-softwares-ideas? > Any help is greatly appreciated, > thanks! > have bright days, > gio > > _________________________________________________________________ > Cimentati con nuove domande su Duel Live… http:// > specials.it.msn.com/DuelLive.aspx > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 15:59:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41169-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 29 Dec 2006 10:59:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 10:59:02 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 55095 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 16:02:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 55082 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 16:02:57 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 10:58:46 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple?....What about you! In-reply-to: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Oh my how argumentative of you to offer up a differing opinion. If i had my way you would be tied to a stake and flogged until you conformed to my ideologies. :) Nice post. Watch your back tho...:) aLEKs On Dec 28, 2006, at 6:49 PM, Paul Pavlovich wrote: > Every single person who lives in the developed west has in some way, > shape, or form, (inadvertently) supported warfare, genocide, political > destabilization, human rights abuses, gentrification, and > environmental destruction. > > If you have a bank account...a mortgage...a car payment...credit > cards...pay taxes...buy produce in you local food store...buy > beer...buy smokes...go to sporting events...rent an apartment...own a > computer...buy CD’s...purchase books...use paper... All of us pay into > the (sometime) unethical and (sometimes) criminal activities of the > multi-national corporation and international banking systems. Don’t > worry about IBM and Greenpeace. Try to remove yourself from the > hypocrisy. Its much harder than you think. > > If you feel your not a part of a destructive system let me know how > you do it... > Id like to join you on your planet. > > assassination not hibernation. > P > > _________________________________________________________________ > The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes is here. Get all the > scoop. http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/ > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 15:45:00 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41168-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 29 Dec 2006 10:45:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 10:44:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 47531 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:49:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 47519 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:49:01 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 10:44:53 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] noise-enzima X-Originating-IP: 68.49.52.232 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.37) by wfilter2.us4.outblaze.com; 29 Dec 2006 15:44:53 -0000 X-Originating-Server: ws1-2a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx My day job is an architect and if you can create a better solution to the white noise for an office environment, you will have a great deal of people interested. http://www.speechprivacysystems.com/resources.html Derek > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "giovanni conti" <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> > To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > Subject: [microsound] noise-enzima > Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:53:32 +0000 > > > hi, > for my thesis project I'm developing a software performing realtime > nonlinear composition > based on environmental_sound_analysis, > to reduce the "psycological" (...) impact of noise on people living > in acoustically-polluted zones. > Keywords: > + profound ecology > + functional use of musical art > + acoustic landscape modelling > + urban noise impact abatement > + environmental sensor systems - immersive acoustic environments > > Can anyone point me in the direction of already existing similar > projects-softwares-ideas? > Any help is greatly appreciated, > thanks! > have bright days, > gio > > _________________________________________________________________ > Cimentati con nuove domande su Duel Live… > http://specials.it.msn.com/DuelLive.aspx > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 14:53:53 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41167-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 29 Dec 2006 09:53:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 09:53:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 25486 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:57:44 +0000 Received: (qmail 25476 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:57:44 +0000 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 14:53:32 +0000 From: giovanni conti <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] noise-enzima X-Originating-IP: [80.183.221.78] X-Sender: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bcc: Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Email: [xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Dec 2006 14:53:36.0847 (UTC) FILETIME=[1E9455F0:01C72B59] hi, for my thesis project I'm developing a software performing realtime nonlinear composition based on environmental_sound_analysis, to reduce the "psycological" (...) impact of noise on people living in acoustically-polluted zones. Keywords: + profound ecology + functional use of musical art + acoustic landscape modelling + urban noise impact abatement + environmental sensor systems - immersive acoustic environments Can anyone point me in the direction of already existing similar projects-softwares-ideas? Any help is greatly appreciated, thanks! have bright days, gio _________________________________________________________________ Cimentati con nuove domande su Duel Live… http://specials.it.msn.com/DuelLive.aspx --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 03:08:27 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41166-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 22:08:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 22:08:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 61309 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 03:12:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 61296 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 03:12:22 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:08:15 -0800 From: leo <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] help please unsubscribe To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=isfcaUdoXQTV65ciQXzTlgVpi90p9dOe9VZ3NErINQFiWZ3GAnGwaNtqRWd5NrLkru6eLjwNDJ7RUPD7kfU58Oaq/ittCfqbgLC1rLwqQQ9K8ZhP6SeMPSoh5HDT+jppeBm5EiGX7EmI5+G+rvIBE7jflZ17692ytMl6qJvkNfo= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx help please unsubscribe me Delivered-To: xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx Received: by 10.78.169.1 with SMTP id r1cs856800hue; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 07:33:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.210.3 with SMTP id i3mr21066642qbg.1167320007492; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 07:33:27 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: <microsound-digest-return-41144-hilarleo=xxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mx.google.com with SMTP id e16si5855834qba.2006.12.28.07.33.26; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 07:33:27 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of microsound-digest-return-41144-hilarleo=xxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx designates 209.237.226.90 as permitted sender) Received: (qmail 7359 invoked by uid 1095); 28 Dec 2006 15:37:03 -0000 Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes list-help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> list-unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> list-post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm Date: 28 Dec 2006 15:37:03 -0000 Message-ID: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> From: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Delivered-To: responder for xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: microsound Digest 28 Dec 2006 15:37:03 -0000 Issue 1740 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 29 03:05:28 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41165-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 22:05:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 22:05:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 59534 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 03:09:25 +0000 Received: (qmail 59523 invoked from network); Fri, 29 Dec 2006 03:09:24 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:05:18 -0800 From: leo <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] please unsubscribe this address To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=UhVccdpgup96FME081FXXFeGLza6CUoY1xnjc781tdAsLSYFvh2Eh+bXWy/xQcrr7XvrJ2LGfCGcyJJ+8iwn4jLvHANI7w5Wn0SOWkG5dfLln6U0KxJQmYeNJ2iu0bFB/bXvdtsi+uAy62ZoHRgLSRxybdAzSPTemc3eKtHA0OI= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx please unsubscribe this address --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 23:50:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41164-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 18:50:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 18:50:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 76476 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 23:54:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 76463 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 23:54:01 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 23:49:56 +0000 From: Paul Pavlovich <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple?....What about you! In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> X-Originating-IP: [66.55.2.105] X-Sender: xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bcc: Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Email: [xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Dec 2006 23:49:56.0958 (UTC) FILETIME=[E101D7E0:01C72ADA] Every single person who lives in the developed west has in some way, shape, or form, (inadvertently) supported warfare, genocide, political destabilization, human rights abuses, gentrification, and environmental destruction. If you have a bank account...a mortgage...a car payment...credit cards...pay taxes...buy produce in you local food store...buy beer...buy smokes...go to sporting events...rent an apartment...own a computer...buy CD’s...purchase books...use paper... All of us pay into the (sometime) unethical and (sometimes) criminal activities of the multi-national corporation and international banking systems. Don’t worry about IBM and Greenpeace. Try to remove yourself from the hypocrisy. Its much harder than you think. If you feel your not a part of a destructive system let me know how you do it... Id like to join you on your planet. assassination not hibernation. P _________________________________________________________________ The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes is here. Get all the scoop. http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 20:07:09 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41163-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 15:07:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 15:07:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 56344 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 20:10:59 +0000 Received: (qmail 56334 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 20:10:59 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 15:08:54 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] was Greenpeace vs apple is now IBM and nazi germany In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx yeah I agree with you that it was not IBM that paved the way for this to happen, the killing machine was not ibm punchcards but rather a tool used for this horrific plan of hitler and his associates. I would never blame ibm for what happened ever, i just find it hard to belive that they had no idea what these punch card machines were being used for. I also think it is important that we aknowlege that the company known as ibm in the 30s and 40s is a very different company then it is now. The people that ran the company then and the people that run it now are very different people. no one is perfect is the thing to remember and as a child of a survivor I have tried hard to live my life like this. that some times people or corperations make horrible mistakes and its important to forgive for such mistakes as long as they are aknowleged and corrected. this can be applied to ones personal life also, for example: I used to work for a company that is involved in the war in iraq, no idea what they do other then its technology driven, but as soon as I found this out I found my self a new job. I personally like you with ibm didnt want to be associated directly with such evil doings. neil... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Johan Nilsson wrote: > Well, I wasn't initially going to reply because I realize it's getting way > off topic and as you say, it's hitting close to home for you and I don't mean > to upset you. I can't relate to how americans knew about the holocaust > because I was born in Sweden. In Sweden, surely enough, people knew the > nazi's were after the Jews. My grandfather, a seaman, helped Jewish children > get into hiding in Sweden. But everytime I talked to him about it, he always > said that even though he knew, he never thought it was as horrific as it > turned out to be. That's where I come from. But that being said, I still > stand by my statement that I think the whole IBM and the nazi Germany thing > is blown way out of porpotions. When people state that IBM laid the way for > the German war, I really want to know how one fights wars with punch card > machines, and what punch card machines has to do with the Nazi ideology. > Personally I think it's just a "hit" at one of the biggest corporations in > the world, but you can't really compare IBM of that day, to Big Blue today. > > But again, I did start by previous post with "Hm, I thought..." and I guess > that belongs in front of this post as well. I hope I do not insult you, I > just wanted to explain my opinion and again sorry to the rest for getting > off-topic. > > Johan. > > On Dec 28, 2006, at 6:50 AM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >> >> >> http://www.ibmandtheholocaust.com/ >> http://www.wsws.org/articles/2001/jun2001/ibm-j27.shtml >> >> there is plenty more just do a google search... >> its pretty nieve for any one to think that people didnt knoww hat hitler >> and the nazi party were up to its not like they really hide it from any >> one... even if they sort of how could they hide it at the scale they were >> doing it (Im a child of a survivor so this subject hits very close to home >> for me). I think people like to say that they didnt know what they were up >> to, I think its more like people didnt want to belive it was happening and >> were there for in denial of it all. they were in dianl untill they could >> not any more, when they were presented with first hand pictures and stories >> from people then the west has no choice but to accept it. but to say they >> didnt now what was going on is IMHO an easy cop out. >> neil.. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 19:18:36 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41162-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:18:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:18:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 28627 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:22:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 28612 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:22:30 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 11:18:07 -0800 From: Johan Nilsson <xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Chzlrs: 0 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Well, I wasn't initially going to reply because I realize it's getting way off topic and as you say, it's hitting close to home for you and I don't mean to upset you. I can't relate to how americans knew about the holocaust because I was born in Sweden. In Sweden, surely enough, people knew the nazi's were after the Jews. My grandfather, a seaman, helped Jewish children get into hiding in Sweden. But everytime I talked to him about it, he always said that even though he knew, he never thought it was as horrific as it turned out to be. That's where I come from. But that being said, I still stand by my statement that I think the whole IBM and the nazi Germany thing is blown way out of porpotions. When people state that IBM laid the way for the German war, I really want to know how one fights wars with punch card machines, and what punch card machines has to do with the Nazi ideology. Personally I think it's just a "hit" at one of the biggest corporations in the world, but you can't really compare IBM of that day, to Big Blue today. But again, I did start by previous post with "Hm, I thought..." and I guess that belongs in front of this post as well. I hope I do not insult you, I just wanted to explain my opinion and again sorry to the rest for getting off-topic. Johan. On Dec 28, 2006, at 6:50 AM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > http://www.ibmandtheholocaust.com/ > http://www.wsws.org/articles/2001/jun2001/ibm-j27.shtml > > there is plenty more just do a google search... > its pretty nieve for any one to think that people didnt knoww hat > hitler and the nazi party were up to its not like they really hide > it from any one... even if they sort of how could they hide it at > the scale they were doing it (Im a child of a survivor so this > subject hits very close to home for me). I think people like to say > that they didnt know what they were up to, I think its more like > people didnt want to belive it was happening and were there for in > denial of it all. they were in dianl untill they could not any > more, when they were presented with first hand pictures and stories > from people then the west has no choice but to accept it. but to > say they didnt now what was going on is IMHO an easy cop out. > neil.. > > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Johan Nilsson wrote: > >> Hm, I thought the only connection IBM had with Nazi Germany was >> that their punch card machines were used in concentration camps. I >> used to do contract work with IBM and this is what I was told. >> It's a bit of an emberassing part of IBM history, but not really >> something that'd stop me from working with them or their machines. >> I mean, who really believes IBM knew what was happening at those >> locations anyways? >> >> You guys make it sound like IBM built nuclear arms or something. >> >> Johan. >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 19:02:40 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41161-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:02:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:02:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 20547 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:06:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 20523 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 19:06:32 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 12:01:22 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] reduce, reuse, recycle redux In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230900c1b9a01896d7@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0810930951/104-5007103-0017509 > >I bought this book for my wife as a xmas gift and I ended up >flipping through it for a few hours...I was very very impressed with >the information presented in it... >maybe some interesting art projects could be inspired by some of >the ideas in it? showing my grey hair :: it reminds me of the Whole Earth Catalog's arrival :: and gawd, don't we need it now!!! the question is, will it have the necessary impact? John --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 17:04:58 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41160-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 12:04:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 12:04:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 54258 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 17:08:53 +0000 Received: (qmail 54243 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 17:08:52 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 12:04:47 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Flame war? Where have i been disrespectful? Since you are so thorough maybe you can point it out to me? As far as i can recall there was only one person who acted in a rude manner. Sorry if it upset you in any way. It was not my intention. aLEKs On Dec 28, 2006, at 11:50 AM, peter lasell wrote: > Will you guys cut out the flame war? > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: "xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx" > <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:37:03 AM > Subject: microsound Digest 28 Dec 2006 15:37:03 -0000 Issue 1740 > > microsound Digest 28 Dec 2006 15:37:03 -0000 Issue 1740 > > Topics (messages 41144 through 41157): > > Re: Greenpeace and apple > 41144 by: aleks vasic > 41145 by: aleks vasic > 41146 by: Neil Wiernik > 41147 by: Jon > 41148 by: xe non > 41149 by: xe non > 41150 by: Robert Arnold > 41151 by: Neil Wiernik > 41152 by: Neil Wiernik > 41155 by: Johan Nilsson > 41156 by: Neil Wiernik > 41157 by: xe non > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 16:50:41 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41159-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 11:50:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 11:50:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 46142 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 16:54:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 46132 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 16:54:34 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 08:50:31 -0800 (PST) From: peter lasell <x_xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Re: Greenpeace and apple To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_ZFyIZ7K4gtu9lCe4QxmpTw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Is1xf0+jbBzig+ySqkkLbphgHJiotDJukQGDhL6U+a5vCxEqPOeZa/ECO5vn8gf5RgyTv5yf7IN+/iv4W8fwxhx0uy31qYn0mjNr1Hwwa+PvOPS08fUaRH4uRFTGQNg9ocT2xVHxg3zm2yqEZBPM2lUXNSG5UuRzsUpDggY0K2Y= ; X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_ZFyIZ7K4gtu9lCe4QxmpTw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Will you guys cut out the flame war? ----- Original Message ---- From: "xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx" <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:37:03 AM Subject: microsound Digest 28 Dec 2006 15:37:03 -0000 Issue 1740 microsound Digest 28 Dec 2006 15:37:03 -0000 Issue 1740 Topics (messages 41144 through 41157): Re: Greenpeace and apple 41144 by: aleks vasic 41145 by: aleks vasic 41146 by: Neil Wiernik 41147 by: Jon 41148 by: xe non 41149 by: xe non 41150 by: Robert Arnold 41151 by: Neil Wiernik 41152 by: Neil Wiernik 41155 by: Johan Nilsson 41156 by: Neil Wiernik 41157 by: xe non __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --Boundary_(ID_ZFyIZ7K4gtu9lCe4QxmpTw)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 16:03:46 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41158-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 11:03:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 11:03:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 25533 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 16:07:30 +0000 Received: (qmail 25507 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 16:07:29 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 10:03:26 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_fuWUDSwSrtIrns4lbLXaSg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=jrc0VlEGiGv9YwGp8YeRKbrvhSikUDJJAh3b22/1wpDari49Ct11vkdeqMzhpy4XPfatnvMS1o3VqIOhcfCm1XQUGUCD3PDj3E3A96h5gjxrWeEEI/C9wPTjTgjH/VZjB3AycL4ID5R/EJO3mh11VqE3Mive8USXKWDLW+ySLJw= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_fuWUDSwSrtIrns4lbLXaSg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This comment is directed at no single person in particular. I'm not trying to be rude, but if you'd use spell checkers before posting, it might help represent your thoughts better. I know it's hard to type something and proofread it every time before you hit the send button, and no one's perfect. But after years of reading Slashdot comments, I've learned to favor the arguments of people who are more traditional in their grammatical expression. Plus, by proofreading, you are given the chance to revise anything written that may have been spurred by heated passions as opposed to rational argument, and we could all avoid having to sit through flamewar after ridiculous flamewar. I made sure to sit on this very email for a good half hour at before sending it for the same reasons; I don't want to pick a fight! Again, this is not meant as an attack on your (plural) character. If you'd rather see your comments be taken more seriously, this could help! We'd all be a lot better off if we could keep emotions to a minimum when debating, and save our passions to pour into our respected creative projects. I'm on this list to learn about new trends in art and music, or discover older ones that I may have missed. I'm definitely not interested in these pointless sparring matches full of off-the-cuff ad hominem remarks. Take care, and enjoy the New Year. ~Kyle -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_fuWUDSwSrtIrns4lbLXaSg)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 15:33:10 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41157-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 10:33:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 10:33:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 7167 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 15:37:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 7154 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 15:37:00 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 07:32:58 -0800 (PST) From: xe non <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_F6Fhvxp6eEarym3UOEWPzw)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=QQ53KW851NAtvTVKNPR1gbAnHvvvwNuiTThDgt49s8S+iImSKx0je00vm1HBSc2SQS48ZETPzaYsJesvdARKUZJ9r5mpnO3FLU9izAsvOr3tjz0Rry2B//78EE1xGtLnQjATmfBKmyxY2gHGRLvFmNvSlFDHzfvytjYwEx9pqFU=; X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_F6Fhvxp6eEarym3UOEWPzw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit but nowhere in your "rhetoric" did you actually counter my argument, you just sort went into attack mode without actually saying anything. was your abusive response really the best you could do? i still say your objections to this greenpeace campaign really doesnt make any sense. yes greenpeace are "in the world"...do you really think they dont address the reality of this internally and look for the best possible solutions to the contradictions that come with that. even the most cynical part of me believes that they would do this even if only for public relations reasons. probably if you bothered to look around or ask you might find greenpeace's own policy regarding the resources they use, after all this is part of what they are asking apple to do. anyway...this is getting way off topic so this will be my last post in this particular thread. xe Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: Im not slamming green peace Im slamming the rehtoric that you and aleks are spewing out.. I acctually for the most part support green peace just not when they dont look in thier own back yard at thier own politics... On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > sexual abuse of animals? really? > > aleks....i suspect you and i are in the presence of a > wind-up artist. > > if thats not the case -- neil, i really dont see what > purpose slamming the greenpeace campaign serves. if you dont > like it, dont participate, if greenpeace doesnt live up to > your standards and goals (still unclear as to what those are > exactly) move to the vanguard and do better, but really, > your invective-filled non-critique (greenpeace isnt perfect > so they should close up shop and go away???) is baffling > and doesnt offer anything but vitriol. > > i still think the greenpeace campaign is nicely done... i > wouldnt mind a microsound project in support by individuals > so inclined, im not really a sound artist but rather > video...if anyone feels a video portion would add to thier > soundwork...drop a line. > > xe > > > Neil Wiernik wrote: > my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other peoples > battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice speak and for > what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! > > regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting here > and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all things produced > for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some where so like I said > put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear your whining its a known > fact that we all know adn live with... if you want to be perfect go live > in a cave in the mountains and eat dirt and run around naked but even tehn > youll opress come thing like the tiny bugs and bacteria youll kill when > eating the dirt and the grass youll sept on running around naked > not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals as they > are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains ... thats just > terrable I think we should censor every thing as evil as its the only way > we can live clean no opressive lives!!! > (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) > > > > "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --Boundary_(ID_F6Fhvxp6eEarym3UOEWPzw)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 14:48:26 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41156-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 09:48:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 09:48:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 86706 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:52:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 86690 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 14:52:16 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 09:50:13 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx http://www.ibmandtheholocaust.com/ http://www.wsws.org/articles/2001/jun2001/ibm-j27.shtml there is plenty more just do a google search... its pretty nieve for any one to think that people didnt knoww hat hitler and the nazi party were up to its not like they really hide it from any one... even if they sort of how could they hide it at the scale they were doing it (Im a child of a survivor so this subject hits very close to home for me). I think people like to say that they didnt know what they were up to, I think its more like people didnt want to belive it was happening and were there for in denial of it all. they were in dianl untill they could not any more, when they were presented with first hand pictures and stories from people then the west has no choice but to accept it. but to say they didnt now what was going on is IMHO an easy cop out. neil.. On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Johan Nilsson wrote: > Hm, I thought the only connection IBM had with Nazi Germany was that their > punch card machines were used in concentration camps. I used to do contract > work with IBM and this is what I was told. It's a bit of an emberassing part > of IBM history, but not really something that'd stop me from working with > them or their machines. I mean, who really believes IBM knew what was > happening at those locations anyways? > > You guys make it sound like IBM built nuclear arms or something. > > Johan. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 07:51:25 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41155-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 02:51:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 02:51:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 36496 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 07:55:19 +0000 Received: (qmail 36486 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 07:55:18 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:51:06 -0800 From: Johan Nilsson <xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Chzlrs: 0 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hm, I thought the only connection IBM had with Nazi Germany was that their punch card machines were used in concentration camps. I used to do contract work with IBM and this is what I was told. It's a bit of an emberassing part of IBM history, but not really something that'd stop me from working with them or their machines. I mean, who really believes IBM knew what was happening at those locations anyways? You guys make it sound like IBM built nuclear arms or something. Johan. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 06:41:49 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41154-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:41:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:41:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16814 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 06:45:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 16804 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 06:45:41 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:41:40 -0500 From: emanuele de raymondi <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] reduce, reuse, recycle redux In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_myJSNuKCKF+imHcexzFRBg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=bgWnZIyyFe5lbUNSXqHTFWRVIGKIzbdRorIlb0ylH3EE0C2od3Q8aENumb4HahUG6cgb08R+rzmx00EwCAiXiQmstFvo4ipYk79b4+AvjB8zHAlwr8nnq9XfOeWkqYOCRjBiHJzH3PHI/dpnWpyQCtrbe2wTAtqo+48fkkOYxJY= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_myJSNuKCKF+imHcexzFRBg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit looks very interesting...I ordered a copy on amazon, looking forward to read it! On 12/27/06, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0810930951/104-5007103-0017509 > > I bought this book for my wife as a xmas gift and I ended up flipping > through it for a few hours...I was very very impressed with the > information presented in it... > maybe some interesting art projects could be inspired by some of the > ideas in it? > > > --Boundary_(ID_myJSNuKCKF+imHcexzFRBg)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 04:17:52 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41153-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:17:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:17:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 70729 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 04:21:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 70712 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 04:21:45 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:17:43 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] reduce, reuse, recycle redux To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Vc4buL7+gIhoQkAL++Cf1g)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_Vc4buL7+gIhoQkAL++Cf1g) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0810930951/104-5007103-0017509 I bought this book for my wife as a xmas gift and I ended up flipping through it for a few hours...I was very very impressed with the information presented in it... maybe some interesting art projects could be inspired by some of the ideas in it? --Boundary_(ID_Vc4buL7+gIhoQkAL++Cf1g)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 01:39:16 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41152-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:39:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:39:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 13464 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:43:07 +0000 Received: (qmail 13451 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:43:07 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:41:06 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Im not slamming green peace Im slamming the rehtoric that you and aleks are spewing out.. I acctually for the most part support green peace just not when they dont look in thier own back yard at thier own politics... On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > sexual abuse of animals? really? > > aleks....i suspect you and i are in the presence of a > wind-up artist. > > if thats not the case -- neil, i really dont see what > purpose slamming the greenpeace campaign serves. if you dont > like it, dont participate, if greenpeace doesnt live up to > your standards and goals (still unclear as to what those are > exactly) move to the vanguard and do better, but really, > your invective-filled non-critique (greenpeace isnt perfect > so they should close up shop and go away???) is baffling > and doesnt offer anything but vitriol. > > i still think the greenpeace campaign is nicely done... i > wouldnt mind a microsound project in support by individuals > so inclined, im not really a sound artist but rather > video...if anyone feels a video portion would add to thier > soundwork...drop a line. > > xe > > > Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other peoples > battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice speak and for > what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! > > regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting here > and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all things produced > for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some where so like I said > put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear your whining its a known > fact that we all know adn live with... if you want to be perfect go live > in a cave in the mountains and eat dirt and run around naked but even tehn > youll opress come thing like the tiny bugs and bacteria youll kill when > eating the dirt and the grass youll sept on running around naked > not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals as they > are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains ... thats just > terrable I think we should censor every thing as evil as its the only way > we can live clean no opressive lives!!! > (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) > > > > "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 28 01:37:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41151-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:37:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:37:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 11763 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:41:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 11753 invoked from network); Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:41:30 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:39:30 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx go right a head ... passionate rants often result in some whacky slogans... On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > this is actually quite lovely...can i borrow it? > > to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white > academic elephant... > > "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 23:28:41 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41150-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 18:28:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 18:28:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 63605 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:32:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 63586 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:32:31 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:26:33 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200700c1b8af701481@[192.168.0.3]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (snip) >or do you prefer the kaczynski method? Much more entertaining and the audio part is spectacular! R. -- -- Website: http://www.warbaby.com (Currently undergoing an overhaul. Some pages and links may not work yet.) Blog: http://raggedwings.blogspot.com/ Nifty Stuff: http://www.cafepress.com/warbaby -- "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." - Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 22:10:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41149-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:10:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:10:43 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 25726 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 22:14:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 25714 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 22:14:20 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:09:48 -0800 (PST) From: xe non <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_dLs/lfS3hJputM1T3EEg1Q)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=Gm9AYEk3KdksNtHUGC+gY+rYW/K+saQdxDIXX6KXHYWUFWr5ww2XD19doamm9qxr8LHGcI1rqGMpW6mBYiK8fQkY4cNdGglFIkRPJ9jHbXT2bOcecIzc3S4gcjCFZIvQJz1SxW/D1r8dj0O9B9xQvtdSrO7/14NWTqZYY33ecs8=; X-YMail-OSG: lq5u2TMVM1lfEaFL53.L3kBB9w5VV93HYNUNrA9PeKFbNnPKIXQkgcVFkZ0rmARJKX2Bn.66QfW3s_9zNd5dP3YJJ8.OLZG_bJ9O8OddE0e3QItCTXWGuF7AjxniuCeenHe8vvyVZdvFDw-- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_dLs/lfS3hJputM1T3EEg1Q) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit this is actually quite lovely...can i borrow it? to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white academic elephant... "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --Boundary_(ID_dLs/lfS3hJputM1T3EEg1Q)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 22:06:47 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41148-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:06:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:06:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 23105 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 22:10:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 23095 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 22:10:37 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:06:39 -0800 (PST) From: xe non <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_/hNt/pcNUOOMVYumhB+IEQ)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=QtRr7P+GNa3I7BHGDZizOovXCSvk75BuA+dJs4I7arYnohGAi2fLD6RvIKI+oZapT17T8kvOd4luvjMrxxWN0dPY8Mvk9pky5vbn34c9oQy3k5wVW0d7kiikmKifDpMcVc9Z51BAYHH35Rs2NJxFVSqs0bMzVijJj6zMdvjy5eE=; X-YMail-OSG: R6JjkZ0VM1klhtoxJkyyhxtCN_ura2VZQ35xRBfM1.QxNrzfCI1qwdK1oNGgzUN.M3IETB6Jcq9F06dv07Zx.tIpHFOOWW2iJ.hcUc1uCgnCCGrKC50_RhKJRChLUcQIsDjvplxKu.f7Cb0- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_/hNt/pcNUOOMVYumhB+IEQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit sexual abuse of animals? really? aleks....i suspect you and i are in the presence of a wind-up artist. if thats not the case -- neil, i really dont see what purpose slamming the greenpeace campaign serves. if you dont like it, dont participate, if greenpeace doesnt live up to your standards and goals (still unclear as to what those are exactly) move to the vanguard and do better, but really, your invective-filled non-critique (greenpeace isnt perfect so they should close up shop and go away???) is baffling and doesnt offer anything but vitriol. i still think the greenpeace campaign is nicely done... i wouldnt mind a microsound project in support by individuals so inclined, im not really a sound artist but rather video...if anyone feels a video portion would add to thier soundwork...drop a line. xe Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other peoples battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice speak and for what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting here and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all things produced for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some where so like I said put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear your whining its a known fact that we all know adn live with... if you want to be perfect go live in a cave in the mountains and eat dirt and run around naked but even tehn youll opress come thing like the tiny bugs and bacteria youll kill when eating the dirt and the grass youll sept on running around naked not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals as they are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains ... thats just terrable I think we should censor every thing as evil as its the only way we can live clean no opressive lives!!! (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --Boundary_(ID_/hNt/pcNUOOMVYumhB+IEQ)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 21:48:10 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41147-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:48:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:48:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 13394 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:52:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 13360 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:51:58 +0000 Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 08:47:57 +1100 From: Jon <xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-IronPort-AV: i="4.12,212,1165152600"; d="scan'208"; a="65177078:sNHT18111646" X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx monkey knife fight! monkey knife fight! .... ... ... ... ... ... ... dizzydonor.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 21:20:34 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41146-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:20:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:20:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 97580 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:24:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 97570 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:24:22 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:22:22 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx no problem aleks as I personally wouldnt really enjoy someone who likes to debate contantly ... it gets annoying On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > No thanks, he seems too angry to have a logical debate with. > > aLEKs > > > On Dec 27, 2006, at 4:13 PM, Derek Mason wrote: > >> Will you two go and drink more Egg Nog and be merry. >> >> Create a Rant-n-Rave list and go at it. >> >> >> >> >> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Neil Wiernik" <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> >>> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> >>> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple >>> Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:11:01 -0500 (EST) >>> >>> >>> >>> my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other >>> peoples battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice >>> speak and for what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! >>> >>> regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting >>> here and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all >>> things produced for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some >>> where so like I said put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear >>> your whining its a known fact that we all know adn live with... if >>> you want to be perfect go live in a cave in the mountains and eat >>> dirt and run around naked but even tehn youll opress come thing >>> like the tiny bugs and bacteria youll kill when eating the dirt and >>> the grass youll sept on running around naked >>> not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals >>> as they are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains >>> ... thats just terrable I think we should censor every thing as >>> evil as its the only way we can live clean no opressive lives!!! >>> (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>> >>>> In regards to flame wars, your the only one that seems to respond >>>> with anger and spite when someone offers a differing opinion. >>>> Reread the thread, your the only one that insults anyone. >>>> >>>> IBM developed technology for the Nazis, as did many corporations >>>> that are still around today. I still do not see how Greenpeace >>>> has anything to do with IBM and the Holocaust. How do you know >>>> what types of computers Greenpeace uses? Gimme some point of >>>> reference. And if they do use technology that was developed >>>> decades after WWII what does it matter? Does that undo the good >>>> that they do? Do you suggest that they cease to exist because of >>>> IBM checkered past via WWII, developing technology that is not >>>> even in use today for the most part? Should use apple/mac who >>>> uses impoverished asian work forces to assemble their >>>> uber/expensive sheik design friendly computers? >>>> >>>> aLEKs >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:43 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in >>>>> some form or manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company >>>>> are far more worse then apple ever will be in that IBM supported >>>>> and built technology for the nazi's in world war 2. sp the >>>>> technology that navigates thier ships or Im sure the laptops >>>>> they use are ibms if not apples machines also... so before they >>>>> stick thier foot deeper into their moths they should stop and >>>>> think is what Im sayign get it now???? >>>>> >>>>> you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being >>>>> condescending but you and the other person what ever his name is >>>>> are and mor eover you say how much you hate flame wars but both >>>>> times I have posted recently it has been you that manages to >>>>> create a flame war, by your stuborn arguments... your entitled >>>>> to your opinion just like I am leave it at that !! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a >>>>>> response to your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with >>>>>> their ideology. Which i also agree is a rather weak argument >>>>>> on your part, no offense intended. Green peace cannot be >>>>>> compared to IBM. IBM's sole motivator is profits. Where Green >>>>>> Peace ideology is global conservation. All of their resources >>>>>> go toward raising awareness in regards to mans inability to >>>>>> live in balance with his environment. Sure they need modern >>>>>> technology in order to operate with any sort of effective >>>>>> impact. They do so with a lot of foresight. Are they perfect? >>>>>> No, nothing is perfect really in this world, but to claim that >>>>>> they are no different then mega corporations, or entities >>>>>> driven solely by profits is misguided. >>>>>> >>>>>> It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What >>>>>> predicates a solid opinion is that it is well thought out as >>>>>> well as being based with a solid point of reference, i.e. facts. >>>>>> >>>>>> Again no offense intended. >>>>>> >>>>>> aLEKs >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> his responce was extreemly condisending... >>>>>>> towards me and towards any one else that might think >>>>>>> diffeently then he does... >>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>>>>>> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i >>>>>>>> do not see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just >>>>>>>> the opposite actually. You need to relax and stop being so >>>>>>>> defensive. If everyone was to act as you do this list would >>>>>>>> be one giant flame war. What are you even being defensive >>>>>>>> about? I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your >>>>>>>> response? His first response was a very logical and well >>>>>>>> thought out observation. >>>>>>>> Have some respect... >>>>>>>> aLEKs >>>>>>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>>>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear >>>>>>>>> your upper class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >>>>>>>>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind >>>>>>>>> your white academic elephant... try getting into the thick >>>>>>>>> of it knee deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber >>>>>>>>> bullets then come talk to me! >>>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>>>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it >>>>>>>>>> at best misguided. >>>>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>>>>>>>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about >>>>>>>>>> others >>>>>>>>>> trash... >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> what a strange rant... >>>>>>>>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the >>>>>>>>>>> contradictions of being "in the world" when it comes to >>>>>>>>>>> effective activism and they make thier peace with the >>>>>>>>>>> compromises they know they will have to make somewhere >>>>>>>>>>> around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will >>>>>>>>>>> probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in >>>>>>>>>>> buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity >>>>>>>>>>> and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if >>>>>>>>>>> they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help >>>>>>>>>>> change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they >>>>>>>>>>> minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. >>>>>>>>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the >>>>>>>>>>> modern world and try to communicate the information they >>>>>>>>>>> have and coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless >>>>>>>>>>> shack in the woods in order to meet your peerless >>>>>>>>>>> standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how >>>>>>>>>>> well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. >>>>>>>>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective >>>>>>>>>>> way it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from >>>>>>>>>>> computers in general. targeting the company with the most >>>>>>>>>>> eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems >>>>>>>>>>> an effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is >>>>>>>>>>> done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or >>>>>>>>>>> do you prefer the kaczynski method? >>>>>>>>>>> xe >>>>>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at >>>>>>>>>>> all as if they do >>>>>>>>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if >>>>>>>>>>> they want to spin >>>>>>>>>>> things that way any how... >>>>>>>>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>>>>>>>>>> rather then against.. >>>>>>>>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who >>>>>>>>>>> IBM >>>>>>>>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like >>>>>>>>>>> they are holier >>>>>>>>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I >>>>>>>>>>> mean what powers >>>>>>>>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>>>>>>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing >>>>>>>>>>> fingers it pisses me >>>>>>>>>>> off!!! >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>>>>>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>>>>>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>>>>>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>>>>>>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>>>>>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>>>>>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>>>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>>>>>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>>>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>>>>>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>>>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>>>>>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>>>>>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>>>>>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant >>>>>>>>>>> changes to the RV." >>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the >>>>>>>>>> RV." >>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ============================ >>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>> releases available on: >>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>> publication: >>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>> >>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> >>> >>> ============================ >>> www.phoniq.net >>> releases available on: >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>> publication: >>> www.vagueterrain.net >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >>> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 21:16:46 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41145-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:16:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:16:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 95173 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:20:28 +0000 Received: (qmail 95163 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:20:27 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:16:28 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx No thanks, he seems too angry to have a logical debate with. aLEKs On Dec 27, 2006, at 4:13 PM, Derek Mason wrote: > Will you two go and drink more Egg Nog and be merry. > > Create a Rant-n-Rave list and go at it. > > > > > >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Neil Wiernik" <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> >> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> >> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple >> Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:11:01 -0500 (EST) >> >> >> >> my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other >> peoples battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice >> speak and for what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! >> >> regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting >> here and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all >> things produced for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some >> where so like I said put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear >> your whining its a known fact that we all know adn live with... if >> you want to be perfect go live in a cave in the mountains and eat >> dirt and run around naked but even tehn youll opress come thing >> like the tiny bugs and bacteria youll kill when eating the dirt and >> the grass youll sept on running around naked >> not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals >> as they are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains >> ... thats just terrable I think we should censor every thing as >> evil as its the only way we can live clean no opressive lives!!! >> (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) >> >> >> >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >> >>> In regards to flame wars, your the only one that seems to respond >>> with anger and spite when someone offers a differing opinion. >>> Reread the thread, your the only one that insults anyone. >>> >>> IBM developed technology for the Nazis, as did many corporations >>> that are still around today. I still do not see how Greenpeace >>> has anything to do with IBM and the Holocaust. How do you know >>> what types of computers Greenpeace uses? Gimme some point of >>> reference. And if they do use technology that was developed >>> decades after WWII what does it matter? Does that undo the good >>> that they do? Do you suggest that they cease to exist because of >>> IBM checkered past via WWII, developing technology that is not >>> even in use today for the most part? Should use apple/mac who >>> uses impoverished asian work forces to assemble their >>> uber/expensive sheik design friendly computers? >>> >>> aLEKs >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:43 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in >>>> some form or manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company >>>> are far more worse then apple ever will be in that IBM supported >>>> and built technology for the nazi's in world war 2. sp the >>>> technology that navigates thier ships or Im sure the laptops >>>> they use are ibms if not apples machines also... so before they >>>> stick thier foot deeper into their moths they should stop and >>>> think is what Im sayign get it now???? >>>> >>>> you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being >>>> condescending but you and the other person what ever his name is >>>> are and mor eover you say how much you hate flame wars but both >>>> times I have posted recently it has been you that manages to >>>> create a flame war, by your stuborn arguments... your entitled >>>> to your opinion just like I am leave it at that !! >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>> >>>>> I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a >>>>> response to your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with >>>>> their ideology. Which i also agree is a rather weak argument >>>>> on your part, no offense intended. Green peace cannot be >>>>> compared to IBM. IBM's sole motivator is profits. Where Green >>>>> Peace ideology is global conservation. All of their resources >>>>> go toward raising awareness in regards to mans inability to >>>>> live in balance with his environment. Sure they need modern >>>>> technology in order to operate with any sort of effective >>>>> impact. They do so with a lot of foresight. Are they perfect? >>>>> No, nothing is perfect really in this world, but to claim that >>>>> they are no different then mega corporations, or entities >>>>> driven solely by profits is misguided. >>>>> >>>>> It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What >>>>> predicates a solid opinion is that it is well thought out as >>>>> well as being based with a solid point of reference, i.e. facts. >>>>> >>>>> Again no offense intended. >>>>> >>>>> aLEKs >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> his responce was extreemly condisending... >>>>>> towards me and towards any one else that might think >>>>>> diffeently then he does... >>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>>>>> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i >>>>>>> do not see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just >>>>>>> the opposite actually. You need to relax and stop being so >>>>>>> defensive. If everyone was to act as you do this list would >>>>>>> be one giant flame war. What are you even being defensive >>>>>>> about? I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your >>>>>>> response? His first response was a very logical and well >>>>>>> thought out observation. >>>>>>> Have some respect... >>>>>>> aLEKs >>>>>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear >>>>>>>> your upper class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >>>>>>>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind >>>>>>>> your white academic elephant... try getting into the thick >>>>>>>> of it knee deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber >>>>>>>> bullets then come talk to me! >>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it >>>>>>>>> at best misguided. >>>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>>>>>>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>>>>>>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about >>>>>>>>> others >>>>>>>>> trash... >>>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>>>>> what a strange rant... >>>>>>>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the >>>>>>>>>> contradictions of being "in the world" when it comes to >>>>>>>>>> effective activism and they make thier peace with the >>>>>>>>>> compromises they know they will have to make somewhere >>>>>>>>>> around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will >>>>>>>>>> probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in >>>>>>>>>> buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity >>>>>>>>>> and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if >>>>>>>>>> they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help >>>>>>>>>> change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they >>>>>>>>>> minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. >>>>>>>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the >>>>>>>>>> modern world and try to communicate the information they >>>>>>>>>> have and coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless >>>>>>>>>> shack in the woods in order to meet your peerless >>>>>>>>>> standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how >>>>>>>>>> well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. >>>>>>>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective >>>>>>>>>> way it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from >>>>>>>>>> computers in general. targeting the company with the most >>>>>>>>>> eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems >>>>>>>>>> an effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is >>>>>>>>>> done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or >>>>>>>>>> do you prefer the kaczynski method? >>>>>>>>>> xe >>>>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at >>>>>>>>>> all as if they do >>>>>>>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if >>>>>>>>>> they want to spin >>>>>>>>>> things that way any how... >>>>>>>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for >>>>>>>>>> them... >>>>>>>>>> rather then against.. >>>>>>>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all >>>>>>>>>> know who IBM >>>>>>>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like >>>>>>>>>> they are holier >>>>>>>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I >>>>>>>>>> mean what powers >>>>>>>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>>>>>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont >>>>>>>>>> take the >>>>>>>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing >>>>>>>>>> fingers it pisses me >>>>>>>>>> off!!! >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>>>>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>>>>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>>>>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>>>>>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>>>>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>>>>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>>>>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>>>>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>>>>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>>>>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>>>>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>> -------- >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: >>>>>>>>>>> xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> ------- >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant >>>>>>>>>> changes to the RV." >>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>> ------ >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to >>>>>>>>> the RV." >>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> ---- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>> ============================ >>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>> publication: >>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>> --- >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> -- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> >>>> >>>> ============================ >>>> www.phoniq.net >>>> releases available on: >>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>> publication: >>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >> >> ============================ >> www.phoniq.net >> releases available on: >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >> publication: >> www.vagueterrain.net >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org > >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 21:15:13 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41144-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:15:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:15:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 93635 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:18:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 93625 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:18:54 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:14:51 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Im not dissing apple. Just as profit motivated as the next mega corporation. Short sighted comment in regards to IBM? How so? Care to elaborate? Why are you so angry? Disclaimer: This email was typed on a Mac. Does this make me a hypocrite? aLEKs On Dec 27, 2006, at 4:11 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other peoples > battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice speak and > for what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! > > regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting > here and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all things > produced for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some where so > like I said put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear your whining > its a known fact that we all know adn live with... if you want to be > perfect go live in a cave in the mountains and eat dirt and run around > naked but even tehn youll opress come thing like the tiny bugs and > bacteria youll kill when eating the dirt and the grass youll sept on > running around naked > not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals as > they are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains ... > thats just terrable I think we should censor every thing as evil as > its the only way we can live clean no opressive lives!!! > (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) > > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > >> In regards to flame wars, your the only one that seems to respond >> with anger and spite when someone offers a differing opinion. Reread >> the thread, your the only one that insults anyone. >> >> IBM developed technology for the Nazis, as did many corporations that >> are still around today. I still do not see how Greenpeace has >> anything to do with IBM and the Holocaust. How do you know what >> types of computers Greenpeace uses? Gimme some point of reference. >> And if they do use technology that was developed decades after WWII >> what does it matter? Does that undo the good that they do? Do you >> suggest that they cease to exist because of IBM checkered past via >> WWII, developing technology that is not even in use today for the >> most part? Should use apple/mac who uses impoverished asian work >> forces to assemble their uber/expensive sheik design friendly >> computers? >> >> aLEKs >> >> >> >> >> >> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:43 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >> >>> no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in some >>> form or manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company are far >>> more worse then apple ever will be in that IBM supported and built >>> technology for the nazi's in world war 2. sp the technology that >>> navigates thier ships or Im sure the laptops they use are ibms if >>> not apples machines also... so before they stick thier foot deeper >>> into their moths they should stop and think is what Im sayign get it >>> now???? >>> you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being condescending >>> but you and the other person what ever his name is are and mor eover >>> you say how much you hate flame wars but both times I have posted >>> recently it has been you that manages to create a flame war, by your >>> stuborn arguments... your entitled to your opinion just like I am >>> leave it at that !! >>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>> I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a response >>>> to your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with their ideology. >>>> Which i also agree is a rather weak argument on your part, no >>>> offense intended. Green peace cannot be compared to IBM. IBM's >>>> sole motivator is profits. Where Green Peace ideology is global >>>> conservation. All of their resources go toward raising awareness >>>> in regards to mans inability to live in balance with his >>>> environment. Sure they need modern technology in order to operate >>>> with any sort of effective impact. They do so with a lot of >>>> foresight. Are they perfect? No, nothing is perfect really in >>>> this world, but to claim that they are no different then mega >>>> corporations, or entities driven solely by profits is misguided. >>>> It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What >>>> predicates a solid opinion is that it is well thought out as well >>>> as being based with a solid point of reference, i.e. facts. >>>> Again no offense intended. >>>> aLEKs >>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>> his responce was extreemly condisending... >>>>> towards me and towards any one else that might think diffeently >>>>> then he does... >>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>>>> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do >>>>>> not see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the >>>>>> opposite actually. You need to relax and stop being so defensive. >>>>>> If everyone was to act as you do this list would be one giant >>>>>> flame war. What are you even being defensive about? I am >>>>>> honestly having a hard time deciphering your response? His first >>>>>> response was a very logical and well thought out observation. >>>>>> Have some respect... >>>>>> aLEKs >>>>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your >>>>>>> upper class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >>>>>>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your >>>>>>> white academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee >>>>>>> deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come >>>>>>> talk to me! >>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at >>>>>>>> best misguided. >>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>>>>>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>>>>>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about >>>>>>>> others >>>>>>>> trash... >>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>>>> what a strange rant... >>>>>>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions >>>>>>>>> of being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism >>>>>>>>> and they make thier peace with the compromises they know they >>>>>>>>> will have to make somewhere around thier sophmore year at >>>>>>>>> college. yes, they will probably have to use cars, yes they >>>>>>>>> will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes they will >>>>>>>>> use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic >>>>>>>>> technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in >>>>>>>>> order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. will >>>>>>>>> they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. >>>>>>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern >>>>>>>>> world and try to communicate the information they have and >>>>>>>>> coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the >>>>>>>>> woods in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable >>>>>>>>> activism, but we all know how well that turned out for the >>>>>>>>> unabomber and all concerned. >>>>>>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way >>>>>>>>> it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from >>>>>>>>> computers in general. targeting the company with the most >>>>>>>>> eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems an >>>>>>>>> effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is done >>>>>>>>> with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or do you >>>>>>>>> prefer the kaczynski method? >>>>>>>>> xe >>>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all >>>>>>>>> as if they do >>>>>>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they >>>>>>>>> want to spin >>>>>>>>> things that way any how... >>>>>>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>>>>>>>> rather then against.. >>>>>>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know >>>>>>>>> who IBM >>>>>>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they >>>>>>>>> are holier >>>>>>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean >>>>>>>>> what powers >>>>>>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>>>>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont >>>>>>>>> take the >>>>>>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it >>>>>>>>> pisses me >>>>>>>>> off!!! >>>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>>>>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>>>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>>>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>>>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>>>>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>>>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>>>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>>>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>>>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>>>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>>>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>>>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> ------- >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>> ------ >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to >>>>>>>>> the RV." >>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to >>>>>>>> the RV." >>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> ---- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>> --- >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> ============================ >>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>> releases available on: >>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>> publication: >>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> -- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> ============================ >>> www.phoniq.net >>> releases available on: >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>> publication: >>> www.vagueterrain.net >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 21:14:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41143-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:14:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:14:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 91671 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:17:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 91655 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:17:46 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:13:48 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple X-Originating-IP: 69.3.155.10 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.123) by wfilter2.us4.outblaze.com; 27 Dec 2006 21:13:48 -0000 X-Originating-Server: ws1-3a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Will you two go and drink more Egg Nog and be merry. Create a Rant-n-Rave list and go at it. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Neil Wiernik" <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple > Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:11:01 -0500 (EST) > > > > my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other > peoples battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice > speak and for what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! > > regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting > here and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all > things produced for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some > where so like I said put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear > your whining its a known fact that we all know adn live with... if > you want to be perfect go live in a cave in the mountains and eat > dirt and run around naked but even tehn youll opress come thing > like the tiny bugs and bacteria youll kill when eating the dirt and > the grass youll sept on running around naked > not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals > as they are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains > ... thats just terrable I think we should censor every thing as > evil as its the only way we can live clean no opressive lives!!! > (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) > > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > > > In regards to flame wars, your the only one that seems to respond > > with anger and spite when someone offers a differing opinion. > > Reread the thread, your the only one that insults anyone. > > > > IBM developed technology for the Nazis, as did many corporations > > that are still around today. I still do not see how Greenpeace > > has anything to do with IBM and the Holocaust. How do you know > > what types of computers Greenpeace uses? Gimme some point of > > reference. And if they do use technology that was developed > > decades after WWII what does it matter? Does that undo the good > > that they do? Do you suggest that they cease to exist because of > > IBM checkered past via WWII, developing technology that is not > > even in use today for the most part? Should use apple/mac who > > uses impoverished asian work forces to assemble their > > uber/expensive sheik design friendly computers? > > > > aLEKs > > > > > > > > > > > > On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:43 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > >> > >> no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in > >> some form or manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company > >> are far more worse then apple ever will be in that IBM supported > >> and built technology for the nazi's in world war 2. sp the > >> technology that navigates thier ships or Im sure the laptops > >> they use are ibms if not apples machines also... so before they > >> stick thier foot deeper into their moths they should stop and > >> think is what Im sayign get it now???? > >> > >> you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being > >> condescending but you and the other person what ever his name is > >> are and mor eover you say how much you hate flame wars but both > >> times I have posted recently it has been you that manages to > >> create a flame war, by your stuborn arguments... your entitled > >> to your opinion just like I am leave it at that !! > >> > >> > >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > >> > >>> I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a > >>> response to your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with > >>> their ideology. Which i also agree is a rather weak argument > >>> on your part, no offense intended. Green peace cannot be > >>> compared to IBM. IBM's sole motivator is profits. Where Green > >>> Peace ideology is global conservation. All of their resources > >>> go toward raising awareness in regards to mans inability to > >>> live in balance with his environment. Sure they need modern > >>> technology in order to operate with any sort of effective > >>> impact. They do so with a lot of foresight. Are they perfect? > >>> No, nothing is perfect really in this world, but to claim that > >>> they are no different then mega corporations, or entities > >>> driven solely by profits is misguided. > >>> > >>> It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What > >>> predicates a solid opinion is that it is well thought out as > >>> well as being based with a solid point of reference, i.e. facts. > >>> > >>> Again no offense intended. > >>> > >>> aLEKs > >>> > >>> > >>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >>> > >>>> his responce was extreemly condisending... > >>>> towards me and towards any one else that might think > >>>> diffeently then he does... > >>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > >>>>> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i > >>>>> do not see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just > >>>>> the opposite actually. You need to relax and stop being so > >>>>> defensive. If everyone was to act as you do this list would > >>>>> be one giant flame war. What are you even being defensive > >>>>> about? I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your > >>>>> response? His first response was a very logical and well > >>>>> thought out observation. > >>>>> Have some respect... > >>>>> aLEKs > >>>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >>>>>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear > >>>>>> your upper class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! > >>>>>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind > >>>>>> your white academic elephant... try getting into the thick > >>>>>> of it knee deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber > >>>>>> bullets then come talk to me! > >>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > >>>>>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it > >>>>>>> at best misguided. > >>>>>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > >>>>>>> its not a wierd rant at all... > >>>>>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others > >>>>>>> trash... > >>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > >>>>>>>> what a strange rant... > >>>>>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the > >>>>>>>> contradictions of being "in the world" when it comes to > >>>>>>>> effective activism and they make thier peace with the > >>>>>>>> compromises they know they will have to make somewhere > >>>>>>>> around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will > >>>>>>>> probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in > >>>>>>>> buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity > >>>>>>>> and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if > >>>>>>>> they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help > >>>>>>>> change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they > >>>>>>>> minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. > >>>>>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the > >>>>>>>> modern world and try to communicate the information they > >>>>>>>> have and coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless > >>>>>>>> shack in the woods in order to meet your peerless > >>>>>>>> standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how > >>>>>>>> well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. > >>>>>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective > >>>>>>>> way it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from > >>>>>>>> computers in general. targeting the company with the most > >>>>>>>> eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems > >>>>>>>> an effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is > >>>>>>>> done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or > >>>>>>>> do you prefer the kaczynski method? > >>>>>>>> xe > >>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: > >>>>>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at > >>>>>>>> all as if they do > >>>>>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if > >>>>>>>> they want to spin > >>>>>>>> things that way any how... > >>>>>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... > >>>>>>>> rather then against.. > >>>>>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM > >>>>>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like > >>>>>>>> they are holier > >>>>>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I > >>>>>>>> mean what powers > >>>>>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... > >>>>>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the > >>>>>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing > >>>>>>>> fingers it pisses me > >>>>>>>> off!!! > >>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: > >>>>>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing > >>>>>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT > >>>>>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, > >>>>>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. > >>>>>>>>> and now Apple?... > >>>>>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why > >>>>>>>>>> not talk about > >>>>>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the > >>>>>>>>>> problem, and work for > >>>>>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the > >>>>>>>>>> progressive European > >>>>>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company > >>>>>>>>>> seems gratuitous... > >>>>>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends > >>>>>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > >>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>>>>>>> ============================ > >>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net > >>>>>>>> releases available on: > >>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >>>>>>>> publication: > >>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net > >>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant > >>>>>>>> changes to the RV." > >>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ > >>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? > >>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > >>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com > >>>>>>> ============================ > >>>>>>> www.phoniq.net > >>>>>>> releases available on: > >>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >>>>>>> publication: > >>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net > >>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > >>>>>>> __________________________________________________ > >>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? > >>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > >>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com > >>>>>> ============================ > >>>>>> www.phoniq.net > >>>>>> releases available on: > >>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >>>>>> publication: > >>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net > >>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>>> ============================ > >>>> www.phoniq.net > >>>> releases available on: > >>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >>>> publication: > >>>> www.vagueterrain.net > >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>> > >>> > >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>> > >> > >> ============================ > >> www.phoniq.net > >> releases available on: > >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >> publication: > >> www.vagueterrain.net > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> website: http://www.microsound.org > >> > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 21:09:13 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41142-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:09:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:09:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 89099 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:13:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 89086 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:13:00 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:11:01 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx my point is that you argue things in excess, you fight other peoples battels for them and more over just like to hear your voice speak and for what NO REASON that I can see!!! jesus!!!!!! regarding your short sighted comment about ibm is that your sitting here and dissing apple when 99.9999999999999999 percent of all things produced for consumer wants/needs are opressing someone some where so like I said put a sock in it, no one really wants to hear your whining its a known fact that we all know adn live with... if you want to be perfect go live in a cave in the mountains and eat dirt and run around naked but even tehn youll opress come thing like the tiny bugs and bacteria youll kill when eating the dirt and the grass youll sept on running around naked not to mention the sexual abuse youll enforce on the poor animals as they are forced to watch you running naked through the mountains ... thats just terrable I think we should censor every thing as evil as its the only way we can live clean no opressive lives!!! (if you take this reply as serious dont even bother) On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > In regards to flame wars, your the only one that seems to respond with anger > and spite when someone offers a differing opinion. Reread the thread, your > the only one that insults anyone. > > IBM developed technology for the Nazis, as did many corporations that are > still around today. I still do not see how Greenpeace has anything to do > with IBM and the Holocaust. How do you know what types of computers > Greenpeace uses? Gimme some point of reference. And if they do use > technology that was developed decades after WWII what does it matter? Does > that undo the good that they do? Do you suggest that they cease to exist > because of IBM checkered past via WWII, developing technology that is not > even in use today for the most part? Should use apple/mac who uses > impoverished asian work forces to assemble their uber/expensive sheik design > friendly computers? > > aLEKs > > > > > > On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:43 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >> >> no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in some form or >> manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company are far more worse then >> apple ever will be in that IBM supported and built technology for the >> nazi's in world war 2. sp the technology that navigates thier ships or Im >> sure the laptops they use are ibms if not apples machines also... so before >> they stick thier foot deeper into their moths they should stop and think is >> what Im sayign get it now???? >> >> you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being condescending but you >> and the other person what ever his name is are and mor eover you say how >> much you hate flame wars but both times I have posted recently it has been >> you that manages to create a flame war, by your stuborn arguments... your >> entitled to your opinion just like I am leave it at that !! >> >> >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >> >>> I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a response to >>> your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with their ideology. Which i >>> also agree is a rather weak argument on your part, no offense intended. >>> Green peace cannot be compared to IBM. IBM's sole motivator is profits. >>> Where Green Peace ideology is global conservation. All of their resources >>> go toward raising awareness in regards to mans inability to live in >>> balance with his environment. Sure they need modern technology in order >>> to operate with any sort of effective impact. They do so with a lot of >>> foresight. Are they perfect? No, nothing is perfect really in this >>> world, but to claim that they are no different then mega corporations, or >>> entities driven solely by profits is misguided. >>> >>> It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What predicates a >>> solid opinion is that it is well thought out as well as being based with a >>> solid point of reference, i.e. facts. >>> >>> Again no offense intended. >>> >>> aLEKs >>> >>> >>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>> >>>> his responce was extreemly condisending... >>>> towards me and towards any one else that might think diffeently then he >>>> does... >>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>>> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not see >>>>> how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite actually. >>>>> You need to relax and stop being so defensive. If everyone was to act >>>>> as you do this list would be one giant flame war. What are you even >>>>> being defensive about? I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your >>>>> response? His first response was a very logical and well thought out >>>>> observation. >>>>> Have some respect... >>>>> aLEKs >>>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your upper >>>>>> class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >>>>>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white >>>>>> academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee deep in tear >>>>>> gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk to me! >>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best >>>>>>> misguided. >>>>>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>>>>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>>>>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others >>>>>>> trash... >>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>>> what a strange rant... >>>>>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of >>>>>>>> being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they >>>>>>>> make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to >>>>>>>> make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will >>>>>>>> probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings >>>>>>>> made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do thier work with >>>>>>>> wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to stay engaged with >>>>>>>> society in order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. >>>>>>>> will they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. >>>>>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world >>>>>>>> and try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier >>>>>>>> campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet >>>>>>>> your peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how >>>>>>>> well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. >>>>>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it >>>>>>>> calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in >>>>>>>> general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public >>>>>>>> image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish >>>>>>>> that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on >>>>>>>> the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski method? >>>>>>>> xe >>>>>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if >>>>>>>> they do >>>>>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to >>>>>>>> spin >>>>>>>> things that way any how... >>>>>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>>>>>>> rather then against.. >>>>>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who >>>>>>>> IBM >>>>>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are >>>>>>>> holier >>>>>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what >>>>>>>> powers >>>>>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>>>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses >>>>>>>> me >>>>>>>> off!!! >>>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>>>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>>>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the >>>>>>>> RV." >>>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the >>>>>>> RV." >>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>> ============================ >>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>> publication: >>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> ============================ >>>> www.phoniq.net >>>> releases available on: >>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>> publication: >>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >> >> ============================ >> www.phoniq.net >> releases available on: >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >> publication: >> www.vagueterrain.net >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 20:57:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41141-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:57:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:57:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 82682 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:00:52 +0000 Received: (qmail 82672 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 21:00:52 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:56:52 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx In regards to flame wars, your the only one that seems to respond with anger and spite when someone offers a differing opinion. Reread the thread, your the only one that insults anyone. IBM developed technology for the Nazis, as did many corporations that are still around today. I still do not see how Greenpeace has anything to do with IBM and the Holocaust. How do you know what types of computers Greenpeace uses? Gimme some point of reference. And if they do use technology that was developed decades after WWII what does it matter? Does that undo the good that they do? Do you suggest that they cease to exist because of IBM checkered past via WWII, developing technology that is not even in use today for the most part? Should use apple/mac who uses impoverished asian work forces to assemble their uber/expensive sheik design friendly computers? aLEKs On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:43 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in some > form or manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company are far more > worse then apple ever will be in that IBM supported and built > technology for the nazi's in world war 2. sp the technology that > navigates thier ships or Im sure the laptops they use are ibms if not > apples machines also... so before they stick thier foot deeper into > their moths they should stop and think is what Im sayign get it > now???? > > you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being condescending but > you and the other person what ever his name is are and mor eover you > say how much you hate flame wars but both times I have posted recently > it has been you that manages to create a flame war, by your stuborn > arguments... your entitled to your opinion just like I am leave it at > that !! > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > >> I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a response >> to your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with their ideology. >> Which i also agree is a rather weak argument on your part, no offense >> intended. Green peace cannot be compared to IBM. IBM's sole >> motivator is profits. Where Green Peace ideology is global >> conservation. All of their resources go toward raising awareness in >> regards to mans inability to live in balance with his environment. >> Sure they need modern technology in order to operate with any sort of >> effective impact. They do so with a lot of foresight. Are they >> perfect? No, nothing is perfect really in this world, but to claim >> that they are no different then mega corporations, or entities driven >> solely by profits is misguided. >> >> It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What predicates >> a solid opinion is that it is well thought out as well as being based >> with a solid point of reference, i.e. facts. >> >> Again no offense intended. >> >> aLEKs >> >> >> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >> >>> his responce was extreemly condisending... >>> towards me and towards any one else that might think diffeently then >>> he does... >>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >>>> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not >>>> see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite >>>> actually. You need to relax and stop being so defensive. If >>>> everyone was to act as you do this list would be one giant flame >>>> war. What are you even being defensive about? I am honestly having >>>> a hard time deciphering your response? His first response was a >>>> very logical and well thought out observation. >>>> Have some respect... >>>> aLEKs >>>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your >>>>> upper class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >>>>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your >>>>> white academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee >>>>> deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk >>>>> to me! >>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at >>>>>> best misguided. >>>>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>>>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>>>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about >>>>>> others >>>>>> trash... >>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>>> what a strange rant... >>>>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of >>>>>>> being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and >>>>>>> they make thier peace with the compromises they know they will >>>>>>> have to make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. >>>>>>> yes, they will probably have to use cars, yes they will have to >>>>>>> live in buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity >>>>>>> and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if they >>>>>>> choose to stay engaged with society in order to help change it >>>>>>> yes. this is a realists approach. will they minimize all >>>>>>> this...most likely, as best thay can. >>>>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern >>>>>>> world and try to communicate the information they have and >>>>>>> coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the >>>>>>> woods in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable >>>>>>> activism, but we all know how well that turned out for the >>>>>>> unabomber and all concerned. >>>>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way >>>>>>> it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers >>>>>>> in general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly >>>>>>> public image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way >>>>>>> to accomplish that goal. at least it is done with good-humour >>>>>>> and stays focused on the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski >>>>>>> method? >>>>>>> xe >>>>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as >>>>>>> if they do >>>>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they >>>>>>> want to spin >>>>>>> things that way any how... >>>>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>>>>>> rather then against.. >>>>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know >>>>>>> who IBM >>>>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they >>>>>>> are holier >>>>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what >>>>>>> powers >>>>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont >>>>>>> take the >>>>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it >>>>>>> pisses me >>>>>>> off!!! >>>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>> ============================ >>>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>>> publication: >>>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> ---- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to >>>>>>> the RV." >>>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>>> ============================ >>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>> publication: >>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>> --- >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to >>>>>> the RV." >>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>> ============================ >>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>> releases available on: >>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>> publication: >>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> -- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> ============================ >>> www.phoniq.net >>> releases available on: >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>> publication: >>> www.vagueterrain.net >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 20:42:02 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41140-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:42:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:42:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 74981 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:45:50 +0000 Received: (qmail 74970 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:45:49 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:43:49 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx no Im saying that greenpeace if not using a mac most likely in some form or manner uses IBM products which IMHO as a company are far more worse then apple ever will be in that IBM supported and built technology for the nazi's in world war 2. sp the technology that navigates thier ships or Im sure the laptops they use are ibms if not apples machines also... so before they stick thier foot deeper into their moths they should stop and think is what Im sayign get it now???? you keep telling me offenxe and that your not being condescending but you and the other person what ever his name is are and mor eover you say how much you hate flame wars but both times I have posted recently it has been you that manages to create a flame war, by your stuborn arguments... your entitled to your opinion just like I am leave it at that !! On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a response to your > claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with their ideology. Which i also > agree is a rather weak argument on your part, no offense intended. Green > peace cannot be compared to IBM. IBM's sole motivator is profits. Where > Green Peace ideology is global conservation. All of their resources go > toward raising awareness in regards to mans inability to live in balance with > his environment. Sure they need modern technology in order to operate with > any sort of effective impact. They do so with a lot of foresight. Are they > perfect? No, nothing is perfect really in this world, but to claim that they > are no different then mega corporations, or entities driven solely by profits > is misguided. > > It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What predicates a solid > opinion is that it is well thought out as well as being based with a solid > point of reference, i.e. facts. > > Again no offense intended. > > aLEKs > > > On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >> >> >> his responce was extreemly condisending... >> towards me and towards any one else that might think diffeently then he >> does... >> >> >> >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: >> >>> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not see how >>> it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite actually. You >>> need to relax and stop being so defensive. If everyone was to act as you >>> do this list would be one giant flame war. What are you even being >>> defensive about? I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your >>> response? His first response was a very logical and well thought out >>> observation. >>> >>> Have some respect... >>> >>> aLEKs >>> >>> >>> >>> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >>> >>>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your upper >>>> class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >>>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white >>>> academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee deep in tear >>>> gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk to me! >>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best >>>>> misguided. >>>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others >>>>> trash... >>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>>> what a strange rant... >>>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of being >>>>>> "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they make thier >>>>>> peace with the compromises they know they will have to make somewhere >>>>>> around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will probably have to >>>>>> use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes >>>>>> they will use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic >>>>>> technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in order to >>>>>> help change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they minimize all >>>>>> this...most likely, as best thay can. >>>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world and >>>>>> try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier >>>>>> campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet your >>>>>> peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how well >>>>>> that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. >>>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it calls >>>>>> attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in general. >>>>>> targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public image that it >>>>>> doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish that goal. at >>>>>> least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or >>>>>> do you prefer the kaczynski method? >>>>>> xe >>>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they >>>>>> do >>>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to >>>>>> spin >>>>>> things that way any how... >>>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>>>>> rather then against.. >>>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM >>>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are >>>>>> holier >>>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers >>>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the >>>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses >>>>>> me >>>>>> off!!! >>>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>> ============================ >>>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>>> releases available on: >>>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>>> publication: >>>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." >>>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>>> ============================ >>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>> releases available on: >>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>> publication: >>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." >>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>> ============================ >>>> www.phoniq.net >>>> releases available on: >>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>> publication: >>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >> >> ============================ >> www.phoniq.net >> releases available on: >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >> publication: >> www.vagueterrain.net >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 20:29:59 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41139-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:29:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:29:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 69232 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:33:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 69218 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:33:41 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:29:41 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I do not see how his response was condescending. It was a response to your claim that Greenpeace is hypocritical with their ideology. Which i also agree is a rather weak argument on your part, no offense intended. Green peace cannot be compared to IBM. IBM's sole motivator is profits. Where Green Peace ideology is global conservation. All of their resources go toward raising awareness in regards to mans inability to live in balance with his environment. Sure they need modern technology in order to operate with any sort of effective impact. They do so with a lot of foresight. Are they perfect? No, nothing is perfect really in this world, but to claim that they are no different then mega corporations, or entities driven solely by profits is misguided. It is true that everyone is entitled to an opinion. What predicates a solid opinion is that it is well thought out as well as being based with a solid point of reference, i.e. facts. Again no offense intended. aLEKs On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:20 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > his responce was extreemly condisending... > towards me and towards any one else that might think diffeently then > he does... > > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > >> You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not >> see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite >> actually. You need to relax and stop being so defensive. If >> everyone was to act as you do this list would be one giant flame war. >> What are you even being defensive about? I am honestly having a hard >> time deciphering your response? His first response was a very >> logical and well thought out observation. >> >> Have some respect... >> >> aLEKs >> >> >> >> On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >> >>> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your upper >>> class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >>> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your >>> white academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee >>> deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk to >>> me! >>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best >>>> misguided. >>>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others >>>> trash... >>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>>>> what a strange rant... >>>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of >>>>> being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they >>>>> make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to >>>>> make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they >>>>> will probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in >>>>> buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do >>>>> thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to >>>>> stay engaged with society in order to help change it yes. this is >>>>> a realists approach. will they minimize all this...most likely, as >>>>> best thay can. >>>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern >>>>> world and try to communicate the information they have and >>>>> coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods >>>>> in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable activism, >>>>> but we all know how well that turned out for the unabomber and all >>>>> concerned. >>>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it >>>>> calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in >>>>> general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public >>>>> image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to >>>>> accomplish that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and >>>>> stays focused on the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski >>>>> method? >>>>> xe >>>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if >>>>> they do >>>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want >>>>> to spin >>>>> things that way any how... >>>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>>>> rather then against.. >>>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who >>>>> IBM >>>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are >>>>> holier >>>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what >>>>> powers >>>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take >>>>> the >>>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it >>>>> pisses me >>>>> off!!! >>>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>>> --- >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> ============================ >>>>> www.phoniq.net >>>>> releases available on: >>>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>>> publication: >>>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> -- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the >>>>> RV." >>>>> __________________________________________________ >>>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>>> ============================ >>>> www.phoniq.net >>>> releases available on: >>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>> publication: >>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the >>>> RV." >>>> __________________________________________________ >>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>> ============================ >>> www.phoniq.net >>> releases available on: >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>> publication: >>> www.vagueterrain.net >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 20:18:53 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41138-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:18:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:18:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 63931 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:22:43 +0000 Received: (qmail 63918 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:22:43 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:20:43 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx his responce was extreemly condisending... towards me and towards any one else that might think diffeently then he does... On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not see how it > can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite actually. You need to > relax and stop being so defensive. If everyone was to act as you do this > list would be one giant flame war. What are you even being defensive about? > I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your response? His first > response was a very logical and well thought out observation. > > Have some respect... > > aLEKs > > > > On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >> >> >> oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your upper class >> white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! >> its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white >> academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee deep in tear >> gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk to me! >> >> >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >> >>> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best >>> misguided. >>> >>> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>> >>> its not a wierd rant at all... >>> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others >>> trash... >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >>> >>>> what a strange rant... >>>> >>>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of being >>>> "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they make thier >>>> peace with the compromises they know they will have to make somewhere >>>> around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will probably have to >>>> use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes >>>> they will use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic >>>> technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help >>>> change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they minimize all >>>> this...most likely, as best thay can. >>>> >>>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world and >>>> try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier >>>> campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet your >>>> peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how well that >>>> turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. >>>> >>>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it calls >>>> attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in general. >>>> targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public image that it >>>> doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish that goal. at >>>> least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or do >>>> you prefer the kaczynski method? >>>> >>>> xe >>>> >>>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they >>>> do >>>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to spin >>>> things that way any how... >>>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>>> rather then against.. >>>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM >>>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are holier >>>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers >>>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the >>>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses me >>>> off!!! >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>>> >>>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>>> >>>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>>> >>>>> and now Apple?... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>>> not talk about >>>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>>> progressive European >>>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>>> >>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> ============================ >>>> www.phoniq.net >>>> releases available on: >>>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>>> publication: >>>> www.vagueterrain.net >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." >>>> __________________________________________________ >>>> Do You Yahoo!? >>>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>> >>> ============================ >>> www.phoniq.net >>> releases available on: >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>> publication: >>> www.vagueterrain.net >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." >>> __________________________________________________ >>> Do You Yahoo!? >>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>> http://mail.yahoo.com >> >> ============================ >> www.phoniq.net >> releases available on: >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >> publication: >> www.vagueterrain.net >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 20:16:47 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41137-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:16:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:16:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 62444 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:20:33 +0000 Received: (qmail 62433 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:20:33 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:16:35 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple X-Originating-IP: 69.3.155.10 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.123) by wfilter2.us4.outblaze.com; 27 Dec 2006 20:16:35 -0000 X-Originating-Server: ws1-3a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Is there any recordings of these computes being smashed? Anything? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "aleks vasic" <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple > Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:06:51 -0500 > > > You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not > see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite > actually. You need to relax and stop being so defensive. If > everyone was to act as you do this list would be one giant flame > war. What are you even being defensive about? I am honestly > having a hard time deciphering your response? His first response > was a very logical and well thought out observation. > > Have some respect... > > aLEKs > > > > On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > > > > > oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your > > upper class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! > > its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your > > white academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee > > deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come > > talk to me! > > > > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > > > >> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at > >> best misguided. > >> > >> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > >> > >> its not a wierd rant at all... > >> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others > >> trash... > >> > >> > >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > >> > >>> what a strange rant... > >>> > >>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions > >>> of being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism > >>> and they make thier peace with the compromises they know they > >>> will have to make somewhere around thier sophmore year at > >>> college. yes, they will probably have to use cars, yes they > >>> will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes they will > >>> use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic > >>> technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in > >>> order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. will > >>> they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. > >>> > >>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern > >>> world and try to communicate the information they have and > >>> coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the > >>> woods in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable > >>> activism, but we all know how well that turned out for the > >>> unabomber and all concerned. > >>> > >>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way > >>> it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from > >>> computers in general. targeting the company with the most > >>> eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems an > >>> effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is done > >>> with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or do you > >>> prefer the kaczynski method? > >>> > >>> xe > >>> > >>> Neil Wiernik wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they do > >>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to spin > >>> things that way any how... > >>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... > >>> rather then against.. > >>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM > >>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are holier > >>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers > >>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... > >>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the > >>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses me > >>> off!!! > >>> > >>> > >>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: > >>> > >>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing > >>>> specific companies then making a POINT > >>>> > >>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, > >>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. > >>>> > >>>> and now Apple?... > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why > >>>>> not talk about > >>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the > >>>>> problem, and work for > >>>>>> enacting national legislation following the > >>>>> progressive European > >>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company > >>>>> seems gratuitous... > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Send instant messages to your online friends > >>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > >>>> > >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- - > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> ============================ > >>> www.phoniq.net > >>> releases available on: > >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >>> publication: > >>> www.vagueterrain.net > >>> > >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > >>> __________________________________________________ > >>> Do You Yahoo!? > >>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > >>> http://mail.yahoo.com > >> > >> ============================ > >> www.phoniq.net > >> releases available on: > >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >> publication: > >> www.vagueterrain.net > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> website: http://www.microsound.org > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > >> __________________________________________________ > >> Do You Yahoo!? > >> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > >> http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > ============================ > > www.phoniq.net > > releases available on: > > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > > publication: > > www.vagueterrain.net > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 20:07:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41136-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:07:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:07:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 56893 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:10:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 56883 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:10:50 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:06:51 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx You are a crass individual. His rationale is logical and i do not see how it can be misconstrued as overbearing, just the opposite actually. You need to relax and stop being so defensive. If everyone was to act as you do this list would be one giant flame war. What are you even being defensive about? I am honestly having a hard time deciphering your response? His first response was a very logical and well thought out observation. Have some respect... aLEKs On Dec 27, 2006, at 3:01 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your upper > class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! > its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white > academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee deep in > tear gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk to me! > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > >> it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best >> misguided. >> >> Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> >> its not a wierd rant at all... >> its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others >> trash... >> >> >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: >> >>> what a strange rant... >>> >>> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of >>> being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they >>> make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to >>> make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will >>> probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings >>> made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do thier work with >>> wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to stay engaged with >>> society in order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. >>> will they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. >>> >>> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world >>> and try to communicate the information they have and coordinate >>> thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to >>> meet your peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all >>> know how well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. >>> >>> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it >>> calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in >>> general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public >>> image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to >>> accomplish that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and stays >>> focused on the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski method? >>> >>> xe >>> >>> Neil Wiernik wrote: >>> >>> >>> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if >>> they do >>> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to >>> spin >>> things that way any how... >>> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >>> rather then against.. >>> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who >>> IBM >>> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are >>> holier >>> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what >>> powers >>> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >>> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take >>> the >>> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it >>> pisses me >>> off!!! >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >>> >>>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>>> specific companies then making a POINT >>>> >>>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>>> >>>> and now Apple?... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>>> not talk about >>>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>>> problem, and work for >>>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>>> progressive European >>>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>>> seems gratuitous... >>>> >>>> >>>> Send instant messages to your online friends >>>> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>>> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>>> >>>> >>> >>> ============================ >>> www.phoniq.net >>> releases available on: >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>> publication: >>> www.vagueterrain.net >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the >>> RV." >>> __________________________________________________ >>> Do You Yahoo!? >>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>> http://mail.yahoo.com >> >> ============================ >> www.phoniq.net >> releases available on: >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >> publication: >> www.vagueterrain.net >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> >> >> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the >> RV." >> __________________________________________________ >> Do You Yahoo!? >> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >> http://mail.yahoo.com > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 19:59:58 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41135-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:59:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:59:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 51988 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:03:48 +0000 Received: (qmail 51978 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:03:47 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 15:01:48 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx oh shut up and put a sock in it no one here wants to hear your upper class white bread mombo jumbo!!! pretentious twit! its so simple to speak from the ivory tower hidding behind your white academic elephant... try getting into the thick of it knee deep in tear gas, police sticks and rubber bullets then come talk to me! On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best misguided. > > Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > its not a wierd rant at all... > its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others > trash... > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > >> what a strange rant... >> >> yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. >> >> i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world and try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. >> >> this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski method? >> >> xe >> >> Neil Wiernik wrote: >> >> >> the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they do >> they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to spin >> things that way any how... >> why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... >> rather then against.. >> Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM >> helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are holier >> then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers >> thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... >> I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the >> time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses me >> off!!! >> >> >> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: >> >>> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >>> specific companies then making a POINT >>> >>> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >>> Esso etc. etc. etc. >>> >>> and now Apple?... >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>>> not talk about >>>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>>> problem, and work for >>>>> enacting national legislation following the >>>> progressive European >>>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>>> seems gratuitous... >>> >>> >>> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >> >> ============================ >> www.phoniq.net >> releases available on: >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >> publication: >> www.vagueterrain.net >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> >> >> "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." >> __________________________________________________ >> Do You Yahoo!? >> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >> http://mail.yahoo.com > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 19:28:13 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41134-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:28:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:28:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 37157 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:32:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 37147 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:31:59 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 11:28:02 -0800 (PST) From: xe non <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_uCjmkWskGzPsWk7wemmmHg)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=gp5uZ1GWXUkFGQdVLtK7kBUISxRugbwFALGGXpb7y27+GdfEvbGCEHNAmMt+pHKGlsf1aiDYTkT+ih+dibEC6XoHboX2PXX7XvzEcVf2lx27iXXlxKinDxt/wSC9JTxrdkCQtwIXGNzI3L1RPpKyCLibDuznvR+vCUJpRTHuGG4=; X-YMail-OSG: xh5ZDUQVM1mplEtxtEuvtO.j9X1EnOJuyHpe52mZ2xudCh4npo_kpKaS9ux6HodHNQ-- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_uCjmkWskGzPsWk7wemmmHg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit it drastically oversimplifies the situation which makes it at best misguided. Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: its not a wierd rant at all... its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others trash... On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > what a strange rant... > > yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. > > i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world and try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. > > this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski method? > > xe > > Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they do > they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to spin > things that way any how... > why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... > rather then against.. > Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM > helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are holier > then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers > thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... > I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the > time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses me > off!!! > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: > >> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >> specific companies then making a POINT >> >> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >> Esso etc. etc. etc. >> >> and now Apple?... >> >> >> >> >> >> >>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>> not talk about >>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>> problem, and work for >>>> enacting national legislation following the >>> progressive European >>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>> seems gratuitous... >> >> >> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --Boundary_(ID_uCjmkWskGzPsWk7wemmmHg)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 19:21:00 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41133-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:21:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:20:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 32571 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:24:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 32557 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:24:41 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:22:42 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx its not a wierd rant at all... its basic look in your own trash can before complaining about others trash... On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, xe non wrote: > what a strange rant... > > yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. > > i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world and try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. > > this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski method? > > xe > > Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they do > they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to spin > things that way any how... > why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... > rather then against.. > Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM > helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are holier > then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers > thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... > I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the > time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses me > off!!! > > > On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: > >> unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing >> specific companies then making a POINT >> >> e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, >> Esso etc. etc. etc. >> >> and now Apple?... >> >> >> >> >> >> >>>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >>> not talk about >>>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >>> problem, and work for >>>> enacting national legislation following the >>> progressive European >>>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >>> seems gratuitous... >> >> >> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 19:17:54 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41132-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:17:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:17:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 30438 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:21:43 +0000 Received: (qmail 30417 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:21:41 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 12:15:37 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230905c1b87697dc99@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if >they do they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they >want to spin things that way any how... >why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... not to mention they are deploying an online campaign! doh! >I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take >the time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it >pisses me off!!! totally! cheers John --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 19:08:18 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41131-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:08:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 14:08:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 24212 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:11:59 +0000 Received: (qmail 24202 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:11:59 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 11:08:02 -0800 (PST) From: xe non <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_dP2fHqK0bNuUohgcX2jF6A)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=zC3/YKznzRwzWtrLtAnGoebVHcZXLPeYoPGBUoz5WbJmXt0mp8QOwdwrGzWUn0RbCg93PpL3B1RoUxU25rJL7P1FmE9aw4nzjtUbqFuW0vuqu802CKe/XsvyrD29dMmz5E0joRDqIE9VMxWH3WYmMq/E6FWcBco5GKco4gfBJhc=; X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_dP2fHqK0bNuUohgcX2jF6A) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit what a strange rant... yes, every environmentalist struggles with the contradictions of being "in the world" when it comes to effective activism and they make thier peace with the compromises they know they will have to make somewhere around thier sophmore year at college. yes, they will probably have to use cars, yes they will have to live in buildings made with wood, yes they will use electricity and do thier work with wasteful and toxic technology...if they choose to stay engaged with society in order to help change it yes. this is a realists approach. will they minimize all this...most likely, as best thay can. i suppose greenpeace could eschew all the tools of the modern world and try to communicate the information they have and coordinate thier campaigns from a computerless shack in the woods in order to meet your peerless standards for acceptable activism, but we all know how well that turned out for the unabomber and all concerned. this campaign is an unusually refreshing for the effective way it calls attention to the problem of toxic waste from computers in general. targeting the company with the most eco-friendly public image that it doesnt live up to, seems an effective way to accomplish that goal. at least it is done with good-humour and stays focused on the problem, or do you prefer the kaczynski method? xe Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they do they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to spin things that way any how... why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... rather then against.. Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are holier then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses me off!!! On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: > unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing > specific companies then making a POINT > > e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, > Esso etc. etc. etc. > > and now Apple?... > > > > > > >>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >> not talk about >>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >> problem, and work for >>> enacting national legislation following the >> progressive European >>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >> seems gratuitous... > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org "The man from Afghanistan has made some significant changes to the RV." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --Boundary_(ID_dP2fHqK0bNuUohgcX2jF6A)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 18:15:24 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41130-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 13:15:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 13:15:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 96404 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 18:19:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 96391 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 18:19:13 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 13:17:14 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx the larger question is does green peace use computers at all as if they do they to are part of the problem and not the solution if they want to spin things that way any how... why dont they look at how computers as a whole work for them... rather then against.. Im sure they use a fine number of IBM products and we all know who IBM helped in world war 2... i think rather then talkign like they are holier then now they need to look in thier own back yards.. I mean what powers thier boats GAS who makes the GAS... I am a political person but when grassroot organisations dont take the time to look in their own back yard before pointing fingers it pisses me off!!! On Wed, 27 Dec 2006, Steffan De Turck wrote: > unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing > specific companies then making a POINT > > e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, > Esso etc. etc. etc. > > and now Apple?... > > > > > > >>> It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why >> not talk about >>> all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the >> problem, and work for >>> enacting national legislation following the >> progressive European >>> lead in this area? Targeting a single company >> seems gratuitous... > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 17:54:40 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41129-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 12:54:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 12:54:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 86160 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:58:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 86143 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:58:17 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:54:19 +0000 (GMT) From: Steffan De Turck <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=1/M0t/bv2ZTMrdXMLjC1wi9tKLtWktct3R4Y4QlVvNhchVPfV0+dx97jGPU31f2RhVFst5NdfIvO4TP2TSKK7nN/71qwVhzebvquU0qb5PzRIMk2TZDPObj2wrZUZj1lvb3vOKpFh9xPO7zYmFvEMHklfzJGMZTOyW8+w3WQ8p0=; X-YMail-OSG: kayZVuEVM1l9Shh0IwpkjkOjMI.YDBaW88nJ1tzOoRWy38M5I5my9hMfrpCbaZ54vzVGpoedoIN33vE5Pv0PQDqPf7hLBojYUhOSM421ABKr5o2c2cJLSihCVzAwT5tf7Hrk0XQ0R52t2OQ- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx unfortunately Greenpeace is more about demonizing specific companies then making a POINT e.g. Shell instead of Exxon Mobile, BP, Q8, Texaco, Esso etc. etc. etc. and now Apple?... > > It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why > not talk about > > all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the > problem, and work for > > enacting national legislation following the > progressive European > > lead in this area? Targeting a single company > seems gratuitous... Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 17:51:35 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41128-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 27 Dec 2006 12:51:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 12:51:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 84115 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:55:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 84102 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:55:23 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 09:48:58 -0800 From: shift8 <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Network Attached Storage In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.x.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.6.1 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx use a few of these cheap ones: http://www.nextag.com/external-raid/search-html throw a good multichannel controller (or multiple single channel cards.) in a linux box. ether stitch them together w/ lvm or make a raid of them w/ the controller card if it supports it (interesting benefits w/ that to) or both. export w/ nfs or smb and there's a good, cheap, dense nas. happy solstice-oriented holiday of your preference! On Sun, 2006-12-24 at 16:01 -0600, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Hi everyone~ > > I'm looking for some advice and opinions regarding Network Attached > Storage. I've already filled two external hard drives with various > audio/visual materials of mine, and am needing to grow. So far I've looked > at a few options and the best price I can find is a Buffalo Technology > 2.0TB TerraStation for about $1000 US. > > My question really is, how many of you rely upon such a device to back up > your data, and how do you go about shopping for one? > > Thanks for any help, and have a happy holiday season. > > ~Kyle > -- Mechanize something idiosyncratic. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 01:37:59 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41127-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 26 Dec 2006 20:37:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 26 Dec 2006 20:37:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 90455 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 01:41:46 +0000 Received: (qmail 90443 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 01:41:46 +0000 Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2006 20:37:53 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple X-Originating-IP: 68.49.52.232 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.37) by wfilter2.us4.outblaze.com; 27 Dec 2006 01:37:53 -0000 X-Originating-Server: ws1-2a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx How is this considered to be microsound? Is there something there we can do as a project? Derek > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John Hopkins" <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple > Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2006 18:15:04 -0700 > > > > see also: > > > > http://www.rebootcanada.ca/index_html.html > > do a google on "computer recycling" hazardous e-waste > > >> Hi all > >> > >> check out the link and take part! > >> Happy New ear > >> love Le chong > >> > >> http://www.greenpeace.org/apple/ > > It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why not talk about > all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the problem, and work for > enacting national legislation following the progressive European > lead in this area? Targeting a single company seems gratuitous... > > > jh > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 01:28:22 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41126-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 26 Dec 2006 20:28:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 26 Dec 2006 20:28:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 87226 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 01:32:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 87215 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 01:32:08 +0000 Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2006 18:15:04 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230901c1b778294382@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >see also: > >http://www.rebootcanada.ca/index_html.html do a google on "computer recycling" hazardous e-waste >>Hi all >> >>check out the link and take part! >>Happy New ear >>love Le chong >> >>http://www.greenpeace.org/apple/ It seems a bit too trendy a campaign for me -- why not talk about all PC manufacturers, the full scope of the problem, and work for enacting national legislation following the progressive European lead in this area? Targeting a single company seems gratuitous... jh --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 27 00:03:27 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41125-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 26 Dec 2006 19:03:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 26 Dec 2006 19:03:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 60189 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 00:07:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 60179 invoked from network); Wed, 27 Dec 2006 00:07:12 +0000 Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2006 19:03:19 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx see also: http://www.rebootcanada.ca/index_html.html for more on computers and recycling. On 26-Dec-06, at 6:22 PM, <xxxx-xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> <jean- xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Hi all > > check out the link and take part! > Happy New ear > love Le chong > > http://www.greenpeace.org/apple/ > > > http://www.idealrecordings.com > http://www.seams.nu/ > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 26 23:23:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41124-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 26 Dec 2006 18:23:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 26 Dec 2006 18:23:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 44137 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 26 Dec 2006 23:26:41 +0000 Received: (qmail 44122 invoked from network); Tue, 26 Dec 2006 23:26:40 +0000 Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 00:22:46 +0100 From: xxxx-xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: [microsound] Greenpeace and apple To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Openwave WebEngine, version 2.8.18 (webedge20-101-1108-20050216) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hi all check out the link and take part! Happy New ear love Le chong http://www.greenpeace.org/apple/ http://www.idealrecordings.com http://www.seams.nu/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 24 23:26:16 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41123-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 24 Dec 2006 18:26:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 18:26:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 29411 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:29:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 29401 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:29:51 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 15:27:07 -0800 From: Eric Dannewitz <xxxxxxxx@xxxx-xxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Network Attached Storage In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx-xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: bgBTA4kVM1mERAqy.9xSVnbuLdJtDC_aruT6pOe84zX5D1mFlJXDmi5rZJ2ukK9SR8E.dXb9n7f.Qj3QYe4ip8vtRQFCVBdmyQQAaE1s4FBmux1RTF1XaflwpKsMrMz7FnNwrdRHmFKDGcP_vyO6uovogIK7l85kkVWc8K1qpofWVakTt9rapaucX7P_ X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I'd avoid the terrastation. Not expandable, and shoddy support. Look at the Infrant ReadyNAS NV. They are a company that is adding features all the time, SATA drive support, expandable RAID, and soon to be breaking the 2 Terrabyte limit. So, you can have 4 750gig drives (or bigger in the future) in the machine. Great Mac and PC support as well. I have a 1 Terrabyte one (RAID 5ed, its around 650+ gigabytes). Great unit. Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Hi everyone~ > > I'm looking for some advice and opinions regarding Network Attached > Storage. I've already filled two external hard drives with various > audio/visual materials of mine, and am needing to grow. So far I've > looked > at a few options and the best price I can find is a Buffalo Technology > 2.0TB TerraStation for about $1000 US. > > My question really is, how many of you rely upon such a device to back up > your data, and how do you go about shopping for one? > > Thanks for any help, and have a happy holiday season. > > ~Kyle > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 24 22:08:56 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41122-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:08:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:08:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 96740 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 22:12:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 96729 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 22:12:29 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:08:41 +0100 From: pachinkostudio <xxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Network Attached Storage In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on 00250.ve.carpathiahost.net X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.5.0.7 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=7.0 tests=none autolearn=ham version=2.63 Hi Kyle, you may also consider building your own NAS starting from a second hand or old pc, installing a gigabit card and a raid controller. Give a look at FreeNAS: http://www.freenas.org/ ale*** -- http://www.pachinkostudio.com Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Hi everyone~ > > I'm looking for some advice and opinions regarding Network Attached > Storage. I've already filled two external hard drives with various > audio/visual materials of mine, and am needing to grow. So far I've looked > at a few options and the best price I can find is a Buffalo Technology > 2.0TB TerraStation for about $1000 US. > > My question really is, how many of you rely upon such a device to back up > your data, and how do you go about shopping for one? > > Thanks for any help, and have a happy holiday season. > > ~Kyle > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 24 22:02:11 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41121-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:02:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:02:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 91249 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 22:05:40 +0000 Received: (qmail 91168 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 22:05:38 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:01:55 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Network Attached Storage To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_LWrc0V239u558y29bfXBrw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=RrWeBiNqnob0l4tZejb5+qMBLK7R0RR0/Dac5ScTU0vMA1Uejdytn/vRGktcobSMqrwfBiq9gCkZurImDKHAk2pjPzdod1IInwCNY4+l8FkmIlRNlm5AKR0oc4R5IxsXUbiFv2r5YDymZ6A7Z0HEdOvQoOd5rAl7rdm+VS3JjIw= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_LWrc0V239u558y29bfXBrw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everyone~ I'm looking for some advice and opinions regarding Network Attached Storage. I've already filled two external hard drives with various audio/visual materials of mine, and am needing to grow. So far I've looked at a few options and the best price I can find is a Buffalo Technology 2.0TB TerraStation for about $1000 US. My question really is, how many of you rely upon such a device to back up your data, and how do you go about shopping for one? Thanks for any help, and have a happy holiday season. ~Kyle -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_LWrc0V239u558y29bfXBrw)-- From ???@??? Sun Dec 24 16:12:49 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41120-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 24 Dec 2006 11:12:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 11:12:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 8143 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:16:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 8132 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:16:15 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 11:12:35 -0500 From: Quintus Frimschlowder VIII <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Happenings in New York To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=LoS9gDnD2+Um9GSs1kf44XFL8QPUAU5rVNg1JxrUv21TtL9hjInEFROvUOszJ9SrvAR4y7GEiHN9GfuiWZsgYbE1vRVrf+tahC+VCnRygsuSw/v60Q4O/yDDttrAc7pRHgj5mzLBkqClYPDOgq1OiEOr8QAtomYKusc/BF1YcWw= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Can anyone point me towards some interesting events going on in New York between now and the 29th? Obviously there The Stone. If anyone knows of other cool happenings, tips would be highly appreciated. Thanks much! Brendan --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 24 00:28:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41119-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:28:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:28:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 64222 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:31:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 64207 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:31:29 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 01:28:41 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <010001c726f2$76e63d10$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <00ce01c726eb$34a53200$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> <00db01c726ee$624ace10$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> <00fa01c726f1$14d3d7f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Ok, now last link before christmas: Author Kurt Vonnegut interviewed by host John Hockenberry, live from Second Life for the national, weekly public radio program. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2140455044291565033&q=vonnegut&hl=en or http://snipurl.com/15p3b /Björn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 1:18 AM Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life > Well, and how late was I?... looks like Suzanne Vega already performed > there at Second Life in september. Link to blog posting and YouTube film > of "the event". > http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/2006/08/audience-with-suzanne-vega.html > > /Björn > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 12:59 AM > Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life > > >> Well, sent this wrong but it could aswell go here too... >> I think this is rather interesting as Second Life seems to have the >> potential to be the forum for future virtual concerts and audio-visual >> happenings. I have been visiting Second Life, first I was quiet >> disappointed as this also seems to be very much commercial oriented with >> the usual adult stuff around, but on another visit there (and thru some >> guiding from more experienced Second Life users) I maybe think there can >> be some useful and interesting things to do there. >> >> Yours, >> Björn Eriksson >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >> To: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >> Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 12:36 AM >> Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life >> >> >>> Robbie Dingo is should spell... and here is his blog: >>> http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/ >>> >>> Seems to be music and sound oriented second lifer. >>> >>> Yours, >>> Björn >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "emanuele de raymondi" <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >>>> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> >>>> Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2006 7:32 PM >>>> Subject: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life >>>> >>>> >>>>>I thought this was pretty interesting...any comments? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.slatenight.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=40 >>>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 24 00:27:04 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41118-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:27:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:27:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 63163 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:30:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 63150 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:30:34 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 01:26:50 +0100 From: =?ISO-8859-15?Q?pirand=E8lo?= <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life In-reply-to: <00fa01c726f1$14d3d7f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <00ce01c726eb$34a53200$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> <00db01c726ee$624ace10$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> <00fa01c726f1$14d3d7f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Dec 2006 00:26:52.0414 (UTC) FILETIME=[3574D9E0:01C726F2] something interesting about music and second life: http://www.myfirstsecondlife.com/articles/music-in-sl-it.html Björn Eriksson ha scritto: > Well, and how late was I?... looks like Suzanne Vega already performed > there at Second Life in september. Link to blog posting and YouTube > film of "the event". > http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/2006/08/audience-with-suzanne-vega.html > > /Björn > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 12:59 AM > Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life > > >> Well, sent this wrong but it could aswell go here too... >> I think this is rather interesting as Second Life seems to have the >> potential to be the forum for future virtual concerts and >> audio-visual happenings. I have been visiting Second Life, first I >> was quiet disappointed as this also seems to be very much commercial >> oriented with the usual adult stuff around, but on another visit >> there (and thru some guiding from more experienced Second Life users) >> I maybe think there can be some useful and interesting things to do >> there. >> >> Yours, >> Björn Eriksson >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >> To: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >> Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 12:36 AM >> Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life >> >> >>> Robbie Dingo is should spell... and here is his blog: >>> http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/ >>> >>> Seems to be music and sound oriented second lifer. >>> >>> Yours, >>> Björn >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "emanuele de raymondi" >>>> <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >>>> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> >>>> Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2006 7:32 PM >>>> Subject: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life >>>> >>>> >>>>> I thought this was pretty interesting...any comments? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.slatenight.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=40 >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 24 00:18:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41117-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:18:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:18:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 58006 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:21:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 57996 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:21:35 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 01:18:47 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <00fa01c726f1$14d3d7f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <00ce01c726eb$34a53200$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> <00db01c726ee$624ace10$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Well, and how late was I?... looks like Suzanne Vega already performed there at Second Life in september. Link to blog posting and YouTube film of "the event". http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/2006/08/audience-with-suzanne-vega.html /Björn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 12:59 AM Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life > Well, sent this wrong but it could aswell go here too... > I think this is rather interesting as Second Life seems to have the > potential to be the forum for future virtual concerts and audio-visual > happenings. I have been visiting Second Life, first I was quiet > disappointed as this also seems to be very much commercial oriented with > the usual adult stuff around, but on another visit there (and thru some > guiding from more experienced Second Life users) I maybe think there can > be some useful and interesting things to do there. > > Yours, > Björn Eriksson > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > To: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 12:36 AM > Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life > > >> Robbie Dingo is should spell... and here is his blog: >> http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/ >> >> Seems to be music and sound oriented second lifer. >> >> Yours, >> Björn >> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "emanuele de raymondi" <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >>> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> >>> Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2006 7:32 PM >>> Subject: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life >>> >>> >>>>I thought this was pretty interesting...any comments? >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.slatenight.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=40 >>>> >>> >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 23 23:58:49 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41116-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 18:58:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 18:58:48 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 50874 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:02:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 50857 invoked from network); Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:02:16 +0000 Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:59:29 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <00db01c726ee$624ace10$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <00ce01c726eb$34a53200$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Well, sent this wrong but it could aswell go here too... I think this is rather interesting as Second Life seems to have the potential to be the forum for future virtual concerts and audio-visual happenings. I have been visiting Second Life, first I was quiet disappointed as this also seems to be very much commercial oriented with the usual adult stuff around, but on another visit there (and thru some guiding from more experienced Second Life users) I maybe think there can be some useful and interesting things to do there. Yours, Björn Eriksson ----- Original Message ----- From: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: "Björn Eriksson" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Sent: Sunday, December 24, 2006 12:36 AM Subject: Re: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life > Robbie Dingo is should spell... and here is his blog: > http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/ > > Seems to be music and sound oriented second lifer. > > Yours, > Björn > >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "emanuele de raymondi" <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> >> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> >> Sent: Saturday, December 23, 2006 7:32 PM >> Subject: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life >> >> >>>I thought this was pretty interesting...any comments? >>> >>> >>> http://www.slatenight.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=40 >>> >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 23 22:49:42 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41115-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 17:49:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 17:49:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 26380 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 22:53:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 26370 invoked from network); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 22:53:08 +0000 Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 14:48:00 -0800 From: JC <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] The Manipulation of Chromatic Alien Dancers - An Interactive Flash Sound Installation X-Originating-IP: 69.181.225.103 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <0c2601c726e4$67c98ed0$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2739.300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_l9ejaVufd6TnkynWQ6MrBw)" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=pCHtP9eNC2aI7MyJ2G3kIhDsAr4pS4mfTYcpK+GR0eB2XPy8GMOaJcVz/UCkZpnv; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; X-ELNK-Trace: 250e53821a8c36f54d2b10475b571120ce4b60d77d89c857e91bf1c8913e88a73122699149cfe979350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_l9ejaVufd6TnkynWQ6MrBw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The trail begins by clicking on the link below: http://www.deconstructionist.com/chromatic.htm (Give the page some time to load as there are several small flash objects in it.) Sound and graphics by Kyron and Etanna Programming by Kyron Feel free to forward the link to anyone that you think might enjoy it. JC Mendizabal Black Note Music -- Energized Sound Creations -- http://www.blacknotemusic.com --Boundary_(ID_l9ejaVufd6TnkynWQ6MrBw)-- From ???@??? Sat Dec 23 18:32:13 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41114-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 13:32:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 13:32:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31634 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 18:35:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 31622 invoked from network); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 18:35:36 +0000 Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 13:32:00 -0500 From: emanuele de raymondi <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Sound Installation in Second Life To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_jGpEIyPPB6mf2a550FoucQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=G8MpTexUjsMRwJUugwTgCRBKfs6I54hwgQ0dliDi5eZia2c5NuJbIWyzzU3mcS9WQ1VNGjt6Tqkud1GrsgP9pOPBXBtQYwHxlX/lgo5loMT4gATl0jAJJAxnNM7wIcKYXEUVEvmidi5Ct3Lt7B9TvXClN09JufHtglfYA/16YCM= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_jGpEIyPPB6mf2a550FoucQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I thought this was pretty interesting...any comments? http://www.slatenight.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=61&Itemid=40 --Boundary_(ID_jGpEIyPPB6mf2a550FoucQ)-- From ???@??? Sat Dec 23 17:24:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41113-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 12:24:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 12:24:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 6753 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 17:27:27 +0000 Received: (qmail 6743 invoked from network); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 17:27:26 +0000 Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 18:23:49 +0100 From: Sergi Valverde <x@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hola Hector, i´ve made some recordings using 24 bits /96 khz with apparently no slutterly problems, at least in 5 minutes recording. Using in 24bits/96 khz with Rode Nt4 and phantom ( with no external pre-amp ), i can listen a small beep produced by phantom. I upload a sample with H4 48v phantom power and high inputs and another one using NT 4 battery ( no phantom ). http://www.sergivalverde.net/MicPhantom.wav http://www.sergivalverde.net/MicPlugin.wav Else, I upload a sample of my test with phantom power. It´s a slow water trickle, that requires the record level inputs at high level ( 127 ). In the middle of the recording water stops and you can listen the same beep than MicPhantom.wav. but i can´t listen when sound is recorded. http://www.sergivalverde.net/STE-001.wav please compare yourself. saludos sergi El 23/12/2006, a las 6:38, Hector Centeno escribió: > Sergi(o?), > > I read in some reviews that using the phantom power and setting the > record level to very high (in a quiet room) you can hear a constant > beeping. I even remember finding an audio file someone posted with it. > Do you get something like this? I'm planning to buy an affordable > portable recorded and I'm still debating between this one or the > Microtrack. > > Thanks! > > Saludos, > > > Hector > > > On 12/22/06, Sergi Valverde <x@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> i buought one last week from Soundprofessionals with a >> Soundprofessional SP-8 mic Preamp. >> >> The Built-In Mics are acceptable ( at least for me ) , but much >> better with my Rode nt4 and an external Preamp. >> >> I dont´ test it in 24 bits mode yet but, this weekend i will .... >> >> saludos >> >> s >> >> >> >> >> but i´don´t test it in 24 bits mode yet. >> El 22/12/2006, a las 2:38, Aaron Ximm escribió: >> >> >> it compares and contrasts all the newest units... i also think >> korg >> >> is coming out w/ a new one soon too... >> > >> > Korg is coming out with two DSD-based recorders, which have looked >> > nice at >> > shows but as yet are untested. >> > >> > xxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx >> > quietamerican.org >> > >> > | quod omne animal post | >> > | cogitum est triste... | >> > >> > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> > website: http://www.microsound.org >> > >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 23 16:37:35 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41112-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 11:37:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 11:37:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 92053 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 16:41:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 92043 invoked from network); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 16:41:01 +0000 Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 10:36:43 -0600 From: Rob Danielson <xxxx@xxx.xxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230904c1b308688f18@[172.16.1.34]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_N/s5IZzpSJjhWTE332XYoA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_N/s5IZzpSJjhWTE332XYoA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I got the beep when recording at 44.1/16 and 48K/24 -- not at 24/96. One should be able to discern some other performance factors in the below A/B test with a Sound Devices 722 and an Art/Hi-MD Combo all using the same very low noise mics: http://www.uwm.edu/~type/audio-art-tech-gallery/mediafiles/H4_744_NH700_Compare_Sm.mov 8.1 mb QuickTime movie test. Use VLC if you don't have a QT 5 plug or later. Note that the test was aimed at high gain applications like recording ambience in quieter locations. I have a test comparing the H4's built-in mics to electret mics commonly used ith PIP mic input of HiMD recorder in the works. In my first run through the material, the H4 had the most noise. Rob D. At 12:38 AM -0500 12/23/06, Hector Centeno wrote: >Sergi(o?), > >I read in some reviews that using the phantom power and setting the >record level to very high (in a quiet room) you can hear a constant >beeping. I even remember finding an audio file someone posted with it. >Do you get something like this? I'm planning to buy an affordable >portable recorded and I'm still debating between this one or the >Microtrack. > >Thanks! > >Saludos, > > >Hector > > >On 12/22/06, Sergi Valverde <x@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>i buought one last week from Soundprofessionals with a >>Soundprofessional SP-8 mic Preamp. >> >>The Built-In Mics are acceptable ( at least for me ) , but much >>better with my Rode nt4 and an external Preamp. >> >>I dont´ test it in 24 bits mode yet but, this weekend i will .... >> >>saludos >> >>s >> >> >> >> >>but i´don´t test it in 24 bits mode yet. >>El 22/12/2006, a las 2:38, Aaron Ximm escribió: >> >>>> it compares and contrasts all the newest units... i also think korg >>>> is coming out w/ a new one soon too... >>> >>> Korg is coming out with two DSD-based recorders, which have looked >>> nice at >>> shows but as yet are untested. >>> >>> xxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx >>> quietamerican.org >>> >>> | quod omne animal post | >>> | cogitum est triste... | >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >> >> >>--------------------------------------------------------------------- >>To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>website: http://www.microsound.org >> > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >website: http://www.microsound.org -- Rob Danielson Peck School of the Arts University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee http://www.uwm.edu/~type/audio-art-tech-gallery/ --Boundary_(ID_N/s5IZzpSJjhWTE332XYoA)-- From ???@??? Sat Dec 23 07:29:53 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41111-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 02:29:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 02:29:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 14034 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 07:33:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 14021 invoked from network); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 07:33:15 +0000 Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 08:30:11 +0100 From: Adern <xxx.xxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] 2006 Playlist In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Sylpheed-Claws 1.0.4 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-pc-linux-gnu) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Scanned: with antispam and antivirus automated system at libero.it X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:26:48 -0500, a Bad Day on the Midway, aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote: > Albums released this year, or albums discovered/purchased/acquired this > year by list members? > > I have stumbled upon a lot of older releases this year that i have > flipped on, The Southern Lord label comes to mind. I chose albums released this year also because there would be too much records on the line. Obviously some of the best records i have acquired this year were not released this year. It's the problem of all lists. -- ( mailto: xxxxx@xxxxxx.xx )) http://digilander.iol.it/adern (GnuPG key available on url) |""|-. fingerprint = CE38 820C F54A 8BBB 114E ED43 EC64 0180 13B6 55B4 |__|-' "Sometimes in a fight it's best to just stay down" (A. Innes) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 23 05:38:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41110-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 23 Dec 2006 00:38:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 00:38:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 75227 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 05:42:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 75215 invoked from network); Sat, 23 Dec 2006 05:42:02 +0000 Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 00:38:31 -0500 From: Hector Centeno <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=U5aRhpc5Iip+PGUDq0q1NzfW02Z4pRY/5v0NxWoAayaTT5Cgqjenim8qdNk1mq9ogYXKE4ejqzAQskAhONhjPlgdWC1J1tVTuqH+GMOUurI+fNbz16JJ6/aTrqTwlufwFF8YISMGY3Ex48j+kJzRtxuE9hgzfsoS8q/PTNUGqcw= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Sergi(o?), I read in some reviews that using the phantom power and setting the record level to very high (in a quiet room) you can hear a constant beeping. I even remember finding an audio file someone posted with it. Do you get something like this? I'm planning to buy an affordable portable recorded and I'm still debating between this one or the Microtrack. Thanks! Saludos, Hector On 12/22/06, Sergi Valverde <x@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > i buought one last week from Soundprofessionals with a > Soundprofessional SP-8 mic Preamp. > > The Built-In Mics are acceptable ( at least for me ) , but much > better with my Rode nt4 and an external Preamp. > > I dont´ test it in 24 bits mode yet but, this weekend i will .... > > saludos > > s > > > > > but i´don´t test it in 24 bits mode yet. > El 22/12/2006, a las 2:38, Aaron Ximm escribió: > > >> it compares and contrasts all the newest units... i also think korg > >> is coming out w/ a new one soon too... > > > > Korg is coming out with two DSD-based recorders, which have looked > > nice at > > shows but as yet are untested. > > > > xxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx > > quietamerican.org > > > > | quod omne animal post | > > | cogitum est triste... | > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 22 20:13:36 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41109-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 22 Dec 2006 15:13:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 15:13:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 29699 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 20:16:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 29689 invoked from network); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 20:16:55 +0000 Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2006 21:13:24 +0100 From: Sergi Valverde <x@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i buought one last week from Soundprofessionals with a Soundprofessional SP-8 mic Preamp. The Built-In Mics are acceptable ( at least for me ) , but much better with my Rode nt4 and an external Preamp. I dont´ test it in 24 bits mode yet but, this weekend i will .... saludos s but i´don´t test it in 24 bits mode yet. El 22/12/2006, a las 2:38, Aaron Ximm escribió: >> it compares and contrasts all the newest units... i also think korg >> is coming out w/ a new one soon too... > > Korg is coming out with two DSD-based recorders, which have looked > nice at > shows but as yet are untested. > > xxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx > quietamerican.org > > | quod omne animal post | > | cogitum est triste... | > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 22 19:54:52 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41108-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 22 Dec 2006 14:54:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 14:54:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 18287 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 19:58:04 +0000 Received: (qmail 18272 invoked from network); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 19:58:03 +0000 Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2006 14:54:33 -0500 From: emanuele de raymondi <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_hoehZmRaI5jVpMGGGHCa+A)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=cRoajm0k0PVWHlsnUOw4xMvPiXWdYj4Sm0iZIO/7IioV6F+D7u7F92tUWjFwVBFIsxXTRviCv18xxaZVYOmkwOKqJqwQdFQCMkPFrBuLunopYO5o8emqT17CZ78If1PUfNN2mc9K+N/hYTZoOnu2y2uznUnKagBEadwyUuUzluQ= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_hoehZmRaI5jVpMGGGHCa+A) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > "RH: Visual representation of sound is evil." How typically German, the hopeless dualism... ;-) --Boundary_(ID_hoehZmRaI5jVpMGGGHCa+A)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 22 12:13:11 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41107-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 22 Dec 2006 07:13:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 07:13:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 1667 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 12:16:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 1657 invoked from network); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 12:16:30 +0000 Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2006 04:13:02 -0800 (PST) From: Cooptrol <xxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Yeah I have asked him some questions through mail and he showed himself very concerned. Plus, he downloaded my software and liked it. I'm looking for the possibility of inviting him to my country to give a master class. > I wouldn't call myself a friend but I did have the opportunity to spend > some time with him when he was in Sydney earlier this year. I found his > humour, enthusiam and singular commitment to his projects and his > aesthetic very inspiring. > >> Everybody is friend of Rob Henke?? He must be very achievable! >> >> >> >> >>> yep it is a good thread. If you've ever spent some time speaking with >>> Robert Henke you might imagine him saying this with a somewhat >>> mischievious grin on his face. I suspect he is using the word evil here >>> in >>> a less than totally didactic manner. I think he is simply saying don't >>> use >>> your eyes in spite of your ears when producing music. >>> >>> Robert Henke is not afraid of the image. >>> >>> PS Ableton Live has a brilliant interface. I find it a transformative >>> environment. This is one of the reason's for it's success. >>> >>>> Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. >>>> >>>>> Visual representation of sound is evil. >>>> >>>> Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could >>>> tell >>>> us >>>> for sure. >>>> >>>> A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR >>>> (post >>>> recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation >>>> for >>>> propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual >>>> representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our >>>> minds >>>> (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to >>>> argue, >>>> really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important >>>> distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter >>>> is >>>> inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, >>>> whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds >>>> outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by >>>> virtue >>>> of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is >>>> indispensible but visual representation is not. The musical conception >>>> of >>>> a >>>> piece that is implemented with Live can precede the software in a way >>>> that >>>> an 18th century piano sonata conception could not precede the >>>> limitations >>>> and affordances of european music notation. (Did Mozart ever complain >>>> about >>>> not being able to write 1/4 tones the way folks here are complaining >>>> about >>>> Live's loop-bias doing their heads in?) >>>> >>>> As a side note, I nominate the optional nature of PR music's visual >>>> representation as a key reason why the wackiest looking music scores >>>> show >>>> up >>>> in the 20th century. Once freed from necessity, some people get looser >>>> with >>>> the tool, or start twirling it around over their heads. >>>> >>>> Eric >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 22 01:38:33 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41106-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 20:38:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 20:38:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 59519 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 01:41:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 59509 invoked from network); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 01:41:50 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:38:24 -0800 (PST) From: Aaron Ximm <xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.x.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-WELL-Auth: Yes X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.7/2367/Thu Dec 21 08:35:52 2006 on paz.well.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > it compares and contrasts all the newest units... i also think korg > is coming out w/ a new one soon too... Korg is coming out with two DSD-based recorders, which have looked nice at shows but as yet are untested. xxxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx quietamerican.org | quod omne animal post | | cogitum est triste... | --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 22 01:03:50 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41105-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 20:03:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 20:03:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 42694 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 01:07:02 +0000 Received: (qmail 42662 invoked from network); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 01:07:00 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 20:03:35 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx check out this site... dug up from an old microsound thread i still have: http://soundtransit.nl/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2 it compares and contrasts all the newest units... i also think korg is coming out w/ a new one soon too... g. On 21-Dec-06, at 7:24 PM, Xdugef wrote: > Hmm.. I seem to remember reading some bad reviews of this one.. > something about it recording 24bit audio as if it could not keep up > and > being stuttery. > > > --- colin <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> wrote: > >> i'm a bit wary of zoom products, but i already had a >> dream last week where i was using one of these: >> >> http://www.samsontech.com/products/productpage.cfm?prodID=1901 >> >> Mobile Field Recording >> Fits in the palm of your hand >> Ideal for infinite variety of mobile recording >> applications >> Records 24-bit/96 kHz digital audio as well as MP3 >> format with bitrates up to 320kbps >> Two studio quality X/Y pattern condenser microphones >> for true stereo recording >> Two combination XLR-1/4-inch input jacks with phantom >> power >> Onboard studio effects compression, limiting and mic >> modeling >> 1/8-inch headphone jack provided for monitoring >> 128MB Secure Digital (SD) card included. >> Using a 2GB SD memory card provides 380 minutes of >> recording with CD Quality sound >> Up to 34 hours recording in MP3 stereo mode >> USB mass-storage interface >> Four hours of continuous recording operation from 2 AA >> batteries >> Back-lit, 128×64 pixel LCD provides the visual >> interface >> AC adapter, windshield cover, USB Cable and tripod >> adapter included >> >> 4-Track Recording >> 4-track audio in CD quality 16-bit PCM, 44.1 kHz >> sampling >> Combination high-impedance phone inputs for vocals, >> guitars, bass or keyboards. >> Built in guitar amp modeling equivalent to the Zoom G2 >> >> Audio Interface >> Records directly to your computer as a USB audio >> interface >> Bundled with Cubase LE, 48-Track Digital Audio >> Workstation software >> >> >> - >> http://freewebs.com/brokensleep >> >> __________________________________________________ >> Do You Yahoo!? >> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >> http://mail.yahoo.com >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 22 00:25:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41104-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 19:25:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 19:25:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 24384 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 00:28:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 24374 invoked from network); Fri, 22 Dec 2006 00:28:12 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 16:24:48 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: b1uH7W0VM1nX40vdR4dhmvprxfyZCOXFwls6D8jvuY6TK2hwV9Y0IJWckS4xdimBfKt_68DpM0G9D2rZrf5ZfS7EVW3IokdY1CVn4lh4HK2ch_2NiHsYx_eI0hapK6uHPHb1ebmU62ciL7I- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hmm.. I seem to remember reading some bad reviews of this one.. something about it recording 24bit audio as if it could not keep up and being stuttery. --- colin <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> wrote: > i'm a bit wary of zoom products, but i already had a > dream last week where i was using one of these: > > http://www.samsontech.com/products/productpage.cfm?prodID=1901 > > Mobile Field Recording > Fits in the palm of your hand > Ideal for infinite variety of mobile recording > applications > Records 24-bit/96 kHz digital audio as well as MP3 > format with bitrates up to 320kbps > Two studio quality X/Y pattern condenser microphones > for true stereo recording > Two combination XLR-1/4-inch input jacks with phantom > power > Onboard studio effects compression, limiting and mic > modeling > 1/8-inch headphone jack provided for monitoring > 128MB Secure Digital (SD) card included. > Using a 2GB SD memory card provides 380 minutes of > recording with CD Quality sound > Up to 34 hours recording in MP3 stereo mode > USB mass-storage interface > Four hours of continuous recording operation from 2 AA > batteries > Back-lit, 128×64 pixel LCD provides the visual > interface > AC adapter, windshield cover, USB Cable and tripod > adapter included > > 4-Track Recording > 4-track audio in CD quality 16-bit PCM, 44.1 kHz > sampling > Combination high-impedance phone inputs for vocals, > guitars, bass or keyboards. > Built in guitar amp modeling equivalent to the Zoom G2 > > Audio Interface > Records directly to your computer as a USB audio > interface > Bundled with Cubase LE, 48-Track Digital Audio > Workstation software > > > - > http://freewebs.com/brokensleep > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 23:07:47 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41103-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:07:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:07:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 81419 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 23:10:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 81409 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 23:10:57 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:07:32 -0500 (EST) From: colin <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] Zoom H4 - Handy Recorder To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=FwjmnzB5RitramllhERW2kSLpUhDVVJXV8wts1DF2zRQJOn0leVNw20+CknjpFP0R8HS8dMcZneGwGEDWbr3Qg8Lvi9JWvvV3DVSesX1Sp29Xf38RbeIkerTZ9K8RTLt32UNPm53TolmRdbpwtMWgfFAtZn1JG/N3EIm/AXpZPs=; X-YMail-OSG: bL_S2h8VM1lwiwtSkFrZe.eJhpQCH5T_BC9FqDDrHrdzlaFDIAOGVPTmDZl4_riuSK16K98ykxJBf_Baiq7ip3FzfBwPa2jeZY_i3cnBvpRfvyEJ33Ikjw-- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i'm a bit wary of zoom products, but i already had a dream last week where i was using one of these: http://www.samsontech.com/products/productpage.cfm?prodID=1901 Mobile Field Recording Fits in the palm of your hand Ideal for infinite variety of mobile recording applications Records 24-bit/96 kHz digital audio as well as MP3 format with bitrates up to 320kbps Two studio quality X/Y pattern condenser microphones for true stereo recording Two combination XLR-1/4-inch input jacks with phantom power Onboard studio effects compression, limiting and mic modeling 1/8-inch headphone jack provided for monitoring 128MB Secure Digital (SD) card included. Using a 2GB SD memory card provides 380 minutes of recording with CD Quality sound Up to 34 hours recording in MP3 stereo mode USB mass-storage interface Four hours of continuous recording operation from 2 AA batteries Back-lit, 128×64 pixel LCD provides the visual interface AC adapter, windshield cover, USB Cable and tripod adapter included 4-Track Recording 4-track audio in CD quality 16-bit PCM, 44.1 kHz sampling Combination high-impedance phone inputs for vocals, guitars, bass or keyboards. Built in guitar amp modeling equivalent to the Zoom G2 Audio Interface Records directly to your computer as a USB audio interface Bundled with Cubase LE, 48-Track Digital Audio Workstation software - http://freewebs.com/brokensleep __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 22:43:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41102-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:43:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:43:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 67572 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 22:46:19 +0000 Received: (qmail 67554 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 22:46:17 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 14:42:49 -0800 (PST) From: xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: SquirrelMail/1.4.3a Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Score: 0.649 (DRUGS_SLEEP,NO_REAL_NAME,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.3a Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I wouldn't call myself a friend but I did have the opportunity to spend some time with him when he was in Sydney earlier this year. I found his humour, enthusiam and singular commitment to his projects and his aesthetic very inspiring. > Everybody is friend of Rob Henke?? He must be very achievable! > > > > >> yep it is a good thread. If you've ever spent some time speaking with >> Robert Henke you might imagine him saying this with a somewhat >> mischievious grin on his face. I suspect he is using the word evil here >> in >> a less than totally didactic manner. I think he is simply saying don't >> use >> your eyes in spite of your ears when producing music. >> >> Robert Henke is not afraid of the image. >> >> PS Ableton Live has a brilliant interface. I find it a transformative >> environment. This is one of the reason's for it's success. >> >>> Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. >>> >>>> Visual representation of sound is evil. >>> >>> Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could tell >>> us >>> for sure. >>> >>> A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR (post >>> recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation >>> for >>> propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual >>> representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our >>> minds >>> (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to >>> argue, >>> really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important >>> distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter >>> is >>> inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, >>> whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds >>> outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by >>> virtue >>> of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is >>> indispensible but visual representation is not. The musical conception >>> of >>> a >>> piece that is implemented with Live can precede the software in a way >>> that >>> an 18th century piano sonata conception could not precede the >>> limitations >>> and affordances of european music notation. (Did Mozart ever complain >>> about >>> not being able to write 1/4 tones the way folks here are complaining >>> about >>> Live's loop-bias doing their heads in?) >>> >>> As a side note, I nominate the optional nature of PR music's visual >>> representation as a key reason why the wackiest looking music scores >>> show >>> up >>> in the 20th century. Once freed from necessity, some people get looser >>> with >>> the tool, or start twirling it around over their heads. >>> >>> Eric >>> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 18:49:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41101-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 13:49:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 13:49:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 33536 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:52:25 +0000 Received: (qmail 33526 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:52:24 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 19:48:53 +0100 From: Frank Barknecht <xxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mail-followup-to: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hallo, Eric Lyon hat gesagt: // Eric Lyon wrote: > Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. > > >Visual representation of sound is evil. > > Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could tell us > for sure. > > A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR (post > recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation for > propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual > representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our minds > (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to argue, > really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important > distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter is > inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, > whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds > outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by virtue > of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is > indispensible but visual representation is not. But let me add that both abstraction and visual representation can show up together. You and me, we both are Max rsp. Pd users, and Robert Henke is a Max user, too. I consider these programs to be visual representations of music or sound processes and thus maybe even of music and sound itself (though this is debatable). They aren't the one-(or actually two-)dimensional view of sound as a wave form , which indeed I do consider very limited and even dangerous (or evil), but they are clearly a visual representation of abstracted sound, or of sound symbols. It's no coincidence that higher-level modules in Max/Pd are called just that: abstractions. Abstractions are tools for the mind, and to some people, visualising abstractions is a big help for thinking. So in this regard, visual representation of sound is not evil at all IMO. Btw.: I can code in a text language as well, but when trying to think about certain sounds and music, I always find myself coming back to the abstract, but visual approach of Pd. It just works better for me; though I know and respect, that it doesn't work for other people at all (like those in the SuperCollider community). Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 18:19:57 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41100-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 13:19:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 13:19:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 14366 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:23:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 14353 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:23:00 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 18:19:36 +0000 From: Eric Lyon <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_CDfAgXhB0bdYR3vzlZbD3g)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=PLjJh9E5XZbZucnQ/dkHKHlKLtr3gdNWmfLn7Soxzoa7UyeP8B3dCsak2DtSOsQAdcnE23Ui7+wxm2YhWGqXOKCiBq9m5ffvlFGiTpwtg+aMxuCcBUYV99lqCyxNXM3nitYpbDw6QE96OrbpCBOfqiofoZqBib9pstXnxqYUAU0= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_CDfAgXhB0bdYR3vzlZbD3g) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > I realized what bothered me about this whole line of argument: It's > the assumption that the visual and audio are opposed. In reality, in a > good musician the two things are complementary. Does this mean blind musicians can't be good? Some of the lines of > argument people take seem to create a false dualism, where I don't > think there's any real opposition. I'm not claiming they're opposed, I'm reporting that in my experience they are different, and not necessarily cross-reliant. Obviously the two modes can be complementary. Anyone experienced with european music notation or computer software GUIs is heavily conditioned by systems that completely fuse auditory and visual cognitive modes, creating synergies that would be difficult to achieve relying on a single mode. But some people can also hear and create music without seeing visuals, myself included. Eric --Boundary_(ID_CDfAgXhB0bdYR3vzlZbD3g)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 17:17:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41099-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 12:17:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 12:17:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 68161 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:20:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 68150 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:20:17 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 12:16:48 -0500 From: Eloy Anzola <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Volume at the Victoria and Albert Museum To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <002b01c72523$cd414b80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-index: AcclI8xvXbeaJ407RXGoE4ZHhAfudQ== X-DCC--Metrics: ss73.shared.server-system.net 1368; Body=2 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Beauty: http://www.uva.co.uk/index.php/archives/49 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 15:58:08 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41098-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 10:58:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 10:58:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31172 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 16:01:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 31161 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 16:01:21 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 09:57:57 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Vn9Bbg/6fcW6PvrZxna5YA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=MZCA0oDEFd4bKi2wNaKqf5+7NdvgN6erw7JmJzqOY5vzdlu96X/e+1XwbQZpRmQHUMoyJgQPquIcu7YAZOaLr1Y8+IGZFAPuZ23Ctl/WjnLHecCcfRiwvti2PYzLZpIJUrra9+veIPASiQIFNABthAkqtL2CHcL8Mz2UZRGPO28= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_Vn9Bbg/6fcW6PvrZxna5YA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've never talked to him, but he looks to be pretty accessible in his video tutorials. I'm sure he's a downright likeable and approachable guy if you meet him in person. Seems a lot more cheerful and upbeat than his latest dark, brooding tunes (which sound amazing, by the way). ~Kyle On 12/21/06, Cooptrol <xxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Everybody is friend of Rob Henke?? He must be very achievable! > > > > > > yep it is a good thread. If you've ever spent some time speaking with > > Robert Henke you might imagine him saying this with a somewhat > > mischievious grin on his face. I suspect he is using the word evil here > in > > a less than totally didactic manner. I think he is simply saying don't > use > > your eyes in spite of your ears when producing music. > > > > Robert Henke is not afraid of the image. > > > > PS Ableton Live has a brilliant interface. I find it a transformative > > environment. This is one of the reason's for it's success. > > > >> Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. > >> > >>> Visual representation of sound is evil. > >> > >> Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could tell > >> us > >> for sure. > >> > >> A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR (post > >> recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation > for > >> propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual > >> representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our > >> minds > >> (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to > >> argue, > >> really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important > >> distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter > is > >> inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, > >> whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds > >> outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by > >> virtue > >> of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is > >> indispensible but visual representation is not. The musical conception > >> of > >> a > >> piece that is implemented with Live can precede the software in a way > >> that > >> an 18th century piano sonata conception could not precede the > >> limitations > >> and affordances of european music notation. (Did Mozart ever complain > >> about > >> not being able to write 1/4 tones the way folks here are complaining > >> about > >> Live's loop-bias doing their heads in?) > >> > >> As a side note, I nominate the optional nature of PR music's visual > >> representation as a key reason why the wackiest looking music scores > >> show > >> up > >> in the 20th century. Once freed from necessity, some people get looser > >> with > >> the tool, or start twirling it around over their heads. > >> > >> Eric > >> > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_Vn9Bbg/6fcW6PvrZxna5YA)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 15:49:34 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41097-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 10:49:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 10:49:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 26776 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 15:52:46 +0000 Received: (qmail 26766 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 15:52:46 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 07:49:18 -0800 (PST) From: Cooptrol <xxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Everybody is friend of Rob Henke?? He must be very achievable! > yep it is a good thread. If you've ever spent some time speaking with > Robert Henke you might imagine him saying this with a somewhat > mischievious grin on his face. I suspect he is using the word evil here in > a less than totally didactic manner. I think he is simply saying don't use > your eyes in spite of your ears when producing music. > > Robert Henke is not afraid of the image. > > PS Ableton Live has a brilliant interface. I find it a transformative > environment. This is one of the reason's for it's success. > >> Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. >> >>> Visual representation of sound is evil. >> >> Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could tell >> us >> for sure. >> >> A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR (post >> recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation for >> propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual >> representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our >> minds >> (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to >> argue, >> really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important >> distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter is >> inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, >> whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds >> outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by >> virtue >> of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is >> indispensible but visual representation is not. The musical conception >> of >> a >> piece that is implemented with Live can precede the software in a way >> that >> an 18th century piano sonata conception could not precede the >> limitations >> and affordances of european music notation. (Did Mozart ever complain >> about >> not being able to write 1/4 tones the way folks here are complaining >> about >> Live's loop-bias doing their heads in?) >> >> As a side note, I nominate the optional nature of PR music's visual >> representation as a key reason why the wackiest looking music scores >> show >> up >> in the 20th century. Once freed from necessity, some people get looser >> with >> the tool, or start twirling it around over their heads. >> >> Eric >> > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 07:01:35 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41096-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 02:01:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 02:01:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 74283 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 07:04:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 74273 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 07:04:47 +0000 Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 20:01:20 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: [microsound] electroacoustic masterpiece In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx play this with the screen turned off: http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/transformers/ -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 06:48:36 2006 Return-path: <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 01:48:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from collab.or8.net (collab.or8.net [209.6.82.6]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 01:48:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from collab.or8.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by collab.or8.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD926650F2F; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 01:45:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp7.orange.fr (smtp7.orange.fr [193.252.22.24]) by collab.or8.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA2C7650BED for <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx>; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 01:45:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.63] (AMarseille-256-1-16-24.w86-219.abo.wanadoo.fr [86.219.63.24]) by mwinf0712.orange.fr (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id 2632C1C00088; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 07:48:29 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2006 07:48:27 +0100 From: Philippe Petit <xxxxxxxx-xxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [Microsound-announce] Hope you are prepairing to enjoy a nice x-mas time In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> Sender: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxx_xxxxxxx_xxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx, ambient <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, idm - moderated <xxx-x@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx, "xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx" <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx>, "xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx" <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxx-xx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx, annonces Wire <xxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Errors-to: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_QvN3OVi80tAej4KaBH5s3w)" Precedence: list X-BeenThere: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx Delivered-to: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx X-Original-To: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx X-ME-UUID: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9rc1 List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx> List-Subscribe: <http://or8.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce>, <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx?subject=subscribe> List-Unsubscribe: <http://or8.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce>, <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://or8.net/pipermail/microsound-announce> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx?subject=help> List-Id: microsound related announcements <microsound-announce.microsound.nexthop.net> Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_QvN3OVi80tAej4KaBH5s3w) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Mailsmith-B4E3CDB8-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Mailsmith-B4E3CDB8-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit $Dear Readers, Hope you are prepairing to enjoy a nice x-mas time In 2006 many things took place @ our BiP_HOp HQ and to end the year nicely 2 of our records got nominated to the Qwartz Awards: Same Actor BiP_HOp Generation v.8 Feel free to follow the links and vote for us, or any other one your ears dictate you to, but in any case please express yourself and support that nice initiative http://www.qwartz.org/joomla/index.php? option=com_content&task=view&id=38&prix=Compilation http://www.qwartz.org/joomla/index.php? option=com_content&task=view&id=38&prix=Track In hope to share our passions allow my pointing out 50 records we have played repeatedly throughout the year (in no particular order, mind you), obviously avoiding favouritism and not placing any BiP_HOp in the list... Believe me it has been tough to select only 50 out of 500 + which I got in 2006... So feel assured that those brought a large pleasure to my ears, kept growing on me with every listen and sometimes called me in the middle of the night... Special thumbs up to our friends from Glasgow who penned "Friend Of The Night" the most delicious and addictive lullaby, ex-aequo with that torrid cover of Pixies' "break my body" coming from a cold coutry but warming your hands so nicely... Let's stop digressing and enjoy the music : Barry Adamson : stranger on the sofa (Central Control International) Foetus : love (Birdman) Enablers : output negative space (Neurot) Many Fingers : our worn shadow (Acuarela) Hanne Hukkelberg : break my body (Leaf) Scanner : messe : klang der macht (KünstRäume) The Timeout Drawer : nowonmai ((Consumer Research & Development Label) Modern Institute : excellent swimmer (Expanding) Flanger : spirituals (Nonplace) Tu M' : fragile touch of the coincidence (Headz) Grails : black tar prophecies (Important) Phelan Sheppard : harps old master (Leaf) Psapp : the only thing i ever wanted (Domino) Biosphere : dropsonde (Touch) Akira Ifukube : king kong vs. godzilla (Lalaland) Daedelus : denies the day's demise (Ninja tune) Mécanosphère : limb shop (Raging Planet) Mogwaï : mr beast (PIAS) Ateleia : formal sleep (Xeric/Table Of The Elements) Pierre-Yves Macé & Quatuor Pli : crash test 2 (Orkhestra) Isis : in the absence of truth (Ipecac) Avia Gardner : mill farm (Intr:Version) Red Sparowes : every red heart shines toward the read (Neurot) Picore : l'hélium du peuple (Jarring Effects) Frequency : s/t (Thrill Jockey) Boxhead Ensemble : nocturnes (Atavistic) Motohiro Nakashima : I dreamt of constellations sang (Loaf) Animal Collective : feels (Fat Cat) Mandelbrot Set : all our actions are constantly repeated (Highpoint Lowlife) Felix Kubin : atoma exi mono (Solnze) Gang Gang Dance : god's money (The Social Registry) Rafael Toral : space (Staubgold) Robert Lippok : robot (Western Vinyl) Schneider TM : skoda mluvit (City Slang) Duchess Says : noviciat mere-perruche (Slum) Tied & Tickled Trio : a. r. c. (Morr Music) Legendary Pink Dots : your children placate you from premature graves (Roir) World's End Girlfriend : the lie lay land (MIDI Creative / noble) Pan.American : for waiting, for chasing (Mosz) Erik Friedlander : prowl (Cryptogramophone) Bästard : yet, reloaded... (Ici d'Ailleurs) 1 Kilo Of Black Bondage : fear the windows (Wallace) Aethenor : deep ocean sunk the lamp of light (VHF) Tunng : comments of the inner chorus (Talitres) The DFA Remixes chapter 1 (DFA) Terrestrial Tones : dead drunk (Paw Tracks) Tape : rideau (Hapna) ZU : the way of the animal powers (Xeng) Judith Juillerat : soliloquy (Shitkatapult) VA. idol tryouts vol.2 (Ghostly international) --Mailsmith-B4E3CDB8-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit <HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; ">$<FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Dear Readers,</FONT><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><B>Hope you are prepairing to enjoy a nice x-mas time</B></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">I</FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">n 2006 m</FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">any things took place @ our BiP_HOp HQ and to end the year nicely 2 of our records got </FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><B>nominated to the </B></FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><B>Qwartz Awards</B></FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">:</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><B>Same Actor</B></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><B>BiP_HOp Generation v.8</B></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Feel free to follow the links and vote for us, or any other one your ears dictate you to, but in any case please express yourself and support that nice initiative</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><A href="http://www.qwartz.org/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=38&prix=Compilation">http://www.qwartz.org/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=38&prix=Compilation</A></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><A href="http://www.qwartz.org/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=38&prix=Track">http://www.qwartz.org/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=38&prix=Track</A></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal American Typewriter; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><B>In hope to share our passions allow my pointing out 50 records we have played repeatedly throughout the year</B></FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"> (in no particular order, mind you), obviously avoiding favouritism and not placing any BiP_HOp in the list... </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Believe me it has been tough to select only 50 out of 500 + which I got in 2006... So feel assured that those brought a large pleasure to my ears, kept growing on me with every listen and sometimes called me in the middle of the night... Special thumbs up to our friends from Glasgow who penned "Friend Of The Night" the most delicious and addictive lullaby, ex-aequo with that torrid cover of Pixies' "break my body" coming from a cold coutry but warming your hands so nicely... </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Let's stop digressing and enjoy the music :</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal American Typewriter; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"><BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal American Typewriter; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Barry Adamson : stranger on the sofa (Central Control International)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal American Typewriter; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Foetus : love (Birdman)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal American Typewriter; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Enablers : output negative space (Neurot)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal American Typewriter; min-height: 14px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Many Fingers : our worn shadow (Acuarela)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Hanne Hukkelberg : break my body (Leaf)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Scanner : messe : klang der macht (KünstRäume) </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">The Timeout Drawer : nowonmai ((Consumer Research & Development Label) </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Modern Institute : excellent swimmer (Expanding)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Flanger : spirituals (Nonplace)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Tu M' : fragile touch of the coincidence (Headz)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Grails : black tar prophecies (Important)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Phelan Sheppard : harps old master (Leaf)</FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"> </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Psapp : the only thing i ever wanted (Domino)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Biosphere : dropsonde (Touch)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Akira Ifukube : king kong vs. godzilla (Lalaland)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Daedelus : denies the day's demise (Ninja tune)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Mécanosphère : limb shop (Raging Planet)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Mogwaï : mr beast (PIAS)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Ateleia : formal sleep (Xeric/Table Of The Elements)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Pierre-Yves Macé & Quatuor Pli : crash test 2 (Orkhestra)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Isis : in the absence of truth (Ipecac)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Avia Gardner : mill farm (Intr:Version)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Red Sparowes : every red heart shines toward the read (Neurot)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Picore : l'hélium du peuple (Jarring Effects)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Frequency : s/t (Thrill Jockey)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Boxhead Ensemble : nocturnes (Atavistic)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Motohiro Nakashima : I dreamt of constellations sang (Loaf)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Animal Collective : feels (Fat Cat)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Mandelbrot Set : all our actions are constantly repeated (Highpoint Lowlife)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Felix Kubin : </FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">atoma exi mono</FONT><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"> (Solnze)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Gang Gang Dance : god's money (The Social Registry)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Rafael Toral : space (Staubgold)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Robert Lippok : robot (Western Vinyl)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Schneider TM : skoda mluvit (City Slang)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Duchess Says : noviciat mere-perruche (Slum)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Tied & Tickled Trio : a. r. c. (Morr Music)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Legendary Pink Dots : your children placate you from premature graves (Roir)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">World's End Girlfriend : the lie lay land (MIDI Creative / noble)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Pan.American : for waiting, for chasing (Mosz)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Erik Friedlander : prowl (Cryptogramophone)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Bästard : yet, reloaded... (Ici d'Ailleurs)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">1 Kilo Of Black Bondage : fear the windows (Wallace)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Aethenor : deep ocean sunk the lamp of light (VHF)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Tunng : comments of the inner chorus (Talitres)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">The DFA Remixes chapter 1 (DFA)<BR style=""></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Terrestrial Tones : dead drunk (Paw Tracks)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Tape : rideau (Hapna) </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">ZU : the way of the animal powers (Xeng) </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">Judith Juillerat : soliloquy (Shitkatapult) </FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times">VA. idol tryouts vol.2 (Ghostly international) </FONT></DIV><P style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px"><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times"> </FONT></P></BODY></HTML> --Mailsmith-B4E3CDB8-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78-- --Boundary_(ID_QvN3OVi80tAej4KaBH5s3w) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit _______________________________________________ Microsound-announce mailing list xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx http://or8.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce --Boundary_(ID_QvN3OVi80tAej4KaBH5s3w)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 05:58:59 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41095-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 21 Dec 2006 00:58:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 00:58:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 50391 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 06:02:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 50377 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 06:02:10 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 21:58:49 -0800 From: leo <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] gigs in january, anyone?? reduxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=hYl6Ym1/WraNVpOhyeJvPjXYNHVCdYDkusDP0pSM+51zRvOl/5i9P7GPMk6XVEU6LVdBhCKKLv4jLgbrWMyVaHFBeghmIpaRDlUwLiYrmJHxrJiUyLBMSb+gvTa+TlSa5OmdMNGd/Vzk1boW0wcSwbAKwcbSyvkmI/W7z6W0xgo= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx cher Javier > indeed there is some one here who can help you out. The bible anglais & clearinghouse for all live artmusic of the occident is Critic et Academic David Cotner's <Actions Communique> which - while never focused on peculiar tonalities or their particular abolition - does list an entirely exhaustive "new music" calendar at the end of each missive, "issued weekly and covering actions for two weeks hence". Apply to: xxxxxx@xxxxx-xxxx.xxx xxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx To quote, "It's not an easy road"; nor would I suggest you to hold your breath: Mr. C's rather busy with critical commitments besides collecting, culling and disseminating his arti-facts. however he also maintians a website http://www.hertz-lion.com/ listing the other comparable and useful performance info which comes his way, such as venues, festivals, et cetera; but unfortunately not yet containing his epic calendars... the most current of which I can quote at the moment is 2006September 18. not surprisingly that edition contains but one current [and conceptually a rather coherent] Euro-'Activity' listed below. ¿Perhaps other correspondents could provide a current Cotner Communique? adios a dieu leo ____________________________________________ from Actions Communique Sept2006: ________________ SEPTEMBER - JANUARY 7, 2007 HE YUN CHANG - "Touring Round Great Britain With a Rock" "Beijing based artist He Yun Chang is amongst the most important artists presently working in China, creating unique solo performances in which he has placed exceptional physical demands upon himself both in terms of his strength and endurance. These works, mostly performed in public though occasionally only observed by a camera operator, have astounded audiences with their simple ambition combined with the difficulty of their implementation and, ultimately, their apparent futility. "Touring Round Great Britain With A Rock" is He Yun Chang's most challenging and ambitious performance to date and it is set to become a landmark project in the history of durational performance art. Starting from Rock, in Northumberland, he will walk to the nearby coast at Boulmer where he will select a rock and set off to carry it around the island of Great Britain in a counter clockwise direction, eventually to return the rock to the precise location from where it was taken. The route is a rough circumnavigation of Great Britain, rather than following the precise coastline, a distance of over 2000 miles and will take around 110 days. Join He Yun Chang at the start of his walk: We will be organising a return bus trip from Newcastle to Rock and on to Boulmer for anyone who would like to join He Yun Chang as he begins his walk on Sunday 17 September. Depart: 12N, High Bridge, Newcastle upon Tyne Return: 5P, from Boulmer to Newcastle Places on the bus are free but will be limited so please contact us in advance to reserve a seat: 44 191 261 7262 Walk with He Yun Chang: You are welcome to join He Yun Chang at any point along the route of his walk and the full itinerary will be available online at http://amino.org.uk You will also be able to keep up to date day by day with his progress and location through the amino website which will be linked to Google Earth." Starting at Rock, Northumberland, ENGLAND Finishing at Boulmer, Northumberland, ENGLAND amino [at] amino [dot] org [dot] uk for information (culled from Amino - thanks!) SEPTEMBER 28 - DECEMBER 31 BERNARD GAL & Y. KORI - "Infinitation" SESC Sao Paolo, BRAZIL http://www.bernhardgal.com/galkori.html for information (culled from Bernard Gal - thanks!) ________________________________________________ >: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 ><xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> >gigs in january, anyone?? >hello! >altough I didnt get any replies to my first mail, >I 4m going to try once again: >could any of you share some data about interesting gigs + >art/sound instalations + etc, taking place during >january 2007, in madrid, paris, london and >/or berlin??? >i'm travelling to these places and I really believe that there >> must be some one here who can help me out. >i googled a lot but could not find any decent= > data. >thank you! and i hope this isn't bothering you too much! >Javier --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 21 04:12:04 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41094-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 20 Dec 2006 23:12:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 23:12:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 7299 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 04:15:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 7272 invoked from network); Thu, 21 Dec 2006 04:15:10 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 23:11:49 -0500 From: xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: [microsound] NY In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; DelSp=Yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - southbend-64.pgzn.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - hyperreal.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32002 32002] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - discosinvisibles.org X-Source: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php X-Source-Args: /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/bin/php /usr/local/cpanel/base/horde/imp/compose.php X-Source-Dir: :/base/horde/imp X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hello all, I am visiting New York until the 30th, any recomendations for a show/concert/presentation/record store/ or any microsoundish people around? I would apreciate any info. N. el sonido nace para todos >../ www.discosinvisibles.org www.electronicamexicana.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 20 21:58:51 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41093-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 20 Dec 2006 16:58:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 16:58:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 19898 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 22:01:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 19888 invoked from network); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 22:01:57 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 13:58:38 -0800 (PST) From: xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: SquirrelMail/1.4.3a Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Score: 0.649 (DRUGS_SLEEP,NO_REAL_NAME,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.3a Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx yep it is a good thread. If you've ever spent some time speaking with Robert Henke you might imagine him saying this with a somewhat mischievious grin on his face. I suspect he is using the word evil here in a less than totally didactic manner. I think he is simply saying don't use your eyes in spite of your ears when producing music. Robert Henke is not afraid of the image. PS Ableton Live has a brilliant interface. I find it a transformative environment. This is one of the reason's for it's success. > Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. > >> Visual representation of sound is evil. > > Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could tell us > for sure. > > A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR (post > recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation for > propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual > representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our > minds > (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to argue, > really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important > distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter is > inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, > whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds > outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by > virtue > of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is > indispensible but visual representation is not. The musical conception of > a > piece that is implemented with Live can precede the software in a way that > an 18th century piano sonata conception could not precede the limitations > and affordances of european music notation. (Did Mozart ever complain > about > not being able to write 1/4 tones the way folks here are complaining about > Live's loop-bias doing their heads in?) > > As a side note, I nominate the optional nature of PR music's visual > representation as a key reason why the wackiest looking music scores show > up > in the 20th century. Once freed from necessity, some people get looser > with > the tool, or start twirling it around over their heads. > > Eric > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 20 20:27:09 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41092-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:27:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:27:08 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 57141 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 20:30:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 57128 invoked from network); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 20:30:06 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:26:48 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] 2006 Playlist In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Albums released this year, or albums discovered/purchased/acquired this year by list members? I have stumbled upon a lot of older releases this year that i have flipped on, The Southern Lord label comes to mind. aLEKs On Dec 20, 2006, at 3:17 PM, Adern wrote: > Ok! Somebody thinks it's a stupid tradition but compiling the list of > the best 10 albums of the year is _the_ tradition! > Here's my choice in random order: > > Scott Walker - The Drift (4AD) > Current 93 - Black Ships Ate The Sky (Durtro) > John Zorn - Astronome (Tzadik) > Xiu Xiu - The Air Force (5RC) > William Basinski - Variations for Piano and Tape (2062) > Rioji Ikeda - Dataplex (Raster-Noton) > S. Mathieu & J. Schaefer - Hidden Name (Crònica) > Doulends Vert - Cistern (L-ne) > eRikm - sixpériodes (sirr) > Steinbrucker - Stage (L-ne) > > As usual, at least for me, too much records out (Olivia Block and Pixel > above all) but that's life! > -- > ( mailto: xxxxx@xxxxxx.xx > )) http://digilander.iol.it/adern (GnuPG key available on url) > |""|-. fingerprint = CE38 820C F54A 8BBB 114E ED43 EC64 0180 13B6 55B4 > |__|-' "Sometimes in a fight it's best to just stay down" (A. Innes) > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 20 20:17:27 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41091-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:17:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:17:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 49364 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 20:20:28 +0000 Received: (qmail 49340 invoked from network); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 20:20:26 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 21:17:34 +0100 From: Adern <xxx.xxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] 2006 Playlist To: ML Microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Sylpheed-Claws 1.0.4 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-pc-linux-gnu) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Scanned: with antispam and antivirus automated system at libero.it X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Ok! Somebody thinks it's a stupid tradition but compiling the list of the best 10 albums of the year is _the_ tradition! Here's my choice in random order: Scott Walker - The Drift (4AD) Current 93 - Black Ships Ate The Sky (Durtro) John Zorn - Astronome (Tzadik) Xiu Xiu - The Air Force (5RC) William Basinski - Variations for Piano and Tape (2062) Rioji Ikeda - Dataplex (Raster-Noton) S. Mathieu & J. Schaefer - Hidden Name (Crònica) Doulends Vert - Cistern (L-ne) eRikm - sixpériodes (sirr) Steinbrucker - Stage (L-ne) As usual, at least for me, too much records out (Olivia Block and Pixel above all) but that's life! -- ( mailto: xxxxx@xxxxxx.xx )) http://digilander.iol.it/adern (GnuPG key available on url) |""|-. fingerprint = CE38 820C F54A 8BBB 114E ED43 EC64 0180 13B6 55B4 |__|-' "Sometimes in a fight it's best to just stay down" (A. Innes) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 20 04:54:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41090-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 23:54:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 23:54:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 53731 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 04:57:48 +0000 Received: (qmail 53719 invoked from network); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 04:57:48 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 23:54:34 -0500 From: emanuele de raymondi <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer/ Birchville Cat Motel In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_HaLxhmLMV3uJw1Yx4YDHDg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=e/9k71YMrYkUol+s63grc8+XT+elIZr/zf50X/qrIBPP9dlTsYo86kjzCa3qYAqtXbQxtX9aWlu5cYC0feD5KGXaVV1CTO+JyYNRYGEbe9Kj9uQXs2kxiO5+nCUVYH2oJosUJPig6/PNhZzuKmppVVbEy/+1zzygOY8slnaFEh0= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <000901c72394$a44dc2c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_HaLxhmLMV3uJw1Yx4YDHDg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit agree, I find sequencers to be conceptually a bit "conservative", the whole notion of a timeline moving in digital ticks from left to right... it encourages certain patterns of musical thinking and production that are limited. The resulting music sounds often very standardized. I mean...I use Logic almost every day of my life, but my favorite software for composition (max/msp, metasynth, argeiphontes, radial, audiomulch, bidule) all share a certain extent of non-linearity in their conception that makes them much more stimulating and fun to use. In this sense, Ableton is a positive exception among commercial software. But then again...they lock you inside a cage with the quantizing everything to a tempo etc... edr On 12/19/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > > emanuele de raymondi wrote: > > > In reply to a previous post, I believe that laying out a score for a > > symphony > > is extremely different than laying out .WAV or .AIFF files and MIDI > tracks. > > I love to listen to and I love to make music that is made without the > aid of sequencing devices, or at least with sequencing devices used as > texture creators, rather than as rigid development-over-time parameters. > > The best microsound-y music happens when you set up enough equipment > that you don't fully understand what's going on, fiddle knobs until it > sounds awesome, then hit record. > > Anyone here ever seen Birchville Cat Motel live? > > -- > Damian Stewart > +64 27 305 4107 > > f r e y > live music with machines > http://www.frey.co.nz > http://www.myspace.com/freyed > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --Boundary_(ID_HaLxhmLMV3uJw1Yx4YDHDg)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 20 01:01:24 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41089-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 20:01:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 20:01:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 37979 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 01:04:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 37957 invoked from network); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 01:04:12 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:00:57 -0800 From: shift8 <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] micro...something In-reply-to: <p06200702c1ae2ba823fc@[192.168.0.3]> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.6.1 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <C1ADA2ED.4665%xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx> <p06200702c1ae2ba823fc@[192.168.0.3]> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx uhm... both i'm sure :) interesting idea tho... make this one a bit more complicated then just skating, and it's kinda that idea: http://www.youtube.com/v/1Xa2wVBza98 (via http://playtherecords.com/ ) On Tue, 2006-12-19 at 16:02 -0800, Robert Arnold wrote: > Might be fun to try to create the audio equivalent of a Rube Goldberg > machine - or rather, to translate the basic concept of RG machines > into an approach to composition. Does this make any sense at all or > am I just dangling from the fringes of reason? > > R. > > > >if you're not already familiar, or just want to relive some childhood > >fun, visit: > > > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg > >and > >http://www.rube-goldberg.com/ > > > >rube goldberg was pretty much the originator of this kinds of complex > >machine chains, as well as the creator of the idea behind the game > >"Mouse Trap" that still rocks to this day. > -- Mechanize something idiosyncratic. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 20 00:04:23 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41088-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:04:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:04:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 8783 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 00:07:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 8769 invoked from network); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 00:07:24 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:02:11 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] micro...something In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200702c1ae2ba823fc@[192.168.0.3]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <C1ADA2ED.4665%xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Might be fun to try to create the audio equivalent of a Rube Goldberg machine - or rather, to translate the basic concept of RG machines into an approach to composition. Does this make any sense at all or am I just dangling from the fringes of reason? R. >if you're not already familiar, or just want to relive some childhood >fun, visit: > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg >and >http://www.rube-goldberg.com/ > >rube goldberg was pretty much the originator of this kinds of complex >machine chains, as well as the creator of the idea behind the game >"Mouse Trap" that still rocks to this day. -- -- Website: http://www.warbaby.com (Currently undergoing an overhaul. Some pages and links may not work yet.) Blog: http://raggedwings.blogspot.com/ Nifty Stuff: http://www.cafepress.com/warbaby -- "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." - Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 20 00:03:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41087-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:03:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:03:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 7555 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 00:06:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 7541 invoked from network); Wed, 20 Dec 2006 00:06:08 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 12:59:48 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Xdugef wrote: > Hmm.. well I can say from experience that including visuals in no way > insures that people will sense what you sensed as an artist. > > Personally I'm interested in finding out how people experience it > differently. I know what you mean, but it kind of upsets me, so I'm trying to pretend that everyone experiences things the same :-) ... I'm friends with a number of live video artists, some of whom work closely with particular musicians (I'm thinking of a musician/VJ pair called Anaesthesia Associates). Even in those close collaborations, to me the video still has little or nothing to do with the sound. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 23:17:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41086-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 18:17:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 18:17:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 83647 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 23:20:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 83637 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 23:20:05 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:16:51 -0800 From: shift8 <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] micro...something In-reply-to: <C1ADA2ED.4665%xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxx.xx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.6.1 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <C1ADA2ED.4665%xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx if you're not already familiar, or just want to relive some childhood fun, visit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg and http://www.rube-goldberg.com/ rube goldberg was pretty much the originator of this kinds of complex machine chains, as well as the creator of the idea behind the game "Mouse Trap" that still rocks to this day. love, -the other shift8 (not the internationalization hater. wanky name stealing bastard) On Tue, 2006-12-19 at 14:08 +0100, steinbr=?ISO-8859-1?B?/A==?=chel wrote: > nic, me thinks this is fantastic. do you know the "movie" entitled "der lauf > der dinge" bei the swiss artist duo "fischli/weiss"? > > very similar... > cheers, ralph. > > Am 19.12.2006 12:02 Uhr schrieb "nicola catalano" unter <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx>: > > > maybe many of you have already seen this... amazing, crazy zen > > micro...something, me think! > > > > http://video.google.it/videoplay?docid=3163263343187879320&q=machine > > > > cheers! > > nic > > > > > > + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + > > + > > > > "talkers do not know, knowers do not talk." lao-tzu > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > -- Mechanize something idiosyncratic. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 21:51:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41085-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:51:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:50:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 37381 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:53:58 +0000 Received: (qmail 37365 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:53:57 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:50:43 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=hKKkzV4XG839hdSX9NYNB6qKjYGY3qIGiCROhddUnvNGy4Gk2Cxepy3iPvgdRCzyD4sWYFlUWJEjv5udGEVci5TgPUHunASdDkJBcg3yzsFrCFMmECnObtWyBV24+eaNEJoIwN4W2vahFC14FAJEEz1TIvEXDI/EMepZTpjA228= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I realized what bothered me about this whole line of argument: It's the assumption that the visual and audio are opposed. In reality, in a good musician the two things are complementary. Some of the lines of argument people take seem to create a false dualism, where I don't think there's any real opposition. ~David On 12/19/06, Eric Lyon <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. > > > Visual representation of sound is evil. > > Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could tell us > for sure. > > A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR (post > recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation for > propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual > representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our minds > (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to argue, > really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important > distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter is > inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, > whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds > outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by virtue > of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is > indispensible but visual representation is not. The musical conception of a > piece that is implemented with Live can precede the software in a way that > an 18th century piano sonata conception could not precede the limitations > and affordances of european music notation. (Did Mozart ever complain about > not being able to write 1/4 tones the way folks here are complaining about > Live's loop-bias doing their heads in?) > > As a side note, I nominate the optional nature of PR music's visual > representation as a key reason why the wackiest looking music scores show up > in the 20th century. Once freed from necessity, some people get looser with > the tool, or start twirling it around over their heads. > > Eric > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 21:49:45 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41084-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:49:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:49:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 35882 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:52:44 +0000 Received: (qmail 35863 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:52:43 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:49:31 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: tUYiNOUVM1lvEXaYtDXmleqNZTfuGe1YUN4vkLiPj.HLp100Cr0HDWBH5ymg1rm9vJ6QklHRGDvdRnxo9Nb7AgMQ7WwkRIBUM6z5hxpV71icsE6Ti39YiwsmXQo60VJKeC0YjQYsaPOBfec- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hmm.. well I can say from experience that including visuals in no way insures that people will sense what you sensed as an artist. Personally I'm interested in finding out how people experience it differently. But I think you can use the visuals to communicate ideas that support the music that might be difficult to convey with sublety and clarity with just sounds. In regards to software interfaces.. there are many and no single one will work best for all. The tools in this case have influenced or even made possible new styles and genres of music... especially electronic music. I can't agree that visuals in either case are inherently evil.. if so then more people should be gouging their eyes out in protest. ;-) AD --- Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > We live in a primarily visual culture. Or we believe we do.. > > Personally I'm a sound->vision/touch synaesthete and I want other > people > to sense what I sense when I hear things.. that's my interest in > putting > visuals to my music. Not that I've actually done any visuals or > anything > like that yet. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 21:28:28 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41083-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:28:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:28:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 25740 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:31:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 25727 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:31:29 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 10:28:12 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer/ Birchville Cat Motel In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <000901c72394$a44dc2c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx emanuele de raymondi wrote: > In reply to a previous post, I believe that laying out a score for a > symphony > is extremely different than laying out .WAV or .AIFF files and MIDI tracks. I love to listen to and I love to make music that is made without the aid of sequencing devices, or at least with sequencing devices used as texture creators, rather than as rigid development-over-time parameters. The best microsound-y music happens when you set up enough equipment that you don't fully understand what's going on, fiddle knobs until it sounds awesome, then hit record. Anyone here ever seen Birchville Cat Motel live? -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 21:25:22 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41082-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:25:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:25:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 23160 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:28:20 +0000 Received: (qmail 23149 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:28:20 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 10:25:00 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Xdugef wrote: > I have no doubt that this no agreement that sound needs visual > representation. > > Where is the pressure to include visuals coming from? Are electronic > music programs telling students to include visual now? > Is the success of youtube making muscians without visuals feel > humbled?? We live in a primarily visual culture. Or we believe we do.. Personally I'm a sound->vision/touch synaesthete and I want other people to sense what I sense when I hear things.. that's my interest in putting visuals to my music. Not that I've actually done any visuals or anything like that yet. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 21:10:49 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41081-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:10:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:10:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15195 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:13:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 15167 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:13:44 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:10:30 +0000 From: Eric Lyon <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Re: an interesting monolake answer To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_yU/rw462ByjWpHzFgXkPdw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=VBxh16JVSIn2q6LjyTlhQiot/CI1laxj/bCYyLtWYf0gQ49sDclzPUdQ2H+7dOuL1HYg2B98ph9BuviOG5YhID6K2hzrgbG+bXdtSwgF592z9GDbO19RvePf7T2OwmRyrpvz6d7PA7HwVx3BJTyFE8KEbPFkkBmX2vQeAhckGkk= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_yU/rw462ByjWpHzFgXkPdw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nice thread, thus Robert's provocative statement must be respected. > Visual representation of sound is evil. Perhaps aural representation of sound is *live* ? Only Miles could tell us for sure. A defining distinction between BR (before recording) music and PR (post recording) music is that the former requires a visual representation for propagation, the latter does not. How much do we still need a visual representation to concretize the musical conceptions we conjure in our minds (for those of us who still consider ourselves composers)? I want to argue, really not much at all anymore. In this regard there is an important distinction between visual representation and abstraction. The latter is inevitable in music conception since any musical conception I know of, whether a tonal fugue or the decision to listen intently to the sounds outside your dwelling, involves abstraction; if nothing else, then by virtue of attention to the processes of auditory cognition. Abstraction is indispensible but visual representation is not. The musical conception of a piece that is implemented with Live can precede the software in a way that an 18th century piano sonata conception could not precede the limitations and affordances of european music notation. (Did Mozart ever complain about not being able to write 1/4 tones the way folks here are complaining about Live's loop-bias doing their heads in?) As a side note, I nominate the optional nature of PR music's visual representation as a key reason why the wackiest looking music scores show up in the 20th century. Once freed from necessity, some people get looser with the tool, or start twirling it around over their heads. Eric --Boundary_(ID_yU/rw462ByjWpHzFgXkPdw)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 19:18:19 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41080-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:18:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:18:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 41332 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:20:20 +0000 Received: (qmail 41249 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:20:15 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:17:01 -0500 From: emanuele de raymondi <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <000901c72394$a44dc2c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_F8tEw82T99GDTujPXt7EMw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=quPNYBz1fWPdZtKEEbTVJ72+CEiiLpeIRk8HmMx8njptYcRi6F6Ogk4SV38aQbicOhHQkCTkSZ7WYv4Du2TRmbiiP9t9h5aHt3/pjDKslgI6PR1u6ECS7kg6HE4WgaDAriBFHkMfPw8Ks5MwzgQhxfgPFMeFfCqRjn2z118YupY= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <000901c72394$a44dc2c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_F8tEw82T99GDTujPXt7EMw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My main issue with the visual representation of sound in Sequencers is the loss of the vertical dimension. The concept of layering tracks horizontally one after the other has, in my opinion, greatly narrowed the creative thinking in assembling musical sounds. This is reflected in most of the mainstream music we hear nowdays. In traditional music notation the vertical and the horizontal dimentions have equal value. This balance is one of the great conceptual forces that shaped Western music from, from Monteverdi to Stockhausen. In reply to a previous post, I believe that laying out a score for a symphony is extremely different than laying out .WAV or .AIFF files and MIDI tracks. In my own everyday experience of working with both media, I find the difference in musicl thinking to be vast. edr --Boundary_(ID_F8tEw82T99GDTujPXt7EMw)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 18:17:47 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41079-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:17:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:17:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 7575 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 18:20:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 7553 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 18:20:13 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:16:59 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] the ambient addition To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_WH0sL4OWAEDWHNTDISKepg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_WH0sL4OWAEDWHNTDISKepg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit check this: http://web.media.mit.edu/~nvawter/thesis/index.html Ambient Addition is a Walkman with binaural microphones. A tiny Digital Signal Processing (DSP) chip analyzes the microphone's sound and superimposes a layer of harmony and rhythm on top of the listener's world. In the new context, some surprising behaviors take place. Listeners tend to play with objects around them, sing to themselves, and wander toward tempting sound sources. With Ambient Addition, I'm hoping to make people think twice about the sounds they initiate as well as loosen up some inhibitions. --Boundary_(ID_WH0sL4OWAEDWHNTDISKepg)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 18:14:17 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41078-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:14:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:14:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4676 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 18:16:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 4659 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 18:16:55 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:13:42 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: 8qBHu68VM1mPqwITPvVrMCTwouSXVUwkIL4KvAQ37V5umE2t0WoK6dUe5doQKkUjdnWL2M8AuzIb6tWi.g1zL50CfH9F4NTgMZvMF9t1C0BDL9NSehhAvoF8ctFcYxx1MeduGSrLZm06MWI- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > The other issue is the visual representation of sound. All musicians > will agree that sound is powerful enough to need some visual > representation. IMHO I have no doubts about that. What is tested here > is our capacity to resist the pressure that the audio-visual mass > culture is making on us. I have no doubt that this no agreement that sound needs visual representation. Where is the pressure to include visuals coming from? Are electronic music programs telling students to include visual now? Is the success of youtube making muscians without visuals feel humbled?? > Should we add visuals to our music? (done by ourselves or with the > aid of > a filmmaker). Could it be that we are lacking performance skills? Or > even > musical skills to generate a really overwhelming musical or sound > enviroment for an audience? Should a musician perform? Is it > mandatory? > The problem is deeper than it seems. Obviously these are questions that individuals must decide for themselves.. I don't see why there has to be a group consensus over it. Adrian --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 17:40:00 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41077-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:40:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:39:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 82848 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:42:48 +0000 Received: (qmail 82836 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:42:48 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:39:31 -0500 From: Eloy Anzola <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: RE: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <000901c72394$a44dc2c0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-index: AccjjzpfpKtKaqHDSmaDTmui4LJaegAAwgqQ X-DCC--Metrics: ss73.shared.server-system.net 1368; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Just wanted to quickly say that I completely agree with Henke's quote. The applications we use have an important effect on our process and final result. Period. Sequencers (Protools, Logic, DP, etc...) encourage us to think in very specifics way -- multiple tracks displaying oh so very linear info -- Sequencers are the mainstream and thus this way of working/thinking is a major influence on almost all the music we hear today. I have in fact, meet many professional musicians and producers who don't even realize it is possible to compose, perform and edit in other ways. Thankfully, this list is open to experimentation and alternatives. Also, about quantization, I understand what you all mean in the context of this discussion. But make no mistake: everything you input into the computer is quantized. ALWAYS. -- It doesn't matter if quantize is turned on or off. 'Quantize on' simply makes it adhere to more particular rules. -- Ultimately, aware or not, like all other instruments, the computer is a filter. The tool has become the message. keep composing. cheers, Eloy ----- xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx 347.225.1058 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 17:03:55 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41076-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:03:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:03:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 61223 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:05:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 61202 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:05:48 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:02:32 -0500 From: Guillaume Grenier <xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Le 06-12-19 à 02:12, David Powers a écrit : > I strongly disagree, because, his point is NOT meant only to apply to > performing, but equally to creating/composing. In fact, I don't think > he was really talk about performance at all. What indication do you > find that he's referencing performing as opposed to > producing/arranging/composing? And laying out a score for a symphony, > isn't so different from laying out .WAV or .AIFF files (or Midi > pianoroll) in the digital sequencing program of your choice. You're right that he was emphasizing the composing aspect -- that wasn't what I had in mind when I wrote my first sentence. What I thought was that your examples (the jazz student who "learns a bunch of scales off a page" and John Coltrane who practices patterns from Slonimsky's Thesaurus of Scales) referred to the learning or formative process, which wasn't really linked to RH's point. Now, of course, I guess you could argue that the formative process is intrinsically linked to the composition process... > Should a composer not use any form of visual notation because some > people become fixated on such notation to the detriment of the music? > The very idea is ridiculous. If your music suffers from such visual > aids, it simply means you aren't a good musician/composer. > > ~David > > On 12/18/06, Guillaume Grenier <xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: >> Le 06-12-18 à 19:38, David Powers a écrit : >> >> > Another example (again not from the digital domain): >> > Every music school has their students in, say, the jazz program, >> who >> > learn a bunch of scales off a page but can't seem to ever use their >> > ears and put those patterns together in a musical way. But John >> > Coltrane was known to practice extensively from Slominzky's >> Thesaurus >> > of Scales (which is simply an abstract representation of basic >> musical >> > building blocks), and I think everyone would agree this only >> enhanced >> > his ability to improvise. >> >> Yeah... but I don't think the argument you're making here relates >> much to RH's point. >> >> A more relevant analogy with regards to a "traditional musical score >> situation" would be, I think, a comparison between a musician who >> performs a piece with a score versus one who performs a piece from >> memory. >> >> To me (and to the vast majority of classical performers, I'd venture >> to say), there is no question that playing from memory is vastly >> preferable. You are much more free to listen attentively — deeply — >> to the sounds you (or others, if you're doing chamber music) produce >> when your mind doesn't have to process a significant amount of visual >> information. >> >> It is thus no surprise that find myself in agreement with RH's view. >> >> g. >> >> -- >> Guillaume Grenier - xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx >> >> "Things are more like they are now than they ever were before." >> >> (Dwight Eisenhower) >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > g. -- Guillaume Grenier - xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx "Things are more like they are now than they ever were before." (Dwight Eisenhower) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 17:00:40 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41075-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:00:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:00:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 59445 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:03:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 59432 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:03:28 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:02:07 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <C1AE01E4.70C4%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <C1AE01E4.70C4%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx from my understanding in my past conversations with robert djing in abelton was not what it was developed for it was just an accidental use of the tool orginally developed as a live sequencing. and yes it was orginally and I belive still is all built or prototyped in max/msp and then broght over to c++ abelton has come a long was since the early days but one thing is for sure it was not made in mind as a djing tool... On Tue, 19 Dec 2006, Simon Hampson wrote: > I didn't think Ableton was created for djing. I always understood that > Robert & co drafted it as a live performance tool in MAX/MSP and then ported > it to C++ for a commercial release. > > The Djing thing was accidental.. > > Simon. > > > On 19/12/06 6:20 PM, "David Powers" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > >> Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between editing >> and generating. It's part of the same process... >> >> But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just trying to >> plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more >> about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, that >> it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T want to >> make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's >> workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I >> had to read the manual! >> >> ~D >> >> On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>> On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>> >>>> Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so lacking >>>> to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally >>>> intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with it and >>>> use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me >>>> absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... >>>> >>>> >>> That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live because >>> it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel like I'm on >>> Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's lacking is a >>> multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) >>> >>> But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual aid. I read >>> an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I think >>> that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I hardly >>> even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when I'm editing >>> it. >>> >>> ~Kyle >>> >>> -- >>> >>> http://theradioproject.com >>> http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com >>> >>> (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) >>> (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) >>> ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ >>> _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ >>> ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO >>> >>> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > Symbiosis - Experimental Sound Textures and Rhythms > > Wednesday nights / 10pm - 12am > 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au > Melbourne / Australia > xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 16:41:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41074-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 11:41:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 11:41:02 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 45228 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:42:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 45000 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:41:29 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 08:38:04 -0800 From: craquemattic <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I'll have to agree with Mr. Henke here, visual representation of sound is ultimately a crutch. I didn't read into this particular passage that he's talking at all about performance. On Dec 18, 2006, at 3:24 PM, Graham Miller wrote: > any thoughts on this? agree? disagree? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 16:24:25 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41073-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 11:24:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 11:24:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 36934 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:26:43 +0000 Received: (qmail 36876 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:26:35 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:24:05 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] tonight in stockholm To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <029201c7238a$1a7ae870$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Are you in Stockholm on wednesday too?... I think there might be some happening at Ugglan at Närkesgatan on Södermalm. (in the cellar) Not microsound though, but they often play very interesting music in the bar and a very nice and friendly place. /Björn Eriksson ----- Original Message ----- From: "philip leitner" <xxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 4:16 PM Subject: [microsound] tonight in stockholm > hi, > > i'm just on transfer in stockholm > > and now searching for an interessing concert or cultural event > happening tonight. > > i'm happy for any hint, as i'm absolutely stockholm newbie. > > thanks > > p > > -- > ++++++++++++++ > Der Autor distanziert sich deutlich vom ganzen Werbemüll ab der nächsten > Zeile > ++++++++++++++ > > Der GMX SmartSurfer hilft bis zu 70% Ihrer Onlinekosten zu sparen! > Ideal für Modem und ISDN: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/smartsurfer > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 15:56:00 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41072-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:56:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:55:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 21485 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:58:40 +0000 Received: (qmail 21465 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:58:39 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:56:10 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] gigs in january, anyone?? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <019901c72386$34885c10$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I think there should be a lot of different happenings in these cities. I think for instance there might be another round with Das Kleine Field Recordings Festival in januar in Berlin. But I might be wrong on this too.. ask Rinus van Alebeek. Another thing we could use the creativity and knowledge on this list is to add up to the wiki. There is some listings on venues in 4 countries that might be interesting to visit. You find these under Reference - Places Go here for the Europe section: http://www.interdisciplina.org/microsound-wiki/index.php/Europe To find to the Wiki, just follow the link at downl left "Wiki". To sign up for adding follow the instructions at "create account" at top right. Those e-mails that are subbed to the .microsound list are permitted to start an account. If any problem with this ask Paolo Mouat or me. Yours, Björn Eriksson ----- Original Message ----- From: "Javier Areal Vélez" <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 4:17 AM Subject: [microsound] gigs in january, anyone?? hello! altough I didnt get any replies to my first mail, I´m going to try once again: could any of you share some data about interesting gigs + art/sound instalations + etc, taking place during january 2007, in madrid, paris, london and/or berlin??? i'm travelling to these places and I really believe that there must be someone here who can help me out. i googled a lot but could not find any decent data. thank you! and i hope this isn't bothering you too much! Javier _________________________________________________________________ Descubre Live.com - tu propia página de inicio, personalizada para ver rápidamente todo lo que te interesa en un mismo sitio. http://www.live.com/getstarted --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 15:44:50 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41071-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:44:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:44:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15285 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:47:27 +0000 Received: (qmail 15249 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:47:25 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:40:36 -0500 From: Michael North <xxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: RE: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <001a01c72384$06e33fc0$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Has anyone looked at the ixi-software.net apps...for 3D interfaces they have micworld, which I've found interesting...... //*-----Original Message----- //*From: Graham Miller [mailto:xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx] //*Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 10:14 AM //*To: microsound //*Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer //* //*in this area i still think of that autechre video for gantz graf is a //*stunning hybrid of sound meets visuals: //* //*http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMRjmtSx24A //* //*but i think we're getting away from the original quote which wasn't //*so much about visuals and music in performance, but rather how GUI //*and the visual representation of music affects the music making //*process itself, positively or negatively. //* //*in my imagination, i have always thought that best kind of computer //*instrument would be closer to a military flight simulator. some kind //*immersive virtual 3D environment to navigate through, controlled //*either physically, or mentally. it would a sound space. this is, //*after all, what music is, in aural form: a sound space. //* //*or reverse engineer the gantz graf video, for instance. imagine that //*the video itself was a live interface for producing sound, and that //*the piece of music, was created by that interface, not the other way //*around, as it actually is. that gantz graf 'world' could be accessed //*through virtual reality technology and that geometry of the VR world //*could be manipulated, like an instrument, to produce sound. //* //*the reality of it is: there will be different interfaces for every //*person. the ultimate trend is total customization and individuality. //*just look at already how many different ways there are to use live. //*no two people i know use it exactly the same way, and its hardly at //*the level of customization of, say, MAX or reaktor. can the same be //*said for pro tools? //* //*g. //* //* //*On 19-Dec-06, at 8:03 AM, Cooptrol wrote: //* //*> I've been discussing this music-video dilemma for some time now, //*> even with //*> Rob Henke, or Thomas Koner for example. //*> //*> I've been trying to enter the video world by learning jitter, using //*> traditional software like premier or after effects. My conclusion //*> is that //*> no technical expertise can match the years in visual formation that //*> people //*> who make videos and movies have. I simply can't figure out how to //*> manage //*> the material, and how to develop a powerful audio-visual piece without //*> collapsing into the lame-visuals-good-music-or-viceversa problem. //*> //*> The other issue is the visual representation of sound. All //*> musicians will //*> agree that sound is powerful enough to need some visual //*> representation. //*> IMHO I have no doubts about that. What is tested here is our //*> capacity to //*> resist the pressure that the audio-visual mass culture is making on //*> us. //*> Should we add visuals to our music? (done by ourselves or with the //*> aid of //*> a filmmaker). Could it be that we are lacking performance skills? //*> Or even //*> musical skills to generate a really overwhelming musical or sound //*> enviroment for an audience? Should a musician perform? Is it //*> mandatory? //*> The problem is deeper than it seems. //*> //*> Some people has been successful in this quest and others haven't. //*> Check //*> out this example, the Incite duo from Hamburg. Excellent music with //*> excellent visuals, all homogenuous. And they told me they both do //*> visuals //*> and music (not the typical laptop musician/VJ line-up). And what's //*> more //*> outstanding is that they pre-edit everything and then reproduce //*> audio and //*> video clips in order following a written (!) score. //*> //*> http://www.incite.fragmentedmedia.org/video_incite.html //*> //*> Hernan //*> //*> www.cooptrol.com //*> //*> //*>> I didn't think Ableton was created for djing. I always understood //*>> that //*>> Robert & co drafted it as a live performance tool in MAX/MSP and then //*>> ported //*>> it to C++ for a commercial release. //*>> //*>> The Djing thing was accidental.. //*>> //*>> Simon. //*>> //*>> //*>> On 19/12/06 6:20 PM, "David Powers" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: //*>> //*>>> Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between //*>>> editing //*>>> and generating. It's part of the same process... //*>>> //*>>> But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just //*>>> trying to //*>>> plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more //*>>> about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, //*>>> that //*>>> it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T //*>>> want to //*>>> make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's //*>>> workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I //*>>> had to read the manual! //*>>> //*>>> ~D //*>>> //*>>> On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: //*>>>> On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: //*>>>> //*>>>>> Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so //*>>>>> lacking //*>>>>> to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally //*>>>>> intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with //*>>>>> it and //*>>>>> use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me //*>>>>> absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... //*>>>>> //*>>>>> //*>>>> That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live //*>>>> because //*>>>> it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel //*>>>> like I'm //*>>>> on //*>>>> Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's //*>>>> lacking is a //*>>>> multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) //*>>>> //*>>>> But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual //*>>>> aid. I //*>>>> read //*>>>> an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I //*>>>> think //*>>>> that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I //*>>>> hardly //*>>>> even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when //*>>>> I'm //*>>>> editing //*>>>> it. //*>>>> //*>>>> ~Kyle //*>>>> //*>>>> -- //*>>>> //*>>>> http://theradioproject.com //*>>>> http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com //*>>>> //*>>>> (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) //*>>>> (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) //*>>>> ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ //*>>>> _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ //*>>>> ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO //*>>>> //*>>>> //*>>> //*>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- //*>>> - //*>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*>>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*>>> website: http://www.microsound.org //*>>> //*>>> //*>> //*>> Symbiosis - Experimental Sound Textures and Rhythms //*>> //*>> Wednesday nights / 10pm - 12am //*>> 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au //*>> Melbourne / Australia //*>> xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx //*>> //*>> //*>> //*>> //*>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- //*>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*>> website: http://www.microsound.org //*>> //*>> //*> //*> //*> //*> --------------------------------------------------------------------- //*> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*> website: http://www.microsound.org //* //* //*--------------------------------------------------------------------- //*To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 15:17:19 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41070-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:17:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:17:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 248 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:20:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 231 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:20:07 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 16:16:55 +0100 From: philip leitner <xxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] tonight in stockholm To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: WWW-Mail 6100 (Global Message Exchange) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Authenticated: #17751425 X-Flags: 0001 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi, i'm just on transfer in stockholm and now searching for an interessing concert or cultural event happening tonight. i'm happy for any hint, as i'm absolutely stockholm newbie. thanks p -- ++++++++++++++ Der Autor distanziert sich deutlich vom ganzen Werbemüll ab der nächsten Zeile ++++++++++++++ Der GMX SmartSurfer hilft bis zu 70% Ihrer Onlinekosten zu sparen! Ideal für Modem und ISDN: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/smartsurfer --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 15:14:16 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41069-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:14:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:14:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 98013 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:16:55 +0000 Received: (qmail 97988 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:16:52 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 10:13:32 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <C1AE01E4.70C4%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx in this area i still think of that autechre video for gantz graf is a stunning hybrid of sound meets visuals: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMRjmtSx24A but i think we're getting away from the original quote which wasn't so much about visuals and music in performance, but rather how GUI and the visual representation of music affects the music making process itself, positively or negatively. in my imagination, i have always thought that best kind of computer instrument would be closer to a military flight simulator. some kind immersive virtual 3D environment to navigate through, controlled either physically, or mentally. it would a sound space. this is, after all, what music is, in aural form: a sound space. or reverse engineer the gantz graf video, for instance. imagine that the video itself was a live interface for producing sound, and that the piece of music, was created by that interface, not the other way around, as it actually is. that gantz graf 'world' could be accessed through virtual reality technology and that geometry of the VR world could be manipulated, like an instrument, to produce sound. the reality of it is: there will be different interfaces for every person. the ultimate trend is total customization and individuality. just look at already how many different ways there are to use live. no two people i know use it exactly the same way, and its hardly at the level of customization of, say, MAX or reaktor. can the same be said for pro tools? g. On 19-Dec-06, at 8:03 AM, Cooptrol wrote: > I've been discussing this music-video dilemma for some time now, > even with > Rob Henke, or Thomas Koner for example. > > I've been trying to enter the video world by learning jitter, using > traditional software like premier or after effects. My conclusion > is that > no technical expertise can match the years in visual formation that > people > who make videos and movies have. I simply can't figure out how to > manage > the material, and how to develop a powerful audio-visual piece without > collapsing into the lame-visuals-good-music-or-viceversa problem. > > The other issue is the visual representation of sound. All > musicians will > agree that sound is powerful enough to need some visual > representation. > IMHO I have no doubts about that. What is tested here is our > capacity to > resist the pressure that the audio-visual mass culture is making on > us. > Should we add visuals to our music? (done by ourselves or with the > aid of > a filmmaker). Could it be that we are lacking performance skills? > Or even > musical skills to generate a really overwhelming musical or sound > enviroment for an audience? Should a musician perform? Is it > mandatory? > The problem is deeper than it seems. > > Some people has been successful in this quest and others haven't. > Check > out this example, the Incite duo from Hamburg. Excellent music with > excellent visuals, all homogenuous. And they told me they both do > visuals > and music (not the typical laptop musician/VJ line-up). And what's > more > outstanding is that they pre-edit everything and then reproduce > audio and > video clips in order following a written (!) score. > > http://www.incite.fragmentedmedia.org/video_incite.html > > Hernan > > www.cooptrol.com > > >> I didn't think Ableton was created for djing. I always understood >> that >> Robert & co drafted it as a live performance tool in MAX/MSP and then >> ported >> it to C++ for a commercial release. >> >> The Djing thing was accidental.. >> >> Simon. >> >> >> On 19/12/06 6:20 PM, "David Powers" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> >>> Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between >>> editing >>> and generating. It's part of the same process... >>> >>> But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just >>> trying to >>> plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more >>> about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, >>> that >>> it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T >>> want to >>> make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's >>> workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I >>> had to read the manual! >>> >>> ~D >>> >>> On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>> On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so >>>>> lacking >>>>> to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally >>>>> intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with >>>>> it and >>>>> use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me >>>>> absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... >>>>> >>>>> >>>> That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live >>>> because >>>> it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel >>>> like I'm >>>> on >>>> Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's >>>> lacking is a >>>> multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) >>>> >>>> But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual >>>> aid. I >>>> read >>>> an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I >>>> think >>>> that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I >>>> hardly >>>> even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when >>>> I'm >>>> editing >>>> it. >>>> >>>> ~Kyle >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> http://theradioproject.com >>>> http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com >>>> >>>> (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) >>>> (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) >>>> ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ >>>> _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ >>>> ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> - >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >>> >>> >> >> Symbiosis - Experimental Sound Textures and Rhythms >> >> Wednesday nights / 10pm - 12am >> 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au >> Melbourne / Australia >> xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx >> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 14:58:48 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41068-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:58:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:58:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 88994 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:00:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 88945 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 15:00:31 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:57:09 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hilarious! it's the only software in my life where i haven't had to read the manual! i find live to be the most intuitive way to work. and i love the GUI - i agree w/ kyle: total ST:TNG (also check out the hartmann neuron and all things LEMUR). i guess that's why there are different products to choose from in our great individualist capitalist society:) g. On 19-Dec-06, at 2:20 AM, David Powers wrote: > Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between editing > and generating. It's part of the same process... > > But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just trying to > plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more > about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, that > it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T want to > make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's > workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I > had to read the manual! > > ~D > > On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> >> > Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so >> lacking >> > to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally >> > intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with >> it and >> > use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me >> > absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... >> > >> > >> That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live >> because >> it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel >> like I'm on >> Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's lacking >> is a >> multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) >> >> But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual >> aid. I read >> an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. >> I think >> that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I >> hardly >> even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when >> I'm editing >> it. >> >> ~Kyle >> >> -- >> >> http://theradioproject.com >> http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com >> >> (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) >> (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) >> ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ >> _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ >> ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO >> >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 14:53:24 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41067-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:53:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:53:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 86202 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:56:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 86186 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:56:01 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 08:52:47 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_XiwpLExEiMGWhuTh8NVoDQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=R0KebMlyP9P04nmo/pxqCPnyWybIcfPgfTlm3P/Vkcqq5Cf2FoOdmWkWmhHK0mFxutUSyW50pZF4hGHBbNlwfdASGzA7jGc22hVTAkdmkh7cHYnkFHPxEAyW8Eerz/WuXP91WkTz4SWkWjoF8GNQ0cY34XMpyBXd8bjLJbZNt28= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_XiwpLExEiMGWhuTh8NVoDQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is true. When I started using Ableton's software (late 2004) I ended up having to BUY Live 4 (after their well-executed marketing plan to break the cracked version after a few months) and I read the entire manual over a week. I never understand why people refuse to read manuals, thinking that they'll be more creative on their own. To me, reading a manual for a tool is just like Coltrane reading a scales book. It makes me MORE creative, not LESS. But yeah, I generally create everything without quantizing, buy playing it live into the computer through MIDI or recording. Sometimes I use a drum machine style beat, but other than that, it's pretty loose. ~Kyle On 12/19/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between editing > and generating. It's part of the same process... > > But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just trying to > plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more > about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, that > it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T want to > make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's > workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I > had to read the manual! > > ~D > > On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so lacking > > > to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally > > > intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with it and > > > use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me > > > absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... > > > > > > > > That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live > because > > it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel like I'm > on > > Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's lacking is a > > multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) > > > > But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual aid. I > read > > an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I > think > > that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I > hardly > > even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when I'm > editing > > it. > > > > ~Kyle > > > > -- > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_XiwpLExEiMGWhuTh8NVoDQ)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 14:17:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41066-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:17:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:17:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 67565 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:19:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 67552 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:19:41 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:12:56 -0500 From: Michael North <xxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: RE: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <000801c72377$c82d4980$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx //*From: David Powers [mailto:xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx] //*Another example (again not from the digital domain): //*Every music school has their students in, say, the jazz program, who //*learn a bunch of scales off a page but can't seem to ever use their //*ears and put those patterns together in a musical way. But John //*Coltrane was known to practice extensively from Slominzky's Thesaurus //*of Scales (which is simply an abstract representation of basic musical //*building blocks), and I think everyone would agree this only enhanced //*his ability to improvise. //* //*~David in jazz/usually/it's required the players have a firm grounding in scales, keys, chord progressions , transposition etc. as a basis for coherent soloing/interplay...as it is required that the players have a grounding in the standard jazz repertoire, an appreciation/understanding of what has come before them in terms of playing/tonal colourations/phrasing...this generally holds whether the player is involved in traditional, swing, cool, modal or the wildest fringes of the free music scene.................. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 13:10:37 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41065-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 08:10:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 08:10:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 34668 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:13:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 34657 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:13:35 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 14:08:45 +0100 From: steinbr=?ISO-8859-1?B?/A==?=chel <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] micro...something In-reply-to: <v03110700c1ad6048ef7a@[151.28.122.59]> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C1ADA2ED.4665%xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] micro...something Thread-index: AccjbtA3DuzEoI9iEduX4AARJHLkrA== X-Authenticated-Sender-Id: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.2.5.060620 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx nic, me thinks this is fantastic. do you know the "movie" entitled "der lauf der dinge" bei the swiss artist duo "fischli/weiss"? very similar... cheers, ralph. Am 19.12.2006 12:02 Uhr schrieb "nicola catalano" unter <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx>: > maybe many of you have already seen this... amazing, crazy zen > micro...something, me think! > > http://video.google.it/videoplay?docid=3163263343187879320&q=machine > > cheers! > nic > > > + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + > + > > "talkers do not know, knowers do not talk." lao-tzu > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > -- http://www.synchron.ch .:.::.:. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 13:04:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41064-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 08:04:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 08:04:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31055 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:06:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 31044 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 13:06:53 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 05:03:40 -0800 (PST) From: Cooptrol <xxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <C1AE01E4.70C4%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <C1AE01E4.70C4%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I've been discussing this music-video dilemma for some time now, even with Rob Henke, or Thomas Koner for example. I've been trying to enter the video world by learning jitter, using traditional software like premier or after effects. My conclusion is that no technical expertise can match the years in visual formation that people who make videos and movies have. I simply can't figure out how to manage the material, and how to develop a powerful audio-visual piece without collapsing into the lame-visuals-good-music-or-viceversa problem. The other issue is the visual representation of sound. All musicians will agree that sound is powerful enough to need some visual representation. IMHO I have no doubts about that. What is tested here is our capacity to resist the pressure that the audio-visual mass culture is making on us. Should we add visuals to our music? (done by ourselves or with the aid of a filmmaker). Could it be that we are lacking performance skills? Or even musical skills to generate a really overwhelming musical or sound enviroment for an audience? Should a musician perform? Is it mandatory? The problem is deeper than it seems. Some people has been successful in this quest and others haven't. Check out this example, the Incite duo from Hamburg. Excellent music with excellent visuals, all homogenuous. And they told me they both do visuals and music (not the typical laptop musician/VJ line-up). And what's more outstanding is that they pre-edit everything and then reproduce audio and video clips in order following a written (!) score. http://www.incite.fragmentedmedia.org/video_incite.html Hernan www.cooptrol.com > I didn't think Ableton was created for djing. I always understood that > Robert & co drafted it as a live performance tool in MAX/MSP and then > ported > it to C++ for a commercial release. > > The Djing thing was accidental.. > > Simon. > > > On 19/12/06 6:20 PM, "David Powers" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > >> Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between editing >> and generating. It's part of the same process... >> >> But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just trying to >> plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more >> about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, that >> it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T want to >> make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's >> workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I >> had to read the manual! >> >> ~D >> >> On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>> On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >>> >>>> Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so lacking >>>> to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally >>>> intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with it and >>>> use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me >>>> absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... >>>> >>>> >>> That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live >>> because >>> it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel like I'm >>> on >>> Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's lacking is a >>> multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) >>> >>> But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual aid. I >>> read >>> an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I >>> think >>> that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I >>> hardly >>> even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when I'm >>> editing >>> it. >>> >>> ~Kyle >>> >>> -- >>> >>> http://theradioproject.com >>> http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com >>> >>> (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) >>> (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) >>> ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ >>> _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ >>> ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO >>> >>> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > Symbiosis - Experimental Sound Textures and Rhythms > > Wednesday nights / 10pm - 12am > 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au > Melbourne / Australia > xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 11:18:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41063-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 06:18:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 06:18:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 76744 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 11:20:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 76725 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 11:20:40 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 12:02:43 +0100 From: nicola catalano <xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] micro...something In-reply-to: <C1ACC872.10A4%xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> X-Sender: xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx (Unverified) To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <v03110700c1ad6048ef7a@[151.28.122.59]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Scanned: with antispam and antivirus automated system at libero.it X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx maybe many of you have already seen this... amazing, crazy zen micro...something, me think! http://video.google.it/videoplay?docid=3163263343187879320&q=machine cheers! nic + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + "talkers do not know, knowers do not talk." lao-tzu --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 09:54:21 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41062-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 04:54:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 04:54:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 34991 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:57:11 +0000 Received: (qmail 34975 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 09:57:09 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 20:53:56 +1100 From: Simon Hampson <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C1AE01E4.70C4%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer Thread-index: AccjU5kH17a1BI9GEdufIgAWy4ns3A== X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.2.5.060620 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I didn't think Ableton was created for djing. I always understood that Robert & co drafted it as a live performance tool in MAX/MSP and then ported it to C++ for a commercial release. The Djing thing was accidental.. Simon. On 19/12/06 6:20 PM, "David Powers" <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between editing > and generating. It's part of the same process... > > But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just trying to > plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more > about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, that > it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T want to > make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's > workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I > had to read the manual! > > ~D > > On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> >>> Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so lacking >>> to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally >>> intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with it and >>> use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me >>> absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... >>> >>> >> That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live because >> it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel like I'm on >> Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's lacking is a >> multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) >> >> But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual aid. I read >> an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I think >> that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I hardly >> even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when I'm editing >> it. >> >> ~Kyle >> >> -- >> >> http://theradioproject.com >> http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com >> >> (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) >> (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) >> ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ >> _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ >> ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO >> >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > Symbiosis - Experimental Sound Textures and Rhythms Wednesday nights / 10pm - 12am 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au Melbourne / Australia xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 07:20:25 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41061-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:20:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:20:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 67264 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:23:28 +0000 Received: (qmail 67253 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:23:27 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 01:20:17 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=WUA/IBaE4NVLuthfvykn4vcnjeWvmsAltnNEVHscUVC9N5tf8DUxsnm0w6RfhWf2sXe3FJKqKM3rilR19ZDJkTZvh8vw29J6rkfVYseGLoMfpVLHb5J+VQaIJ+KY7PkfgmTgf5lJE+em4F6viuFXuRUgarjdV/9NfYdsCsuh0M4= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Interesting ... for me, I couldn't really draw a line between editing and generating. It's part of the same process... But I LOATHE the piano roll, and I've also had problems just trying to plug in a keyboard and play a simple live keyboard part. It's more about assumptions Ableton makes about what I want to create, ie, that it's a loop, that it should be quantitized. Every time I DON'T want to make a loop, it turns out to be a real pain. I know there's workarounds, but this is almost the only software in my life where I had to read the manual! ~D On 12/19/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so lacking > > to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally > > intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with it and > > use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me > > absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... > > > > > That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live because > it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel like I'm on > Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's lacking is a > multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) > > But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual aid. I read > an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I think > that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I hardly > even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when I'm editing > it. > > ~Kyle > > -- > > http://theradioproject.com > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 07:17:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41060-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:17:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:17:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 65164 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:20:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 65152 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:20:08 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 01:16:58 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_CcsyYcXuSNsa0zcvYgPAZQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=XMb8FN/RGQCuxVCp4fChsOyNv+zXoxWN6whVkuV3pp8/TfpvfT+Vgx6z3ciBugEk4GvIbmXlS8stygWSma2uCnAPlYpcvu3tWQDZV/RJZ6U7J2eBx+9hkCtJ/bW7eSVuwy8Ol+hbiKgIo6AXQ2cy89MV6Vpldj3nouo8WG2Hbw8= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_CcsyYcXuSNsa0zcvYgPAZQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 12/18/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so lacking > to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally > intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with it and > use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me > absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... > > That's funny, because I find that I am so addicted to Ableton Live because it has the most elegant interface that I've ever used. I feel like I'm on Star Trek: The Next Generation when I use it. All that's lacking is a multi-touch screen (pleeeease Apple!) But I do agree that it's nice to listen to music w/out visual aid. I read an Autechre interview where they discuss similar things as well. I think that the visual aspect is great for editing, but not producing. I hardly even look at the screen when I'm generating content, rather when I'm editing it. ~Kyle -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_CcsyYcXuSNsa0zcvYgPAZQ)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 07:12:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41059-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:12:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:12:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 62743 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:15:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 62730 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:15:17 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 01:12:06 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=eKkEY37dEZsRurzqWe+MNU8qJ7eSV1YyIFJgNsNDsrc50vQDjeTGAKKvSHBfKfg3ELOXmbWM9Thk5bCl6kfEkORtYScB8uz9Innx+HKKLTfPe/d4c/FIAU4/FK0k/xVP8BqgGRKeGU3BPplkacyIeK6oTHkZXyvbIMdgdKUkSt0= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I strongly disagree, because, his point is NOT meant only to apply to performing, but equally to creating/composing. In fact, I don't think he was really talk about performance at all. What indication do you find that he's referencing performing as opposed to producing/arranging/composing? And laying out a score for a symphony, isn't so different from laying out .WAV or .AIFF files (or Midi pianoroll) in the digital sequencing program of your choice. Should a composer not use any form of visual notation because some people become fixated on such notation to the detriment of the music? The very idea is ridiculous. If your music suffers from such visual aids, it simply means you aren't a good musician/composer. ~David On 12/18/06, Guillaume Grenier <xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > Le 06-12-18 à 19:38, David Powers a écrit : > > > Another example (again not from the digital domain): > > Every music school has their students in, say, the jazz program, who > > learn a bunch of scales off a page but can't seem to ever use their > > ears and put those patterns together in a musical way. But John > > Coltrane was known to practice extensively from Slominzky's Thesaurus > > of Scales (which is simply an abstract representation of basic musical > > building blocks), and I think everyone would agree this only enhanced > > his ability to improvise. > > Yeah... but I don't think the argument you're making here relates > much to RH's point. > > A more relevant analogy with regards to a "traditional musical score > situation" would be, I think, a comparison between a musician who > performs a piece with a score versus one who performs a piece from > memory. > > To me (and to the vast majority of classical performers, I'd venture > to say), there is no question that playing from memory is vastly > preferable. You are much more free to listen attentively — deeply — > to the sounds you (or others, if you're doing chamber music) produce > when your mind doesn't have to process a significant amount of visual > information. > > It is thus no surprise that find myself in agreement with RH's view. > > g. > > -- > Guillaume Grenier - xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx > > "Things are more like they are now than they ever were before." > > (Dwight Eisenhower) > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 04:40:46 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41057-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:40:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:40:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 95519 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 04:43:39 +0000 Received: (qmail 95465 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 04:43:38 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 21:15:26 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] year-enders In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230901c1ad1695311b@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >So, to preempt the deluge of year-end favorites lists, I'd love to >see some thought about a slightly tougher list.... Anyone want to >submit a short list (preferably just a single album/piece) of music >this I really enjoyed Gintas K's work "Jamaika" which you can download at http://www.archive.org/details/pmact8 lost track on how many times I played it... I like the idea that the whole work was built from one 2-second clip of material. I found it very meditative and relaxing while retaining an edge during the whole piece. what else? it speaks the language of sound better than I can circumscribe it with words... other work of his is at http://www.last.fm/music/Gintas+K Merry New Year, Peace NOW. JH --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 07:01:13 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41058-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:01:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 02:01:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 56971 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:04:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 56955 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 07:04:14 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:07:31 -0500 From: Guillaume Grenier <xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Le 06-12-18 à 19:38, David Powers a écrit : > Another example (again not from the digital domain): > Every music school has their students in, say, the jazz program, who > learn a bunch of scales off a page but can't seem to ever use their > ears and put those patterns together in a musical way. But John > Coltrane was known to practice extensively from Slominzky's Thesaurus > of Scales (which is simply an abstract representation of basic musical > building blocks), and I think everyone would agree this only enhanced > his ability to improvise. Yeah... but I don't think the argument you're making here relates much to RH's point. A more relevant analogy with regards to a "traditional musical score situation" would be, I think, a comparison between a musician who performs a piece with a score versus one who performs a piece from memory. To me (and to the vast majority of classical performers, I'd venture to say), there is no question that playing from memory is vastly preferable. You are much more free to listen attentively — deeply — to the sounds you (or others, if you're doing chamber music) produce when your mind doesn't have to process a significant amount of visual information. It is thus no surprise that find myself in agreement with RH's view. g. -- Guillaume Grenier - xxxxxxx.x@xxxxxxxxx.xx "Things are more like they are now than they ever were before." (Dwight Eisenhower) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 03:36:51 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41056-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:36:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:36:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 69503 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 03:39:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 69491 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 03:39:45 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:36:34 -0500 From: michael trommer <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] year-enders In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C1ACC872.10A4%xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] year-enders Thread-index: AccjHuFYIBVDfY8SEduSCgAWy9DJLA== X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.2.5.060620 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Of the new stuff i've bought this year: the burial cd (hyperdub) comes immediately to mind...still on heavy rotation after many months (and I normally don't do this kind of thing). On 12/18/06 10:13 PM, "Scott Carver" <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > So, to preempt the deluge of year-end favorites lists, I'd love to see > some thought about a slightly tougher list.... Anyone want to submit a > short list (preferably just a single album/piece) of music this year > that, for you, was truly a leap forward ( sideways, if you want to > avoid Hegelian connotations) for microsound music, or music in general? > Something that shifted the landscape, forced it's way into new > territories, something that was unforgettably powerful or compelling, > something incommensurable... Not so much the album that you listened to > the most on your way to work, but more, the album that will be > troubling you for a long time, the one that got you excited about the > possibilities of music. Or, if not any of these things, then whatever > comes closest. And why. > > I've got to think for a bit about my choice. > > - Scott Carver > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 03:17:48 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41055-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:17:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:17:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 62696 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 03:20:46 +0000 Received: (qmail 62686 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 03:20:46 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2006 00:17:38 -0300 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Javier_Areal_V=E9lez?= <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] gigs in january, anyone?? X-Originating-IP: [201.254.232.192] To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Email: [xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2006 03:17:38.0573 (UTC) FILETIME=[3C93E3D0:01C7231C] hello! altough I didnt get any replies to my first mail, I´m going to try once again: could any of you share some data about interesting gigs + art/sound instalations + etc, taking place during january 2007, in madrid, paris, london and/or berlin??? i'm travelling to these places and I really believe that there must be someone here who can help me out. i googled a lot but could not find any decent data. thank you! and i hope this isn't bothering you too much! Javier _________________________________________________________________ Descubre Live.com - tu propia página de inicio, personalizada para ver rápidamente todo lo que te interesa en un mismo sitio. http://www.live.com/getstarted --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 03:13:54 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41054-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:13:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:13:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 60705 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 03:16:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 60679 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 03:16:50 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 19:13:32 -0800 From: Scott Carver <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] year-enders To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx So, to preempt the deluge of year-end favorites lists, I'd love to see some thought about a slightly tougher list.... Anyone want to submit a short list (preferably just a single album/piece) of music this year that, for you, was truly a leap forward ( sideways, if you want to avoid Hegelian connotations) for microsound music, or music in general? Something that shifted the landscape, forced it's way into new territories, something that was unforgettably powerful or compelling, something incommensurable... Not so much the album that you listened to the most on your way to work, but more, the album that will be troubling you for a long time, the one that got you excited about the possibilities of music. Or, if not any of these things, then whatever comes closest. And why. I've got to think for a bit about my choice. - Scott Carver --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 19 00:38:51 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41053-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 19:38:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 19:38:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 92719 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 00:41:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 92706 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 00:41:46 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:38:37 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=WroS11DoYWNDXrY+PvJue6sys15j4xrBdN/QzfYJByDeT0c1gNyJVE2CkoPIvhhioed/DUI9gUZ5oDeQYfSlE67oEmya/1oMaa92bjljuZf7YbP8YPzNKtr0uucrX4CfjMoHGPUBXYWLnzlUR5qFFFaW+SCFV2h6C6IjHgMvFso= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/18/06, Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > any thoughts on this? agree? disagree? > g. > from: http://www.vagueterrain.net/content/archives/journal05/ > monolake02.html > RH: Visual representation of sound is evil. Maybe this explains why Ableton's interface seems visually so lacking to me. Okay, it's great for doing live DJing as it was originally intended, but every time I go to write some kind of piece with it and use it more like a traditional sequencer, the interface drives me absolutely insane. I just can't get a good workflow going in it... Also, this question of the visual vs. aural is at least as old as Western Europeans started seriously notating music (not sure if this would apply to any other cultures). More to the point, I think it's silly to call visual representation "evil" in fact. Sure, there is a danger that the visual as tool has a detrimental influence on the music. But, it is equally true that there are fascinating musical processes, which are only made possible, or can only be controlled, through or with the assistance of various visualization and abstraction procedures (whether it is traditional notation, mathematical represesentation, or digital representation). Some examples: Traditional counterpoint Any complex symphonic orchestration Serial/post-serial musical procedures John Cage's music and various chance procedures generative patches created in PD, Max, or Reaktor all DSP (not the GUI, but the code as the representation of sound) Another example (again not from the digital domain): Every music school has their students in, say, the jazz program, who learn a bunch of scales off a page but can't seem to ever use their ears and put those patterns together in a musical way. But John Coltrane was known to practice extensively from Slominzky's Thesaurus of Scales (which is simply an abstract representation of basic musical building blocks), and I think everyone would agree this only enhanced his ability to improvise. ~David --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 18 23:58:42 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41052-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:58:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:58:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 70426 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 00:01:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 70413 invoked from network); Tue, 19 Dec 2006 00:01:35 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 19:00:18 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I agree.. sonic artists for the most part should stick to what they do boest and video artists need to do the same the only truely great combos I have seen come from media artist who have worked with both mediums from day one... or when video artist and sonic artists collaberation... but when a sonic or video artist try to do one or the other it just comes off for the most part as a medium that they just dont know to well and are just slapping it onto thier set up becasue they think they have to... On Mon, 18 Dec 2006, xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: > > On the broader topic of marrying visuals with sound, I think most attempts > I've experienced are clumsy. To me it is very common to see well developed > sonic work undermined with weakly conceived, cliched visuals, and vice > versa. ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 18 23:53:09 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41051-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:53:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:53:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 67097 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:55:58 +0000 Received: (qmail 67086 invoked from network); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:55:58 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 15:52:48 -0800 (PST) From: xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.xxx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: SquirrelMail/1.4.3a Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Score: 3.265 (NO_REAL_NAME,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS,URIBL_OB_SURBL) X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.3a Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Level: !!! In Live I just swap to clip view if I don't want the timeline. Ffor me it is repetitively listening to a piece that makes me think something is boring, not the visual representation. On the broader topic of marrying visuals with sound, I think most attempts I've experienced are clumsy. To me it is very common to see well developed sonic work undermined with weakly conceived, cliched visuals, and vice versa. > any thoughts on this? agree? disagree? > > when i used to work in cubase VST one of the great things about it > was the fact you could turn off the display within cubase and just > listen to the music with a black screen. i am always surprised why > this feature doesn't appear in more audio software. i was hoping they > would add this ability to ableton live 6. now after reading this > comment by henke i'm really surprised they didn't! > > > > g. > > > > from: http://www.vagueterrain.net/content/archives/journal05/ > monolake02.html > > VT: I’m interested in the interaction between the visual interface > (say Atlantic Waves or Ableton Live) and musical creation. How do you > think the evolution of sound creation tools from aural to visual has > changed our relationship to sound? For example, sound editing has > shifted from a primary reliance on our ears (i.e. tape splicing) > towards visual representations of sound (i.e. waveform editors). How > do you think this changes our perception of sound? > > RH: Visual representation of sound is evil. A waveform editor is an > enormous help when editing sound but at the same time it has the > potential to keep the composer effectively from listening. The > visualization by nature stresses the abstract formal quality of a > work but makes no statement about its content. The result is obvious, > a lot of music these days works correctly according to a formal > scheme but lacks beauty within. It takes quite some courage to work > against the visual scheme, because oddly structured parts look so > wrong. The timeline always tells us how long a piece is in bars or > seconds but it knows nothing about our perception of time. We might > think a part is too long because it looks long on screen but in fact > it is interesting enough to be much longer and we would not shorten > it if we could not see it but just listened. I often turn off the > screen or close my eyes when listening to my edits because the visual > representation is a false friend. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 18 23:29:25 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41050-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:29:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:29:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 51430 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:32:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 51420 invoked from network); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:32:18 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 15:29:10 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I guess using the power off button on the monitor doesn't count? ;-) AD --- Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > any thoughts on this? agree? disagree? > > when i used to work in cubase VST one of the great things about it > was the fact you could turn off the display within cubase and just > listen to the music with a black screen. i am always surprised why > this feature doesn't appear in more audio software. i was hoping they > > would add this ability to ableton live 6. now after reading this > comment by henke i'm really surprised they didn't! > > > > g. > > > > from: http://www.vagueterrain.net/content/archives/journal05/ > monolake02.html > > VT: I’m interested in the interaction between the visual interface > (say Atlantic Waves or Ableton Live) and musical creation. How do you > > think the evolution of sound creation tools from aural to visual has > > changed our relationship to sound? For example, sound editing has > shifted from a primary reliance on our ears (i.e. tape splicing) > towards visual representations of sound (i.e. waveform editors). How > > do you think this changes our perception of sound? > > RH: Visual representation of sound is evil. A waveform editor is an > > enormous help when editing sound but at the same time it has the > potential to keep the composer effectively from listening. The > visualization by nature stresses the abstract formal quality of a > work but makes no statement about its content. The result is obvious, > > a lot of music these days works correctly according to a formal > scheme but lacks beauty within. It takes quite some courage to work > against the visual scheme, because oddly structured parts look so > wrong. The timeline always tells us how long a piece is in bars or > seconds but it knows nothing about our perception of time. We might > think a part is too long because it looks long on screen but in fact > > it is interesting enough to be much longer and we would not shorten > it if we could not see it but just listened. I often turn off the > screen or close my eyes when listening to my edits because the visual > > representation is a false friend. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 18 23:24:55 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41049-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:24:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:24:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 47703 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:27:44 +0000 Received: (qmail 47668 invoked from network); Mon, 18 Dec 2006 23:27:44 +0000 Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 18:24:35 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] an interesting monolake answer To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_NVyECE3ptJWASMolS0IcVA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_NVyECE3ptJWASMolS0IcVA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit any thoughts on this? agree? disagree? when i used to work in cubase VST one of the great things about it was the fact you could turn off the display within cubase and just listen to the music with a black screen. i am always surprised why this feature doesn't appear in more audio software. i was hoping they would add this ability to ableton live 6. now after reading this comment by henke i'm really surprised they didn't! g. from: http://www.vagueterrain.net/content/archives/journal05/ monolake02.html VT: I’m interested in the interaction between the visual interface (say Atlantic Waves or Ableton Live) and musical creation. How do you think the evolution of sound creation tools from aural to visual has changed our relationship to sound? For example, sound editing has shifted from a primary reliance on our ears (i.e. tape splicing) towards visual representations of sound (i.e. waveform editors). How do you think this changes our perception of sound? RH: Visual representation of sound is evil. A waveform editor is an enormous help when editing sound but at the same time it has the potential to keep the composer effectively from listening. The visualization by nature stresses the abstract formal quality of a work but makes no statement about its content. The result is obvious, a lot of music these days works correctly according to a formal scheme but lacks beauty within. It takes quite some courage to work against the visual scheme, because oddly structured parts look so wrong. The timeline always tells us how long a piece is in bars or seconds but it knows nothing about our perception of time. We might think a part is too long because it looks long on screen but in fact it is interesting enough to be much longer and we would not shorten it if we could not see it but just listened. I often turn off the screen or close my eyes when listening to my edits because the visual representation is a false friend. --Boundary_(ID_NVyECE3ptJWASMolS0IcVA)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 18:52:42 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41048-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:52:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:52:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4437 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:55:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 4421 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:55:14 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 12:52:23 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_c5+2XdED4TUdbQMh7F48cQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=W8Afb/IpR9pmyWBD339YgtNJbMmI8RjYQ7qlARFnmQrbj+OTMkdja5eOVC9hXHvfvVxMnNgHmjUfilS1QX053R32vj0fcEpOoP7g5UWQuHNZIKykgW0rTwPtb7+fi7uh63aj1pOICEM+1R2+2okG5L+OocC0o9UcgSt851ild0U= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_c5+2XdED4TUdbQMh7F48cQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was thinking the exact same thing. The dissonance becomes fairly Jazzy if you just add twelve semitones here or there. ~Kyle On 12/15/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > What's wrong with those notes? > > Try putting the F# on the bottom, F#, C# E - that's a seventh chord > without the third. An A# makes it a dominant seventh chord, an A would > make it a minor seventh, and it's a perfectly good three note cell as > far as all that goes. > > Since three notes aren't enough for me, if it would me I'd do a mirror > inversion: > (F# C# [E) G D] '' > > That gives things a little bite... ;-) > > ~David > > On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > wait i screwed that up. if you translate it from your personal natal > chart, > > everyone would start with C. (your sun sign is always at top). so you > > would need to get the zodiacal information for your chart, and then > > translate it from a natural order zodiac. typically, C would be > > sagitarius. you can see a natural order zodiac here: > > > > http://borndigital.com/tree/esa/wheel.jpg > > > > so i would be Db, F#, E. (taurus, gemini, leo) > > > > not a pretty sounding chord. > > > > > > On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > you need to know your time and place of birth, and then you go here: > > > > > > http://alabe.com/freechart/ > > > > > > it will tell you your sun, moon, and rising sign (the 3 most > important) > > > > > > then if you need a circle of fifths chart, here is one: > > > > > > > > > > http://users2.ev1.net/~charliehb/Chavez/MathInMusic/Circle%20of%20Fifths.GIF > > > > > > you can then make it as complex as you like... you can take it from > degree > > > and make up a simple calculation to change it to frequency. > > > > > > so for instance, i am taurus sun, gemin moon, and leo rising. using > > > simple translation, my cosmic chord is C, Eb, F > > > > > > but it is possible to also take into account all planetary positioning > and > > > astrological degrees and tonal frequencies, etc. > > > > > > > > > On 12/15/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > This Cosmic Chord idea is fascinating. I'd love to hear how mine > > > > sounds. > > > > I'm not that familiar with astrological knowledge, so yes, as > requested > > > > by > > > > Milan: where can we find such details? > > > > > > > > ~Kyle > > > > > > > > > > > > On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > i dont know how one goes about actually creating the project in > > > > > microsound, > > > > > but an idea that i had toyed w/ a while back was based upon the 12 > > > > signs > > > > > of > > > > > the zodiac and the 12 steps to an octave. if you look at the > circle > > > > of > > > > > fifths it coincidentally looks like a zodiacal chart. there being > 360 > > > > > > > > > degrees in a natal chart, one could translate one's chart into a > > > > selected > > > > > octave's frequencies. or you could simply say that everyone has a > > > > cosmic > > > > > chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign > could be > > > > > > > > > configured based upon the corresponding notes in the circle of > fifths. > > > > > > > > > > dont know if i explained it well enough... but there's the idea > > > > anyhow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 12/15/06, xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx <xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > By all means... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_c5+2XdED4TUdbQMh7F48cQ)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 18:44:21 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41047-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:44:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:44:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 99009 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:46:59 +0000 Received: (qmail 98998 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:46:58 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 12:44:06 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=fveKd8XjUHVFrpSy6Z8ISMIEQCKcqJYkko8X1HlAtFa2ZcYsTq4vcfMDmCRZHQ/PfZ5HYZN4h+yerHqdHSh/DT9UTPVav96VU/svzP+7L2rnQXeB2aCODVgVIL/MG24W3QD2U4VLLNPj68Hp9QJK8cfnAwsoThhdSuxm5F1F70g= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > i dont know how one goes about actually creating the project in microsound, > but an idea that i had toyed w/ a while back was based upon the 12 signs of > the zodiac and the 12 steps to an octave. if you look at the circle of > fifths it coincidentally looks like a zodiacal chart. there being 360 > degrees in a natal chart, one could translate one's chart into a selected > octave's frequencies. or you could simply say that everyone has a cosmic > chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign could be > configured based upon the corresponding notes in the circle of fifths. Oh, something I forgot to mention: This reminds me a lot of the famous Coltrane diagram of the cycle of fifths, which in its appearance has some obvious mystical/esoteric significance. I can't find the image online, but I know I found it in the past. I do know, that originally Coltrane drew the image for Yussef Lateef, on 1960 on his birthday. It might be in Lateef's book... Still searching for the online link. ~David --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 18:32:39 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41046-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:32:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:32:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 92504 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:35:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 92484 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:35:14 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 12:32:21 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=eGzwrMdrJu6n+1wgpjJhQ2Jmr8dJNpIxBLvKIctqujinCEgf2EG7t4U8zMTOXxZHead/wJFITn0ZvoLrROVP4CxT4pkUjPQCUdNDfCCPe3JTIVBSDzFKGuGJmMIugH0dTK1iNYGd3HSKaL7hwGWkrz9xQvQ9CSNuwflA5pue5uQ= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx What's wrong with those notes? Try putting the F# on the bottom, F#, C# E - that's a seventh chord without the third. An A# makes it a dominant seventh chord, an A would make it a minor seventh, and it's a perfectly good three note cell as far as all that goes. Since three notes aren't enough for me, if it would me I'd do a mirror inversion: (F# C# [E) G D] '' That gives things a little bite... ;-) ~David On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > wait i screwed that up. if you translate it from your personal natal chart, > everyone would start with C. (your sun sign is always at top). so you > would need to get the zodiacal information for your chart, and then > translate it from a natural order zodiac. typically, C would be > sagitarius. you can see a natural order zodiac here: > > http://borndigital.com/tree/esa/wheel.jpg > > so i would be Db, F#, E. (taurus, gemini, leo) > > not a pretty sounding chord. > > > On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > you need to know your time and place of birth, and then you go here: > > > > http://alabe.com/freechart/ > > > > it will tell you your sun, moon, and rising sign (the 3 most important) > > > > then if you need a circle of fifths chart, here is one: > > > > > > http://users2.ev1.net/~charliehb/Chavez/MathInMusic/Circle%20of%20Fifths.GIF > > > > you can then make it as complex as you like... you can take it from degree > > and make up a simple calculation to change it to frequency. > > > > so for instance, i am taurus sun, gemin moon, and leo rising. using > > simple translation, my cosmic chord is C, Eb, F > > > > but it is possible to also take into account all planetary positioning and > > astrological degrees and tonal frequencies, etc. > > > > > > On 12/15/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > This Cosmic Chord idea is fascinating. I'd love to hear how mine > > > sounds. > > > I'm not that familiar with astrological knowledge, so yes, as requested > > > by > > > Milan: where can we find such details? > > > > > > ~Kyle > > > > > > > > > On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > i dont know how one goes about actually creating the project in > > > > microsound, > > > > but an idea that i had toyed w/ a while back was based upon the 12 > > > signs > > > > of > > > > the zodiac and the 12 steps to an octave. if you look at the circle > > > of > > > > fifths it coincidentally looks like a zodiacal chart. there being 360 > > > > > > > degrees in a natal chart, one could translate one's chart into a > > > selected > > > > octave's frequencies. or you could simply say that everyone has a > > > cosmic > > > > chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign could be > > > > > > > configured based upon the corresponding notes in the circle of fifths. > > > > > > > > dont know if i explained it well enough... but there's the idea > > > anyhow. > > > > > > > > > > > > On 12/15/06, xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx <xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > By all means... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 16:28:06 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41045-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 11:28:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 11:28:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 27776 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 16:30:44 +0000 Received: (qmail 27763 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 16:30:43 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:27:50 -0700 From: michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_XjVL1dTl21BsIbNZ1MsHJg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=JdHceL9cMV3e+mEGNlUD/Xh9sZ+0NM8OZyQRUYdJz8PlzZlFKffEFpg27gYyGK6Hi0GX71zu0m6cYIsRx5fU/YqMzo6qadyA70gDcFootWYCzSm7/TTjoGR8vLQENeki4ONXg4GCZWfssoNzSpsj9mIyrExx1ZocTUXWeFUE+F8= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_XjVL1dTl21BsIbNZ1MsHJg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit wait i screwed that up. if you translate it from your personal natal chart, everyone would start with C. (your sun sign is always at top). so you would need to get the zodiacal information for your chart, and then translate it from a natural order zodiac. typically, C would be sagitarius. you can see a natural order zodiac here: http://borndigital.com/tree/esa/wheel.jpg so i would be Db, F#, E. (taurus, gemini, leo) not a pretty sounding chord. On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > you need to know your time and place of birth, and then you go here: > > http://alabe.com/freechart/ > > it will tell you your sun, moon, and rising sign (the 3 most important) > > then if you need a circle of fifths chart, here is one: > > > http://users2.ev1.net/~charliehb/Chavez/MathInMusic/Circle%20of%20Fifths.GIF > > you can then make it as complex as you like... you can take it from degree > and make up a simple calculation to change it to frequency. > > so for instance, i am taurus sun, gemin moon, and leo rising. using > simple translation, my cosmic chord is C, Eb, F > > but it is possible to also take into account all planetary positioning and > astrological degrees and tonal frequencies, etc. > > > On 12/15/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > This Cosmic Chord idea is fascinating. I'd love to hear how mine > > sounds. > > I'm not that familiar with astrological knowledge, so yes, as requested > > by > > Milan: where can we find such details? > > > > ~Kyle > > > > > > On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > i dont know how one goes about actually creating the project in > > > microsound, > > > but an idea that i had toyed w/ a while back was based upon the 12 > > signs > > > of > > > the zodiac and the 12 steps to an octave. if you look at the circle > > of > > > fifths it coincidentally looks like a zodiacal chart. there being 360 > > > > > degrees in a natal chart, one could translate one's chart into a > > selected > > > octave's frequencies. or you could simply say that everyone has a > > cosmic > > > chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign could be > > > > > configured based upon the corresponding notes in the circle of fifths. > > > > > > dont know if i explained it well enough... but there's the idea > > anyhow. > > > > > > > > > On 12/15/06, xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx <xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > By all means... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > --Boundary_(ID_XjVL1dTl21BsIbNZ1MsHJg)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 16:14:45 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41044-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 11:14:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 11:14:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 21511 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 16:17:20 +0000 Received: (qmail 21487 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 16:17:19 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:14:29 -0700 From: michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_oB9TpO+snYWKLZjvSLpbEw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=FIT7uYbsDyXQRHFXZYuaQp9fjucCWc2br8skZIcXPDOaxYoM6zVmVbirgAO9mGJG2lmWai9TiyRZNqe1wfXENsbRAG3RcRRt7Od/5xSzh9+lIG/0oxKLndMVGepbAOi3w0AmJ2bbXDGyZwrJKf3vZldjQl/xjLdoMFZQeRgCNZs= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_oB9TpO+snYWKLZjvSLpbEw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit you need to know your time and place of birth, and then you go here: http://alabe.com/freechart/ it will tell you your sun, moon, and rising sign (the 3 most important) then if you need a circle of fifths chart, here is one: http://users2.ev1.net/~charliehb/Chavez/MathInMusic/Circle%20of%20Fifths.GIF you can then make it as complex as you like... you can take it from degree and make up a simple calculation to change it to frequency. so for instance, i am taurus sun, gemin moon, and leo rising. using simple translation, my cosmic chord is C, Eb, F but it is possible to also take into account all planetary positioning and astrological degrees and tonal frequencies, etc. On 12/15/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > This Cosmic Chord idea is fascinating. I'd love to hear how mine sounds. > I'm not that familiar with astrological knowledge, so yes, as requested by > Milan: where can we find such details? > > ~Kyle > > > On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > i dont know how one goes about actually creating the project in > > microsound, > > but an idea that i had toyed w/ a while back was based upon the 12 signs > > of > > the zodiac and the 12 steps to an octave. if you look at the circle of > > fifths it coincidentally looks like a zodiacal chart. there being 360 > > degrees in a natal chart, one could translate one's chart into a > selected > > octave's frequencies. or you could simply say that everyone has a > cosmic > > chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign could be > > configured based upon the corresponding notes in the circle of fifths. > > > > dont know if i explained it well enough... but there's the idea anyhow. > > > > > > On 12/15/06, xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx <xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > By all means... > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > http://theradioproject.com > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > --Boundary_(ID_oB9TpO+snYWKLZjvSLpbEw)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 15:51:29 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41043-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:51:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:51:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 9935 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:54:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 9925 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:54:09 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:51:19 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_hylMtbUECPvlXaJPDX9ndg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=NaCn1MNt2vy9koLfT2VcjYmSbVeeKv+6cDffo4d/5Yxyce6jGPcZa2deKi4VSo9RZA31/YkZDW18Aw4jMfwHZuOA5Ch2i5g3To/nacUgJVBx7XZ3LzMe7WxUEGLiUI7/VUyu7jDglw7/7dePFNclnVM+AS4+9oTWFOqSToNdYIA= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_hylMtbUECPvlXaJPDX9ndg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This Cosmic Chord idea is fascinating. I'd love to hear how mine sounds. I'm not that familiar with astrological knowledge, so yes, as requested by Milan: where can we find such details? ~Kyle On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > i dont know how one goes about actually creating the project in > microsound, > but an idea that i had toyed w/ a while back was based upon the 12 signs > of > the zodiac and the 12 steps to an octave. if you look at the circle of > fifths it coincidentally looks like a zodiacal chart. there being 360 > degrees in a natal chart, one could translate one's chart into a selected > octave's frequencies. or you could simply say that everyone has a cosmic > chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign could be > configured based upon the corresponding notes in the circle of fifths. > > dont know if i explained it well enough... but there's the idea anyhow. > > > On 12/15/06, xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx <xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > By all means... > > > > > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_hylMtbUECPvlXaJPDX9ndg)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 15:33:33 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41042-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:33:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:33:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 98662 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:36:11 +0000 Received: (qmail 98651 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:36:11 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:33:21 -0500 From: Milan Davidovic <xxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=ErrT/oANtYsJkuVhbvOfiVkEcm923A4qf80ve8jheJ1BgAoXO0/1SYmIupNgaR4oOLbbcu8raEpCKsXewxGX5OcGzbdpbNUN6LaFLcBBsKjuDiHfa1wMSg3Rq/m5lmKmRF7j5/oebDxXZgASD2I2q+r3gqrJIG/xxwbicLhLDB8= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/15/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > you could simply say that everyone has a cosmic > chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign How would I obtain these details? Thanks. -- Milan Davidovic http://altmilan.blogspot.com http://www.terminus1525.ca/studio/view/2758 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 15:26:02 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41041-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:26:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:26:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 94136 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:28:43 +0000 Received: (qmail 94124 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:28:42 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 08:25:49 -0700 From: michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_aYjoUl+4Tl/UxhRko7G4FQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=KyQVy5Im5UjXPZ+QSDRA6cTItOz2Duv8zYQqIF4R7mqmySTHhraPf2pUui0QaUfzwCCsPdWp0fFgtSPOp8H1dzlkntKgcOZtzjaaVWaLcNBHtrn2i91/8hoouKeGG6TavEd5f/MBQqbzJEWbbHuNRl7eb261lnJL0c6nmgYEF7c= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_aYjoUl+4Tl/UxhRko7G4FQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i dont know how one goes about actually creating the project in microsound, but an idea that i had toyed w/ a while back was based upon the 12 signs of the zodiac and the 12 steps to an octave. if you look at the circle of fifths it coincidentally looks like a zodiacal chart. there being 360 degrees in a natal chart, one could translate one's chart into a selected octave's frequencies. or you could simply say that everyone has a cosmic chord - being that their sun sign, moon sign, and rising sign could be configured based upon the corresponding notes in the circle of fifths. dont know if i explained it well enough... but there's the idea anyhow. On 12/15/06, xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx <xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> wrote: > > By all means... > > --Boundary_(ID_aYjoUl+4Tl/UxhRko7G4FQ)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 15:02:10 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41040-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:02:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:02:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 80790 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:04:50 +0000 Received: (qmail 80777 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 15:04:49 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 10:01:54 -0500 (EST) From: xxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxx.xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5032 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_8YI0CwjoxhTFaOK5VG0gTg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_8YI0CwjoxhTFaOK5VG0gTg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit By all means... --Boundary_(ID_8YI0CwjoxhTFaOK5VG0gTg)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 15 14:57:16 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41039-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:57:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 09:57:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 77601 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 14:59:55 +0000 Received: (qmail 77590 invoked from network); Fri, 15 Dec 2006 14:59:55 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 08:57:03 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] new lister In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_NYRnVU+3Fklnt55QZcW6Mw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=BVm98HGKIQZ08+d8EbU/Q8aG2JQUo16ArBpsieQEmFXJPL3CPYZRtmzwLTziQeURIKfU+jdg3sXvvun2wNv9eFTsQWKQdUeNuMcE1CiXsSmk3UiXDo1qU33icoLqrQ96qmth7OgSIZXmnzJtrerBxmioKqpQ25WUIowl1m50njY= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_NYRnVU+3Fklnt55QZcW6Mw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Please discuss! I've been revving up for a decent project lately. ~Kyle On 12/14/06, michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Hello, I found the microsound site and joined the list. I am interested > in > participating in a microsound project, but it looks like most are dated a > few years. Are there any on the table? if not, I have an idea for one > and > wouldnt mind sharing. > > Best, > Michael > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_NYRnVU+3Fklnt55QZcW6Mw)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 14 21:51:30 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41038-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 14 Dec 2006 16:51:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 16:51:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 92101 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 21:54:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 92091 invoked from network); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 21:54:02 +0000 Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 14:51:17 -0700 From: michael gardner <xxxx.xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] new lister To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_yuu7nBb0/g3/5G4z/qKTSw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=tXdAg5wPf2ZERjEKrw+11DfeWsEW5WGd5uAFhlpxdujlkNPPN/56pVlthcWXJQak86i/z5+7U7mU6ISExd16gaj4/84H670Y7lTn35SY+qsf+jCph3U/59u96aD2h28bc0guDwrD9JnXY3NOsJ6yVim1q0we1lsYjvlE4bDvlvM= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_yuu7nBb0/g3/5G4z/qKTSw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I found the microsound site and joined the list. I am interested in participating in a microsound project, but it looks like most are dated a few years. Are there any on the table? if not, I have an idea for one and wouldnt mind sharing. Best, Michael --Boundary_(ID_yuu7nBb0/g3/5G4z/qKTSw)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 14 21:05:49 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41037-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 14 Dec 2006 16:05:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 16:05:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 63820 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 21:08:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 63808 invoked from network); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 21:08:24 +0000 Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 16:05:38 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [microsound] mashups made legal? To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, Robert Bowman <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_jqUxzIx2rmE5CRcG5YyLtA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_jqUxzIx2rmE5CRcG5YyLtA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit http://business.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,9071-2489166,00.html from the article: While getting tough on infringement of the rules, the report also proposes a liberalisation to help the creative industries, arguing that at least two of the exciting developments in the American music and business world might have happened in Britain. The report suggests that exemptions to copyright law should be allowed for “transformative works”. This would permit the use of copyright material in new and creative ways, so long as it did not detract from the value of that material or offend artistic integrity. It calls on the EU to amend the law to allow for that exception. It would allow “rappers” and other creators to rework old material. The rise of hip-hop in the US has been attributed to that relaxation. Similarly, the existence of the exemption in America was cited by Google to the Gowers report as one of the reasons that search engines started there rather than in Britain. It allowed them to “cache” the content of other websites without breaching copyright. --Boundary_(ID_jqUxzIx2rmE5CRcG5YyLtA)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 14 17:35:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41036-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 14 Dec 2006 12:35:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 12:35:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 22799 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 17:38:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 22788 invoked from network); Thu, 14 Dec 2006 17:38:14 +0000 Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 09:35:27 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] [ot] musicians owed money To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_KcPNliLopmK9iylDh4h75A)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_KcPNliLopmK9iylDh4h75A) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.counterpunch.org/wilhelms12132006.html December 13, 2006 A Last Minute Appeal If You Know a Musician on This List, Let Them Know They Are Owed Money By FRED WILHELMS On Friday, December 15, 2006, over 7,500 recording artists are going to lose money. This is money that was collected on their behalf by SoundExchange, the entity set up by the RIAA to collect and distribute license fees from satellite radio and streaming Internet broadcasts. All the fees collected for broadcasts up through March 31, 2000 will be forfeited forever. SoundExchange has done a pretty good job collecting the fees from the broadcasters. They haven't done as good a job of finding the artists they are supposed to be paying. But it is really no skin off their nose if they don't find them, because, if they don't, they get to keep the money they would have to pay out. Take some time today and look at the list of artists who SoundExchange has been unable to locate. The list is here: http://plays.soundexchange.com/jsp/unpaidArtistList.jsp It lists the artists by first name, so be sure to check it closely. If you are on the list, register today. It takes about ten minutes to do. All the necessary forms are on the website. If you know someone who is on the list, or even if you know a relative of a deceased artist on the list, LET THEM KNOW ABOUT IT TODAY! If they don't register by Friday, they will lose the money that has already been collected for them, and they will be likely to lose more in the future if they do not sign up for it. Here's a link to a newspaper article about SoundExchange that has just run in Memphis. It has a lot more details, and it should help prove that this money is real, and the chance of losing it just as real. This money belongs to the artists that earned it. Help get it into the right hands. Today. Fred Wilhelms is a lawyer who represents musicians and songwriters. He can be reached at: xxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_KcPNliLopmK9iylDh4h75A)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 13 22:37:06 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41035-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 13 Dec 2006 17:37:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 13 Dec 2006 17:37:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 77035 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 13 Dec 2006 22:39:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 77019 invoked from network); Wed, 13 Dec 2006 22:39:34 +0000 Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2006 17:37:01 -0500 From: Gregory Wildes <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Subject: RE: [microsound] Reading the HD as sound? To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Many moons ago I did a piece like this on the Commodore Vic20. Read through the entire 3.6k of memory (including program itself) with values printed to screen and controlling square wave oscillator in 60 minutes. Fun with data! long time lurker, Gregory --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 12 18:23:25 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41034-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 12 Dec 2006 13:23:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 12 Dec 2006 13:23:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 65197 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 12 Dec 2006 18:25:33 +0000 Received: (qmail 65167 invoked from network); Tue, 12 Dec 2006 18:25:32 +0000 Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2006 10:22:37 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] [ot] rnd nums To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_dnRaKGPsQVXgo1BDJ+3AeA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_dnRaKGPsQVXgo1BDJ+3AeA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://news.com.com/Start-up+generates+random+numbers+from+space/ 2100-11397_3-6142935.html?tag=nefd.top http://tinyurl.com/y9fppd --Boundary_(ID_dnRaKGPsQVXgo1BDJ+3AeA)-- From ???@??? Mon Dec 11 23:25:08 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41033-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:25:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 76429 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 23:27:25 +0000 Received: (qmail 76419 invoked from network); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 23:27:24 +0000 Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2006 15:24:55 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] sometimes a pipe is just a pipe To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > Does anyone know if there has been made a program (or object/patch/ > code) > that can read from one specified point on the HD to another and > interpret it > as a soundfile without it necessarily being a soundfile? using bash terminal in Unix you can pipe the data from a volume to an audio I/O --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 11 23:15:54 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41032-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:15:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:15:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 70825 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 23:18:13 +0000 Received: (qmail 70813 invoked from network); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 23:18:13 +0000 Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2006 15:15:45 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] [ot] media selection In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: x19vi9UVM1k6Slt7L77Rlg_d3Hy3aunwZt8aPij47JKkQ9CXJuQFsDKttQv23CHQNNpDGqX9sMXIvbQFDIdyBceatniVOA3eME5Q.OcC1CS3oZsuIDxh0BJPIXpfR4mWbmcu.dL2j5Hj9Q-- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Nice article.. I had allready come to my own conclusion that Taiyo Yuden is the way to go but I really enjoyed the explaination of the difference between DVD-R and +R. --- Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > http://adterrasperaspera.com/blog/2006/10/30/how-to-choose-cddvd- > archival-media/ > > > http://tinyurl.com/ycowgr > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 11 23:07:50 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41031-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:07:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 18:07:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 65598 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 23:10:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 65586 invoked from network); Mon, 11 Dec 2006 23:10:08 +0000 Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2006 15:07:38 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] [ot] media selection To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_XhhGmrAQPq04UE1TVqKSYg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_XhhGmrAQPq04UE1TVqKSYg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://adterrasperaspera.com/blog/2006/10/30/how-to-choose-cddvd- archival-media/ http://tinyurl.com/ycowgr --Boundary_(ID_XhhGmrAQPq04UE1TVqKSYg)-- From ???@??? Sun Dec 10 23:39:34 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41030-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 10 Dec 2006 18:39:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 18:39:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 97010 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 23:41:38 +0000 Received: (qmail 96992 invoked from network); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 23:41:37 +0000 Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2006 23:39:13 +0000 From: alex <xxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Reading the HD as sound? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.8.1 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On Sun, 2006-12-10 at 15:30 +0000, Martin . wrote: > Does anyone know if there has been made a program (or object/patch/code) > that can read from one specified point on the HD to another and interpret it > as a soundfile without it necessarily being a soundfile? > > I know it's possible to interpret any file as a soundfile in many ways but > the issue here would probably be to refer to a physical point on the HD and > not the file structure. Under unix there is "dd", for example to listen to the scsi hard drive "sda" run this as root: dd if=/dev/sda of=/dev/audio you can then add skip and count to listen to particular blocks from the disk. To save as something like a wav you would have to pipe into an audiofile conversion program such as sox. For example the following would save the 500 blocks after the millionth block as out.wav dd if=/dev/sda skip=100000 count=500 | sox -s -w -r 22000 -t raw - out.wav Be careful though, getting the options round the wrong way will write data from your microphone to your hard drive. More info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dd_(Unix) http://sox.sourceforge.net/ alex --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 10 22:06:59 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41029-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 10 Dec 2006 17:06:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 17:06:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 49002 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 22:09:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 48975 invoked from network); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 22:09:07 +0000 Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2006 16:06:50 -0600 From: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: RE: [microsound] Reading the HD as sound? In-reply-to: <p06230909c1a202a5a849@[192.168.0.2]> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1250 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-index: Acccl0lf3VaJvV8CTaqwYuUi+oCnRQAD/KBw X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > My friend August Black out at UCSB has a nice app datadada > http://aug.ment.org/datadada/ which is along the lines of > what you want, not sure about recording the output direct to > disk, but there are other ways of getting at it -- with > soundflower or such... > > cheers > John Martin; The old Commodore Amiga had a great sampler/editor called "Audiomaster II" which also had this feature. It would read and stream raw drive data to the audio device in realtime. Perhaps not useful now, but it was fun then! _________________________________ Christopher Sorg New Media Artist and Instructor Communication Department Loyola University Chicago http://www.chrissorg.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.15.15/580 - Release Date: 12/8/2006 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 10 20:11:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41028-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 10 Dec 2006 15:11:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 15:11:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 86506 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 20:13:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 86495 invoked from network); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 20:13:07 +0000 Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2006 13:10:39 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Reading the HD as sound? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230909c1a202a5a849@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hi Martin -- My friend August Black out at UCSB has a nice app datadada http://aug.ment.org/datadada/ which is along the lines of what you want, not sure about recording the output direct to disk, but there are other ways of getting at it -- with soundflower or such... cheers John --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 10 15:31:04 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41027-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 10 Dec 2006 10:31:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 10:31:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 68906 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 15:33:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 68896 invoked from network); Sun, 10 Dec 2006 15:33:14 +0000 Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2006 15:30:53 +0000 From: "Martin ." <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Reading the HD as sound? To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_riBv7UMEaidAGus+qurdQQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=tu7PI5/1SsdgZIZlE6fPBowusN9WCBE3QhMVIhWJgQ5/FV8h9RDB46inacY27Dh7ZJSp22oXdOo2SnSTcFEZis5vYE6u2uZjJXZLVdg1yZQfRqNiimm60jNWTdQM0LzSvuNvDc6gM7yHKPGR6KU7KWf/TOJgeXhK8ALR0xHjO3c= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_riBv7UMEaidAGus+qurdQQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, Does anyone know if there has been made a program (or object/patch/code) that can read from one specified point on the HD to another and interpret it as a soundfile without it necessarily being a soundfile? I know it's possible to interpret any file as a soundfile in many ways but the issue here would probably be to refer to a physical point on the HD and not the file structure. Any suggestions are welcome! Martin --Boundary_(ID_riBv7UMEaidAGus+qurdQQ)-- From ???@??? Sat Dec 9 11:51:08 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41026-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 09 Dec 2006 06:51:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 06:51:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 40761 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 11:53:13 +0000 Received: (qmail 40728 invoked from network); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 11:53:08 +0000 Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2006 11:53:21 +0100 From: Thanos Chrysakis <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] article on music and politics In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C1A05430.1672C%xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: 6C40gX4VM1m8YQIzynhKgIL.ElYOmH2kxm80eNR2ScQfpfDa34IPld0MA_1gIBVN9x3VK8KQWYzIQtsMHBmnllgWBQkpL.B.S6tsY7_ZQi_pVub397hVcSW4IVDfs9p_7HoLW3P02V0R X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.0.3 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx on 12/8/06 4:18 AM, Paulo Mouat at xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx wrote: > It is unfortunate that the article has some blatant inaccuracies, > perhaps in the name of accessibility and generality. The conflation of > Boulez, Stockhausen and Nono is typical of a "transatlantic outsider", > especially when their music is characterized as gratuitously dense, > opaque and (to commit the ultimate capital sin) serial. "Invites > explanation"? Does everything need to be explained? Just listen and > let it move you--but you have to leave your baggage at the door. There are many degrees of the political expressed in art -even those that they are not engaged in an explicit conscious manner can articulate political attitudes/stances. Taking the notes of a CD as a matter of fact in order to draw conclusions and to think about the music it can't generate any fruitful experiences and ideas. It seems that Mr Kyle Gann hasn't bothered to look after what Luigi Nono has said about his work or what his close collaborators have said about him and his works. It is all about human dignity (his early and later work) and the dramaturgy of sound. Within an artist's vision such as Luigi Nono's the political is so articulated that cannot be expressed like a slogan/message to pass it through...which relate with the cathartic effect that any strong artistic utterance possesses in my view. > I would have expected more from Kyle Gann, but then he has that > insurmountable handicap: He's american and unfortunately no Elliot > Carter. !:-)) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 9 06:00:48 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41025-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 09 Dec 2006 01:00:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 01:00:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 8349 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 06:02:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 8327 invoked from network); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 06:02:48 +0000 Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2006 01:00:34 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] Wii Remote as MIDI/Audio controller In-reply-to: <000f01c71b01$e8d68a80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <000f01c71b01$e8d68a80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx seems a bit clunky.. wasn't there a toy called 'hot stix' or something to that effect they sold a radio shack that did something similiar? g. On 8-Dec-06, at 2:49 PM', Eloy Anzola wrote: > Some links and videos here: > http://createdigitalmusic.com/2006/12/07/midi-control-for-music- > with-wii-rem > ote-teaser/ > > http://tinyurl.com/yjlfu2 > > Awesome potential > > cheers, > > Eloy > ----- > xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 9 04:51:18 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41024-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 08 Dec 2006 23:51:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 23:51:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 81908 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 04:53:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 81892 invoked from network); Sat, 09 Dec 2006 04:53:17 +0000 Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2006 23:51:04 -0500 From: Paulo Mouat <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] article on music and politics In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=ftNhnTTAC9fYhHxHa8zl4BkrGiK+7zAl6zsNF/oW/X6UbQ3Mlz9cK0M0xcMxr9gnodD7SjZBAJclpk3vGe9ysxv9JrsfSRcFbBqsNUznLYVj+zXN69FDBFlY6PtE4gmM2kxxg3CpJDJwJFV0GN+mkl2pc3b6l8g4AoHVqo+nI+k= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I fully agree with you--my criticism was more directed at Gann and the usual whining about serialism. I was very fortunate to have attended a number of concerts of Nono's music. From 'Quando stanno morendo' to 'Hay que caminar sognando' by way of 'Caminantes Ayacucho' and even 'Y entonces comprendio' at the Biennale last year, I have to say it is an enlightening experience. And curiously, no serial permutations to be found anywhere... So much for applying the label to composers that had a passing flirt with serialism (same applies to Boulez and Stockhausen, even). Still waiting for the next concert of 'Prometeo'. //p http://www.interdisciplina.org/00.0/ On 12/8/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > I want to add, I LOVE Nono's music (more than Boulez or Stochkausen), > but I've never heard it live. I've never seen it on a program > anywhere. Being in the US, and only in a large city (Chicago) within > the last three years, I guess that's no surprise. Especially because > serial and post-serial music seem to have become "politically > incorrect" after things took a postmodern/neo-whatever turn. > > And to be clear, I don't mind that music took a turn away from > serialism, but I'm bothered by this need to viciously attack and > discredit anything that was rooted in the earlier > post-serialistserial/post-serial practices. One senses a strange > paranoia, as if anything rooted in any kind of rational and modernist > principles is going to give rise to some sort Stalinist > totalitarianism; even when it's just a work of art! Interestingly, > this turn happened at the same time that everyone gave up on the > project of creating a liberated, rational society, and instead bowed > down before the magical powers of the Free Market and the Invisible > Hand. > > Regardless of all that, I still think in the broader sense the author > has a point about the politics of titles - even if Nono himself was a > bad example. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 8 19:49:15 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41023-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 08 Dec 2006 14:49:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 14:49:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 34140 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 19:51:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 34130 invoked from network); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 19:51:14 +0000 Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2006 14:49:00 -0500 From: Eloy Anzola <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Wii Remote as MIDI/Audio controller To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <000f01c71b01$e8d68a80$xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-index: AccbAegXPXtPm0tiSCilCPfr53IkRw== X-DCC--Metrics: ss73.shared.server-system.net 1368; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Some links and videos here: http://createdigitalmusic.com/2006/12/07/midi-control-for-music-with-wii-rem ote-teaser/ http://tinyurl.com/yjlfu2 Awesome potential cheers, Eloy ----- xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 8 18:05:56 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41022-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 08 Dec 2006 13:05:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 13:05:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 82368 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 18:07:55 +0000 Received: (qmail 82344 invoked from network); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 18:07:54 +0000 Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2006 12:05:43 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] article on music and politics In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=dIfA0neHbncikOH4P3zrXSNQZ9T5OM0zvNnrebwFbf+Re4kw1s+FKVyGFpwthbQ1QIMi9y9a3BsJzv+ObLm77QqIajn49lgGUs94SnH/SirOZOzd+OWBfsjN+2vZF1TZbAiEloiO2AOLfdQ8f93fJMSMiIAhcsfd/oa0d6MxJtk= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/7/06, Paulo Mouat <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > I think the Luigi Nono section was somewhat insightful, where the > > author states, "By changing a title, one becomes a political > > composer... For Cardew, I suspect that would have meant doing > > precisely what Nono's apologists fear: allowing the bourgeois to > > 'simulate horror but keep their distance.' > > The changing title applies to Penderecki's Threnody, not Nono. Nono's > work is inextricably linked with political and social ideas. Even if > the text is changed beyond recognition, the message is remarkably > clear from the music itself. It is not simply a matter of title. > Furthermore, Nono's music needs to be heard live; the sheer drama and > emotion are positively overwhelming. > > It is unfortunate that the article has some blatant inaccuracies, > perhaps in the name of accessibility and generality. The conflation of > Boulez, Stockhausen and Nono is typical of a "transatlantic outsider", > especially when their music is characterized as gratuitously dense, > opaque and (to commit the ultimate capital sin) serial. "Invites > explanation"? Does everything need to be explained? Just listen and > let it move you--but you have to leave your baggage at the door. I want to add, I LOVE Nono's music (more than Boulez or Stochkausen), but I've never heard it live. I've never seen it on a program anywhere. Being in the US, and only in a large city (Chicago) within the last three years, I guess that's no surprise. Especially because serial and post-serial music seem to have become "politically incorrect" after things took a postmodern/neo-whatever turn. And to be clear, I don't mind that music took a turn away from serialism, but I'm bothered by this need to viciously attack and discredit anything that was rooted in the earlier post-serialistserial/post-serial practices. One senses a strange paranoia, as if anything rooted in any kind of rational and modernist principles is going to give rise to some sort Stalinist totalitarianism; even when it's just a work of art! Interestingly, this turn happened at the same time that everyone gave up on the project of creating a liberated, rational society, and instead bowed down before the magical powers of the Free Market and the Invisible Hand. Regardless of all that, I still think in the broader sense the author has a point about the politics of titles - even if Nono himself was a bad example. ~David --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 8 14:26:51 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41021-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 08 Dec 2006 09:26:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 09:26:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 80612 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 14:28:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 80602 invoked from network); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 14:28:50 +0000 Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2006 09:26:42 -0500 From: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] reminder! In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=nsEH/Xdj/0wqvrZGbHQfWitd60XlrC9TBcsksC4qDvMGfcJYvq2kiaq6kYSUvU14VrAkeJSrCRepUva1Cpk4Ivy/6FqwFeN+7NyY0OmntKSJD5ZBEnu8uPE3+1dS7UyZq6S0zGUnoCVdEVp8DpstgXZAxbsqCcdha7DJBMl0n/E= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi On 12/8/06, Hen Hall <xxx_xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > hi sorry my link is down to the annouce is it still active? http://or8.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce -- \js [ http://or8.net/~johns/ ] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 8 13:32:50 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41020-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 08 Dec 2006 08:32:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 08:32:48 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 56678 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 13:34:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 56663 invoked from network); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 13:34:45 +0000 Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2006 05:32:36 -0800 (PST) From: Hen Hall <xxx_xxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] reminder! In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_vvL9z4yECItpk1iUHhwhog)" Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=HhzgKsDfweHKTlF5rjAnkJv1qFiSwoQLyzsnM6ArxRri+TApaaY30HX7lutjNIyZvDCxpiyzaZ6c4c9O8zXarlmqs+AEPIitlzeyLRpgvJ965f0O/OF5XeWgivla9dthx2tm4m2uROqAWzWvl0RK4YwGhqp+rrTemj40wuy7ZHs=; X-YMail-OSG: X4wr3b0VM1lhe56xdyovnwT9EPYEpdub_SHoSFnKXOLZRZ2WUUI6rkO9K1G7rQcWjGQ__IxfVbVrTcVa03eEx4HFSgPS6vgXGWkbhlSfW.H_wqzY.BznltXQaO8zzzXs83_gEPYmkrGMPQ-- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_vvL9z4yECItpk1iUHhwhog) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit hi sorry my link is down to the annouce is it still active? Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: all calls for projects, job opportunities, promotional postings etc etc belong on the microsound announce list – not this one! please read the microsound web page!: > you can also subscribe to the microsound-announce list that holds > show announcements, music releases, podcasts and anything that's > not aesthetic discussion. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------- Check out the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. --Boundary_(ID_vvL9z4yECItpk1iUHhwhog)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 8 03:19:02 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41019-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 07 Dec 2006 22:19:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 22:19:02 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 14752 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 03:20:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 14728 invoked from network); Fri, 08 Dec 2006 03:20:56 +0000 Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2006 22:18:48 -0500 From: Paulo Mouat <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] article on music and politics In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=MfQt7zBcn14o07jYpequnKeQv+Wjij5t9RbiZF41oxZQGh7leHTJ/SvTj0O5Gxs9IOQiVbVt7PuPcWZIccGPI+JyD/7tzonDi21PGml2rf0y8HHoSV7GdTzhlHfpjmJWzGJBlgcXaYCfQfaCrFX9O0vtMoQmJX+1w6FylGIXoGk= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > I think the Luigi Nono section was somewhat insightful, where the > author states, "By changing a title, one becomes a political > composer... For Cardew, I suspect that would have meant doing > precisely what Nono's apologists fear: allowing the bourgeois to > 'simulate horror but keep their distance.' The changing title applies to Penderecki's Threnody, not Nono. Nono's work is inextricably linked with political and social ideas. Even if the text is changed beyond recognition, the message is remarkably clear from the music itself. It is not simply a matter of title. Furthermore, Nono's music needs to be heard live; the sheer drama and emotion are positively overwhelming. It is unfortunate that the article has some blatant inaccuracies, perhaps in the name of accessibility and generality. The conflation of Boulez, Stockhausen and Nono is typical of a "transatlantic outsider", especially when their music is characterized as gratuitously dense, opaque and (to commit the ultimate capital sin) serial. "Invites explanation"? Does everything need to be explained? Just listen and let it move you--but you have to leave your baggage at the door. I would have expected more from Kyle Gann, but then he has that insurmountable handicap: He's american and unfortunately no Elliot Carter. //p http://www.interdisciplina.org/00.0/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 7 15:21:16 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41018-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 07 Dec 2006 10:21:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 10:21:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 30473 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 15:22:59 +0000 Received: (qmail 30423 invoked from network); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 15:22:57 +0000 Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2006 10:20:54 -0500 From: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] article on music and politics In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=Mw5ybBv3RUxXVkwkQK5it2xWj2cSaT+IzfKecOWphZSQ73kDJDuTfGpkUivZT3L5rOqAP2GnZq7Nqmla6DRuHP3jOKYE2mwZyVFnMwiQkugA3kXVQVxAvfw0wmNxAMpQjJGFUcM3oqrMp1mywq4tw9mOebev3Zs2jDT+4na9Ez0= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi On 12/6/06, David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > it always offers some > catharsis, some retreat into an inner "spiritual" world, that > disengages us from the overtly political and the world of action. i don't think these are so separate. war outside reflects war inside. and the same could be said for peace. > without those moments of beauty and escape, how could we remain strong > enough to confront the horror of our contemporary society, how could > we manage to go on resisting and fighting? there are also beauties in our contemporary society. they don't get any press, but if you look around carefully, i am sure you can find some. also, some people fight on even when they have no hope of escape. not many, to be sure, but some. -- \js [ http://or8.net/~johns/ ] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 7 14:07:07 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41017-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Thu, 07 Dec 2006 09:07:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 09:07:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 90501 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 14:08:58 +0000 Received: (qmail 90469 invoked from network); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 14:08:57 +0000 Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2006 09:06:52 -0500 From: experimedia <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] rochester ny next week (anything to do) To: xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx, xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx, IDM-making list <xxx-xxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx>, incidental derogatory mnemonics <xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_JXROmwmGq8MiWv6zcSH1eQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=XQ5p3Ac2+0wxxxT4VXEdKLzhH3dwEBFlzLl9Po1dmTAbYLEpkGHlKlbLcWHCuY6Cx0rXzWlfwxI+5SKK/gr5cjX6iSacfPWdglGqopBJUS6xggB/qRMZNGGMNOQ3QjL6c2kN3c9gglUli3O4bim08m0CySyEMJpnLdzFevb6Q0Q= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_JXROmwmGq8MiWv6zcSH1eQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I will be in Rochester NY from the morning of the Monday Dec 11th until the afternoon of the Friday December 15th for training at Xerox HQ. Anything interesting to do or see during those nights? I see Alarm Will Sound is playing the night of the 15th. Wish they were playing Thursday night. I would love to see them but unfortunately I can't stick around for it. Any tips you can throw my way would be great. Events, record shoppes, etc. --Boundary_(ID_JXROmwmGq8MiWv6zcSH1eQ)-- From ???@??? Thu Dec 7 03:13:54 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41016-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 06 Dec 2006 22:13:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 22:13:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 19890 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 03:15:30 +0000 Received: (qmail 19877 invoked from network); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 03:15:29 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 21:13:27 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] article on music and politics In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=qUIXxgCym0qDZjV2KrGJ4joFoljvvlG3Rfo1xcWcYxpuGGf9mqQEE29wpLQXuSOvk+7kTq8tNMEk4htUMZioqz5AstJQ4h1fBzrY/hiaWgKQW5nbNNHZFSp5sGrb6oF1YlkfFp9/21cjaexbTaN3NRE+eDm72Q2lQleKOtQXE6k= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thanks, that gave me a few things to consider. My only gripe is that the survey of potential political practices seems to end somewhere in the mid-70's. I'd be interested to see this line of reasoning extended to more recent practices, including the issues raised with post-digital/glitch practices and sample appropriation. I think the Luigi Nono section was somewhat insightful, where the author states, "By changing a title, one becomes a political composer... For Cardew, I suspect that would have meant doing precisely what Nono's apologists fear: allowing the bourgeois to 'simulate horror but keep their distance.' For many composers, that's what political music amounts to. For those of us whose work is ghettoized in new-music festivals, perhaps that's all it can be." I wonder, if that is really as political as abstract art can get sometimes. I do think there are subtle ways we can remain engaged as we work as abstract artists: whether we are creating, distributing, or performing. But perhaps the limit remains, that art can never be, in the Brechtian sense, alienated enough - it always offers some catharsis, some retreat into an inner "spiritual" world, that disengages us from the overtly political and the world of action. I don't blame art for this. Perhaps it is just as well, because without those moments of beauty and escape, how could we remain strong enough to confront the horror of our contemporary society, how could we manage to go on resisting and fighting? A small dose of utopia, the hope for something better, something beautiful, gives our political practice meaning. And perhaps some artworks do embody this utopian longing for the other... ~David On 12/6/06, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > http://www.newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=2312 > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Thu Dec 7 01:12:34 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41015-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 06 Dec 2006 20:12:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 20:12:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 60284 invoked by uid 1095); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 01:14:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 60273 invoked from network); Thu, 07 Dec 2006 01:14:23 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 17:12:19 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] article on music and politics To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_aN0rWc4DLZDPmkeMvlCuHQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_aN0rWc4DLZDPmkeMvlCuHQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=2312 --Boundary_(ID_aN0rWc4DLZDPmkeMvlCuHQ)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 19:50:45 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41014-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 06 Dec 2006 14:50:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 14:50:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 85928 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 19:52:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 85915 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 19:52:21 +0000 Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2006 08:49:58 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Milan Davidovic wrote: > Ridiculous that you're doing something illegal, or that the thing > you're doing is illegal? I'm guessing you mean the latter... yeah, the latter > If so, what's the proper response to a ridiculous rule? break it :-) -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 16:36:02 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41013-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:36:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:36:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 71690 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 16:37:48 +0000 Received: (qmail 71679 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 16:37:48 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 10:35:47 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] future of music policy summit In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_DPzvzDX3X1DdjCDkZMXF2Q)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=RKGmWYFCHIUrSlumAGl2NNBRJUOcPWaFSD/6yCgNZx/sE0OUWG0k0qERlMCxfjP2udOH1II6A5rWhYiiraqHTgipnwdLLvxyqlot73vxfbyl0vS9CmtMz4/MLpEOAomX4ifqsdkPhgpdXKP2ZFPBCVwpjMRZ72sz/Hu6i91i+/I= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_DPzvzDX3X1DdjCDkZMXF2Q) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yeah, what's the deal with that? ~Kyle On 12/6/06, Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > > except of course for the byrne one... > > On 5-Dec-06, at 10:51 PM, Kim Cascone wrote: > > > http://www.futureofmusic.org/events/summit06/matrix.cfm > > > > most of these panels have webcasts... > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_DPzvzDX3X1DdjCDkZMXF2Q)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 16:33:59 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41012-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:33:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:33:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 69529 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 16:35:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 69519 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 16:35:44 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:33:46 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] future of music policy summit In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx except of course for the byrne one... On 5-Dec-06, at 10:51 PM, Kim Cascone wrote: > http://www.futureofmusic.org/events/summit06/matrix.cfm > > most of these panels have webcasts... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 03:52:12 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41011-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:52:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:52:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 44938 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 03:53:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 44928 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 03:53:50 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:51:50 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] future of music policy summit To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_rJQHz0F7GozSSGX3ZXBmoQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_rJQHz0F7GozSSGX3ZXBmoQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.futureofmusic.org/events/summit06/matrix.cfm most of these panels have webcasts... --Boundary_(ID_rJQHz0F7GozSSGX3ZXBmoQ)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 02:26:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41009-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 21:26:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 21:26:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 12464 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 02:27:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 12450 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 02:27:47 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 21:25:51 -0500 From: Milan Davidovic <xxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=AwwwATKlAHVhGe2PuDMb1ZED3DbJtAaixyoIZ3Jt68OaAJoY3iBMkzsGR08CMR2nRU5QqOa/uLobGwDQdpArtPRn7xjVq6t2++WnCvpVj4OQCI4va+1ngu4+KlglVtT3n8vPBY+48244vo0wc3vRRF3HtIfBTXZb/waSc52AVII= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/5/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > Probably no-one's going to come chasing after me with a big stick unless > it's music I'm sampling, and I somehow become successful, but regardless > of whether I'm chased or not, I'm still doing something generally > illegal. Isn't this ridiculous? Ridiculous that you're doing something illegal, or that the thing you're doing is illegal? I'm guessing you mean the latter... If so, what's the proper response to a ridiculous rule? -- Milan Davidovic http://altmilan.blogspot.com http://www.terminus1525.ca/studio/view/2758 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 03:06:17 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41010-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:06:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:06:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 25966 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 03:07:53 +0000 Received: (qmail 25945 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 03:07:51 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 21:07:53 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn X-Originating-IP: 68.49.52.232 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.37) by wfilter.us4.outblaze.com; 6 Dec 2006 02:29:59 -0000 X-Originating-Server: ws1-2a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Kyle, I was having fun with your sarcasm. Viewing, playing, listening is not a threat unless someone feels that they ought to be given money for it to happen. It wasn't too long ago that some fantastic store in NYC got busted for selling something they shouldn't or something like that, right? Why? Because someone wanted their take on it. They wanted their cut of the share. When music is meant to be passed on and added to it, but not bought, who owns it and why should someone ask money for it? Some friends of mine did a freespeechforsale CD which de-constructed commercials. It wasn't until finally Coke a cola sent them a very polite letter telling them to stop of hell fire would rain down on them. Funny thing was, they did not sell them, but gave them away. Who owns a sound bite? Derek > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kyle Klipowicz" <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > > Maybe so, I'm no Lawrence Lessig or Jack Valenti for that matter. > > ~Kyle > > On 12/5/06, Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > You really don't know what your talking about Kyle. Just eat your popcorn > > and enjoy the microsound. > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Kyle Klipowicz" <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > > > No, usually if you see me write a one sentence post, it's laden with > > > sarcasm. > > > > > > It's hard to tell subtle tone with text sometimes i guess... > > > > > > ~Kyle --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 01:53:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41008-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:53:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:53:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 97699 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:55:31 +0000 Received: (qmail 97688 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:55:30 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 14:53:31 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Milan Davidovic wrote: > On 12/4/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: >> So how illegal it is depends on whether I capture, for example, the DJ >> speaking, versus advertising, or music? > > Are these all protected by copyright? Probably no-one's going to come chasing after me with a big stick unless it's music I'm sampling, and I somehow become successful, but regardless of whether I'm chased or not, I'm still doing something generally illegal. Isn't this ridiculous? -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 01:50:18 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41007-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:50:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:50:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 95536 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:51:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 95520 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:51:56 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 14:49:57 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Milan Davidovic wrote: > On 12/4/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: >> So how illegal it is depends on whether I capture, for example, the DJ >> speaking, versus advertising, or music? > > Are these all protected by copyright? yep. by default. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 01:47:55 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41006-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:47:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:47:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 93187 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:49:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 93177 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:49:41 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:47:45 -0500 From: Milan Davidovic <xxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=p+XLqxx14eflx4m6lI7auCjo2mycnSxxpJn2QeSfc4OwPsLE5xt/DyOm6T9MbMFsjo4yf0sl22gMPflVNEFiPfTpjP9rnJw4vTpU7mZylAn5by0nInt8zcc5faxiQevKrWwCMNnDFqpWbQiqiuBVIzlJsD9Jxhur2Xc9kGS4jYs= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/4/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > So how illegal it is depends on whether I capture, for example, the DJ > speaking, versus advertising, or music? Are these all protected by copyright? -- Milan Davidovic http://altmilan.blogspot.com http://www.terminus1525.ca/studio/view/2758 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 01:42:24 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41005-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:42:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:42:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 90294 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:44:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 90284 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:44:09 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:42:14 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_sn3y9cCmOgidKULho+E2og)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=np8tuf1JwlNLEA1pOSOnq2ewGoxmEqkyuaYFEsjfZHB17GvEmT8AqtbNWyY1rgnX2RHx/rBJRDkFAtKC0LXARkmOhxEmVGpUvRr17E9lyceaU6Be2w2QyfwNAT0b/yGVq3e1pE4ti5Qd3PvHfNxDR54zZSiGIiKmIwvEwBkLaiA= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_sn3y9cCmOgidKULho+E2og) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Maybe so, I'm no Lawrence Lessig or Jack Valenti for that matter. But I do have another question: When all those fancy shmancy TV ads tell you that you can "own it today" for new DVD's, shouldn't they really say "license the content for viewing from a DVD today"? Seems kind of deceptive that ad campaigns can tell you that you own something but when you try to exercise any type of "ownership" besides watching it on a region-encoded acceptable player, they get all in a hissy fit. Unless, of course they are just being sneaky about the fact that you own the piece of plastic, but not the content. Then that's just a plain ole' mean trick. ~Kyle On 12/5/06, Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > You really don't know what your talking about Kyle. Just eat your popcorn > and enjoy the microsound. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Kyle Klipowicz" <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > > Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn > > Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2006 16:34:19 -0600 > > > > > > No, usually if you see me write a one sentence post, it's laden with > > sarcasm. > > > > It's hard to tell subtle tone with text sometimes i guess... > > > > ~Kyle > > > > On 12/4/06, aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > R U serious? > > > > > > > > > aLEKs > > > > > > > > > On Dec 4, 2006, at 10:17 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > > > > > > > If you happen to snag commercials, aren't you entitled to a fee for > > > > "broadcasting" them? > > > > > > > > ~Kyle > > > > > > > > On 12/3/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > > > >> > > > >> xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: > > > >> > > > >> > "Taking it seriously" is another issue entirely. This would > involve > > > >> > *actively* challenging current opinions regarding copyright law > > > >> and not > > > >> > voting for those who support and vote for copyright continuums > and > > > >> draconian > > > >> > laws like the individual-restrictive, industry-favorable DMCA. > > > >> > > > >> I suspected that's what you meant, I just thought I'd play up the > > > >> other > > > >> angle ;-) > > > >> > > > >> I have built an instrument in Pure Data that is basically a > > > >> live-sampling mellotron: it takes an audio feed, partitions based > on > > > >> perceived pitch, and maps it to a 12-semitone scale which I can > then > > > >> play using a MIDI controller keyboard. > > > >> > > > >> I intend to perform by plugging this instrument in to the radio > > > >> waves, > > > >> using it as a base for building looped improvisations. The radio > > > >> is both > > > >> a good way of getting fresh and unexpected audio data, rather than > > > >> just > > > >> relying on prerecorded samples, but also demonstrates virtuosity, > one > > > >> quality that is often perceived to be missing from laptop > > > >> performance. > > > >> > > > >> Question is, how does something like this fall under present > > > >> copyright > > > >> law? > > > >> > > > >> -- > > > >> Damian Stewart > > > >> +64 27 305 4107 > > > >> > > > >> f r e y > > > >> live music with machines > > > >> http://www.frey.co.nz > > > >> http://www.myspace.com/freyed > > > >> > > > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > >> website: http://www.microsound.org > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > -- http://theradioproject.com > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_sn3y9cCmOgidKULho+E2og)-- From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 01:01:38 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41004-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:01:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:01:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 68690 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:03:19 +0000 Received: (qmail 68675 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 01:03:18 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 14:01:18 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Frank Barknecht wrote: > I'm actually referring to something like "tape music" which is quite > common in "academic" computer music and somehow maybe beyond. Here the > tape or compact disk or wav-file *is* the concerto. You can fully > reproduce it at home. Only if suitable bits-to-air-movement equipment exists. While it is true that the concerto is contained entirely within the tape or the compact disk or the wav-file, it is the sounds that come out of your speakers when the tape is played, rather than the tape itself, that is considered the concerto.. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 6 00:43:31 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41003-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:43:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:43:30 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 57555 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 00:45:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 57544 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 00:45:14 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:43:18 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn X-Originating-IP: 68.49.52.232 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.80) by wfilter.us4.outblaze.com; 6 Dec 2006 00:43:20 -0000 X-Originating-Server: ws1-1a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx You really don't know what your talking about Kyle. Just eat your popcorn and enjoy the microsound. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kyle Klipowicz" <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn > Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2006 16:34:19 -0600 > > > No, usually if you see me write a one sentence post, it's laden with > sarcasm. > > It's hard to tell subtle tone with text sometimes i guess... > > ~Kyle > > On 12/4/06, aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote: > > > > R U serious? > > > > > > aLEKs > > > > > > On Dec 4, 2006, at 10:17 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > > > > > If you happen to snag commercials, aren't you entitled to a fee for > > > "broadcasting" them? > > > > > > ~Kyle > > > > > > On 12/3/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > > >> > > >> xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: > > >> > > >> > "Taking it seriously" is another issue entirely. This would involve > > >> > *actively* challenging current opinions regarding copyright law > > >> and not > > >> > voting for those who support and vote for copyright continuums and > > >> draconian > > >> > laws like the individual-restrictive, industry-favorable DMCA. > > >> > > >> I suspected that's what you meant, I just thought I'd play up the > > >> other > > >> angle ;-) > > >> > > >> I have built an instrument in Pure Data that is basically a > > >> live-sampling mellotron: it takes an audio feed, partitions based on > > >> perceived pitch, and maps it to a 12-semitone scale which I can then > > >> play using a MIDI controller keyboard. > > >> > > >> I intend to perform by plugging this instrument in to the radio > > >> waves, > > >> using it as a base for building looped improvisations. The radio > > >> is both > > >> a good way of getting fresh and unexpected audio data, rather than > > >> just > > >> relying on prerecorded samples, but also demonstrates virtuosity, one > > >> quality that is often perceived to be missing from laptop > > >> performance. > > >> > > >> Question is, how does something like this fall under present > > >> copyright > > >> law? > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Damian Stewart > > >> +64 27 305 4107 > > >> > > >> f r e y > > >> live music with machines > > >> http://www.frey.co.nz > > >> http://www.myspace.com/freyed > > >> > > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > >> website: http://www.microsound.org > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > -- http://theradioproject.com > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 23:58:52 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41002-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 18:58:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 18:58:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 34084 invoked by uid 1095); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 00:00:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 34069 invoked from network); Wed, 06 Dec 2006 00:00:33 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 00:57:50 +0100 From: Frank Barknecht <xxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mail-followup-to: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hallo, Damian Stewart hat gesagt: // Damian Stewart wrote: > Frank Barknecht wrote: > > >Today a bunch of bits can be both the concerto and the compact disk > >quite easily. > > Mm, bits are tricky like this; they lack physicality (even though they > are themselves based on /arrangements/ of physicality - electrons, > magnetic fields) yet they often describe physical things (movement of > air particles, patterns of photons, solid objects). > > I think though that for a bunch of bits to 'be' a piano concerto, some > kind of translation has to take place. So it's more a case of a bunch of > bits being translatable to a concerto or a compact disk, rather than > actually being the concerto or the compact disk itself... I'm actually referring to something like "tape music" which is quite common in "academic" computer music and somehow maybe beyond. Here the tape or compact disk or wav-file *is* the concerto. You can fully reproduce it at home. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 22:34:30 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41001-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 17:34:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 17:34:30 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 90901 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:36:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 90888 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:36:13 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 16:34:19 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_9NHhgX2RCoF3Sr9+tsUM8A)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=mrZcRI46hz+sFsxlle6i/95oGu0oyoFgbPbGtHdlulI20yhZz7nhn5YLo9hX6UFDnJi2o4QDEpRE0SgfLtev3KMIyUe8d4O9WcC9KeMdgfu/4qzAbfyWO9KLUTwx2304oiGKDWw46KBxqtOxaBRe7Ycj9TR2K/mIS2tXLFRqid4= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_9NHhgX2RCoF3Sr9+tsUM8A) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit No, usually if you see me write a one sentence post, it's laden with sarcasm. It's hard to tell subtle tone with text sometimes i guess... ~Kyle On 12/4/06, aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote: > > R U serious? > > > aLEKs > > > On Dec 4, 2006, at 10:17 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > > > If you happen to snag commercials, aren't you entitled to a fee for > > "broadcasting" them? > > > > ~Kyle > > > > On 12/3/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > >> > >> xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: > >> > >> > "Taking it seriously" is another issue entirely. This would involve > >> > *actively* challenging current opinions regarding copyright law > >> and not > >> > voting for those who support and vote for copyright continuums and > >> draconian > >> > laws like the individual-restrictive, industry-favorable DMCA. > >> > >> I suspected that's what you meant, I just thought I'd play up the > >> other > >> angle ;-) > >> > >> I have built an instrument in Pure Data that is basically a > >> live-sampling mellotron: it takes an audio feed, partitions based on > >> perceived pitch, and maps it to a 12-semitone scale which I can then > >> play using a MIDI controller keyboard. > >> > >> I intend to perform by plugging this instrument in to the radio > >> waves, > >> using it as a base for building looped improvisations. The radio > >> is both > >> a good way of getting fresh and unexpected audio data, rather than > >> just > >> relying on prerecorded samples, but also demonstrates virtuosity, one > >> quality that is often perceived to be missing from laptop > >> performance. > >> > >> Question is, how does something like this fall under present > >> copyright > >> law? > >> > >> -- > >> Damian Stewart > >> +64 27 305 4107 > >> > >> f r e y > >> live music with machines > >> http://www.frey.co.nz > >> http://www.myspace.com/freyed > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> website: http://www.microsound.org > >> > >> > > > > > > -- > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_9NHhgX2RCoF3Sr9+tsUM8A)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 22:26:24 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-41000-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 17:26:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 17:26:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 84132 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:28:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 84120 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:28:07 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 16:26:13 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=lD5hxKdDvmS4L4WxAbifIWrKJsxDuSWAvYERBdb8plMzAAMYTnYCfUV9UgKqwDpY4z4qkx8PhRyYp2nyflmzlxvUTIwInhXdOumWY8sbBIydMvZcUPI++llJmkJ/AYzQ1vGZfGZF2z478piMImjClO9+gOhBWw1r6W2LF6dDNUQ= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx What is the piano concerto, really? Is it the performance, or the score? It can't be the score, because that would imply that a piano concerto is only a conceptual art piece and the physical/material realization doesn't matter (though if it were the score, then there's no reason it can't be reproduced, since the score itself is probably already a printed reproduction that could just as well be represented by digital means). But certainly, the piano concerto must be more than any single real performance. No performance can exhaust the possibilities inherent in a score - and that's assuming that the score is meant to be performed verbatim. If, actually, it's a John Cage concerto, than every performance might radically differ, making it extremely obvious that no given performance can be identified as being more than one possibility out of many. It would be better, perhaps, to imagine the concerto as being the score + all possible realizations of the work. Therefore, I argue that a digital reproduction of a piano concerto performance, IS the piano concerto, in the same way any given real performance is - ie. it is just one possible realization of the work in a potentially infinite series... And I don't actually place any special importance on the non-materiality and reproducibility of the concerto in its digital form. It must add that these types of questions tend to lead in the direction of rather pointless semantic games. Anyway, everyone knows that hyperreality is superior to plain old "reality" ... ;-) ~David On 12/5/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > Frank Barknecht wrote: > > > Today a bunch of bits can be both the concerto and the compact disk > > quite easily. > > Mm, bits are tricky like this; they lack physicality (even though they > are themselves based on /arrangements/ of physicality - electrons, > magnetic fields) yet they often describe physical things (movement of > air particles, patterns of photons, solid objects). > > I think though that for a bunch of bits to 'be' a piano concerto, some > kind of translation has to take place. So it's more a case of a bunch of > bits being translatable to a concerto or a compact disk, rather than > actually being the concerto or the compact disk itself... > > Interesting. > > -- > Damian Stewart > +64 27 305 4107 > > f r e y > live music with machines > http://www.frey.co.nz > http://www.myspace.com/freyed > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 22:01:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40999-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 17:01:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 17:01:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 64824 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:02:30 +0000 Received: (qmail 64812 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:02:30 +0000 Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:00:35 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Frank Barknecht wrote: > Today a bunch of bits can be both the concerto and the compact disk > quite easily. Mm, bits are tricky like this; they lack physicality (even though they are themselves based on /arrangements/ of physicality - electrons, magnetic fields) yet they often describe physical things (movement of air particles, patterns of photons, solid objects). I think though that for a bunch of bits to 'be' a piano concerto, some kind of translation has to take place. So it's more a case of a bunch of bits being translatable to a concerto or a compact disk, rather than actually being the concerto or the compact disk itself... Interesting. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 20:03:11 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40998-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 15:03:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 15:03:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 5682 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:04:52 +0000 Received: (qmail 5670 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:04:52 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 15:02:54 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] filesharing: it's not just for pirates anymore! In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx just found this relevant site linked from the author's blog: http:// www.futureofmusic.org/ i can't believe i missed david byrne lecturing in montreal... shit. merde. anyone hit this? http://www.futureofmusic.org/events/summit06/paneltopics.cfm?ID=3 On 5-Dec-06, at 11:53 AM, Kim Cascone wrote: > http://www.forbes.com/2006/11/30/cory-doctorow-copyright-tech- > media_cz_cd_books06_1201doctorow.html > > http://tinyurl.com/yjss93 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 19:31:55 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40997-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 14:31:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 14:31:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 86219 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:33:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 86207 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:33:36 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 20:30:50 +0100 From: Frank Barknecht <xxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mail-followup-to: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Hallo, Damian Stewart hat gesagt: // Damian Stewart wrote: > A compact disc containing a recording of a piano concerto is not a piano > concerto. Today a bunch of bits can be both the concerto and the compact disk quite easily. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 16:53:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40995-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 11:53:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 11:53:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 11050 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 16:54:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 11037 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 16:54:57 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 08:53:01 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] filesharing: it's not just for pirates anymore! To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Tb9R2JIIatgFMRIuhXiy3g)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_Tb9R2JIIatgFMRIuhXiy3g) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.forbes.com/2006/11/30/cory-doctorow-copyright-tech- media_cz_cd_books06_1201doctorow.html http://tinyurl.com/yjss93 --Boundary_(ID_Tb9R2JIIatgFMRIuhXiy3g)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 14:51:00 2006 Return-path: <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 09:51:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from collab.or8.net (collab.or8.net [209.6.82.6]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 09:50:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from collab.or8.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by collab.or8.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6BE165059E; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 09:49:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp-msa-out14.orange.fr (smtp14.orange.fr [193.252.23.69]) by collab.or8.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C4D064B49A for <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx>; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 08:26:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.63] (AMarseille-253-1-10-171.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr [83.205.129.171]) by mwinf1408.orange.fr (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id A499270000B6; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 14:27:59 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 14:27:58 +0100 From: Philippe Petit <xxxxxxxx-xxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> Subject: [Microsound-announce] BiP_HOp Generation : November playlist In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> Sender: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxx_xxxxxxx_xxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx, ambient <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, idm - moderated <xxx-x@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx, "xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx" <xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx>, "xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx" <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxx-xx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx, annonces Wire <xxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx, xxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx, xxxxxxxxx-xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxx.xxx Errors-to: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.749.3) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_e7RIq0shvPRZXOMApYjfiw)" Precedence: list X-BeenThere: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx Delivered-to: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx X-Original-To: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx X-ME-UUID: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx.xx X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 09:49:32 -0500 References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx> X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9rc1 List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx> List-Subscribe: <http://or8.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce>, <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx?subject=subscribe> List-Unsubscribe: <http://or8.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce>, <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://or8.net/pipermail/microsound-announce> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx?subject=help> List-Id: microsound related announcements <microsound-announce.microsound.nexthop.net> Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_e7RIq0shvPRZXOMApYjfiw) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Mailsmith-B5FEB22E-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Mailsmith-B5FEB22E-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit BiP_HOp Generation on Radio Grenouille // 88.8 FM Wednesday evenings : 19:00 - 20:30 PM // Marseille // France November 2006 Playlist ARTIST ALBUM label Erik Friedlander and Teho Teardo : giorni rubati (BiP_HOp) Larsen : seies (Important) Mécanosphère : limb shop (Raging Planet) Grails : black tar prophecies (Important) Michael Schiefel : I don't belong (Traumton) Phelan Sheppard : harps old master (Leaf) Ateleia : formal sleep (Xeric/Table Of The Elements) Pierre-Yves Macé & Quatuor Pli : crash test 2 (Orkhestra) Isis : in the absence of truth (Ipecac) To Rococo rot : taken from vinyl (Staubgold) Adrian Klumpes : be still (Leaf) Mono & World's End Girlfriend : palmless prayer/mass murder refrain (Human Highway) Oblong : indicator (Expanding) Nina Nastasia : on leaving (Fat Cat) Andy Stott : merciless (Modern Love) Robert Henke : layering buddha (Imbalance Computer Music) Picore : l'hélium du peuple (Jarring Effects) Thomas Belhom : no border (Ici d'Ailleurs) Frequency : s/t (Thrill Jockey) Resina : opinioomnium (Mousike Lab) Avia Gardner : mill farm (Intr:Version) Ellen Burr : duos (pfMentum) Dosh : the lost take (Anticon) The Idealist : I am the fire (Nosordo) Dax Pierson & Robert horton : pablo feldman sun riley (Nosordo) Conjoint : a few emptu chairs (Buro) Telepathe : farewell forest (The Social Registry) Mûm : peel session (Fat Cat) Tuomi : tightrope walker (Traumton) Welcome : sirs (Fat Cat) Mountaineer : when the air is bright they shine (Type) Ultra Milkmaids : pocket station (Ant Zen) Library Tapes : feelings for something lost (Resonant) Richard Javerling : two times five lullaby (Yesternow) Archi.Texture vol.1 : Boghossian/Tilbuty/Wastell (Cathnor) Zeitkratzer : noise/... (lärm) (Tourette) Lasse Marhaug : carnival of souls (Thisco) Working For A Nuclear Free City : s/t (Melodic) Fat Jon & Styrofoam : the same channel (Morr Music) The Blow : paper television (Tomlab) D_rradio : out of love (Distraction) Prince Valium : andlaus (Resonant) L'Ocelle Mare : s/t (Ruminance) Okay : low road (Ruminance) Spies Under Von Magnet Influence : suvmi (Cinetiks) Zonk't : purr (Sound On Probation) Forrest Fang & Carl Weingarten : invisibility (The Foundry) Hey Willpower : pda (Tomlab) Eagle : seagull (Ladomat) --Mailsmith-B5FEB22E-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit <HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; "><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">BiP_HOp Generation on Radio Grenouille // 88.8 FM</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Wednesday evenings : 19:00 - 20:30 PM // Marseille // France</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">November 2006 Playlist</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "> ARTIST ALBUM label</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="Times New Roman">Erik Friedlander and Teho Teardo : giorni rubati (BiP_HOp)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Larsen : seies (Important)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Mécanosphère : limb shop (Raging Planet)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Grails : black tar prophecies (Important)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Michael Schiefel : I don't belong (Traumton)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Phelan Sheppard : harps old master (Leaf)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Ateleia : formal sleep (Xeric/Table Of The Elements)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Pierre-Yves Macé & Quatuor Pli : crash test 2 (Orkhestra)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Isis : in the absence of truth (Ipecac)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">To Rococo rot : taken from vinyl (Staubgold)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Adrian Klumpes : be still (Leaf)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Mono & World's End Girlfriend : palmless prayer/mass murder refrain (Human Highway)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Oblong : indicator (Expanding)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Nina Nastasia : on leaving (Fat Cat)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Andy Stott : merciless (Modern Love)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Robert Henke : layering buddha (Imbalance Computer Music)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Picore : l'hélium du peuple (Jarring Effects)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Thomas Belhom : no border (Ici d'Ailleurs)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Frequency : s/t (Thrill Jockey)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Resina : opinioomnium (Mousike Lab)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Avia Gardner : mill farm (Intr:Version)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Ellen Burr : duos (pfMentum)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Dosh : the lost take (Anticon)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">The Idealist : I am the fire (Nosordo)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Dax Pierson & Robert horton : pablo feldman sun riley (Nosordo)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Conjoint : a few emptu chairs (Buro)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Telepathe : farewell forest (The Social Registry)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Mûm : peel session (Fat Cat)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Tuomi : tightrope walker (Traumton)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Welcome : sirs (Fat Cat)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Mountaineer : when the air is bright they shine (Type)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Ultra Milkmaids : pocket station (Ant Zen)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Library Tapes : feelings for something lost (Resonant)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Richard Javerling : two times five lullaby (Yesternow)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Archi.Texture vol.1 : Boghossian/Tilbuty/Wastell (Cathnor)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Zeitkratzer : noise/... (lärm) (Tourette)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Lasse Marhaug : carnival of souls (Thisco)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Working For A Nuclear Free City : s/t (Melodic)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Fat Jon & Styrofoam : the same channel (Morr Music)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">The Blow : paper television<FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="American Typewriter"> (Tomlab)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">D_rradio : out of love (Distraction)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Prince Valium : andlaus (Resonant)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">L'Ocelle Mare : s/t (Ruminance)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Okay : low road (Ruminance)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Spies Under Von Magnet Influence : suvmi (Cinetiks)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Zonk't : purr (Sound On Probation)</DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="American Typewriter">Forrest Fang & Carl Weingarten : invisibility (The Foundry)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="American Typewriter">Hey Willpower : pda (Tomlab)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="American Typewriter">Eagle : seagull (Ladomat)</FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT class="Apple-style-span" face="American Typewriter"><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></FONT></DIV><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><BR><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV></BODY></HTML> --Mailsmith-B5FEB22E-AD5D-11DB-9D5B-000D932C0D78-- --Boundary_(ID_e7RIq0shvPRZXOMApYjfiw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit _______________________________________________ Microsound-announce mailing list xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx.xxx http://or8.net/mailman/listinfo/microsound-announce --Boundary_(ID_e7RIq0shvPRZXOMApYjfiw)-- From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 16:53:36 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40996-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Tue, 05 Dec 2006 11:53:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 11:53:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 11970 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 16:55:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 11960 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 16:55:17 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 00:02:02 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230900c19aa269688c@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >This whole argument sounds like it is from the late 1800's when >there was the introduction to recordings. it's not really an argument, just an observation of the general evolution of technology and mediation of connection between humans. >Is it live or memorex? If you don't know the answer to that question, then I don't believe it's an issue that need concern you... John --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 01:20:52 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40994-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 20:20:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 20:20:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 67056 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 01:22:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 67043 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 01:22:20 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 20:17:53 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? X-Originating-IP: 68.49.52.232 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.37) by wfilter.us4.outblaze.com; 5 Dec 2006 01:17:54 -0000 X-Originating-Server: ws1-2a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx This whole argument sounds like it is from the late 1800's when there was the introduction to recordings. Is it live or memorex? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John Hopkins" <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? > Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2006 13:11:32 -0700 > > > > A compact disc containing a recording of a piano concerto is not > > a piano concerto. Is the piano concerto the cultural artifact? > > the CD? both? As cultural practitioners, which one do we care > > about more? I'd argue that the CD is a function of the particular > > material emphasis of our current times, and that we care much > > more about the piano concerto itself than about the shiny plastic > > disc. > > A map is not the territory -- the CD re-creation of the concerto is > NOT the Concerto. It is a re-creation, a re-production, a > re-ductive simulation of living, present interaction -- as a social > system, we evolve more and more towards systems of interaction > which are becoming more mediated and more dependent on complex > social systems (recording, distribution systems, for example, and > their attendant political/economic drivers) through which to > interact. Extrapolating this technological/social development > further alienates the individual from his/her immediate > surroundings and especially from the individuals who are > immediately around... > > that's why I suggested the idea of live performance -- suggesting > for those of you who are feeling put-down by the system of > (expensive) recording and distribution -- to look to your immediate > surroundings for possibilities of using your art to exchange > creative energies locally... just a thought... > > it does so happen, that in the age of heavy mediation, perversely, > your immediate surrounding does include this list... but isn't a > conversation about sonic art much better over a beer f2f? just > like having a laptopper demo/discuss/trouble-shoot his/her work > for/with you f2f... > > That materialization of individual human life is exactly what Marx > was talking about -- he predicted the alienation increasing as > technological society continued to evolve... > > cheers > John > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Tue Dec 5 01:00:27 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40993-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 20:00:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 20:00:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 55713 invoked by uid 1095); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 01:02:05 +0000 Received: (qmail 55703 invoked from network); Tue, 05 Dec 2006 01:02:05 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 22:00:17 -0300 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Javier_Areal_V=E9lez?= <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] concerts in europe, january 2006? X-Originating-IP: [201.212.75.162] To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_zZ/p8cIKh/tEmE5y0uE2+w)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Email: [xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2006 01:00:17.0261 (UTC) FILETIME=[BA96F9D0:01C71808] --Boundary_(ID_zZ/p8cIKh/tEmE5y0uE2+w) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit hello, i'm new to microsound though several friends have told me about it for a long time .. . i thought maybe some of you could help me out: im travelling to paris, madrid, barcelona and london in january 2007 and im trying to find out about concerts, art exhibitions, etc. particulary, anything related to experimental electronics and contemporary music (academic or else). i would really appreciate any data you can share with me about these topics, and i apologyse if this is a wrong use of the microsound list. thanks! javier _________________________________________________________________ Descubre Live.com - tu propia página de inicio, personalizada para ver rápidamente todo lo que te interesa en un mismo sitio. http://www.live.com/getstarted --Boundary_(ID_zZ/p8cIKh/tEmE5y0uE2+w)-- From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 23:36:17 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40992-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 18:36:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 18:36:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 10221 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 23:37:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 10205 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 23:37:48 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 12:35:56 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Milan Davidovic wrote: > I'd guess that from a copyright standpoint, the only issue is what > your audio data consists of, and how much is present. So how illegal it is depends on whether I capture, for example, the DJ speaking, versus advertising, or music? Does this strike anyone else as slightly absurd? -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 21:59:34 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40991-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:59:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:59:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 36159 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 22:01:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 36147 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 22:01:09 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:59:13 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <p06230913c199f66427be@[192.168.0.2]> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <p06230913c199f66427be@[192.168.0.2]> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx John Hopkins wrote: > That materialization of individual human life is exactly what Marx was > talking about -- he predicted the alienation increasing as technological > society continued to evolve... I think it's our job as artists to jump the gun on this, assume people already are alienated and provide some kind of alternative, ie intimate, local, live performance. I'm /so/ with you on that one. I've done gigs using field recordings I've taken on the same day, and just telling the audience this has brought up some really interesting feedback, almost like the members of the audience who talked to me afterwards were paying more attention because they knew it was based temporally local recorded sound. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 21:55:53 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40990-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:55:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:55:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 33687 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 21:57:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 33664 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 21:57:20 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:55:17 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Benedikt Koehler wrote: > I believe this question has to do with the industrialisation of culture. > This makes it hard to conceive of cultural products that are not > commodified. But it also means that a whole new fields of interesting > contradictions of being inside and outside of the commodity exchange system > at the same time. Those contradictions can be used as raw material for > cultural practices. Whenever I've been to gigs where the performer has done a workshop beforehand, I've always been much more interested in the workshoppy part than in the gig part. Such as, I think a possible avenue for a performance might be blending the boundaries between workshop and gig, so that each 'piece' would be preceded or accompanied by a commentary by the performer as to what on earth they're actually doing.. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 21:49:09 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40989-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:49:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:49:08 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 30169 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 21:50:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 30158 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 21:50:46 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 13:11:32 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230913c199f66427be@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >A compact disc containing a recording of a piano concerto is not a >piano concerto. Is the piano concerto the cultural artifact? the CD? >both? As cultural practitioners, which one do we care about more? >I'd argue that the CD is a function of the particular material >emphasis of our current times, and that we care much more about the >piano concerto itself than about the shiny plastic disc. A map is not the territory -- the CD re-creation of the concerto is NOT the Concerto. It is a re-creation, a re-production, a re-ductive simulation of living, present interaction -- as a social system, we evolve more and more towards systems of interaction which are becoming more mediated and more dependent on complex social systems (recording, distribution systems, for example, and their attendant political/economic drivers) through which to interact. Extrapolating this technological/social development further alienates the individual from his/her immediate surroundings and especially from the individuals who are immediately around... that's why I suggested the idea of live performance -- suggesting for those of you who are feeling put-down by the system of (expensive) recording and distribution -- to look to your immediate surroundings for possibilities of using your art to exchange creative energies locally... just a thought... it does so happen, that in the age of heavy mediation, perversely, your immediate surrounding does include this list... but isn't a conversation about sonic art much better over a beer f2f? just like having a laptopper demo/discuss/trouble-shoot his/her work for/with you f2f... That materialization of individual human life is exactly what Marx was talking about -- he predicted the alienation increasing as technological society continued to evolve... cheers John --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 17:52:30 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40988-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 12:52:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 12:52:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 80909 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 17:53:57 +0000 Received: (qmail 80899 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 17:53:57 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 12:52:07 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx R U serious? aLEKs On Dec 4, 2006, at 10:17 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > If you happen to snag commercials, aren't you entitled to a fee for > "broadcasting" them? > > ~Kyle > > On 12/3/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: >> >> xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: >> >> > "Taking it seriously" is another issue entirely. This would involve >> > *actively* challenging current opinions regarding copyright law >> and not >> > voting for those who support and vote for copyright continuums and >> draconian >> > laws like the individual-restrictive, industry-favorable DMCA. >> >> I suspected that's what you meant, I just thought I'd play up the >> other >> angle ;-) >> >> I have built an instrument in Pure Data that is basically a >> live-sampling mellotron: it takes an audio feed, partitions based on >> perceived pitch, and maps it to a 12-semitone scale which I can then >> play using a MIDI controller keyboard. >> >> I intend to perform by plugging this instrument in to the radio >> waves, >> using it as a base for building looped improvisations. The radio >> is both >> a good way of getting fresh and unexpected audio data, rather than >> just >> relying on prerecorded samples, but also demonstrates virtuosity, one >> quality that is often perceived to be missing from laptop >> performance. >> >> Question is, how does something like this fall under present >> copyright >> law? >> >> -- >> Damian Stewart >> +64 27 305 4107 >> >> f r e y >> live music with machines >> http://www.frey.co.nz >> http://www.myspace.com/freyed >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > > -- > > http://theradioproject.com > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 17:05:54 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40987-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 12:05:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 12:05:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 57878 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 17:07:23 +0000 Received: (qmail 57866 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 17:07:22 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 18:05:34 +0100 From: Benedikt Koehler <xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_69W17oHYXa533CrHw8YYKQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=IGX0QuujfQADhbjxg4nMMgypSOsnzW8V7PvoOoORUZsYOFtU24fJYRaexvPH35mDXwloXGseC1D3WyGsE8C566/tIl9rZPnYemXHNp6StSc2HdVdPs7lW8qJNIR1wBo2HU1XYdBaoNwBEWHmJI4lzocpEx37dewWgU+dFpdGIao= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_69W17oHYXa533CrHw8YYKQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 12/4/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > > I think we've got multiple different meanings of the word 'cultural > artifact' here. A CD or DVD is a different kind of cultural artifact to > a lunchbox, or a book, or a 78 RPM single. On a lower level you've got > the item of culture (cultural artifact 0) that the physical object > encloses or represents. Then you've got the physical object itself > (cultural artifact 1). > > A compact disc containing a recording of a piano concerto is not a piano > concerto. Is the piano concerto the cultural artifact? the CD? both? As > cultural practitioners, which one do we care about more? I'd argue that > the CD is a function of the particular material emphasis of our current > times, and that we care much more about the piano concerto itself than > about the shiny plastic disc. > I believe this question has to do with the industrialisation of culture. This makes it hard to conceive of cultural products that are not commodified. But it also means that a whole new fields of interesting contradictions of being inside and outside of the commodity exchange system at the same time. Those contradictions can be used as raw material for cultural practices. benedikt --Boundary_(ID_69W17oHYXa533CrHw8YYKQ)-- From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 16:58:18 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40986-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:58:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:58:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 52464 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:59:53 +0000 Received: (qmail 52453 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:59:53 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:58:06 -0500 From: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.x.x> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=E9OP6fjikKzRwtpEELD52rfTTBPtwqUokACewX+846dhtyvpE5T5BOxV4OTfQDL198P2z3G68hY8vTWGxSMA+ZNSlJ9y7bIwhmOcjsX5fz6CLEjKKqW8efhMLf5XKDz4nwxvZc9RYRrB7d9UAY0boQkc/sFAhfi1S98mriLnI6U= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <C199DE09.6AAD%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.x.x> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi On 12/4/06, John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > have all music be performed LIVE only! Imagine that! ok. $100. fine for each mp3 you have on your computer. $500. for a wav or anything at greater resolution than 128 kb/sec [oggs/flacs would not be penalized as the enforcement agencies have no clue about audio formats]. -- \js [ http://or8.net/~johns/ ] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 16:42:27 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40985-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:42:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:42:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 43350 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:44:02 +0000 Received: (qmail 43331 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:44:00 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 09:01:29 -0700 From: John Hopkins <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <C199DE09.6AAD%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06230914c199f6b53ae2@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <C199DE09.6AAD%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >Well said.. So how do we move past the 'shiny plastic disc'? ;) (and you can >add to that, "In a way that is fair for the 'creator','artist' (or whatever >you want to call him/her/it)") have all music be performed LIVE only! Imagine that! JOhn --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 15:18:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40984-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 10:18:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 10:18:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4646 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 15:19:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 4635 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 15:19:29 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 09:17:41 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_OL4/7+zHTk2iB9WLLQC2Ew)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=MSCiY2qTM6DJ68nEopP3ZaAij3apdr4Fw6p8A0To/y/nOom5ENM/0+qNxtzH9hhw5dr8qLhgSOhQqBDceSXKaze/ppFmcu19rnpdjub0EwZqQvrX/o/NKF/KimtYLNMUhoJOxi4khn66TlgmL69yiy4Ow4Kwym43fLv24LIeq9g= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_OL4/7+zHTk2iB9WLLQC2Ew) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If you happen to snag commercials, aren't you entitled to a fee for "broadcasting" them? ~Kyle On 12/3/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > > xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: > > > "Taking it seriously" is another issue entirely. This would involve > > *actively* challenging current opinions regarding copyright law and not > > voting for those who support and vote for copyright continuums and > draconian > > laws like the individual-restrictive, industry-favorable DMCA. > > I suspected that's what you meant, I just thought I'd play up the other > angle ;-) > > I have built an instrument in Pure Data that is basically a > live-sampling mellotron: it takes an audio feed, partitions based on > perceived pitch, and maps it to a 12-semitone scale which I can then > play using a MIDI controller keyboard. > > I intend to perform by plugging this instrument in to the radio waves, > using it as a base for building looped improvisations. The radio is both > a good way of getting fresh and unexpected audio data, rather than just > relying on prerecorded samples, but also demonstrates virtuosity, one > quality that is often perceived to be missing from laptop performance. > > Question is, how does something like this fall under present copyright > law? > > -- > Damian Stewart > +64 27 305 4107 > > f r e y > live music with machines > http://www.frey.co.nz > http://www.myspace.com/freyed > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_OL4/7+zHTk2iB9WLLQC2Ew)-- From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 14:30:53 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40983-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 09:30:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 09:30:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 84221 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 14:32:27 +0000 Received: (qmail 84209 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 14:32:26 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 09:30:38 -0500 From: Milan Davidovic <xxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=Ksv6YmHC6MaKhuDI0XPmDgbepDAosRvqI4Riwvu7i6eBNzBXcObMUatnToWH4zC/0qTS2cipPR5ViKwQdm9Ad66SN4oHfms5N58Dxo3HdmdfTzfiRKBx/MMB3N+fZvdjdJ/9OECZx4dI4YG/ofIljLHhDNOmw5FofebtZvCDw4c= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/3/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > Question is, how does something like this fall under present copyright law? I'd guess that from a copyright standpoint, the only issue is what your audio data consists of, and how much is present. -- Milan Davidovic http://altmilan.blogspot.com http://www.terminus1525.ca/studio/view/2758 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 07:00:25 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40982-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 02:00:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 02:00:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 49931 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 07:02:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 49919 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 07:02:01 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 02:00:15 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] adorno In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i've read 'the culture industry' kim. many times in ethnomusicology at york in toronto. i've also read middleton's "It's all over now'. Popular music and mass culture – Adorno's theory" in Middleton's 'Studying Popular Music' once again. many times. more on this later, as i must sleep and watch battlestar galactica (not in that order) On 3-Dec-06, at 7:47 PM, Kim Cascone wrote: >> same kind elitist and uninformed nonsense that >> adorno would spew from his pedestal on a regular basis. > > while you might not agree with Herr Adorno he was hardly > _uninformed_ ...but if you read 'The Culture Industry' I would bet > you pr0lly agree with most of it > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 06:33:52 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40981-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:33:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:33:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 40727 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 06:35:28 +0000 Received: (qmail 40715 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 06:35:28 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 06:33:40 +0000 From: greg g <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-Originating-IP: [67.188.238.182] X-Sender: xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bcc: Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Email: [xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Dec 2006 06:33:45.0338 (UTC) FILETIME=[25EB7DA0:01C7176E] i guess my previous 4 pager on sunn/boris/filesharing didn't get through. bummer. so here's the rewrite from memory, always diluted and out of itself... i agree with the statement that if people pay for things they value, and music has become self-parodistic and devalued, and perhaps always was "junk" to people, but they never had the technological option to obtain it for free aside from stuffing LPs in their shirt. now such a reality exists, and i don't think it's necessarily detrimental to the record industry, if only they knew how to react to it and harness the distributive and promotional power it possesses. basically, if they offered a decent product with some credibility and value, people would be fine with paying for it. there are plenty of labels i respect and pay for--i've spent hundreds with captain trip, for example. they are convincing to me. all this crass myspace-cultured stuff that's in stores and on the internet today is inherently degrading to appreciation of the music, has no standards, and will ultimately result in achieving only turning what may be worthwhile art into widely available junk. it's become very easy to obtain and listen to, and everyone can and does make it, it's cheap. and that's not inherently a bad thing, necessarily, it's just the reality, and astute artists understand it and act accordingly. however--i feel that many of those people who pay for music don't *actually* value it, but rather *want* to value it, so they go to fair levels of absurdity to convince themselves of the power of their actions, but eventually are inevitably left unsatisfied with that novelty, and fail to see the content for what it is. case in point: the southern lord record label's ridiculously limited vinyl releases, which is basically price gouging and offering a product with diminished quality (colored/clear vinyl, digital mastering, and probably digitally recorded as well). there are always the extremist reactionaries in society, as we all know, and the reactions to music filesharing are just as deluded as the file sharers themselves are often perceived as. the truth is, filesharing is a tool that exists and will for the forseeable future, and i think labels like southern lord would never have reached international prominence and acclaim (article in new york times, etc) or their current high level of sales without it. i'm pretty sure they understand this, and take advantage of it, and secondly, they (geniusly, if not illegitimately as far as art is concerned) take advantage of the reactionaries on the other side of the file sharing coin, by restricting the editions of LPs and convincing people they are "art objects" for the purpose of gouging the price and gaining large profits there. the true consumer of art only accepts what is legitimate as a medium of art (one that puts the content at the fore and presents it in the best light possible, rather than cheapening it through wanton business), and should also be entitled to using technological tools for the purpose of obtaining information and developing a stronger worldview--something i feel is the prerogative of the modern consumer. however, i think care should be taken to avoid the opposite extreme, and feeling that only pure paid consumption is the answer to appreciating music and supporting it--in a way, you're advocating and perpetuating business practices that are detrimental to the content, and ensuring that future releases will be even more superficial from that label, in addition to tricking yourself into thinking the music is something different than what it is. the problem i have with southern lord is that the business aspect for me ruins the credibility of what purports to be outsider extreme music, which it clearly is sonically, but business-wise it's turned into a total sensation every dumb midwestern kid is going crazy over on ebay, which comes into conflict with the purported belief as i understand it that what should be the focus is the music, not the object or the price or scarcity. unfortunately, stephen o'malley is a worldly man, and i feel the music on his label suffers because of it. admittedly, southern lord has a great roster--the grief reissues were excellent, but i would never give my money to southern lord. this is politics, no? see, the thing is, southern lord is (i think) attempting to achieve artistic standards, and that becomes problematic for me when that clashes with their otherwise mainstream/exploitative business policies. on the other hand, it makes sense for a group like metallica to possess mainstream business policies on filesharing, since their music isn't anything but mainstream, and they aren't purporting to offer anything aside from pure mainstream product by being on a major label, so at least their logic is consistent--i can't say as much about southern lord. as for labels like autofact, they're basically stealing from the artist, so the only thing keeping southern lord legal is that they actually pay the artists, which is another genius move, because it allows them to live for another round of limited vinyls to rake in the cash at the expense of some wealthy and confused teenagers seeking to obtain something they perceive as real in the face of fakeness. not so simple, unfortunately. bottom line is that consumers have the power, and if people in the country said "no" to bad business practices in any market, those practices would no longer be viable and the businesses would be forced to change. unfortunately, people buy into things without thinking about them a whole lot in america, and the result is the sort of value system that's in place today. once again, though, i don't think it's really changed in fundamental character in a long time, it's just more apparent how retarded it actually is now that things are as blatant as they are, and the things technology has made possible. _________________________________________________________________ Fixing up the home? Live Search can help http://imagine-windowslive.com/search/kits/default.aspx?kit=improve&locale=en-US&source=hmemailtaglinenov06&FORM=WLMTAG --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 06:28:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40980-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:28:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:28:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 38342 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 06:29:50 +0000 Received: (qmail 38331 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 06:29:50 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:25:45 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] used cd's my two cents In-reply-to: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200707c1996f969bff@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >I know of a handful of artists/musicians that strictly do not buy >used cd's. The reasoning is that merch sales is personal income. I suppose they'd think it was immoral to buy used books as well. R. -- -- Website: http://www.warbaby.com (Currently undergoing an overhaul. Some pages and links may not work yet.) Blog: http://raggedwings.blogspot.com/ Nifty Stuff: http://www.cafepress.com/warbaby -- "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." - Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 04:16:28 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40979-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:16:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:16:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 96777 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 04:18:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 96764 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 04:18:00 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 04:16:17 +0000 From: choncey langford <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] used cd's my two cents X-Originating-IP: [69.111.13.137] X-Sender: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Bcc: Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Email: [xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Dec 2006 04:16:17.0435 (UTC) FILETIME=[F1C95EB0:01C7175A] I know of a handful of artists/musicians that strictly do not buy used cd's. The reasoning is that merch sales is personal income. A lot of them do however utilize second hand cd's to sample or preview the material. I am guilty of buying used -I also use libraries-and donate to libraries- I dupe rare vinyl and donate the copies - a lot of things get reissued though. I also do not complain if I see my records in used bins-or on ebay or what have you.... I also do not depend on album sales to make a living- i have a day job. So it's different. It was strange though to google myself and find 97 mp3 downloadable files - that charge $ that I will never see. My truth is I also download quite a bit- but I share with others almost like an infomercial.I am always happy to be turned on to something or be turned on to something new. I do wonder about labels doing business and making ends meat- I do not believe selling promos of mass "eagles- hotel California" or metallica releases harms the artist- I do believe it harms smaller releases. BUT used is sometimes the only way I can find releases I am searching for- year long searches where a used copy is me finally finding what I want. Generally a release like that - the artist wouldn't see any money from it any ways. Even if it were "new". the label might own the rights and do reissues with no intention of paying the artist.... I justify it by going to a show/performance. That is my redemption to the artist. It's funny how now at every show rock or other- the performer mentions how they have cd's for sale- And from being on tour I know that means food and gas- BUT I HAVE NEVER HEARD JAMES BROWN say " i have cd's for sale." He puts on a show. You go to see someone to SEE something you can't in your living room... To me, this is a very tricky subject. If anyone figures it out-please let me know. choncey www.myspace.com/chonceylangford >From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> >Reply-To: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx >To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> >Subject: Re: [microsound] buying used cd's >Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2006 12:54:10 -0800 (PST) > >No because downloading makes more instances of the "CD" whereas buying >a "used CD" does not. > > >--- Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > Couldn't this argument be equally as compelling if we replace the > > word "buy > > a used cd" with "download mp3s"? > > > > ~Kyle > > > > On 12/3/06, Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > if people buy a used cd of your music, perhaps they > > > will like it so much that they'll go to your > > > performance and buy your new cd. > > > i don't know anyone with enough cd sales to complain > > > about the money they lose from the sale of used ones. > > > i guess this problem is relative. > > > > > > --- Gregory Taylor <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > > how do people who are against filesharing feel > > > > about buying used > > > > >CD's - since > > > > > > the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > > > > > > With the exception of things that I am certain are > > > > out of print > > > > or available [to my knowledge] only for usurious > > > > prices at > > > > watering holes for speculators, I don't buy used CDs > > > > for > > > > precisely the reason you state. > > > > -- > > > > on the floor there's a long wooden table/on the > > > > table there's an open book/ > > > > on the page there's a detailed drawing/and on the > > > > drawing is the name I took > > > > Gregory Taylor http://www.rtqe.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________________________________ > > > Do you Yahoo!? > > > Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. > > > http://new.mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >website: http://www.microsound.org > _________________________________________________________________ Talk now to your Hotmail contacts with Windows Live Messenger. http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwme0020000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://get.live.com/messenger/overview --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 03:15:51 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40978-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:15:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:15:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 76072 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 03:17:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 76056 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 03:17:23 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 14:15:37 +1100 From: Simon Hampson <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C199DE09.6AAD%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] artificats? Thread-index: AccXUnfrtj36q4NFEduzSwAWy4ns3A== X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.2.5.060620 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 4/12/06 2:01 PM, "Damian Stewart" <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > A compact disc containing a recording of a piano concerto is not a piano > concerto. Is the piano concerto the cultural artifact? the CD? both? As > cultural practitioners, which one do we care about more? I'd argue that > the CD is a function of the particular material emphasis of our current > times, and that we care much more about the piano concerto itself than > about the shiny plastic disc. Well said.. So how do we move past the 'shiny plastic disc'? ;) (and you can add to that, "In a way that is fair for the 'creator','artist' (or whatever you want to call him/her/it)") Simon. Symbiosis - Experimental Sound Textures and Rhythms Wednesday nights / 10pm - 12am 102.7 FM / www.rrr.org.au Melbourne / Australia xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 03:02:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40977-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:02:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:02:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 69644 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 03:03:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 69624 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 03:03:35 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:01:48 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] artificats? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Kim Cascone wrote: >> In the language of capitalism, culture is a service, not a product. > > I totally disagree with your statement...culture is a commodity i.e. > product by virtue of the fact an artifact has an exchange value...and > let's not forget that most service can also be defined as a commodity > for the very same reason... I think we've got multiple different meanings of the word 'cultural artifact' here. A CD or DVD is a different kind of cultural artifact to a lunchbox, or a book, or a 78 RPM single. On a lower level you've got the item of culture (cultural artifact 0) that the physical object encloses or represents. Then you've got the physical object itself (cultural artifact 1). A compact disc containing a recording of a piano concerto is not a piano concerto. Is the piano concerto the cultural artifact? the CD? both? As cultural practitioners, which one do we care about more? I'd argue that the CD is a function of the particular material emphasis of our current times, and that we care much more about the piano concerto itself than about the shiny plastic disc. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 02:19:17 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40976-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:19:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:19:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 54891 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 02:20:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 54874 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 02:20:50 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 13:19:04 +1100 From: Simon Hampson <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C199D0C8.6AA4%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] the culture industry Thread-index: AccXSpGI0F8kLIM9EduzSwAWy4ns3A== X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.2.5.060620 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 4/12/06 11:56 AM, "Stephen Hastings-King" <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > what exactly is "the culture industry" in 2006? > where does it stop and start? Sorry to snip your email here Stephen but this reminds me of an interesting book I have just read. Chris Anderson (editor of Wired) has recently released "The Long Tail". His theory is that the internet will move businesses away from the top of the products curve and in to the 'long tail'. Where total sales are from many more items but in much smaller quantities. So how does this tap into what you are saying? If our culture moves away from the 'hit machine' that has been prevalent throughout the 20th Century. If we drive more deeply into the niches and people are encouraged to explore their individual tastes rather than their manufactured tastes.. Surely it bodes well for the variety of things we will be exposed to? But it also means that commercialism moves more deeply into our lives and interests. As we move our interests and consumption into the digital domain, the data on our habits and preferences multiplies. Anderson draws much of his data from places like Rhapsody and Amazon. They're on the upper end of the curve for collecting that 'anonymous' data. Then you have the burgeoning number of companies that are analysing p2p traffic over the internet. I have recently read Philip Ball's book "Critical Mass". In it he looks at culture from a birds-eye view (why mass change or motion takes place in society). When I consider his arguments in conjunction with the data that is being generated about us on a daily basis it doesn't bode well for individual action. Especially action that is not anticipated. I haven't entered the file "sharing" debate because I think it is a little circular. However, no one has mentioned my believe that the industries concerned are partly to blame. They resisted the move towards digital/online consumption and created a lot of the drive towards p2p. But at the end of the day I think the extent of the problem is inflated by the media & the constant debate about it. Simon. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 01:56:48 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40975-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:56:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:56:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 45849 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:58:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 45837 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:58:20 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 14:56:28 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1250; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: > "Taking it seriously" is another issue entirely. This would involve > *actively* challenging current opinions regarding copyright law and not > voting for those who support and vote for copyright continuums and draconian > laws like the individual-restrictive, industry-favorable DMCA. I suspected that's what you meant, I just thought I'd play up the other angle ;-) I have built an instrument in Pure Data that is basically a live-sampling mellotron: it takes an audio feed, partitions based on perceived pitch, and maps it to a 12-semitone scale which I can then play using a MIDI controller keyboard. I intend to perform by plugging this instrument in to the radio waves, using it as a base for building looped improvisations. The radio is both a good way of getting fresh and unexpected audio data, rather than just relying on prerecorded samples, but also demonstrates virtuosity, one quality that is often perceived to be missing from laptop performance. Question is, how does something like this fall under present copyright law? -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 01:22:27 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40974-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:22:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:22:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 32378 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:24:02 +0000 Received: (qmail 32351 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:24:01 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:22:08 -0600 From: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: RE: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1250 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-index: AccXNGJm+SHNJwHZTVG49NjTtSUo/AACjOAg X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > I have difficulty reconciling this sentence: > >> I sincerely hope that U.S. citizens start taking copyright >> and patent laws and restrictions more seriously. > > with this one: > >> It's great to see more creativity coming from the YouTube >> community than from NBC/ABC/CBS. > > A lot of the creativity coming out of YouTube (the genuine > creativity, not just recording stuff directly from TV) is > based on a blatant disregard for copyright laws. Mashups? > ScrambledHackz? Hmmm...I guess I have a different experience with YouTube. I'm well aware of the copyright infringement on YouTube, but I'm far more entertained by the indy music videos, animation, student films, web camera follies, home videos, YouTube performances (LonelyGirl15), etc., rather than what I missed on Jon Stewart or SNL. Much of the top-rated and top-favorites listed on YouTube are certainly individually/independently produced. For example, www.bestofyoutube.com/ looks like at least half of the videos are produced independentaly or grabbed off of some home/unpublished video recording. One could also argue that Mashups are not created in ignorance of copyright, but are a political activity challenging copyright. There may be those creators not aware of or blatantely disregarding copyright laws. This does not make the act of taking copyrighted material and creating something new from it or commenting on it through reappropriation non-political. Disregarding a law could be considered a protest against it (civil disobedience). "Taking it seriously" is another issue entirely. This would involve *actively* challenging current opinions regarding copyright law and not voting for those who support and vote for copyright continuums and draconian laws like the individual-restrictive, industry-favorable DMCA. _________________________________ Christopher Sorg New Media Artist and Instructor Communication Department Loyola University Chicago http://www.chrissorg.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.15.4/563 - Release Date: 12/2/2006 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 01:01:15 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40973-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:01:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:01:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 23670 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:02:50 +0000 Received: (qmail 23658 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 01:02:50 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:01:07 -0600 From: Stephen Hastings-King <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] antifacts? In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_XaoCMSgWqsZ2ZDCVBlQqGw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=uk0OJfqJgxVUIkvMn7/7smOqWOEI0xXAQyJ+9YpCVyBiPlhP82whSF2Ulvht5RRXmnwI9B2/gykbMjmvGSJ08V4d0beIk8MHEh886XjGx9B4xAPGZCcUX+xCsDG7C6rv6jwPkfcUc5jtSIfFqg5hn46iJBv2qhYmYuzPuTbRhus= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxx.xxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_XaoCMSgWqsZ2ZDCVBlQqGw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit huh? lunchboxes and calendars are cultural objects/expressions. why wouldn't they be? what they are is relatively simple---in that they are usually symptomatic--but they are no less expressions for that. cds and other types of recorded material are denser types of information that are lunchboxes or calendars, but they are not different in kind. On 12/3/06, Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > The only difference between collecting lunchboxes and collecting music > is that there are alot fewer lunchboxes out there than CD's. > > > --- Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > Calenders and lunch boxes are less 'cultural artifacts' than they > > are > > > are functional items, so the point is weaker. But they also aren't > > > 'cultural antifacts' in the interesting way that CDs or DVDs are. > > > > tell this to any number of lunch box collectors who buy and sell them > > > > and/or make a living doing so > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --Boundary_(ID_XaoCMSgWqsZ2ZDCVBlQqGw)-- From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 00:56:34 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40972-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:56:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:56:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 21303 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:58:09 +0000 Received: (qmail 21291 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:58:08 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:56:25 -0600 From: Stephen Hastings-King <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <C1999BA7.6A79%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_OvAfTO3r57YL0hVcLRK8xQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=L4XiPyEBC5ChcyAwhanqW0nv6DMh8j662Z/5/uNJikkQWQcGDdck35fur48z/7rvM8YKpoouqjGTrFY9Y0y9Q0k5O7Zgv5NJ/NQjp9wbW0sooWzE45XliHQhbExPO8g0zJWPGws3CJbQ+v4jV8iHg2XPkW4sdcAY/p0PIMIrp+o= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <C1999BA7.6A79%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_OvAfTO3r57YL0hVcLRK8xQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not worth paying for? what exactly is "the culture industry" in 2006? where does it stop and start? as a metaphor in the middle 1940s, this category had some descriptive power because it corresponded to the dominant characteristics of the fordist mode of production. one way of thinking about the dominant characteristics of the present mode of production is networks of small to medium-scale subcontractors which are linked to large-scale final assembly and distribution systems across supply chain management software. so you have a curious new type of combination of decentralization and centralization. the same kind of situation obtains--and has obtained since the 1870s--at the finance end of capitalism as a simple function of stock. anyway. computer technologies and telecommunications infrastructure play fundamental roles in enabling the development of new patterns of production and distribution characteristic of globalizing captialism.. we are communicating using computer technologies and telecommunications infrastructure. we produce sonic objects using computer technologies. in some cases, this production involves telecommunications infrastructure as well. we distribute these objects using computer technologies and telecommunications infrastructure. where does that put us? i am not sure that the category "culture industry" at this point designates much beyond "stuff you or i or we dont like." on devaluation: what explains the value attached to a sonic object? the amount of labor/labor power expended? whose? or is it a function of the amount of money spent on advertising, which is the dominant mode of demand creation? sometimes i wonder if the theory of value in the cook the theif his wife and her lover is not accurate. you charge most for food that is black, black reminds people of death, and everybody wants to eat their own death. another way: where does the intrinsic value of a sonic object reside? if there is no intrinsic value, when what does devaluation mean? q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the devaluation of cultural > artifacts or simply a problem in itself? i dont think i really understand q. 1 and 2 is a correlate, so. --Boundary_(ID_OvAfTO3r57YL0hVcLRK8xQ)-- From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 00:47:38 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40971-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:47:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:47:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16930 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:49:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 16910 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:49:10 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:47:15 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] adorno To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > same kind elitist and uninformed nonsense that > adorno would spew from his pedestal on a regular basis. while you might not agree with Herr Adorno he was hardly _uninformed_ ...but if you read 'The Culture Industry' I would bet you pr0lly agree with most of it --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 00:45:31 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40970-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:45:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:45:30 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 14963 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:47:04 +0000 Received: (qmail 14952 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:47:04 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:45:21 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] antifacts? In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: 4JoeOvcVM1ld8uN8mN9DrOe1sSnNIzntOU9_wr.gurVgrSBEJrN3akYywEE0Iz9RILXG_M97AVqN0Q6dUR35l3zb3WeJifs97KNzHXTRpUVAC6uGgs9lph0rnC1zFuVwX5MdguxyvmPiq7A- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx The only difference between collecting lunchboxes and collecting music is that there are alot fewer lunchboxes out there than CD's. --- Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Calenders and lunch boxes are less 'cultural artifacts' than they > are > > are functional items, so the point is weaker. But they also aren't > > 'cultural antifacts' in the interesting way that CDs or DVDs are. > > tell this to any number of lunch box collectors who buy and sell them > > and/or make a living doing so > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 00:43:28 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40969-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:43:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 13423 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:45:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 13392 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:45:00 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:43:14 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] antifacts? To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > Calenders and lunch boxes are less 'cultural artifacts' than they are > are functional items, so the point is weaker. But they also aren't > 'cultural antifacts' in the interesting way that CDs or DVDs are. tell this to any number of lunch box collectors who buy and sell them and/or make a living doing so --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Mon Dec 4 00:40:41 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40968-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:40:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:40:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 11059 invoked by uid 1095); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:42:12 +0000 Received: (qmail 11039 invoked from network); Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:42:12 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:40:27 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] artificats? To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > In the language of capitalism, culture is a service, not a product. I totally disagree with your statement...culture is a commodity i.e. product by virtue of the fact an artifact has an exchange value...and let's not forget that most service can also be defined as a commodity for the very same reason... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 23:49:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40967-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:49:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:49:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 89136 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:50:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 89125 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:50:34 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 00:49:25 +0100 From: =?windows-1250?Q?Bj=F6rn_Eriksson?= <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <04af01c71735$aa6eeb90$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=windows-1250; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xxxxxxx-xxx.xx.xxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Ha, nice! Your popcorn respone mail got me to think what would happen if some copyright holders just reversed it. The copyright holders... for instance some famous music makers could release some music that should only be permitted to view, listened to, downloaded, copied and shared privately. If any commercial use is suspected, like airing on a commercial radio station or tv channel, copyright infringements would be obvious and some compensation to the copyright holder for the "damage" should be necessary. The mass media should also be invited to cover this happening. Guess this scenario only could happen with a "big" artist with some considerable amount of so called fame. A great sense of humour and integrity would help also. Also probably would be needed some risk money to make an experiment like this come true. Hmm... just thinking aloud... Could this happen? Has it happened already somewhere? :) /Björn Eriksson - Sweden > I sincerely hope that U.S. citizens start taking copyright and patent laws > and restrictions more seriously. We are no longer living in a one-way > media > dominion. Microsound was a "consumer as author" bellwether. The more > two-way, open-source, Creative Commons initiatives, the better. It's great > to see more creativity coming from the YouTube community than from > NBC/ABC/CBS. > _________________________________ > Christopher Sorg --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 23:40:19 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40966-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:40:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:40:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 84142 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:41:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 84126 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:41:53 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 12:40:06 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1250; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx wrote: I have difficulty reconciling this sentence: > I sincerely hope that U.S. citizens start taking copyright and patent laws > and restrictions more seriously. with this one: > It's great > to see more creativity coming from the YouTube community than from > NBC/ABC/CBS. A lot of the creativity coming out of YouTube (the genuine creativity, not just recording stuff directly from TV) is based on a blatant disregard for copyright laws. Mashups? ScrambledHackz? -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 23:13:06 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40965-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:13:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:13:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 73560 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:14:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 73546 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 23:14:37 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:12:53 -0600 From: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Subject: RE: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: 'microsound' <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1250 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-index: AccWPtDJ2UrWHvpJR2mOuP/ImthRpAA7VVdA X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > so here is another problem: > say I rent a movie, for example, a documentary on Karl Marx's > impact on the US labor movement after WWII (had to do that > sorry;) and I invite five friends over to watch and enjoy it > with me... > > q: hasn't the store 'lost' money on my friends watching the > movie with me? is that different than filesharing? Yes, the store, or actually, the publishing company considers that they have lost money. Many movie viewing licenses do NOT include permission to show a film in a group. When I consider airing documentaries and films for courses, I must make sure that the university is licensed or has purchased the appropriate license for academic/group viewing purposes. For example, the Fischinger Archive has finally released some of Oskar Fischinger's animations on DVD. However, it is only "licensed for private home use only, all other rights reserved. " (http://www.centerforvisualmusic.org/DVD.htm) Another film I have considered showing in class is "The Magic of Radio", a guerilla radio documentary (http://www.heatsignature.com/radio.html). In order to show it at a university or in a public forum, you must purchase the "institutional use" license. Many films I have considered for class viewing have had similar restrictions. I'm not sure where the line is drawn between personal, public, and institutional viewing, but the MPAA has recently taken an interest in regulating personal home theaters (http://www.bbspot.com/News/2006/11/home-theater-regulations.html). I don't see any problem with an author requesting an extra $50-75 for an institutional license, for example, for your Karl Marx documentary. I don't really believe that this a big concern for the MPAA. They are primarily fighting for films that have already been distributed internationally, made millions, and has been on national and cable TV. Does it really matter if I screen it for five people at home? In how many theatres can I revisit "Brazil" or "Blade Runner"? I sincerely hope that U.S. citizens start taking copyright and patent laws and restrictions more seriously. We are no longer living in a one-way media dominion. Microsound was a "consumer as author" bellwether. The more two-way, open-source, Creative Commons initiatives, the better. It's great to see more creativity coming from the YouTube community than from NBC/ABC/CBS. _________________________________ Christopher Sorg New Media Artist and Instructor Communication Department Loyola University Chicago http://www.chrissorg.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.15.4/563 - Release Date: 12/2/2006 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 22:32:42 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40964-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:32:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:32:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 57558 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:34:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 57546 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:34:09 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 09:32:23 +1100 From: Simon Hampson <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C1999BA7.6A79%xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] the culture industry Thread-index: AccXKua0JV5z5oMeEduTFQAWy4ns3A== X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.2.5.060620 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 4/12/06 9:24 AM, "Damian Stewart" <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: >>> The last hundred years blip of culture as recorded medium is a blip, and >>> will end soon. > john saylor wrote: >> how do you know this? > > I don't /know/ it, I just believe it, strongly. I hold a mostly circular > view of history, and a whole bunch of instincts, not to mention my > ethical sense and the perceived ethical sense of most of my peers, lead > me to this belief. And you, of course, forgot your time machine.. :) Now if you can just help with where I put the remote control.. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 22:25:05 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40963-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 54175 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:26:39 +0000 Received: (qmail 54165 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:26:39 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:24:49 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx john saylor wrote: > comic books, cds, dvds, calendars, lunch boxes: products. > what's the service? A comic book is an object through which a comic is distributed. The comic itself is a distinct object from the book. The purpose of the comic is to cause a collection of mental events in the reader. In an important sense the comic is the mental events. My point is clearer with a CD. When I buy a CD I'm not buying it because it's a shiny plastic disc, I'm buying it because it lets me arrange the air molecules in front of my speakers (or headphones) in particular ways that I like. The 'fan' aspect (the desire to hold the object and read the liner notes) aside, I'm buying a service, not a product. Calenders and lunch boxes are less 'cultural artifacts' than they are are functional items, so the point is weaker. But they also aren't 'cultural antifacts' in the interesting way that CDs or DVDs are. >> The last hundred years blip of culture as recorded medium is a blip, and >> will end soon. > > how do you know this? I don't /know/ it, I just believe it, strongly. I hold a mostly circular view of history, and a whole bunch of instincts, not to mention my ethical sense and the perceived ethical sense of most of my peers, lead me to this belief. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 22:07:35 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40962-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:07:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:07:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 44977 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:09:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 44964 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:09:10 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:07:27 -0500 From: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=VgiOqjHbiFRQSTsjX5nBPebp9wdCo71jNswoOE9lJYRPYkWO/Q2wuZ+UtgLAb8SSyjslirdfe+30jRp8wVUrjpNe/buBHK/ZCDoYthaAGuntcIuFp/z6kMGuBFqgO7CzrXAoolBjfeZVqMH4hGJ0iPMhpR+1p1OCN+hlMGWO1Dk= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi On 12/3/06, Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > In the language of capitalism, culture is a service, not a product. comic books, cds, dvds, calendars, lunch boxes: products. what's the service? > The last hundred years blip of culture as recorded medium is a blip, and > will end soon. how do you know this? -- \js [ http://or8.net/~johns/ ] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 22:05:54 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40961-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:05:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 17:05:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 43643 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:07:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 43632 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:07:29 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 11:05:43 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx david.microsuoni wrote: > this is the era of the real-audio/mp3 preview. This is the era where being able to /perform/ reasserts itself. Kind of scary from our perspective as electronic/'studio' musicians, but the tools necessary to transfer talents in the studio to talents on stage are there. Our skill as a studio artist is the ability to listen and to make choices based on what we hear; and at any distance away from the puppetry of fully notated scores, a live musician's skill (especially in a group) is their ability to listen and to make choices based on what they hear. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 21:56:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40960-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:56:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:56:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 38583 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:57:45 +0000 Received: (qmail 38572 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:57:45 +0000 Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 10:55:53 +1300 From: Damian Stewart <xxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxx@xxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025) Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Kim Cascone wrote: > q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' > given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not worth > paying for? Perhaps. Invert the importance of money, though. I don't think people have the impression that music is disposable (except for music designed to be disposable), but 'not worth paying for' implies that to pay for something is the basic determinant of value, upon which other kinds of value can be built. Money has become so much more imaginary in a digital world (especially where the population is largely ignorant of how the underlying electronic mechanisms works) that it doesn't surprise me that music, even more esoteric than money, is the first to show the strain. > q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the devaluation of cultural > artifacts or simply a problem in itself? Filesharing is a symptom of the weakening of the psychological mechanisms necessary to make culture a product you have to pay money for. I'm not sure such a thing as a 'cultural artificat' as something that you pay money for just because it's culture has any meaning outside of the performance arena. In the language of capitalism, culture is a service, not a product. The last hundred years blip of culture as recorded medium is a blip, and will end soon. -- Damian Stewart +64 27 305 4107 f r e y live music with machines http://www.frey.co.nz http://www.myspace.com/freyed --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 21:48:22 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40959-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:48:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:48:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 35393 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:49:55 +0000 Received: (qmail 35383 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:49:55 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:48:13 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] buying used cd's In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: BzX_XPcVM1l8fYgiJQ.TV_fgDIKU_wH_VYBtqsgKtBL.A8D_lggpy9sdQy_6bm_C0of44MzrTXH2Pn7FerBxkzc8rZo96.FhnqkxoP.IqrjvPooNOXMgpwYTL1r3ZOjkqZx3OeWeAZcbYlA- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I wasn't addressing that concern .. just pointing out the difference in copies and passing around the same CD. For unknown artists who want to reach a larger audience then making mp3's available freely is an obvious way to go.. I really don't think that it is disputable. Of course there are some artist's where the only way you can get their newest material is to go to see them live and buy their CD's at the show. Or seeing them live is the only way to hear their material period because they release infrequently or in very limited editions. However from the perspective of the record industry (not that agree with them) when you spend millions of dollars promoting a band and royalties are pennies for every CD sold then you want to sell as many CD's as possible. Since you have allready saturated the market with promotions allready then you don't care about word of mouth via filesharing. So for the small artist at soem point you will have grown past the stage of simply needing exposure at whatever cost into okay now I have a fan base and I'd like to make some profits. If touring is your only option to make money at the point it's a pretty gruelling way to do it. But to get back to the issue at hand.. I don't think filesharing will ever just be given a total greenlight because it can't pave the way for pirating and by that I mean people who sell copies in any form to make money off your efforts. As far as I can tell though with the exception of the RIAA debacle that is where most ofthe busting efforts have been placed. Adrian --- Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > oh. so does that mean less people will pay to see/hear > your performance? > i don't understand why more instances of your cd would > be bad in this case, if we are only talking in terms > of promotion, and not about profit. > > --- Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > No because downloading makes more instances of the > > "CD" whereas buying > > a "used CD" does not. > > > > > > --- Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > Couldn't this argument be equally as compelling if > > we replace the > > > word "buy > > > a used cd" with "download mp3s"? > > > > > > ~Kyle > > > > > > On 12/3/06, Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > if people buy a used cd of your music, perhaps > > they > > > > will like it so much that they'll go to your > > > > performance and buy your new cd. > > > > i don't know anyone with enough cd sales to > > complain > > > > about the money they lose from the sale of used > > ones. > > > > i guess this problem is relative. > > > > > > > > --- Gregory Taylor <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > how do people who are against filesharing > > feel > > > > > about buying used > > > > > >CD's - since > > > > > > > the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > > > > > > > > With the exception of things that I am certain > > are > > > > > out of print > > > > > or available [to my knowledge] only for > > usurious > > > > > prices at > > > > > watering holes for speculators, I don't buy > > used CDs > > > > > for > > > > > precisely the reason you state. > > > > > -- > > > > > on the floor there's a long wooden table/on > > the > > > > > table there's an open book/ > > > > > on the page there's a detailed drawing/and on > > the > > > > > drawing is the name I took > > > > > Gregory Taylor http://www.rtqe.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > > > > Do you Yahoo!? > > > > Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail > > beta. > > > > http://new.mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > > > > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Music Unlimited > Access over 1 million songs. > http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 21:31:48 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40958-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:31:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:31:48 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 28425 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:33:20 +0000 Received: (qmail 28412 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:33:20 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:31:37 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] buying used cd's In-reply-to: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=yuNInjVGwlKV434gGhLNKJMOxl4Z7SdEEaTHBmGk+svEubP8Hb2TzTn+uh22ZZ+xbUUs0+WSRSgTXBJxiQYfKQ7fb4cFzqg4dPhXWyZf/2xrBJWzi7yYcJYfIjPgtqVe/qH5lk/t3z+MOZEy3NXveMrdpJWtK2YoQRh7oINQgso=; X-YMail-OSG: B0ZQj1MVM1nKgoLiv3sVR_TbOHIJrYpi4WxLaCFofSWMh1qbk59OCQBOLcbn3EHV1JhRyMcBfE1YGyzDC5xu3fwm.n3vGelsmMQJ6w3JiL79yKRWdT3I1.X5roiUfCOkyqzFtjiITsJKmog- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx oh. so does that mean less people will pay to see/hear your performance? i don't understand why more instances of your cd would be bad in this case, if we are only talking in terms of promotion, and not about profit. --- Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > No because downloading makes more instances of the > "CD" whereas buying > a "used CD" does not. > > > --- Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > Couldn't this argument be equally as compelling if > we replace the > > word "buy > > a used cd" with "download mp3s"? > > > > ~Kyle > > > > On 12/3/06, Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > if people buy a used cd of your music, perhaps > they > > > will like it so much that they'll go to your > > > performance and buy your new cd. > > > i don't know anyone with enough cd sales to > complain > > > about the money they lose from the sale of used > ones. > > > i guess this problem is relative. > > > > > > --- Gregory Taylor <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > > how do people who are against filesharing > feel > > > > about buying used > > > > >CD's - since > > > > > > the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > > > > > > With the exception of things that I am certain > are > > > > out of print > > > > or available [to my knowledge] only for > usurious > > > > prices at > > > > watering holes for speculators, I don't buy > used CDs > > > > for > > > > precisely the reason you state. > > > > -- > > > > on the floor there's a long wooden table/on > the > > > > table there's an open book/ > > > > on the page there's a detailed drawing/and on > the > > > > drawing is the name I took > > > > Gregory Taylor http://www.rtqe.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > > > Do you Yahoo!? > > > Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail > beta. > > > http://new.mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > http://theradioproject.com > > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > > > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > > > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 21:29:57 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40957-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:29:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:29:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 26932 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:31:28 +0000 Received: (qmail 26920 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:31:28 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:29:45 -0500 From: Milan Davidovic <xxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=C65tGXrr2EONPQmq2JTuhit/YkwSDTwSjgjGowO9Glml/OpXYf8TttNufaO17oTCt4f/SAJsOulN+8rPvgAniNTn/d6tBeyBuk196vkGjV3HzTZfQL5Z+cNMcKUDdWv6pPWqiFP7CMnCEg7rIOLG14Fw/S2lqYD2K+NYRPZUXvY= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/3/06, david.microsuoni <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > nowadays we are bombarded with tons of newsletters, hundreds of labels and releases every month... i simply feel that the pleasure of listening to something new is not here anymore, this is the era of the real-audio/mp3 preview. Maybe abundance isn't all it's cracked up to be. -- Milan Davidovic http://altmilan.blogspot.com http://www.terminus1525.ca/studio/view/2758 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 21:22:23 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40956-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:22:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:22:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 23158 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:23:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 23143 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 21:23:55 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 22:25:12 +0100 From: "david.microsuoni" <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0652-6, 01/12/2006), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' >given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not >worth paying for? > maybe overproduction is another reason, and internet too ;-) when i was a boy in the '80 information about experimental music was scarce and difficult to find out, you had to hunt it down on paper fanzines like vital, nd or est... sometimes it was even difficult to know about new releases by your favorite artists. i often bought LPs making my choice based on reviews, or word of mouth, and surely i got some awful releases now and then, but everytime i had the surprise to listen to something new, unexpected. holding in my hands a new vinyl was a joy.... nowadays we are bombarded with tons of newsletters, hundreds of labels and releases every month... i simply feel that the pleasure of listening to something new is not here anymore, this is the era of the real-audio/mp3 preview. david. http://microsuoni.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 20:54:20 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40955-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 15:54:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 15:54:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 10577 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:55:52 +0000 Received: (qmail 10565 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:55:52 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 12:54:10 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] buying used cd's In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: p.kBwn4VM1l9MEN0xesVG5vyipP1x7fPG43e9ul0.onsbb0R8SKFaXmK3SJviiKpf3eQ6V75vTqX7rfiCuoxjVtg6Xl7Acie6jQE401GxdYS0y08ejvrPmWvBh5J0jP.6UeMLVqvLQXhGIQ- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx No because downloading makes more instances of the "CD" whereas buying a "used CD" does not. --- Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > Couldn't this argument be equally as compelling if we replace the > word "buy > a used cd" with "download mp3s"? > > ~Kyle > > On 12/3/06, Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > if people buy a used cd of your music, perhaps they > > will like it so much that they'll go to your > > performance and buy your new cd. > > i don't know anyone with enough cd sales to complain > > about the money they lose from the sale of used ones. > > i guess this problem is relative. > > > > --- Gregory Taylor <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > > > how do people who are against filesharing feel > > > about buying used > > > >CD's - since > > > > > the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > > > > With the exception of things that I am certain are > > > out of print > > > or available [to my knowledge] only for usurious > > > prices at > > > watering holes for speculators, I don't buy used CDs > > > for > > > precisely the reason you state. > > > -- > > > on the floor there's a long wooden table/on the > > > table there's an open book/ > > > on the page there's a detailed drawing/and on the > > > drawing is the name I took > > > Gregory Taylor http://www.rtqe.net > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. > > http://new.mail.yahoo.com > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > -- > > http://theradioproject.com > http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com > > (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) > (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) > ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ > _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ > ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 20:28:08 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40954-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 15:28:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 15:28:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 798 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:29:40 +0000 Received: (qmail 782 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 20:29:39 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 14:27:56 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] buying used cd's In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_iiiDLy4N8srj5J4fYg8nQg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=oxPGoRwIWx92gIBV1kJvQwZ+ijtL34RbE9zjD/el3euKGJyZ4H5JUPltyAPef2YLzekUH5etfawD8Au2irREL/iLIrQUqAdAoyIhuPYRcCrHhmhYFUwrXjKJaczsOT/hCjI0JyoZSJaPbQnNMzYdpbikLLLA0C1umgNr0Dw5GeE= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx.x.x> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_iiiDLy4N8srj5J4fYg8nQg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Couldn't this argument be equally as compelling if we replace the word "buy a used cd" with "download mp3s"? ~Kyle On 12/3/06, Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > if people buy a used cd of your music, perhaps they > will like it so much that they'll go to your > performance and buy your new cd. > i don't know anyone with enough cd sales to complain > about the money they lose from the sale of used ones. > i guess this problem is relative. > > --- Gregory Taylor <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > > > how do people who are against filesharing feel > > about buying used > > >CD's - since > > > > the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > > With the exception of things that I am certain are > > out of print > > or available [to my knowledge] only for usurious > > prices at > > watering holes for speculators, I don't buy used CDs > > for > > precisely the reason you state. > > -- > > on the floor there's a long wooden table/on the > > table there's an open book/ > > on the page there's a detailed drawing/and on the > > drawing is the name I took > > Gregory Taylor http://www.rtqe.net > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. > http://new.mail.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_iiiDLy4N8srj5J4fYg8nQg)-- From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 19:36:59 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40953-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 14:36:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 14:36:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 76363 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:38:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 76352 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:38:28 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 11:36:47 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] buying used cd's In-reply-to: <p06240800c1975ba12b18@[192.168.0.3]> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=l7JJLYholh3XjFyJMkAvj5I6zYRoAZmZq5Pi9KrmrdigakQbUUSsiJLRosqNNF/AKYrI6PqlFLEQfjvt7vyhI3NR4N+ahPVIuGFHzk942CwN1gnU0Pwz3ZUWTUhTIcHesNAWOMFMf7ClNaaQZiyCo3GNxcjiUxFe9OYXa59nw+o=; X-YMail-OSG: 8Gt0D1oVM1mO4aa3Ldsvs4qHJrthHzKLtZp_UzTt68VoQibTKQBg3_jbWVFyY06IuBbm6ruBANMfE737ypyiqoYwe4M8b0mMbZkUObkX3X0ZeiZ56lakxEWdAIASdZpNv.F9BPdiJveQcRw- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx if people buy a used cd of your music, perhaps they will like it so much that they'll go to your performance and buy your new cd. i don't know anyone with enough cd sales to complain about the money they lose from the sale of used ones. i guess this problem is relative. --- Gregory Taylor <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> wrote: > > > how do people who are against filesharing feel > about buying used > >CD's - since > > > the artist makes no money on that sale? > > With the exception of things that I am certain are > out of print > or available [to my knowledge] only for usurious > prices at > watering holes for speculators, I don't buy used CDs > for > precisely the reason you state. > -- > on the floor there's a long wooden table/on the > table there's an open book/ > on the page there's a detailed drawing/and on the > drawing is the name I took > Gregory Taylor http://www.rtqe.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. http://new.mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 19:27:43 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40952-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 14:27:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 14:27:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 71965 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:29:14 +0000 Received: (qmail 71953 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:29:14 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 11:27:32 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Klein <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=iCT9R2BoOLMnkn+EEeoERoZn6Y3BFPt3hELCXpOOHR3Di9b8mxMrZQLcI4fGhJxGTctHzAFJDh7EVSny97puCyinlpgkqquDK+Ifdyltq06OIjP8T8XAjdPVe9+rXGLzucfzE+EImm/0itWAQ41cPLKAzLBY+EJgEb/qUQlMPiA=; X-YMail-OSG: LvvvUM4VM1n6qxaQIqHjs3IegD8TsewNS3L6QAqw9jZS4PQ21XAY9h0ze9Mi3e7yRlO7Q.BNTlAW_TtmW1MCby08m79ThyXtn0buTHjbB1KIpd24NlKQMCKJpkzLs7CEqtHH4SEq8Ax2hMk- X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx this pop music stuff has been going on since the recording industry began. why are we just now starting to have a problem with it? the real problem with filesharing is how easy it is to do. there's no work or meaning behind it. you're not copying a cd or record to tape, which involves at least the amount of time that it takes to listen to the recording. downloading a song is immediate gratification, which no one is exempt from. sure, you may not download songs, but you grab a snack from the fridge, drive a car, or check your email 1700 times a day. everyone wants something right now, and a lot of people want a particular song. it's also a lot easier to download some rare psychedelic or electro acoustic record that someone has digitized than to comb through record stores the world over to find 1 out of 19 available copies. ok, it's time for me to stop wasting time typing emails and get back to making music. --- Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> wrote: > and do you think that microsound is somehow above > the steady stream > of swill that constitutes your 'culture industry'? > that sounds like the same kind elitist and > uninformed nonsense that > adorno would spew from his pedestal on a regular > basis. > > On 3-Dec-06, at 1:08 PM, Kim Cascone wrote: > > > this clip > > > > > http://axiomsun.com/home/video/no_talent_no_problem! > > > _how_to_create_a_sexy_pop_star.html > > > > http://tinyurl.com/y24d4w > > > > is from a doc film titled 'Before The Music Dies' > and shows how a > > pop song/singer is manufactured... > > > > http://www.beforethemusicdies.com/ > > > > I read an in-depth article in the New York Times > Magazine a few > > years back on the same subject/issues: > manufacturing a pop star/hit > > single...I tossed it during a spring studio > cleaning but I'm sure > > some Googling would reveal title/author > > > > q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the > 'culture > > industry' given people the impression that music > is disposable and > > hence not worth paying for? > > > > q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the > devaluation of cultural > > artifacts or simply a problem in itself? > > > > Adorno turns in his grave > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: > xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Have a burning question? Go to www.Answers.yahoo.com and get answers from real people who know. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 18:53:26 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40951-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 55692 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:54:58 +0000 Received: (qmail 55682 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:54:58 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:53:11 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx To me its Entertainment. It is disposable. If somebody appreciates that then fine, that is what they are into. There will always be people that want more substance in the music they listen to and will be willing to pay for it. I bet a lot of people on this list do not watch MTV or VH1. I know that i do not. I barely watch TV at all. People gravitate towards their interest's. I feel its sad, but at the same time who am i to judge anyone? Ignorance is bliss to a lot of people. Life goes on. aLEKs On Dec 3, 2006, at 1:37 PM, András Rónai wrote: > So what is really the problem? > > That 40 years old men write the songs that teenagers listen to? > So should teenagers write the songs other teenagers listen to? Should > teenagers write, direct and edit the films they watch? Should > teenagers > write the books they read? (And so should 6 year old children write > tales?) > > Is the problem that the music industry uses young, > good-looking girls instead of 40 years old, not-so-good-looking men? > > I think there are more 40 or more years old men on music channels I > really > can't stand. At least young girls are good to look at, even if > that's the > only important difference. > > Or is that they use effects in the studio? > Is that really a problem here on the microsound list? ;) > > Well, my point is that while the video is entertaining it doesn't > touch any > of the real problems of the music industry, or say the > "industrialisation" > of culture. > > r.a > http://ra.underground.hu/ > > On 12/3/06, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: >> >> this clip >> >> http://axiomsun.com/home/video/no_talent_no_problem! >> _how_to_create_a_sexy_pop_star.html >> >> http://tinyurl.com/y24d4w >> >> is from a doc film titled 'Before The Music Dies' and shows how a pop >> song/singer is manufactured... >> >> http://www.beforethemusicdies.com/ >> >> I read an in-depth article in the New York Times Magazine a few years >> back on the same subject/issues: manufacturing a pop star/hit >> single...I tossed it during a spring studio cleaning but I'm sure >> some Googling would reveal title/author >> >> q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' >> given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not >> worth paying for? >> >> q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the devaluation of cultural >> artifacts or simply a problem in itself? >> >> Adorno turns in his grave >> >> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 18:44:01 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40950-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:44:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:44:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 51302 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:45:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 51289 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:45:29 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:43:46 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx and do you think that microsound is somehow above the steady stream of swill that constitutes your 'culture industry'? that sounds like the same kind elitist and uninformed nonsense that adorno would spew from his pedestal on a regular basis. On 3-Dec-06, at 1:08 PM, Kim Cascone wrote: > this clip > > http://axiomsun.com/home/video/no_talent_no_problem! > _how_to_create_a_sexy_pop_star.html > > http://tinyurl.com/y24d4w > > is from a doc film titled 'Before The Music Dies' and shows how a > pop song/singer is manufactured... > > http://www.beforethemusicdies.com/ > > I read an in-depth article in the New York Times Magazine a few > years back on the same subject/issues: manufacturing a pop star/hit > single...I tossed it during a spring studio cleaning but I'm sure > some Googling would reveal title/author > > q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture > industry' given people the impression that music is disposable and > hence not worth paying for? > > q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the devaluation of cultural > artifacts or simply a problem in itself? > > Adorno turns in his grave > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 18:37:17 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40949-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:37:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:37:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 48387 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:38:50 +0000 Received: (qmail 48374 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:38:50 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 19:37:08 +0100 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E1s_R=F3nai?= <xxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_qHEa6H8wtQyvPqCGV//dUg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=ZJRp3M8hAi/USXW1Brctdi10yUPKeO5v/iftwcdyY/SRXHaCSXzEYwV8ZtMkPiVbDSjmP40VDoz314cFRlnwXWeccqK040vU0j/TBF6rtjkAN+WUYVzngQulbVvt43uGBQGXWIHtI37sGICVgLgv8rO0LFPnuQgoD+ncqmGVmn4= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_qHEa6H8wtQyvPqCGV//dUg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit So what is really the problem? That 40 years old men write the songs that teenagers listen to? So should teenagers write the songs other teenagers listen to? Should teenagers write, direct and edit the films they watch? Should teenagers write the books they read? (And so should 6 year old children write tales?) Is the problem that the music industry uses young, good-looking girls instead of 40 years old, not-so-good-looking men? I think there are more 40 or more years old men on music channels I really can't stand. At least young girls are good to look at, even if that's the only important difference. Or is that they use effects in the studio? Is that really a problem here on the microsound list? ;) Well, my point is that while the video is entertaining it doesn't touch any of the real problems of the music industry, or say the "industrialisation" of culture. r.a http://ra.underground.hu/ On 12/3/06, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > this clip > > http://axiomsun.com/home/video/no_talent_no_problem! > _how_to_create_a_sexy_pop_star.html > > http://tinyurl.com/y24d4w > > is from a doc film titled 'Before The Music Dies' and shows how a pop > song/singer is manufactured... > > http://www.beforethemusicdies.com/ > > I read an in-depth article in the New York Times Magazine a few years > back on the same subject/issues: manufacturing a pop star/hit > single...I tossed it during a spring studio cleaning but I'm sure > some Googling would reveal title/author > > q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' > given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not > worth paying for? > > q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the devaluation of cultural > artifacts or simply a problem in itself? > > Adorno turns in his grave > > > > > > --Boundary_(ID_qHEa6H8wtQyvPqCGV//dUg)-- From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 18:31:12 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40948-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:31:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:31:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 45050 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:32:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 44984 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:32:35 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:30:50 -0500 From: john saylor <xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=SLsuoWVC3sLNlQtJoZkpVXzhm0GpmSuo0f2GEazGDBJM618T0InaWpNYqAAfEnyBYkC12fJnrtEetmGL4JREKLjy/KMUodHm4YuiV5LY6pRrv20OAX54QJMXzKsSryTKz/MNVvgb4DMhFkrp8kmElPf12yBa6f4nMHqB8SHQrRk= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx hi On 12/3/06, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' > given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not > worth paying for? everything is disposable in america. people, culture, containers. it's only money that matters. -- \js [ http://or8.net/~johns/ ] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 18:24:27 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40947-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:24:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:24:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 40939 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:26:00 +0000 Received: (qmail 40929 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:25:59 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 10:24:18 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] the culture industry In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: IsFmiUIVM1lxhg6PYh.LgcBVDNPYygSZX7k4BplIjYg8S2Diai3gSUXTwMweBPn8isCr8UgBL0RLr89naAvFgbuuK1rF9UZUbGVaNsi.HEydxGAH1ejuWxn.uBaujLrDil4oUeQJswBhjwQ- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' > > given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not > worth paying for? I think this is a possibility > q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the devaluation of cultural > artifacts or simply a problem in itself? I think it has more to do with technology .. manual labor is devalued because robots don't go on strike. Technology allows perfect and infinite copies devalues artifacts because anyone can have it without manufacturing costs (no labor). --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sun Dec 3 18:08:37 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40946-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:08:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 13:08:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 33732 invoked by uid 1095); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:10:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 33720 invoked from network); Sun, 03 Dec 2006 18:10:05 +0000 Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2006 10:08:20 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] the culture industry To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_8kyg+djAmD19Ngy99a5jJg)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_8kyg+djAmD19Ngy99a5jJg) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit this clip http://axiomsun.com/home/video/no_talent_no_problem! _how_to_create_a_sexy_pop_star.html http://tinyurl.com/y24d4w is from a doc film titled 'Before The Music Dies' and shows how a pop song/singer is manufactured... http://www.beforethemusicdies.com/ I read an in-depth article in the New York Times Magazine a few years back on the same subject/issues: manufacturing a pop star/hit single...I tossed it during a spring studio cleaning but I'm sure some Googling would reveal title/author q1: has the steady stream of swill coming from the 'culture industry' given people the impression that music is disposable and hence not worth paying for? q2: is filesharing a _symptom_ of the devaluation of cultural artifacts or simply a problem in itself? Adorno turns in his grave --Boundary_(ID_8kyg+djAmD19Ngy99a5jJg)-- From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 19:32:17 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40945-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 14:32:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 14:32:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 67941 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 19:33:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 67901 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 19:33:41 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 11:32:02 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] This list contradicts In-reply-to: <006301c715fa$031825f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200700c1977c8acce6@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <006301c715fa$031825f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Since I was the one who started this irresolvable philosophical wank by trying to be helpful when someone couldn't find a particular recording, I apologise. In the end, we must all follow our respective ethics and do as we must. The ethics themselves are irrelevant as long as we're true to them. The real artist ripoffs are the greedhead weasels in the recording industries, and short of mounting an assassination jihad, there's not much we can do about it if we opt to release our work through them (please, let's not start a philosophical thread in this direction). Fortunately, technology has advanced recording, editing, duplication and distribution to a point where it's technically and economically feasible to eliminate the bloodsucking middlemen and do it ourselves. We may not sell millions of CDs this way, but I think that, for most of us anyway, the stuff we're doing will never have the mass appeal that elevates us to pop star wealth and status. While it's a lovely dream to be able to make a living from our art, the first consideration should be creation of the art, with making a buck from it as a periphal factor and not the primary motivation. Otherwise, we should all just give it up and become Yannis... Getting back on a more relevant topic, are y'all familiar with Miniorgan <http://www.miniorgan.com>? It's all about cheesy toy synthisizers and musical toys with sample sounds of some of these delightful little gizmos, some of which could be potentially useful in creative work. And useful or not, it's fun. R. >the boris / sunn 0))) became focused on a russian mp3-site (and >assciated politic / ethics) instead of discussing the music. > >~vincent. -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 19:11:04 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40944-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 14:11:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 14:11:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 56092 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 19:12:25 +0000 Received: (qmail 56075 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 19:12:25 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 14:10:42 -0500 From: Derek Mason <xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn X-Originating-IP: 69.3.155.10 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxxxx@xxx-xx.xxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Server: ws1-2a.us4.outblaze.com X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Its called a copyright issue and yes it does matter. It matters if you are charging money for your five friends to watch it, you do a screening of the movie. Besides, what I don't tell you and what you don't find out; you don't know. It is a non issue if nobody know about it. > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > I think movies are a different beast here, you can rent movies you can't > > music albums, because the RIAA put an end to that. > > Why? a copy of a rented movie isn't a big deal, as must only watch it once, > > maybe twice, so no sale there. > > so here is another problem: > say I rent a movie, for example, a documentary on Karl Marx's > impact on the US labor movement after WWII (had to do that sorry;) > and I invite five friends over to watch and enjoy it with me... > > q: hasn't the store 'lost' money on my friends watching the movie > with me? is that different than filesharing? > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 18:37:21 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40943-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:37:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:37:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 42047 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:38:50 +0000 Received: (qmail 42030 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:38:49 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:37:11 -0800 (PST) From: xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx Subject: Re: [microsound] popcorn In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xx.xx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx You can't really compare these two. It'd more be like if you rented the movie, copied it to your friends so they could watch it at home. Or rather, if you wanna compare it to filesharing - as if you stole the DVD and then made 5 copies to your friend so they could watch them at home. Johan. >> I think movies are a different beast here, you can rent movies you >> can't >> music albums, because the RIAA put an end to that. >> Why? a copy of a rented movie isn't a big deal, as must only watch >> it once, >> maybe twice, so no sale there. > > so here is another problem: > say I rent a movie, for example, a documentary on Karl Marx's impact > on the US labor movement after WWII (had to do that sorry;) and I > invite five friends over to watch and enjoy it with me... > > q: hasn't the store 'lost' money on my friends watching the movie > with me? is that different than filesharing? > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 18:33:26 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40942-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:33:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:33:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 39952 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:34:56 +0000 Received: (qmail 39942 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:34:55 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:33:12 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] pirat spinat - typo fix To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > (i don't know if i can say that here, but kim cascone's work with > Merzbow is > one of the greatest music i ever heard, BUT i don't have the money > to buy > cd, because i have my work as musician and image maker, and that > costs me a > lot!!! since I was paid 'in product' for that particular release and sell my copies while on tour I *personally* don't lose any money from people filesharing...that is not an invitation to rip and share since the record label and distributors are the ones who lose in that case that being said though I don't know if the label has gone into a second or third or 'n' pressing of that release I have not been given product as payment for any subsequent pressings - if any also, I don't know if Masami has been paid for any subsequent pressings - if any...but I doubt it in this case we have a label who is not sending me any info regarding sales of the CD since I've been 'paid in full' for my work i.e., our contract is fulfilled and they no longer have any obligation to me as an artist so I can't see any reason - at this point - for people NOT to share this release *if they can't afford to buy it* I might feel differently IF the label were sending me sales reports and/or extra product as payment for extra pressings of the CD but... the sad fact is (and I know this from having run Silent Records for 10 years) many indie labels struggle to stay in business and do so on the backs of the artist by not paying them and up the food chain the labels are further squeezed by distributors who are ALWAYS late (very very very late) in paying the labels for their product so the whole system of moving widgets is broken and decayed (has been for years now) unless people making and selling the product are doing it as a hobby and have the luxury of not having to worry about drawing an income from this... the two main reasons I sold my company in 1996: - I saw the writing on the wall w/r/t the Internet - we managed to get massively screwed by our main distributor (they essentially bankrupted us) since then I have released CD's on various other labels but *I do not make a living* from doing this... I usually get paid in 'n' number of copies and then rarely hear from the label again I then sell those copies for retail while I am on the road... this makes me enough extra pocket money to fund the logistics of being on the road (food, metro tickets, books, etc) so the whole pirating discussion is really a non-issue for most of us in the trenches since the concept of a clean unobstructed flow of money from consumer- >shop->distributor->label is a myth --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 18:27:56 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40941-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.112]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:27:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta18.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:27:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 36766 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:29:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 36754 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:29:21 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:27:44 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] manifest To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > The main annoyance was when the myspace music topic came up a while > back and > people were listing 'microsound' type projects for people to listen > to and > THATS when people became uptight and started waving their hands > around. > Why?!! because this is not a trainspotting list...this list focuses on discussing philosophical issues surrounding digital music politics and filesharing are inextricably interwoven with making digital artifacts if you don't agree then please think about joining or starting another list more to your liking --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 18:22:28 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40940-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.187]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:22:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta26.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:22:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 34332 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:23:55 +0000 Received: (qmail 34319 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:23:55 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:22:17 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] popcorn To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > I think movies are a different beast here, you can rent movies you > can't > music albums, because the RIAA put an end to that. > Why? a copy of a rented movie isn't a big deal, as must only watch > it once, > maybe twice, so no sale there. so here is another problem: say I rent a movie, for example, a documentary on Karl Marx's impact on the US labor movement after WWII (had to do that sorry;) and I invite five friends over to watch and enjoy it with me... q: hasn't the store 'lost' money on my friends watching the movie with me? is that different than filesharing? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 18:09:48 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40939-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:09:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:09:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 28269 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:11:11 +0000 Received: (qmail 28258 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 18:11:11 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:09:33 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] pirat spinat To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > (i don't know if i can say that here, but kim cascone's work with > Merzbow is > one of the greatest music i ever heard, BUT i don't have the money > to buy > cd, because i have my work as musician and image maker, and that > costs me a > lot!!! since I was paid 'in product' for that particular release and sell my copies while on tour I *personally* don't lose any money from people filesharing...that is not an invitation to rip and share since the record label and distributors are the ones who lose in that case that being said though I don't know if the label has gone into a second or third or 'n' pressing of that release I have not been given product as payment for any subsequent pressings - if any also, I don't know if Masami has been paid for any subsequent pressings - if any...but I doubt it in this case we have a label who is not sending me any info regarding sales of the CD since I've been 'paid in full' for my work i.e., our contract is fulfilled and they no longer have any obligation to me as an artist so I can't see any reason - at this point - for people to share this release *if they can't afford to buy it* I might feel differently IF the label were sending me sales reports and/or extra product as payment for extra pressings of the CD but... the sad fact is (and I know this from having run Silent Records for 10 years) many indie labels struggle to stay in business and do so on the backs of the artist by not paying them and up the food chain the labels are further squeezed by distributors who are ALWAYS late (very very very late) in paying the labels for their product so the whole system of moving widgets is broken and decayed (has been for years now) unless people making and selling the product are doing it as a hobby and have the luxury of not having to worry about drawing an income from this... the two main reasons I sold my company in 1996: - I saw the writing on the wall w/r/t the Internet - we managed to get massively screwed by our main distributor (they essentially bankrupted us) since then I have released CD's on various other labels but *I do not make a living* from doing this... I usually get paid in 'n' number of copies and then rarely hear from the label again I then sell those copies for retail while I am on the road... this makes me enough extra pocket money to fund the logistics of being on the road (food, metro tickets, books, etc) so the whole pirating discussion is really a non-issue for most of us in the trenches since the concept of a clean unobstructed flow of money from consumer- >shop->distributor->label is a myth --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 16:41:26 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40938-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 11:41:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 11:41:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 92607 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 16:42:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 92597 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 16:42:49 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:41:12 -0600 From: Gregory Taylor <xxxxxxx@xxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] Re: *****SPAM***** microsound Digest 2 Dec 2006 11:09:43 -0000 Issue 1725 In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06240800c1975ba12b18@[192.168.0.3]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-ORBL: [70.226.149.29] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used >CD's - since > > the artist makes no money on that sale? With the exception of things that I am certain are out of print or available [to my knowledge] only for usurious prices at watering holes for speculators, I don't buy used CDs for precisely the reason you state. -- on the floor there's a long wooden table/on the table there's an open book/ on the page there's a detailed drawing/and on the drawing is the name I took Gregory Taylor http://www.rtqe.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 11:08:16 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40937-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 06:08:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 06:08:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 71223 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 11:09:41 +0000 Received: (qmail 71211 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 11:09:41 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 12:10:59 +0100 From: "david.microsuoni" <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] This list contradicts In-reply-to: <006301c715fa$031825f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0652-6, 01/12/2006), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <006301c715fa$031825f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx sure, but as long as the discussion is interesting and constructive, i don't see it as a problem. unless we start talking about the new nhl season... ;-) david. >@ david: >yes, it's related music however it is far more general rather than >specified >or focussed on "microsound" or the aesthetic of it, imo. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 10:11:18 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40936-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 05:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 05:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 51177 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:12:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 51061 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:11:42 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 11:09:53 +0100 From: eretsua <xxxxxxxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] This list contradicts To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx>, xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <006301c715fa$031825f0$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx @ david: yes, it's related music however it is far more general rather than specified or focussed on "microsound" or the aesthetic of it, imo. however, i do feel that the myspace situation turned to a self-promotion-chaos. people were not commenting on the music at the profiles but rather used the list as a canvas to write their profile links on. the boris / sunn 0))) became focused on a russian mp3-site (and assciated politic / ethics) instead of discussing the music. ~vincent. ----- Original Message ----- From: "david.microsuoni" <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Saturday, December 02, 2006 10:34 AM Subject: re: [microsound] This list contradicts sorry, i don't understand. isn't piracy and donwloading related to music?? should we open a new list for every single thread? david. >I just don't understand this list. I read the emails semi-regularly so >when >I checked this time, there was a big list of Sunn/Boris headings. I >thought, cool; I'll have a look. 2 artists which I enjoy listening to. >What I find is a topic that is totally off-topic and not even 'microsound'. >Sure, this happens on forums/mailing lists so that's not the main >annoyance. >The main annoyance was when the myspace music topic came up a while back >and >people were listing 'microsound' type projects for people to listen to and >THATS when people became uptight and started waving their hands around. >Why?!! I thought it was great to actually listen to some of the music >which >s meant to be being discussed. People should be interested in listening to --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 09:56:58 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40935-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 04:56:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 04:56:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 43129 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 09:58:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 43118 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 09:58:24 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:56:53 +0100 From: eretsua <xxxxxxxxx_xxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] This list contradicts To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <003f01c715f8$31e71910$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx you wrote pretty much i exactly what i wanted to write & post. ~vincent. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ritchie" <x_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 10:44 PM Subject: [microsound] This list contradicts >I just don't understand this list. I read the emails semi-regularly so >when I checked this time, there was a big list of Sunn/Boris headings. I >thought, cool; I'll have a look. 2 artists which I enjoy listening to. >What I find is a topic that is totally off-topic and not even 'microsound'. >Sure, this happens on forums/mailing lists so that's not the main >annoyance. > The main annoyance was when the myspace music topic came up a while back > and people were listing 'microsound' type projects for people to listen to > and THATS when people became uptight and started waving their hands > around. Why?!! I thought it was great to actually listen to some of the > music which is meant to be being discussed. People should be interested > in listening to other peoples music. As a music/sound creator, I'm also a > music lover so bring on more music to listen to I say instead of drifting > off topic about piracy plus 'many' other topics which have happened in the > past. > > Support the music you enjoy! > > /Rant off > > R. > http://murdergrin.blogspot.com > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 09:31:25 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40934-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.184]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 04:31:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta23.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 04:31:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 34314 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 09:32:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 34303 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 09:32:51 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 10:34:12 +0100 From: "david.microsuoni" <xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: re: [microsound] This list contradicts To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_ASmOXTOIyxr4XqdDs3U7pA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0652-6, 01/12/2006), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_ASmOXTOIyxr4XqdDs3U7pA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit sorry, i don't understand. isn't piracy and donwloading related to music?? should we open a new list for every single thread? david. >I just don't understand this list. I read the emails semi-regularly so when >I checked this time, there was a big list of Sunn/Boris headings. I >thought, cool; I'll have a look. 2 artists which I enjoy listening to. >What I find is a topic that is totally off-topic and not even 'microsound'. >Sure, this happens on forums/mailing lists so that's not the main annoyance. >The main annoyance was when the myspace music topic came up a while back and >people were listing 'microsound' type projects for people to listen to and >THATS when people became uptight and started waving their hands around. >Why?!! I thought it was great to actually listen to some of the music which >s meant to be being discussed. People should be interested in listening to --Boundary_(ID_ASmOXTOIyxr4XqdDs3U7pA)-- From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 08:35:00 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40933-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 03:35:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 03:34:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16469 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 08:36:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 16459 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 08:36:25 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 08:33:53 +0000 From: Paul Sanders <xxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <p06200702c1965b079e7a@[192.168.0.2]> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <p06200702c1965b079e7a@[192.168.0.2]> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 2 Dec 2006, at 03:19, Robert Arnold wrote: >> but the artist never sees the money from that 2nd hand cd sell... >> > > And an artist who does a painting or a sculpture doesn't make any > money when the work is later resold (often at a much higher figure > as the artist's reputation grows). Is this not a similar injustice? > How about used books? Should the writer get a cut every time the > book changes hands? There is now a beastie called a 'resale right' or something like that, where the original creator of a painting or sculpture does get a small percentage of subsequent sales. There are limitations, such as a minimum sale price, and the involvement of an agent (gallery or dealer). It's the subject of an EU directive. These things play to our notions of fairness, but don't seem particularly logical. If the original contract was willingly entered into, then that should be the end of it. However we do seem to be redistributative by nature, especially where art and craft is concerned. Paul --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 04:42:57 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40932-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.183]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 23:42:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta22.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 23:42:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 54123 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 04:44:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 54110 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 04:44:21 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 20:40:35 -0800 From: JC <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] This list contradicts X-Originating-IP: 69.181.225.103 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <054101c715cc$2e918970$xxxxxxxx@xxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2739.300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=Y/mkhbagBrCJZT5YA6EdedEiorXS92qVls1HJGE+Q9Q4SiAiMKBRRban0FFRHDd3; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; X-ELNK-Trace: 250e53821a8c36f54d2b10475b571120ccafd9493d20a3b19434c6fd579e4dccdb90d1f507f8762a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I agree completely. Thanks for stating it so clearly. JC Mendizabal Black Note Music -- Energized Sound Creations -- http://www.blacknotemusic.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ritchie" <x_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> To: "microsound" <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 1:44 PM Subject: [microsound] This list contradicts > I just don't understand this list. I read the emails semi-regularly so when > I checked this time, there was a big list of Sunn/Boris headings. I > thought, cool; I'll have a look. 2 artists which I enjoy listening to. > What I find is a topic that is totally off-topic and not even 'microsound'. > Sure, this happens on forums/mailing lists so that's not the main annoyance. > The main annoyance was when the myspace music topic came up a while back and > people were listing 'microsound' type projects for people to listen to and > THATS when people became uptight and started waving their hands around. > Why?!! I thought it was great to actually listen to some of the music which > is meant to be being discussed. People should be interested in listening to > other peoples music. As a music/sound creator, I'm also a music lover so > bring on more music to listen to I say instead of drifting off topic about > piracy plus 'many' other topics which have happened in the past. > > Support the music you enjoy! > > /Rant off > > R. > http://murdergrin.blogspot.com > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 03:36:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40931-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:36:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:36:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 32003 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 03:37:39 +0000 Received: (qmail 31993 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 03:37:38 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:35:49 -0800 From: "p. hendricks" <xx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <C1963495.25D2D%xx@xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Thread-topic: [microsound] torrents Thread-index: AccVwvWANEu3coG2Edu6WAANkzE3GA== X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/11.2.1.051004 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I think movies are a different beast here, you can rent movies you can't music albums, because the RIAA put an end to that. Why? a copy of a rented movie isn't a big deal, as must only watch it once, maybe twice, so no sale there. That's most and many still only buy movies they love. Music is different, you may listen 10-1000+ times. Anyway, my argument supports the MPAA mostly so i'll stop there as i would go out of my way to give them a dime. Regardless, for music, i like the sharing, if you like it BUY IT, if you don't or can't at least it may get passed on (shared) with someone who will. Or one day you will, or buy the artist's next release. Sharing is paid for corporations because they focus on the pop single and and the rest of the album is filler. And if you can download that, they are fucked, because 3 months later there will be another "hit" Or if you can DL the whole album it will be exposed how much it sucks. Bottom-line: if you have a strong enough product, let your customers preview it first and share that! that's the best advertising you'll ever get. 90% of the music i've bought was based on a tape or mp3 i was given or downloaded. best, pH On 12/1/06 11:15 AM, "Kim Cascone" <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > here's a suggestion: > - search for torrents of things you want to listen to/watch > - DL them via a torrent client > - listen to/watch them > - if you like a release/movie then buy it used > - if you don't like release/movie delete it from your hard drive > > which raises a question: > > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's > - since the artist makes no money on that sale? > > not trying to add fuel to the flamewar, just curious --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 03:20:37 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40930-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:20:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:20:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 25827 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 03:22:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 25817 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 03:22:01 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:19:47 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200702c1965b079e7a@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >but the artist never sees the money from that 2nd hand cd sell... > And an artist who does a painting or a sculpture doesn't make any money when the work is later resold (often at a much higher figure as the artist's reputation grows). Is this not a similar injustice? How about used books? Should the writer get a cut every time the book changes hands? I think this thread we've been following is one of the most slippery ethical issues one could possibly attempt to resolve. Personallly, I can agree with the rationale and justification for all of the viewpoints, depending on how I look at it - which leaves me in an opinionless void. Kind of a nice place to be, all things considered. R. -- -- Website: http://www.warbaby.com (Currently undergoing an overhaul. Some pages and links may not work yet.) Blog: http://raggedwings.blogspot.com/ Nifty Stuff: http://www.cafepress.com/warbaby -- "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." - Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Sat Dec 2 02:38:09 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40929-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:38:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:38:08 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 11812 invoked by uid 1095); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 02:39:30 +0000 Received: (qmail 11798 invoked from network); Sat, 02 Dec 2006 02:39:29 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 13:37:49 +1100 From: Andrew Cameron <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] boris + sunn o))) collaboration In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Cc: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Since I found it accidentally, I thought others would have too. But I won't be taking out any full page ads, so we should all be fine... I will not be eating in London sushi bars anytime soon however... On 01/12/2006, at 10:34 PM, xxxxx.xxxxx@xxx.xx wrote: > Uhhh, that (the tabbed bleep page that never times out during > playback) was > like "privileged" information Andrew. > > One of the best kept secret on the interweb I'd have thought. > > Why don't we, in future, try and keep it that little bit of a > secret. Not > so that it can be utilised towards any nefarious purpose, like stream > ripping or whatever - simply let's think of it as our own secret > little > oasis of freely streamed playback on demand. > > It could potentially be very damaging to bleep, the artists and > thus the > consumer if this was to become publicised widely. That which is one > of the > sites great advantages (ability to preview audio at any point of > the actual > track) could in the end become it's achilles heal. Just think about > it... > > All the best fella, > bp > ~ > > > |---------+----------------------------> > | | Andrew Cameron | > | | <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx| > | | .net.au> | > | | | > | | 01/12/2006 04:14 | > | | Please respond to| > | | microsound | > |---------+----------------------------> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> ---------------------------------------------------------| > > | > | > | To: microsound > <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> > | > | cc: > xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx > | > | Subject: Re: [microsound] boris + sunn o))) > collaboration > | >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> ---------------------------------------------------------| > > > > > Beatport can be flaky for me, lost items in the crate a few times > etc... The best part of bleep.com for me is how (in safari in my > case) when you preview a track, just create a new tab and read the > news or something, and the track will play with no fade-out until you > click back on the bleep tab. Great for certain tracks that you want > to hear in full (pedantically). > > It flaked on me only once, I think in the first week of its life, so > I think it's definitely the benchmark. > > > On 01/12/2006, at 6:07 AM, Graham Miller wrote: > >> my problem with beatport is that the preview quality is atrocious. >> you can't tell if the production of the actual recording is any >> good and that deters me from buying any digital downloads. i think >> this is especially shortsighted when you consider that in the idiom >> of electronic dance music the production IS the music. >> >> i'm really hooked on bleep.com. the preview system they have there >> is perfect. you see the entire track as a waveform and can shuttle >> instantly anywhere in the track, with really decent preview audio >> quality that plays for about 20 seconds before fading to silence. >> >> it's also a beautiful website done by the geniuses at kleber.net. >> >> g. >> >>> >>> Anyway I buy the releases I like, in part because I do want to >>> support >>> artists. But note that beyond that, a digital download from beatport >>> is normally of higher quality, especially since I usually buy WAV >>> rather than mp3 for instance. So all ethics aside, there is, in >>> fact, >>> good incentive for a discriminating consumer to buy legal digital >>> copies of files. >>> >>> ~David >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> - >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > <InterScan_Disclaimer.txt> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 22:12:22 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40927-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.81]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:12:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta12.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:12:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 79261 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:13:42 +0000 Received: (qmail 79249 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:13:41 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:12:09 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_secngd9yqehPETVNzXUMoQ)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=DPheZf04cxM1jq9SCnMGGdKOP2xj+XhEHCq/9Di+ibeWmYdcnmz8vdnt71RCQsAfpjr7i1mropSeerC+uqkR5ZFwZQzmbnsrYPXdIxqDTuR9amPVIlrwR3xnkWfD1+9DLyW90bpdJIwhXFbQkoQQL9pNEFR0hxRKqxbRXVavw58= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_secngd9yqehPETVNzXUMoQ) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit haha didn't notice that error! But to confirm, it was supposed to read Slashdot. It's Friday, I need to get out of the office. ~Kyle On 12/1/06, Milan Davidovic <xxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > On 12/1/06, Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > Is it just me, or is this starting to sound like a Slashot thread? > > Must be the season, but for a millisecond I was torn as to whether to > read that as "Slashdot" or "Slapshot". > > Have a good one... > > -- > Milan Davidovic > http://altmilan.blogspot.com > http://www.terminus1525.ca/studio/view/2758 > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_secngd9yqehPETVNzXUMoQ)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 22:13:16 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40928-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:13:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:13:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 80387 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:14:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 80374 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:14:35 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:12:06 -0800 From: Robert Arnold <xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <p06200700c19657a3d2e5@[192.168.0.2]> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >not trying to add fuel to the flamewar, just curious > Flamewar? Seemed pretty civilized for a flamewar. I don't think a thread qualifies as a flame war unless (a) at least two people quit the list, and (b) the words 'Marx', 'Nazi", and 'Racist' appear more than once, preferably in the same post, preferably in the same sentence. Umm...oops, I think I just created one of the qualifications... R. -- -- Website: http://www.warbaby.com (Currently undergoing an overhaul. Some pages and links may not work yet.) Blog: http://raggedwings.blogspot.com/ Nifty Stuff: http://www.cafepress.com/warbaby -- "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." - Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 22:04:02 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40926-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:04:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:04:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 75603 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:05:18 +0000 Received: (qmail 75588 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:05:17 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 17:03:44 -0500 From: Graham Miller <xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] This list contradicts In-reply-to: <xxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx i couldn't agree more. On 1-Dec-06, at 4:44 PM, Ritchie wrote: > I just don't understand this list. I read the emails semi- > regularly so when I checked this time, there was a big list of Sunn/ > Boris headings. I thought, cool; I'll have a look. 2 artists > which I enjoy listening to. What I find is a topic that is totally > off-topic and not even 'microsound'. Sure, this happens on forums/ > mailing lists so that's not the main annoyance. > The main annoyance was when the myspace music topic came up a while > back and people were listing 'microsound' type projects for people > to listen to and THATS when people became uptight and started > waving their hands around. Why?!! I thought it was great to > actually listen to some of the music which is meant to be being > discussed. People should be interested in listening to other > peoples music. As a music/sound creator, I'm also a music lover so > bring on more music to listen to I say instead of drifting off > topic about piracy plus 'many' other topics which have happened in > the past. > > Support the music you enjoy! > > /Rant off > > R. > http://murdergrin.blogspot.com > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 21:59:51 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40925-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.83]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:59:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta14.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:59:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 73318 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:01:10 +0000 Received: (qmail 73307 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:01:10 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:59:36 -0500 From: Eloy Anzola <xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] reactable interface X-Originating-IP: 24.90.10.217 To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-ELNK-Trace: 61ccf016e473eb8b1aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79228a9c7d4b69675f1ae5550e15ae6ce3350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h-RhyopUmc --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 21:44:17 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40924-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:44:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:44:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 66065 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:45:37 +0000 Received: (qmail 66044 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:45:36 +0000 Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2006 08:14:02 +1030 From: Ritchie <x_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] This list contradicts X-Originating-IP: [202.61.214.105] X-Sender: x_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Originating-Email: [x_xxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx] X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Dec 2006 21:44:06.0585 (UTC) FILETIME=[D37B1A90:01C71591] I just don't understand this list. I read the emails semi-regularly so when I checked this time, there was a big list of Sunn/Boris headings. I thought, cool; I'll have a look. 2 artists which I enjoy listening to. What I find is a topic that is totally off-topic and not even 'microsound'. Sure, this happens on forums/mailing lists so that's not the main annoyance. The main annoyance was when the myspace music topic came up a while back and people were listing 'microsound' type projects for people to listen to and THATS when people became uptight and started waving their hands around. Why?!! I thought it was great to actually listen to some of the music which is meant to be being discussed. People should be interested in listening to other peoples music. As a music/sound creator, I'm also a music lover so bring on more music to listen to I say instead of drifting off topic about piracy plus 'many' other topics which have happened in the past. Support the music you enjoy! /Rant off R. http://murdergrin.blogspot.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 21:33:10 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40923-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:33:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:33:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 59718 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:34:27 +0000 Received: (qmail 59706 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:34:27 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 15:32:54 -0600 From: Kyle Klipowicz <xxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_3vhGxZXbTG1uTW6ismsbcA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=pfGWEukCt9IhDjsAeFXTa6jr3uomaby9RK+X37B6lo9bgQHhVE/cYSNd5DuSEoaikkEVwPRao7t7S/rvJT67WhevvXrREv1cTMra7wdnub8mTmspZnAB7HXyasn4lZHJW/ZTW7IInAc4ZnffXtn7Y1ZqQaaBuzTjUcEwWZ5AUoo= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_3vhGxZXbTG1uTW6ismsbcA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is it just me, or is this starting to sound like a Slashot thread? ~Kyle On 12/1/06, aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> wrote: > > Yeah i know. And it would also still be illegal for that second new > owner to distribute MP3's from the second hand CD. The CD is purchased > under the assumtion that it is for entertainment purposes only or some > such shlock. Just like you could not Buy or rent a movie at block > buster then charge people a fee to view the movie. > > For the most part i think this sort of crap only affects the big boys. > Could really give two shits about em any way. Im sure it can all get > really confusing... > > aLEKs > > > > > On Dec 1, 2006, at 4:13 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > > > but the artist never sees the money from that 2nd hand cd sell... > > > > > > On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > > > >> Because when you sell your cd used you give up ownership of it and > >> the person who buys it takes up that ownership. Ripping that same > >> cd to mp3 and freely distributing it is a world apart. > >> > >> No different then buying a piece of software, cracking it, and then > >> bartering with the crack for other cracked software. > >> > >> Honestly its hard not to do so ever. At least for me. I just try to > >> be as moralistic about it as possible. Always pay when i can. If i > >> cant afford all the music i want then the bigger labels wont be > >> getting my money but smaller joe's like you or me. Its still wrong > >> and i guess thats my justification for it, but at least i am being > >> honest. > >> > >> aLEKs > >> > >> > >> > >> On Dec 1, 2006, at 2:23 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >> > >>> This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been > >>> aware of for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to > >>> buy second hand cds and not ok to file share... > >>> On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Kim Cascone wrote: > >>>> how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used > >>>> CD's - since the artist makes no money on that sale? > >>> ============================ > >>> www.phoniq.net > >>> releases available on: > >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >>> publication: > >>> www.vagueterrain.net > >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >>> website: http://www.microsound.org > >> > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> website: http://www.microsound.org > >> > >> > > > > ============================ > > www.phoniq.net > > releases available on: > > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > > publication: > > www.vagueterrain.net > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > -- http://theradioproject.com http://perhapsidid.blogspot.com (((())))(()()((((((((()())))()(((((((())()()())()))) (())))))(()))))))))))))(((((((((((()()))))))))((()))) ))(((((((((((())))())))))))))))))))__________ _____())))))(((((((((((((()))))))))))_______ ((((((())))))))))))((((((((000)))oOOOOOO --Boundary_(ID_3vhGxZXbTG1uTW6ismsbcA)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 21:26:42 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40922-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.186]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:26:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta25.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:26:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 55618 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:28:01 +0000 Received: (qmail 55606 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:28:01 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:26:30 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Yeah i know. And it would also still be illegal for that second new owner to distribute MP3's from the second hand CD. The CD is purchased under the assumtion that it is for entertainment purposes only or some such shlock. Just like you could not Buy or rent a movie at block buster then charge people a fee to view the movie. For the most part i think this sort of crap only affects the big boys. Could really give two shits about em any way. Im sure it can all get really confusing... aLEKs On Dec 1, 2006, at 4:13 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > but the artist never sees the money from that 2nd hand cd sell... > > > On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > >> Because when you sell your cd used you give up ownership of it and >> the person who buys it takes up that ownership. Ripping that same >> cd to mp3 and freely distributing it is a world apart. >> >> No different then buying a piece of software, cracking it, and then >> bartering with the crack for other cracked software. >> >> Honestly its hard not to do so ever. At least for me. I just try to >> be as moralistic about it as possible. Always pay when i can. If i >> cant afford all the music i want then the bigger labels wont be >> getting my money but smaller joe's like you or me. Its still wrong >> and i guess thats my justification for it, but at least i am being >> honest. >> >> aLEKs >> >> >> >> On Dec 1, 2006, at 2:23 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: >> >>> This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been >>> aware of for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to >>> buy second hand cds and not ok to file share... >>> On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Kim Cascone wrote: >>>> how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used >>>> CD's - since the artist makes no money on that sale? >>> ============================ >>> www.phoniq.net >>> releases available on: >>> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >>> publication: >>> www.vagueterrain.net >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >>> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 21:23:15 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40921-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:23:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:23:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 52943 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:24:36 +0000 Received: (qmail 52928 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:24:35 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 22:20:35 +0100 From: Glenn Folkvord - Hyperion Media <xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <0b7e01c7158e$e0872100$xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kim Cascone" <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's - > since the artist makes no money on that sale? One argument is that the artist made his money once, through the first sale, and that he would not get more compensation from the first owner no matter how much he listened to it. Thus, reselling the CD will deprive the first owner from the pleasure of owning it, and the second owner will still be only one person to benefit from it, as in the case with the first owner. One owner = one point of compensation. glenn --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 21:15:14 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40920-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:15:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:15:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 46434 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:16:35 +0000 Received: (qmail 46423 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:16:35 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 13:15:04 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx In the case of material items .. I can't think of an instance where you have to pay the original owner a fee to "transfer" ownership to a new owner. However this is certianly the case with some software. --- Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > but the artist never sees the money from that 2nd hand cd sell... > > > On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > > > Because when you sell your cd used you give up ownership of it and > the person > > who buys it takes up that ownership. Ripping that same cd to mp3 > and freely > > distributing it is a world apart. > > > > No different then buying a piece of software, cracking it, and then > bartering > > with the crack for other cracked software. > > > > Honestly its hard not to do so ever. At least for me. I just try > to be as > > moralistic about it as possible. Always pay when i can. If i cant > afford > > all the music i want then the bigger labels wont be getting my > money but > > smaller joe's like you or me. Its still wrong and i guess thats my > > > justification for it, but at least i am being honest. > > > > aLEKs > > > > > > > > On Dec 1, 2006, at 2:23 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > > >> > >> This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been > aware of > >> for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to buy > second hand > >> cds and not ok to file share... > >> > >> > >> > >> On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Kim Cascone wrote: > >> > >>> > >>> how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used > CD's - > >>> since the artist makes no money on that sale? > >> > >> > >> ============================ > >> www.phoniq.net > >> releases available on: > >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com > >> publication: > >> www.vagueterrain.net > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > >> website: http://www.microsound.org > >> > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 21:11:57 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40919-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:11:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:11:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 43333 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:13:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 43311 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 21:13:16 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 16:13:20 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx but the artist never sees the money from that 2nd hand cd sell... On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, aleks vasic wrote: > Because when you sell your cd used you give up ownership of it and the person > who buys it takes up that ownership. Ripping that same cd to mp3 and freely > distributing it is a world apart. > > No different then buying a piece of software, cracking it, and then bartering > with the crack for other cracked software. > > Honestly its hard not to do so ever. At least for me. I just try to be as > moralistic about it as possible. Always pay when i can. If i cant afford > all the music i want then the bigger labels wont be getting my money but > smaller joe's like you or me. Its still wrong and i guess thats my > justification for it, but at least i am being honest. > > aLEKs > > > > On Dec 1, 2006, at 2:23 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > >> >> This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been aware of >> for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to buy second hand >> cds and not ok to file share... >> >> >> >> On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Kim Cascone wrote: >> >>> >>> how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's - >>> since the artist makes no money on that sale? >> >> >> ============================ >> www.phoniq.net >> releases available on: >> www.noisefactoryrecords.com >> publication: >> www.vagueterrain.net >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 20:27:31 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40918-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 15:27:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 15:27:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16535 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 20:28:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 16525 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 20:28:51 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 15:27:15 -0500 From: aleks vasic <xxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Because when you sell your cd used you give up ownership of it and the person who buys it takes up that ownership. Ripping that same cd to mp3 and freely distributing it is a world apart. No different then buying a piece of software, cracking it, and then bartering with the crack for other cracked software. Honestly its hard not to do so ever. At least for me. I just try to be as moralistic about it as possible. Always pay when i can. If i cant afford all the music i want then the bigger labels wont be getting my money but smaller joe's like you or me. Its still wrong and i guess thats my justification for it, but at least i am being honest. aLEKs On Dec 1, 2006, at 2:23 PM, Neil Wiernik wrote: > > This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been aware > of for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to buy > second hand cds and not ok to file share... > > > > On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Kim Cascone wrote: > >> >> how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's >> - since the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 20:19:44 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40917-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.111]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 15:19:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta17.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 15:19:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 10182 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 20:21:04 +0000 Received: (qmail 10170 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 20:21:03 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 15:19:32 -0500 From: Milan Davidovic <xxxxx.xxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=OEjqjXmG0oX4XcgkZJMVUXSUZOXS7lNl5pMQtSzfHge/0ytcz4ofWzzoruq0E4SVr8onI2hp8vuAzu6QwPPUo5BP3/0bq8/DyMrjchO+vlOzJpZgrZThbtIc7sw+lCRIUXAEmOP5vmf4pQA4xMiXsBVbkoSNaQ1T1HG6AxmDZYQ= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 12/1/06, Paul Sanders <xxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> wrote: > > On 1 Dec 2006, at 19:23, Neil Wiernik wrote: > The law says this is OK because these things are whatever it is - > economists have a word for it - it means that two people cannot > possess them at the same time. Buying a second hand CD deprives the > previous owner of the benefit. I've seen the expression "to lose the utility of a thing". -- Milan Davidovic http://altmilan.blogspot.com http://www.terminus1525.ca/studio/view/2758 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:58:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40916-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.82]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:58:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta13.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:58:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 95712 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:59:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 95698 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:59:20 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:57:50 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For that matter should it be okay to buy collectables even if you don't use them and then pocket the profit at a later date? Think about it.. the only reason they are collectable is because not every single person can have a copy of it. --- Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> wrote: > > This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been aware > of > for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to buy second > hand > cds and not ok to file share... > > > > On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Kim Cascone wrote: > > > > > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used > CD's - since > > the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > ============================ > www.phoniq.net > releases available on: > www.noisefactoryrecords.com > publication: > www.vagueterrain.net > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:37:19 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40915-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.99]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:37:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta28.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:37:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 83472 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:38:32 +0000 Received: (qmail 83459 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:38:32 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:36:57 +0000 From: Paul Sanders <xxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx On 1 Dec 2006, at 19:23, Neil Wiernik wrote: > This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been > aware of for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to > buy second hand cds and not ok to file share... The law says this is OK because these things are whatever it is - economists have a word for it - it means that two people cannot possess them at the same time. Buying a second hand CD deprives the previous owner of the benefit. Cheerio --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:30:28 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40914-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.110]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:30:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta16.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:30:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 78874 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:31:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 78859 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:31:47 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 13:30:16 -0600 From: David Powers <xxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=Z7kzM82KQPUPLhNV7F+LSOkM1WiMOrXLvPIavOoKJONSUyqTYR0rH4z+b6KsdrULbWMyOuVAYUiT6fAN7qwHfyO0rjg9l4IYtMJZ9LmcuzUzXr/3K74WrHH9YDEcCAulQkQK/u+W8MZfBmTkXJo9XVeUoid0ZoN6g7YEb7aaInc= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Actually, in a kind of hilarious coincidence, I might have bought that Cascone/Merzbow CD used. I've never seen the new version around and it just happened to be sitting there when I was record shopping. Sorry Kim! But, that disc is indeed really great, definitely one of my best impulse buys at the record store. ~David On 12/1/06, philippe cavaleri <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> wrote: > (i don't know if i can say that here, but kim cascone's work with Merzbow is > one of the greatest music i ever heard, BUT i don't have the money to buy > cd, because i have my work as musician and image maker, and that costs me a > lot!!! : So what can i do, just listen once, and erase it after? And can i > share my copy with anyone else, or not? I'm not a pirat, i'm an art lover > without money... > That's my point of view... > > 2006/12/1, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx>: > > > > here's a suggestion: > > - search for torrents of things you want to listen to/watch > > - DL them via a torrent client > > - listen to/watch them > > - if you like a release/movie then buy it used > > - if you don't like release/movie delete it from your hard drive > > > > which raises a question: > > > > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's > > - since the artist makes no money on that sale? > > > > not trying to add fuel to the flamewar, just curious > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > > website: http://www.microsound.org > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:29:44 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40913-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.98]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:29:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta27.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:29:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 77737 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:30:47 +0000 Received: (qmail 77717 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:30:45 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 20:29:04 +0100 From: isjtar <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new-20030616-p10 (Debian) at okno.be X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx thanks for that, i fully agree. i make just enough to get by and i don't care about that at all, as long as i can make stuff. no money to buy cd's a the moment, though o'd love to. but i am pretty happy to get payed for concerts and installations or i'd be in trouble -well, more trouble anyway... cheers isjtar Op 1-dec-06, om 20:24 heeft philippe cavaleri het volgende geschreven: > Well Well!!! As an artist, i always feel free to copy, download, etc, > because anyone can do the same with my work! Art is sharing a point > of view, > an aesthetic experience, far away from money or fame... > (i don't know if i can say that here, but kim cascone's work with > Merzbow is > one of the greatest music i ever heard, BUT i don't have the money > to buy > cd, because i have my work as musician and image maker, and that > costs me a > lot!!! : So what can i do, just listen once, and erase it after? > And can i > share my copy with anyone else, or not? I'm not a pirat, i'm an art > lover > without money... > That's my point of view... > > 2006/12/1, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx>: >> >> here's a suggestion: >> - search for torrents of things you want to listen to/watch >> - DL them via a torrent client >> - listen to/watch them >> - if you like a release/movie then buy it used >> - if you don't like release/movie delete it from your hard drive >> >> which raises a question: >> >> how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's >> - since the artist makes no money on that sale? >> >> not trying to add fuel to the flamewar, just curious >> >> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:25:03 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40912-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.86]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:25:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:25:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 74795 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:26:22 +0000 Received: (qmail 74785 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:26:22 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 20:24:51 +0100 From: philippe cavaleri <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_lP8crPsBwnnoIfR78rdEKw)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=k9jR8SkzsvhNW50W/SO/pGuUPVfPN/q3CwiUHsYA/POUZ19H2y1GdLfDeByAQFe+dNGCmrhayMH49FymEK5RA3ZjBxABk1tpA0v0UD6oFRs5FIT0uYxukYfBKrWkObib73/QUjg0pr9ZHwkOJO7cQQRbepnLGc7LCu4HqF2u4hE= X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_lP8crPsBwnnoIfR78rdEKw) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well Well!!! As an artist, i always feel free to copy, download, etc, because anyone can do the same with my work! Art is sharing a point of view, an aesthetic experience, far away from money or fame... (i don't know if i can say that here, but kim cascone's work with Merzbow is one of the greatest music i ever heard, BUT i don't have the money to buy cd, because i have my work as musician and image maker, and that costs me a lot!!! : So what can i do, just listen once, and erase it after? And can i share my copy with anyone else, or not? I'm not a pirat, i'm an art lover without money... That's my point of view... 2006/12/1, Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx>: > > here's a suggestion: > - search for torrents of things you want to listen to/watch > - DL them via a torrent client > - listen to/watch them > - if you like a release/movie then buy it used > - if you don't like release/movie delete it from your hard drive > > which raises a question: > > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's > - since the artist makes no money on that sale? > > not trying to add fuel to the flamewar, just curious > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > > --Boundary_(ID_lP8crPsBwnnoIfR78rdEKw)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:24:02 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40911-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.113]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:24:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta19.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:24:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 73533 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:25:23 +0000 Received: (qmail 73523 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:25:23 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:23:53 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxx.xxxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: a2319JEVM1m_0bUyfO8brTeswGHI4PJOlvjn93OMRhxrckzWcBfMB0Emioa7R4UrZQ-- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx In theory the person who owned the CD should delete any mp3's or copies they made of said CD after reselling it. Adrian > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's > > - since the artist makes no money on that sale? > > not trying to add fuel to the flamewar, just curious --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:21:49 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40910-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.114]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:21:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta20.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:21:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 71729 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:23:07 +0000 Received: (qmail 71715 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:23:06 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:23:10 -0500 (EST) From: Neil Wiernik <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: Re: [microsound] torrents In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-X-Sender: xxxx@xxxxxx To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxx@xxxxxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx This is an interesting question as it is some thing I have been aware of for some time now and dont really understand why its ok to buy second hand cds and not ok to file share... On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Kim Cascone wrote: > > how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's - since > the artist makes no money on that sale? ============================ www.phoniq.net releases available on: www.noisefactoryrecords.com publication: www.vagueterrain.net --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:16:42 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40909-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.100]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:16:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta29.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:16:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 67528 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:17:49 +0000 Received: (qmail 67417 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:17:41 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:15:57 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] torrents To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx here's a suggestion: - search for torrents of things you want to listen to/watch - DL them via a torrent client - listen to/watch them - if you like a release/movie then buy it used - if you don't like release/movie delete it from your hard drive which raises a question: how do people who are against filesharing feel about buying used CD's - since the artist makes no money on that sale? not trying to add fuel to the flamewar, just curious --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 19:04:04 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40908-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:04:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:04:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 59615 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:05:15 +0000 Received: (qmail 59598 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 19:05:14 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:03:42 -0800 From: Kim Cascone <xxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] [ot] psiphon: firewall hopper To: microsound_list <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_ZNus+ciLbjWbaVeXmmtBZA)" Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_ZNus+ciLbjWbaVeXmmtBZA) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://psiphon.civisec.org/index.html for any of you out there living in a place which restricts internet access --Boundary_(ID_ZNus+ciLbjWbaVeXmmtBZA)-- From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 18:15:51 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40907-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.182]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 13:15:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta21.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 13:15:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 28653 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 18:16:52 +0000 Received: (qmail 28641 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 18:16:51 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 10:15:21 -0800 (PST) From: Xdugef <xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] inline pad for a microphone In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: xxxx@xxxxxx.xxx Message-id: <xxxxxx.xxxxx.xx@xxxxxxxx.xxxx.xxx.xxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-YMail-OSG: CCuxLwwVM1kuoSKwfMKDJXIzQUo6q1maHhOZa2.W1yXNb3fEnYPeyU7Kej5Uo9_3X5_.C2C7GcQ2QpYUSlkDIZgYOBqBbRvwaVEEqOAuh2W9arbm9fmkQLZ1FyhjbPrlY22ks17uXkeqP176erHWV49FVqvkVUZqQw-- X-RocketYMMF: adrian_dimond X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I was taking to somebody the other day about recording really loud shows because the built in Mics on the Edirol R9 tend to overload past a certain volume. I have a Sony ECM-959A stereo Mic but he mentioned that I coudl probably use a 10db inline pad to bring the levels down. I done some cursory googling for "inline pad" with no luck. Any suggestions? It'd be especially nice to find one made for stereo mini cables. thanks Adrian --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 14:29:13 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40906-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.109]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 09:29:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta15.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 09:29:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 99229 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:30:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 99218 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 14:30:29 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:28:56 -0800 (PST) From: Cooptrol <xxxx@xxxxxxxx.xxx> Subject: [microsound] new sequencer from cooptrol In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xx> To: xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxx.xxx.xx.xx.xxx.xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx.xxx> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N References: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx> <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xx> Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.6 Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx I have just uploaded to my webpage the new version of my "cptrl" sequencer Its called "cptrl av" (av stands for audio-video) It has a video generating engine in sync with the sequences. It has two waveform graphs anda a quicktime movie player, all intearcting together by multiplexing in sync. it also includes scale and root note selectors for creating harmonic music, and a pair of poly synths with chord capability other features: independent signature sequencers, delay/flanger, reverb in the main output, fft sampler-player, bit crusher in each synth, simplyfied preset system, rewire sync in mxb version (Im trying to resolve rewire not working in the standalone version) check it out at http://www.cooptrol.com/software/cooptrol_software.htm feedback welcome!! Hernan www.cooptrol.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org From ???@??? Fri Dec 1 11:36:24 2006 Return-path: <microsound-return-40905-vze26m98=xxxxxxxxx.xxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Received: from mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.185]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:36:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hyperreal.org (taz3.hyperreal.org [209.237.226.90]) by mta24.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxx.xxx.xxxxxx.xx.xxx> for xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx (ORCPT xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:36:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 35834 invoked by uid 1095); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:37:40 +0000 Received: (qmail 35823 invoked from network); Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:37:40 +0000 Date: Fri, 01 Dec 2006 11:34:48 +0000 From: xxxxx.xxxxx@xxx.xx Subject: Re: [microsound] boris + sunn o))) collaboration In-reply-to: <xxxxxxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxx-xxxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx> To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Reply-to: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> Message-id: <xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx@xxx.xx> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 7.0 August 18, 2005 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_fLUlxS8wonLiyiQfPb2Z1g)" X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on cmlot01/Cso(Release 6.5.4|March 27, 2005) at 01/12/2006 11:34:50 AM Precedence: bulk Delivered-to: mailing list xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx X-Spam-Rating: taz3.hyperreal.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Mailing-List: contact xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx; run by ezmlm List-Post: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> List-Help: <mailto:xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> X-No-Archive: yes Original-recipient: rfc822;xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx --Boundary_(ID_fLUlxS8wonLiyiQfPb2Z1g) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Uhhh, that (the tabbed bleep page that never times out during playback) was like "privileged" information Andrew. One of the best kept secret on the interweb I'd have thought. Why don't we, in future, try and keep it that little bit of a secret. Not so that it can be utilised towards any nefarious purpose, like stream ripping or whatever - simply let's think of it as our own secret little oasis of freely streamed playback on demand. It could potentially be very damaging to bleep, the artists and thus the consumer if this was to become publicised widely. That which is one of the sites great advantages (ability to preview audio at any point of the actual track) could in the end become it's achilles heal. Just think about it... All the best fella, bp ~ |---------+----------------------------> | | Andrew Cameron | | | <xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx| | | .net.au> | | | | | | 01/12/2006 04:14 | | | Please respond to| | | microsound | |---------+----------------------------> >------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | | | To: microsound <xxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> | | cc: xxxxxxxx@xxxxxxx.xxx.xx | | Subject: Re: [microsound] boris + sunn o))) collaboration | >------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| Beatport can be flaky for me, lost items in the crate a few times etc... The best part of bleep.com for me is how (in safari in my case) when you preview a track, just create a new tab and read the news or something, and the track will play with no fade-out until you click back on the bleep tab. Great for certain tracks that you want to hear in full (pedantically). It flaked on me only once, I think in the first week of its life, so I think it's definitely the benchmark. On 01/12/2006, at 6:07 AM, Graham Miller wrote: > my problem with beatport is that the preview quality is atrocious. > you can't tell if the production of the actual recording is any > good and that deters me from buying any digital downloads. i think > this is especially shortsighted when you consider that in the idiom > of electronic dance music the production IS the music. > > i'm really hooked on bleep.com. the preview system they have there > is perfect. you see the entire track as a waveform and can shuttle > instantly anywhere in the track, with really decent preview audio > quality that plays for about 20 seconds before fading to silence. > > it's also a beautiful website done by the geniuses at kleber.net. > > g. > >> >> Anyway I buy the releases I like, in part because I do want to >> support >> artists. But note that beyond that, a digital download from beatport >> is normally of higher quality, especially since I usually buy WAV >> rather than mp3 for instance. So all ethics aside, there is, in fact, >> good incentive for a discriminating consumer to buy legal digital >> copies of files. >> >> ~David >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx >> website: http://www.microsound.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx > website: http://www.microsound.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx For additional commands, e-mail: xxxxxxxxxx-xxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx website: http://www.microsound.org --Boundary_(ID_fLUlxS8wonLiyiQfPb2Z1g)--