Re: [AH] wanted: acid machine

From Horton
Sent Thu, Jan 8th 2015, 23:53

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FSK Sync for the win. I'm a huge fan of the Korg KMS-30; FSK can be the
master and then it pukes out two MIDI and two DIN. I'll often drive
everything off of the MC-4 and stripe its FSK to an audio track at the same
time, then repatch that into the KMS-30 to slave up MIDI devices or DIN
boxes for more detailed parts, fills, etc. beyond what was laid down live
on the first pass. Rock solid timing no matter how many times you go back,
it's just that simple.

MC-4 lays down FSK, which goes to the KMS-30 and slaves MC-202 and TR-606
off of DIN outputs. MC-202 then has two more DIN outputs as needed, and the
606 has the two channels of triggers. Rock solid! I can then drive a
CSQ-600 off of one of the 606's trigger outs, Juno 6 arpeggiator off of the
other. Four channels of the MC-4 sequence System 100m voices.

All hail Roland!

On Thu, Jan 8, 2015 at 4:41 PM, Nicholas Keller <niroke@tampabay.rr.com>
wrote:

> I see no one has mentioned the Machinedrum as a source of solid midi
> timing. I thought that was one of its selling points.  I have one and oft=
en
> use it as a master clock driving two MAQs and the Rolands via midi->DIN,
> but I've never done a comparative test
>
> Nick
>
>
> On Jan 8, 2015, at 4:39 PM, David Vicu=C3=B1a <davidvicuna@gmail.com> wro=
te:
>
> I am not an expert in any way, but from what i know, one of the things
> that can affect midi timing is the jitter... when you have jitter problem=
s
> in a midi signal, the devices can loss their original "analog swing"...
> there are some analog devices that definitely have their own micro
> pulsating rhythm that makes you dance - 606, 808, 909, 303, 101, the mpc
> with that 60% set... the XBase09 has also a groove which is pleasant to m=
e.
>
> But if you provide those "groovy" devices a jitter-free midi signal, they
> keep their original groove even when it is midi. If it is not jitter free=
,
> like a bad USB midi signal from Ableton.
>
> Another thing is that midi messages need to be "read" by software, and
> that can delay the response, specially when you have several devices
> chained... affecting the global groove.
>
> Last, CV/gate attacks tends to be sharper in many synths; there are also
> midi only synths that make for great attacks like Nords though.
>
> All those characteristics added make it easier to get sharp grooves if yo=
u
> use only CVgate/dinsync connections, but you can also achieve great resul=
ts
> with a dependable midi clock source like a syncgen, a mpc or a hw
> sequencer, and avoiding midi daisy chains.
>
>
>
>
> 2015-01-08 21:24 GMT+01:00 David Bulog <d2ba@xtra.co.nz>:
>
>> One thing to my ears is the TT-303  as a midi slave its not quite there
>> (latest OS never solved it)
>> It seems a bit off compare to other midi sequencers as a slave =E2=80=94=
anyone
>> else think this about theres?
>>
>> On 9/01/2015, at 8:46 am, Nicholas Keller <niroke@tampabay.rr.com> wrote=
:
>>
>> > I thought you were saying that the original machines had a unique
>> sloppiness to their clocks which is often not replicated successfully in
>> clones, and that upgrading to a QS CPU would eliminate this slop and tha=
t
>> the slop is actually preferable.  I can testify that the 707 I used to h=
ave
>> was terrible as a master clock.  Now I have a TB and a 606, sometimes ru=
n
>> by themselves and sometimes synced to a midi master with either a Doepfe=
r
>> MSY-2 or MCV24 (and soon, a TR-9090).
>> >
>> > And I love a good curry.  I got spoiled living in the UK for a few
>> years, now I'm back in FL and it's hard to find a dish that satisfies me=
.
>> >
>> >
>> > Nick
>> >
>> >
>> >> On Jan 8, 2015, at 2:22 PM, Kenny Balys <kenny@beatkamp.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> As soon as you are running things via midi, all bets are off for
>> timing.
>> >>
>> >> The best Midi you will ever get will be from an MPC or something
>> similar but its nowhere near analogue.
>> >>
>> >> Timing in the analogue domain is where everything can be rigidly
>> synchronous. Triggers, pulses, clocks all together work well because the=
y
>> are just a precession or cascade of events happening at the slew rate of
>> the component parts. ie) Nanoseconds
>> >>
>> >> If you are not using the internal sequencer on the 303 I don't imagin=
e
>> a difference as far as the timing goes. I don't have a quick silver'd
>> machine so take that with a grain of salt.
>> >>
>> >> ps: saying nanoseconds always makes me want a stiff curry with some
>> nanobread
>> >>
>> >>> On 08-01-2015 7:01 PM, Nicholas Keller wrote:
>> >>> This sequencer stiffness you mention... If you ran the TB from a
>> >>> MIDI->Sync converter, wouldn't you also lose some of the TB's
>> >>> fl-acid-ity?  I was thinking about getting the Quicksilver upgrade a=
t
>> >>> some point, so I wonder what difference it will make if I rarely use
>> the
>> >>> TB with its own internal clock.
>> >>>
>> >>> Nick
>> >>
>>
>>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">FSK Sync for the win. I&#39;m a huge fan of the Korg KMS-3=
0; FSK can be the master and then it pukes out two MIDI and two DIN. I&#39;=
ll often drive everything off of the MC-4 and stripe its FSK to an audio tr=
ack at the same time, then repatch that into the KMS-30 to slave up MIDI de=
vices or DIN boxes for more detailed parts, fills, etc. beyond what was lai=
d down live on the first pass. Rock solid timing no matter how many times y=
ou go back, it&#39;s just that simple.<div><br></div><div>MC-4 lays down FS=
K, which goes to the KMS-30 and slaves MC-202 and TR-606 off of DIN outputs=
. MC-202 then has two more DIN outputs as needed, and the 606 has the two c=
hannels of triggers. Rock solid! I can then drive a CSQ-600 off of one of t=
he 606&#39;s trigger outs, Juno 6 arpeggiator off of the other. Four channe=
ls of the MC-4 sequence System 100m voices.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>=
All hail Roland!=C2=A0</div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 8, 2015 at 4:41 PM, Nicholas Keller <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:niroke@tampabay.rr.com" target=3D"_blank">ni=
roke@tampabay.rr.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex=
"><div dir=3D"auto"><div>I see no one has mentioned the Machinedrum as a so=
urce of solid midi timing. I thought that was one of its selling points.=C2=
=A0 I have one and often use it as a master clock driving two MAQs and the =
Rolands via midi-&gt;DIN, but I&#39;ve never done a comparative test<br><br=
>Nick</div><div><div class=3D"h5"><div><br></div><div><br>On Jan 8, 2015, a=
t 4:39 PM, David Vicu=C3=B1a &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:davidvicuna@gmail.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">davidvicuna@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockqu=
ote type=3D"cite"><div><div dir=3D"ltr">I am not an expert in any way, but =
from what i know, one of the things that can affect midi timing is the jitt=
er... when you have jitter problems in a midi signal, the devices can loss =
their original &quot;analog swing&quot;... there are some analog devices th=
at definitely have their own micro pulsating rhythm that makes you dance - =
606, 808, 909, 303, 101, the mpc with that 60% set... the XBase09 has also =
a groove which is pleasant to me.<br><br>But if you provide those &quot;gro=
ovy&quot; devices a jitter-free midi signal, they keep their original groov=
e even when it is midi. If it is not jitter free, like a bad USB midi signa=
l from Ableton.<div><br></div><div>Another thing is that midi messages need=
 to be &quot;read&quot; by software, and that can delay the response, speci=
ally when you have several devices chained... affecting the global groove.<=
br><div><br></div><div>Last, CV/gate attacks tends to be sharper in many sy=
nths; there are also midi only synths that make for great attacks like Nord=
s though.=C2=A0<br><br>All those characteristics added make it easier to ge=
t sharp grooves if you use only CVgate/dinsync connections, but you can als=
o achieve great results with a dependable midi clock source like a syncgen,=
 a mpc or a hw sequencer, and avoiding midi daisy chains.=C2=A0</div><div><=
br></div><div><div><div><div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div></div></di=
v></div></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quot=
e">2015-01-08 21:24 GMT+01:00 David Bulog <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:d2ba@xtra.co.nz" target=3D"_blank">d2ba@xtra.co.nz</a>&gt;</span>:<b=
r><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:=
1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">One thing to my ears is the TT-303=C2=A0 a=
s a midi slave its not quite there (latest OS never solved it)<br>
It seems a bit off compare to other midi sequencers as a slave =E2=80=94any=
one else think this about theres?<br>
<div><div><br>
On 9/01/2015, at 8:46 am, Nicholas Keller &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:niroke@tamp=
abay.rr.com" target=3D"_blank">niroke@tampabay.rr.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
&gt; I thought you were saying that the original machines had a unique slop=
piness to their clocks which is often not replicated successfully in clones=
, and that upgrading to a QS CPU would eliminate this slop and that the slo=
p is actually preferable.=C2=A0 I can testify that the 707 I used to have w=
as terrible as a master clock.=C2=A0 Now I have a TB and a 606, sometimes r=
un by themselves and sometimes synced to a midi master with either a Doepfe=
r MSY-2 or MCV24 (and soon, a TR-9090).<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; And I love a good curry.=C2=A0 I got spoiled living in the UK for a fe=
w years, now I&#39;m back in FL and it&#39;s hard to find a dish that satis=
fies me.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Nick<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; On Jan 8, 2015, at 2:22 PM, Kenny Balys &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kenn=
y@beatkamp.com" target=3D"_blank">kenny@beatkamp.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; As soon as you are running things via midi, all bets are off for t=
iming.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; The best Midi you will ever get will be from an MPC or something s=
imilar but its nowhere near analogue.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; Timing in the analogue domain is where everything can be rigidly s=
ynchronous. Triggers, pulses, clocks all together work well because they ar=
e just a precession or cascade of events happening at the slew rate of the =
component parts. ie) Nanoseconds<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; If you are not using the internal sequencer on the 303 I don&#39;t=
 imagine a difference as far as the timing goes. I don&#39;t have a quick s=
ilver&#39;d machine so take that with a grain of salt.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; ps: saying nanoseconds always makes me want a stiff curry with som=
e nanobread<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; On 08-01-2015 7:01 PM, Nicholas Keller wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; This sequencer stiffness you mention... If you ran the TB from=
 a<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; MIDI-&gt;Sync converter, wouldn&#39;t you also lose some of th=
e TB&#39;s<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; fl-acid-ity?=C2=A0 I was thinking about getting the Quicksilve=
r upgrade at<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; some point, so I wonder what difference it will make if I rare=
ly use the<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; TB with its own internal clock.<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; Nick<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
<br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

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